Can I work for the Episcopal church?

[PaulinVA]

Well, those darned Anglicans were the first mainline Christian denomination to allow artificial birth control, back in 1930.

The Episcopal church is the only mainline denomination that is a member of the pro abortion group “Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice”.

The Presiding Bishop of the Episcopal church believes that there are other ways to the Father other than Jesus. To say that Jesus is the only way is to put “God in a very small box”.

And, the practicing gay bishops are a bit of a stretch in any context.

I acknowledge it could be a very conservative parish you are being interviewed by, but the national church has run so far off of the rails I would be afraid it wouldn’t be good for you.

 

[OraLabora]

I acknowledge it could be a very conservative parish you are being interviewed by, but the national church has run so far off of the rails I would be afraid it wouldn’t be good for you.

If the OP is well-grounded in her faith, however, it might be good for them

 

[beeliner]

I’m not sure who mislead you into this. God has authority over everything, including sexual behaviors. Morally, sex is ordered towards unity and procreation. Anything that goes against that, including being closed to life by using artificial contraception, is disordered.

Then all of Christianity is misled except the RCC, I know of no other denomination that forbids contraception, do you? Is there any scriptural basis for such a prosciption? I certainly can’t think of any.

But it’s off the topic. The hierarchy will continue to forbid contraception and the membership will continue following their own individual consciences and, hopefully, their common sense.

 

[curlycool89]

Then all of Christianity is misled except the RCC, I know of no other denomination that forbids contraception, do you?

DING DING DING! We have a winner!

All of Christianity but the Catholic Church IS mislead because only the Catholic Church has the fullness of Truth and is protected and guided by the Holy Spirit. Others may contain elements of the Truth, but they have been perverted by fallible people for their own ends.

That’s the reason we want people to be Catholic. If you’re not Catholic, then you’re fundamentally missing the fullness of the Truth. Christ only founded 1 Church, the Catholic Church, not a bunch of churches.

The hierarchy will continue to forbid contraception and the membership will continue following their own individual consciences and, hopefully, their common sense.

You really shouldn’t be so happy about people separating themselves from God. What happens when people die separated from God? That’s Hell.

 

[Holly3278]

Well, from Rome’s perspective, male Episcopal priests are just as invalid as female Episcopal priests, right?

That is correct but that is not the point. The point is that women should never be ordained regardless of what church they are being ordained in. Personally, I have fewer problems with an invalidly ordained man than I do with an invalidly ordained woman. The difference being that with men, the ordination is sometimes valid (as in the case of the Catholic Church and the Orthodox Church) whereas with women, the ordination is always invalid.

 

[OraLabora]

Then all of Christianity is misled except the RCC, I know of no other denomination that forbids contraception, do you? Is there any scriptural basis for such a prosciption? I certainly can’t think of any.

The Catholic Church is not a scripture-only Church.

The proscription against contraception is in the Natural Law.

 

[beeliner]

1. All of Christianity but the Catholic Church IS mislead because only the Catholic Church has the fullness of Truth and is protected and guided by the Holy Spirit. Others may contain elements of the Truth, but they have been perverted by fallible people for their own ends.
2. That’s the reason we want people to be Catholic. If you’re not Catholic, then you’re fundamentally missing the fullness of the Truth. Christ only founded 1 Church, the Catholic Church, not a bunch of churches.
3. You really shouldn’t be so happy about people separating themselves from God. What happens when people die separated from God? That’s Hell.

Sigh.

1. Does the fullness of truth, excuse me, Truth with a capital T, include raping deaf kids? If not, strange that the Holy Spirit didn’t protect them.
2. How many non-Catholics do you imagine have converted as a result of your posts here?
3. Abandon your God-given intellect or abandon hope! Quite a choice.

P.S.(added later) If the above remarks seem disrespectful I apologize. The point is, the Church is in a grave crisis, and clinging to teachings that make no sense is not going to help. It’s time to clean house, in more ways than one.

 

[PhilipIII]

Hi everyone. Thank you for all the (name removed by moderator)ut. I’m going to have to turn down the job. I believe if it was a strictly business position there would be no conflict. I don’t like “shades of grey” or a situations that involve confusion. The position involves too many personal conflicts.
For example: Answering the phone and referring people in crisis to non-Catholic sources and writing the weekly bulletin.

