Can I vent or more like cry one more time?

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1990Domer

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This is a follow-up to how sad my son has been lately. He often won’t tell a whole story to me, but I get bits and pieces which start to make sense.

This summer we helped (to a great extent) a family friend who’s DH had terminal cancer. We were actually trying to help them prior to that because they were financially in dire straights. Then the cancer diagnosis hit and she found out that she was pregnant with twins. I think the true story is she only had insurance for her 2 kids, so she couldn’t afford BC. Well, enough there.

With my college background, I basically kept them from 3 court hearings, as I filed all the paperwork and paid the fines. I was told I would be repaid, but nothing. DH told me to offer it as a work of mercy.

Her 2 sons have been buddies to my son since kindy…they accepted him and his autism. I know I cannot understand the grief the kids are going through (I arranged pro-Bono services with my son’s therapist), but she punted on therapy. Then the one son started acting really mean to DS…more than even our therapist expected given the history. He was not acting like this to his other friends.

Son tells me he’s lying to him, shooting his bee-bee gun at him, blowing a leaf blower in his face and basically ignoring him. Acting “super cool.” The other brother–total opposite. The cool on is 13 and the more quiet, academic boy is 12.

Well, after I witnessed 13 yo going off on me and son when I dropped paperwork to their house, my son fell into this depression where he felt like the world would be better off without him. This also brought back all his horrible sixth grade memories. DS is sad because he donated his birthday and Confirmation money to them and feels unappreciated.

I, too, feel used by this family, as the relatives know how DS is being treated and doing nothing about it (actually, a simple I’m sorry was all DS wanted). And the only time they seem to need me is when a legal crisis (debt issues) come up. A simple thank you card would have been nice.

So, DS feels he has lost yet another friend, and his depression spurned mine. And I feel totally used. I know God sees all and is fair, but it’s not been terribly comforting in the last 1-2 weeks. However, yesterday’s Mass and Confession helped!

Thank you for all the love and prayers here! God bless you all.

Thank you for reading! Son and I now feel stable as we both mutually feel we were, in a way, duped.
 
1990Domer said:
This is a follow-up to how sad my son has been lately. He often won’t tell a whole story to me, but I get bits and pieces which start to make sense.

This summer we helped (to a great extent) a family friend who’s DH had terminal cancer. We were actually trying to help them prior to that because they were financially in dire straights. Then the cancer diagnosis hit and she found out that she was pregnant with twins. I think the true story is she only had insurance for her 2 kids, so she couldn’t afford BC. Well, enough there.

With my college background, I basically kept them from 3 court hearings, as I filed all the paperwork and paid the fines. I was told I would be repaid, but nothing. DH told me to offer it as a work of mercy.

Her 2 sons have been buddies to my son since kindy…they accepted him and his autism. I know I cannot understand the grief the kids are going through (I arranged pro-Bono services with my son’s therapist), but she punted on therapy. Then the one son started acting really mean to DS…more than even our therapist expected given the history. He was not acting like this to his other friends.

Son tells me he’s lying to him, shooting his bee-bee gun at him, blowing a leaf blower in his face and basically ignoring him. Acting “super cool.” The other brother–total opposite. The cool on is 13 and the more quiet, academic boy is 12.

Well, after I witnessed 13 yo going off on me and son when I dropped paperwork to their house, my son fell into this depression where he felt like the world would be better off without him. This also brought back all his horrible sixth grade memories. DS is sad because he donated his birthday and Confirmation money to them and feels unappreciated.

I, too, feel used by this family, as the relatives know how DS is being treated and doing nothing about it (actually, a simple I’m sorry was all DS wanted). And the only time they seem to need me is when a legal crisis (debt issues) come up. A simple thank you card would have been nice.

So, DS feels he has lost yet another friend, and his depression spurned mine. And I feel totally used. I know God sees all and is fair, but it’s not been terribly comforting in the last 1-2 weeks. However, yesterday’s Mass and Confession helped!

Thank you for all the love and prayers here! God bless you all.

Thank you for reading! Son and I now feel stable as we both mutually feel we were, in a way, duped.
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The mom is probably totally overwhelmed just with the twins. No life insurance? If these are old friends (like they were friends of yours before they needed you), give them some space and try to pick up later (but keep your kid away from being alone with the 13-year-old). You might be able to be a little strategic and peel away the 12-year-old. For instance, if you invited him to an academic type outing, the 13-year-old might not even mind.

If these aren’t old friends (if they weren’t your friends before they needed you and there isn’t a strong history of reciprocity), I would let it fade out.

That would be my question–is there a history of them ever supporting YOU? If there isn’t, I don’t think there is a lot to salvage here.

By the way, since kids can be really unpredictable, how about more friendly adult type activities for your son? My kids go to a twice-a-month grown up games night with my husband that’s held by friends of the family. I believe that game stores sponsor that kind of thing. My only concern would be inappropriate language, but it depends a lot on the clientele.

There are also adult music groups that might welcome a mature and talented young musician. Some music teachers have paid “orchestras.”

Meetups might be a good place to look for educational activities with a lot of adults. Our area also has a meet up for programmers.

Best wishes!
 
They did support DS when he was in the public school system. Things faded a bit when we tried different placements, but the kids would do things with us. Sadly, I was always the one doing the inviting and paying for the activity (movie, etc). So, things have been like a wave–peaks and valleys so to say.

Right now, we aren’t in any adult groups because DHs job is super demanding and we aren’t horribly social ourselves. However, I do have an idea for another outlet that you just inspired…alumni events in our area.

If you have an updated opinion, please let me know.

Thanks Xantippe. You are a rock for me.

God bless,

Sandy
 
My friend, this may be a great learning experience for you and for your son. Don’t expect thank you’s for your good works or apologies for the slights of children. Often, you will not get them. If a kid is upsetting your son, keep him away from the kid. Continue to pray for the family and wish them the best. It sounds as though they are in the midst of a terrible struggle. Don’t expect anything from them, just pray for them.
 
PaulfromIowa said:
My friend, this may be a great learning experience for you and for your son. Don’t expect thank you’s for your good works or apologies for the slights of children. Often, you will not get them. If a kid is upsetting your son, keep him away from the kid. Continue to pray for the family and wish them the best. It sounds as though they are in the midst of a terrible struggle. Don’t expect anything from them, just pray for them.
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This^^.

Also, as you say you are not terribly social yourselves…but yet you’d likeyour son to have all this energy and desire for many friendships?
The apple doesn’t fall far from the tree. Maybe he’s not the social type. But then again, you HAVE to get him into some groups of similar interests as Xantippe often recommends. He HAS to get out. All of us, even yourself, when faced with a disappointment, large or small, tend to want to blame people, ask God WHY? and the like.

Now is the time to let dear son know that many people hurt us but mostly not intentionally.
Everyone has some battle they are fighting. What matters is the grace with which we fight our own, and that we don’t unduly burden others. Even people without any measurable disability need more than one or two friends. That’s a pretty huge investment in a fallible person or two. Is he interested in Scouting or Squires? There may be some groups like that which are specific to a young man’s interests as well as outside clubs and such. The important thing is to keep him around people. Lots of people. Lots of eyes watching & ears listening for further signs of deep depression. Be assured of our prayers.
 
1990Domer said:
They did support DS when he was in the public school system. Things faded a bit when we tried different placements, but the kids would do things with us. Sadly, I was always the one doing the inviting and paying for the activity (movie, etc). So, things have been like a wave–peaks and valleys so to say.

Right now, we aren’t in any adult groups because DHs job is super demanding and we aren’t horribly social ourselves. However, I do have an idea for another outlet that you just inspired…alumni events in our area.

If you have an updated opinion, please let me know.

Thanks Xantippe. You are a rock for me.

God bless,

Sandy
Click to expand...
So it doesn’t sound like the other family was very proactive at the best of times…

The alumni idea sounds very good. If he gets it into his head that he also wants to go to Notre Dame, that could be a very nice long-term goal for him (with all the necessary caveats about safety schools…). I know my daughter (exactly the same age) has already for a couple of years had her mind made up that she is going to go to the college my husband teaches at.