Thanks again
God Bless

 

[beeliner]

Hi everyone. Thank you for all the (name removed by moderator)ut. I’m going to have to turn down the job. I believe if it was a strictly business position there would be no conflict. I don’t like “shades of grey” or a situations that involve confusion. The position involves too many personal conflicts.
For example: Answering the phone and referring people in crisis to non-Catholic sources and writing the weekly bulletin.

Thanks again
God Bless

Yeah, I guess if they are non-Catholics you would be referring them to non-Catholic sources.

And at this point, I think it’s worth a mention that the Episcopal Church and the Catholic Church, with all the positive things they share, are also both experiencing some negatives right now, The Anglican community is deeply divided over homosexual relations.

We all need to pray for both bodies of believers and for their leaders,

 

[kage_ar]

P.S.(added later) If the above remarks seem disrespectful I apologize. The point is, the Church is in a grave crisis, and clinging to teachings that make no sense is not going to help. It’s time to clean house, in more ways than one.

No, the media is having a field day and Satan is giggling with glee because the public eats it up with a spoon over a sinners.

Those who question the Church over this would have left Jesus because of Judas.

 

[beeliner]

No, the media is having a field day and Satan is giggling with glee because the public eats it up with a spoon over a sinners.

Those who question the Church over this would have left Jesus because of Judas.

The media is reporting the news because that’s their job.

There isn’t any question that the Church’s enemies are gleeful and that many of the accusations are false.

Many others, though, have been credibly documented, and at this point the worst possible thing that the Church can do is to attempt a whitewash or cover-up. Hopefully that will not happen, the pope’s 'get tough; attitude of the past few days is encouraging, but the proof is in the pudding. It may be too little too late. A papal resignation is a real possibility.

I guess my point, vis-a-vis my earlier exchanges on this thread, is that the “the-Church-can-do-no-wrong” attitude expressed by some here is a big part of the problem. That is obviously no longer true, one wonders if it were ever true. The Irish people, God bless them, used to have that attitude. Their trust has been shattered, they have been devastated by the recent revelations.

The Church has made enormous mistakes throughout its history, and now finds itself at a crossroads. This crisis could be a blessing in disguise, an opportunity to admit its shortcomings and bring itself into, if not the 21st or even the 20th, at least the 18th or 19th century.

There’s an old Chinese curse: “May you live in interesting times”. This is certainly an interesting time in Church history.

Of course the Episcopalians, whom this thread is supposed to be about, are also beset by turmoil just now.

 

[curlycool89]

1. Does the fullness of truth, excuse me, Truth with a capital T, include raping deaf kids? If not, strange that the Holy Spirit didn’t protect them.

I said “faith and morals”, ie the teachings, not the actions of the members. People seem to have trouble with that concept. The people of the Church, all the way up to and including the Pope, can still be terrible sinners. That doesn’t lessen the message. The people are fallible; the faith is not. The faith will always live on; the people will always die in the end.

The solution is obvious. The problem was that we weren’t following the faith. The solution is to become more Catholic, not less. Maybe that means going a little “backwards”. What it doesn’t mean is going into heresy, which I what I see some people proposing.

1. How many non-Catholics do you imagine have converted as a result of your posts here?

Honestly? I’m not here to convert non-Catholics. I never was. What I’ll never do is water down the faith to some touchy-feelly kum-bi-yah thing that is not Catholicism. The Truth has to be spoken, even if it falls on deaf ears.

1. Abandon your God-given intellect or abandon hope! Quite a choice.

Entering into a relationship with God and Jesus Christ is a free choice. I can’t speak for everyone here obviously, but I can say that my life has just gotten better since I did. It is my choice, nobody forced it on me. I don’t really care what the larger society thinks because I know exactly who’s right (the Church) and who’s wrong.

Sometime when I look, I think that this is one thing that the Protestants do well. They seem to do a much better job than we Catholics sometimes do at remembering it’s all about God, not about us.

It’s time to clean house, in more ways than one.