One of the things that I’ve heard from my kid’s psychologist and that an email buddy with an autistic child the same age has heard from her kid’s psychologist is that it’s very important for the parents of autistic children to model a social life by being social themselves.

Best wishes!
 
I am sorry for what you are going through Domer.

It’s time to dust yourself off, your son too, and start a new beginning–without relying on friends from the past. You can be nice to them-but find a new direction. If you have many things to do with your son-thier rudeness will not be as important to you.

Enroll your son in an activity that you think he will enjoy that is structured and that he will be good at-you know his talents. Set him up for success.

It could be swimming classes at the ymca, or music lessons or art class or recreational sports. I would choose something that is regulated with a coach or teacher. He will be around others-without having to have exceptional social skills-just the fun of the activity. Try new things until something clicks.

Best wishes
 
I have followed your posts and I am so sorry you have been through various issues lately. The hardest thing as a parent, I believe, is to watch your child go through a painful experience and try to navigate it into a teaching situation.

I think you can let your son know that there will always be those in our lives that disappoint and hurt us. Fortunately, we have Christ to uphold us when we suffer. Your son can learn that God is there for him; no matter the circumstance. He is made stronger by God’s love and support to withstand the actions of others. He must be the strong one and pray for the friend’s misgivings. I know this is hard. Trust me, I know at his age he may not understand this, or want to forgive this boy. But this type of situation will present itself to him his whole life. He must be taught to deal with it in a productive, and forgiving manner.

God Bless You for helping this family. You have shown far more patience and tolerance than I would have shown had I been in your shoes. Although, let me qualify: I do not know all the details and nuances of this situation, either. What I have read here indicates an overwhelming situation for this family. Perhaps the pressure of it all has created a chaotic environment that has become impossible for them to deal with. Do they have a priest or spiritual counselor to see? I can’t imagine facing this type of life struggle without some spiritual help.

I will keep you in my prayers. Know that I care about you and your family. Peace be with you.
 
I agree with Monicad that the family and the boy might ironically feel jealous of the bounty from which your charity is offered, OP. I wouldn’t be surprised if the necessity of getting help at all from others causes resentment towards the helpers in the 13 year old. His dad had cancer so bad the doctors were helpless to stop it, you are helping, which means you are the family that has both health and enough extra money that you can actually give it away, while his family has a serious lack of both. At an age when young people like to be making a contribution, he is powerless to do anything to change what happened to his dad, to his mom, to his family. Even this other kid who is vulnerable–meaning, your son–is in a position to grant charity out of his own pocket, but the oldest son in the family feels as if he himself can’t do anything! That can make a teen feel very angry and jealous. A serious level of acting out is unfortunate, but not surprising, and his choice to bring the brunt of his resentment down on the most vulnerable member of your family is not that much of a surprise, either.

Having said that, your son doesn’t have the emotional resources to absorb this kind of abuse. You don’t have much choice but to do what is necessary to keep him safe. If the mother of the boy who is attacking him won’t do it, you have to. I’d tell your son that you have to hope the other boy will grow out of this terrible behavior, but there is a time to accept that he needs help that neither you nor your son can give. Sometimes, there is something to be gained by absorbing what other people dish out in their pain, but this is not one of those times. This kid would be better off if someone said, “No. You’re hurting, but you cannot be allowed to do this to someone. That is out-of-bounds, period.”

Most of us have been far less grateful than we have been blessed, so doing for others without the expectation of thanks is a praiseworthy thing. Having said that, sometimes what we do is not accepted with gratitude because it is actually resented or in some way unwanted. If the people we help do not act grateful, we have to consider that perhaps we are not really wanted, and withdraw our offers of help accordingly. (It is not as if someone who has accepted a lot of help from us can openly admit how they resent our help.)

If you are not at least getting verbal thanks, I would not call to offer help, because the lack of expressed gratitude is an indication that the family may not want your help but may not know how to tell you that. If you are asked for help, do not agree to anything that puts contact between your son and theirs. Encourage them to get help from another source, such as their relatives. Play it by ear, but realize that it is time that you refrain on doing anything for this family that will require another sacrifice by your son. He’s not in a position to offer that.

I echo those who made the conjecture that life may be no bowl of cherries for the 12 year old living in the same house with that 13 year old, too. I can hardly believe he is only that cruel with just one bystander. If I had to guess, I’d guess that the studious 12 year old is getting the most of the brunt of the older brother’s impulses towards cruel misbehavior. If there is any gracious way to let your son have contact with the younger one and give him a respite from his brother, it might do them both good. Otherwise, offer up what you’ve done, pray for this family, but back away.
 
Xantippe said:
So it doesn’t sound like the other family was very proactive at the best of times…

The alumni idea sounds very good. If he gets it into his head that he also wants to go to Notre Dame, that could be a very nice long-term goal for him (with all the necessary caveats about safety schools…). I know my daughter (exactly the same age) has already for a couple of years had her mind made up that she is going to go to the college my husband teaches at.

One of the things that I’ve heard from my kid’s psychologist and that an email buddy with an autistic child the same age has heard from her kid’s psychologist is that it’s very important for the parents of autistic children to model a social life by being social themselves.

Best wishes!
Click to expand...
How did you know he wanted to go to Notre Dame? Am I that obvious? For seminary. My greatest love has always been there. I think that’s our path! Lots of service projects.
 
EasterJoy said:
I agree with Monicad that the family and the boy might ironically feel jealous of the bounty from which your charity is offered, OP. I wouldn’t be surprised if the necessity of getting help at all from others causes resentment towards the helpers in the 13 year old. His dad had cancer so bad the doctors were helpless to stop it, you are helping, which means you are the family that has both health and enough extra money that you can actually give it away, while his family has a serious lack of both. At an age when young people like to be making a contribution, he is powerless to do anything to change what happened to his dad, to his mom, to his family. Even this other kid who is vulnerable–meaning, your son–is in a position to grant charity out of his own pocket, but the oldest son in the family feels as if he himself can’t do anything! That can make a teen feel very angry and jealous. A serious level of acting out is unfortunate, but not surprising, and his choice to bring the brunt of his resentment down on the most vulnerable member of your family is not that much of a surprise, either.

Having said that, your son doesn’t have the emotional resources to absorb this kind of abuse. You don’t have much choice but to do what is necessary to keep him safe. If the mother of the boy who is attacking him won’t do it, you have to. I’d tell your son that you have to hope the other boy will grow out of this terrible behavior, but there is a time to accept that he needs help that neither you nor your son can give. Sometimes, there is something to be gained by absorbing what other people dish out in their pain, but this is not one of those times. This kid would be better off if someone said, “No. You’re hurting, but you cannot be allowed to do this to someone. That is out-of-bounds, period.”

Most of us have been far less grateful than we have been blessed, so doing for others without the expectation of thanks is a praiseworthy thing. Having said that, sometimes what we do is not accepted with gratitude because it is actually resented or in some way unwanted. If the people we help do not act grateful, we have to consider that perhaps we are not really wanted, and withdraw our offers of help accordingly. (It is not as if someone who has accepted a lot of help from us can openly admit how they resent our help.)

If you are not at least getting verbal thanks, I would not call to offer help, because the lack of expressed gratitude is an indication that the family may not want your help but may not know how to tell you that. If you are asked for help, do not agree to anything that puts contact between your son and theirs. Encourage them to get help from another source, such as their relatives. Play it by ear, but realize that it is time that you refrain on doing anything for this family that will require another sacrifice by your son. He’s not in a position to offer that.

I echo those who made the conjecture that life may be no bowl of cherries for the 12 year old living in the same house with that 13 year old, too. I can hardly believe he is only that cruel with just one bystander. If I had to guess, I’d guess that the studious 12 year old is getting the most of the brunt of the older brother’s impulses towards cruel misbehavior. If there is any gracious way to let your son have contact with the younger one and give him a respite from his brother, it might do them both good. Otherwise, offer up what you’ve done, pray for this family, but back away.
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I think you’re quite right that things may be pretty bad at home for the 12-year-old, what with his rage-y older brother and preoccupied mom.

If there’s some way of getting him out occasionally without his brother, it could be a godsend.

But that may not be possible.
 
1990Domer said:
How did you know he wanted to go to Notre Dame? Am I that obvious? For seminary. My greatest love has always been there. I think that’s our path! Lots of service projects.
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I think you might have mentioned it before, but it would be very natural even if you hadn’t.
 
Xantippe said:
So it doesn’t sound like the other family was very proactive at the best of times…

The alumni idea sounds very good. If he gets it into his head that he also wants to go to Notre Dame, that could be a very nice long-term goal for him (with all the necessary caveats about safety schools…). I know my daughter (exactly the same age) has already for a couple of years had her mind made up that she is going to go to the college my husband teaches at.

One of the things that I’ve heard from my kid’s psychologist and that an email buddy with an autistic child the same age has heard from her kid’s psychologist is that it’s very important for the parents of autistic children to model a social life by being social themselves.

Best wishes!
Click to expand...
Honestly, I have tried for the 21 years I have been married to DH. He is a recluse. I can’t name a friend he has locally. Sad. Puts too much pressure on me.
 
Xantippe said:
I think you’re quite right that things may be pretty bad at home for the 12-year-old, what with his rage-y older brother and preoccupied mom.

If there’s some way of getting him out occasionally without his brother, it could be a godsend.

But that may not be possible.
Click to expand...
He and my son both like math and science. I think I can interest just him in a science themed show. The older one would be looking for a peek show…no lie.
 
pianistclare said:
This^^.

Also, as you say you are not terribly social yourselves…but yet you’d likeyour son to have all this energy and desire for many friendships?
The apple doesn’t fall far from the tree. Maybe he’s not the social type. But then again, you HAVE to get him into some groups of similar interests as Xantippe often recommends. He HAS to get out. All of us, even yourself, when faced with a disappointment, large or small, tend to want to blame people, ask God WHY? and the like.

Now is the time to let dear son know that many people hurt us but mostly not intentionally.
Everyone has some battle they are fighting. What matters is the grace with which we fight our own, and that we don’t unduly burden others. Even people without any measurable disability need more than one or two friends. That’s a pretty huge investment in a fallible person or two. Is he interested in Scouting or Squires? There may be some groups like that which are specific to a young man’s interests as well as outside clubs and such. The important thing is to keep him around people. Lots of people. Lots of eyes watching & ears listening for further signs of deep depression. Be assured of our prayers.
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Thankfully, his cyber school is having 3 straight Tuesdays of community get-togethers. The kids get to meet and greet fellow classmates and teachers.
 
1990Domer said:
He and my son both like math and science. I think I can interest just him in a science themed show. The older one would be looking for a peek show…no lie.
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Lawdamercy.

So, you should be able to make it sound really boring to him while making it sound interesting to the 12-year-old. Good deal.

This may not work, but it’s worth trying.
 
1990Domer said:
You are also highly educated! Where did you go?
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I did undergraduate at University of Southern California (Thematic Option and Resident Honors program–so honors and an early entrance), Peace Corps in Russia, then MA “somewhere in Pennsylvania” (bailed on the doctorate) where I met my future husband.

Funny story:

At one point my husband was interviewing at USC. He mentioned to his interviewers that his wife was a USC alum. Interviewer said, “Our standards are much higher now.” Alrighty, then!
 
mommy_k said:
I am sorry for what you are going through Domer.

It’s time to dust yourself off, your son too, and start a new beginning–without relying on friends from the past. You can be nice to them-but find a new direction. If you have many things to do with your son-thier rudeness will not be as important to you.

Enroll your son in an activity that you think he will enjoy that is structured and that he will be good at-you know his talents. Set him up for success.

It could be swimming classes at the ymca, or music lessons or art class or recreational sports. I would choose something that is regulated with a coach or teacher. He will be around others-without having to have exceptional social skills-just the fun of the activity. Try new things until something clicks.

Best wishes
Click to expand...
Thank you. He does play trumpet and is quite good. But, we all need to get out of our comfort zone.
 
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