Oh, I agree. It’s probably time to get rid of all the heterodox and sometimes downright heretical priests (the ones who want priestesses, approve of contraception, etc) and bring in the next generation of very orthodox priests. I’ll even take the traditionalist priests, because even though I’m not a fan of the EF mass at least they’ll be teaching and preaching the real faith instead of some watered down faux faith.

 

[beeliner]

1. I said “faith and morals”, ie the teachings, not the actions of the members. People seem to have trouble with that concept. The people of the Church, all the way up to and including the Pope, can still be terrible sinners. That doesn’t lessen the message. The people are fallible; the faith is not. The faith will always live on; the people will always die in the end.
2. Honestly? I’m not here to convert non-Catholics. I never was. What I’ll never do is water down the faith to some touchy-feelly kum-bi-yah thing that is not Catholicism. The Truth has to be spoken, even if it falls on deaf ears.
3. Entering into a relationship with God and Jesus Christ is a free choice. I can’t speak for everyone here obviously, but I can say that my life has just gotten better since I did. It is my choice, nobody forced it on me. I don’t really care what the larger society thinks because I know exactly who’s right (the Church) and who’s wrong.
4. Sometime when I look, I think that this is one thing that the Protestants do well. They seem to do a much better job than we Catholics sometimes do at remembering it’s all about God, not about us.
5. Oh, I agree. It’s probably time to get rid of all the heterodox and sometimes downright heretical priests (the ones who want priestesses, approve of contraception, etc) and bring in the next generation of very orthodox priests. I’ll even take the traditionalist priests, because even though I’m not a fan of the EF mass at least they’ll be teaching and preaching the real faith instead of some watered down faux faith.

1. Well, here I agree with you wholeheartedly, it’s good to know we’re not entirely at odds.
2. Really? I thought you were. Here is what you wrote:

That’s the reason we want people to be Catholic. If you’re not Catholic, then you’re fundamentally missing the fullness of the Truth. Christ only founded 1 Church, the Catholic Church, not a bunch of churches.

I acknowledge that the Catholic Church can rightly claim apostolic succession as no other Christian body can. But that power has been abused, sometimes horribly, as in the current scandals, almost since Christianity began. Abuse of power led to Protestant Reformation. That the resulting sects and denominations were bastardized versions of Christianity is something upon which we probably agree. But this leads us to your next statement:

1. This is almost exactly what any Protestant will tell you.
2. See 4. Agreed.
3. Here is where I think you go seriously astray. Catholicism claims inspiration from scripture and tradition. Anglicans, who this thread is supposed to be about, claim inspiration from scriptue, tradition, and reason, common sense, they call it their ‘three-legged stool’.

The RCC has abandoned reason. Reason tells us that it is right, not sinful, for a married couple to use reliable methods of family planning.

Another example: A young couple, barely out of their teens, falls in love and marries in all good faith. The marriage turns out to be a disaster, for whatever reason, and they divorce, still in their early twenties. The Catholic Church insists that those two loyal Catholics must either reconcile (which, for the sake of argument we’ll say is not a viable option) or remain celibate until one of them dies, effectively ruining their lives, and the Church bases this teaching on nothing more than one offhand remark by Jesus. That is contrary to reason, no reasonable person would believe that that is what God wants or requires in such a situation.

The same principle applies to female clergy, no logical reason to imagine that God does not call women, or to imagine that the calling, the ‘tap on the shoulder’, experienced by those women who have had to leave the Catholic Church for the Episcopal in order to answer that call, is any less real than when experienced by a male.

Sadly, I’m afraid that, once this scandal has passed, the Church is likely to continue in your direction rather than the direction of reason. That will not bode well for Catholicism in the future.

But since the original poster has decided what to do, I consider the thread effectively closed, and this will be my last post here. Perhaps we will be able to exchange views elsewhere on the forum later on.

May God and reason guide the Catholic Church in the future!

 

[kage_ar]

I guess my point, vis-a-vis my earlier exchanges on this thread, is that the “the-Church-can-do-no-wrong” attitude expressed by some here is a big part of the problem. That is obviously no longer true, one wonders if it were ever true.

In Faith and Morals, the Church CAN do no wrong. If She does, then Jesus is a liar and we should all pack up and go home.

Individuals CAN sin, they do sin.

The Church cannot and does not.

If you do not believe this, think twice before you say “AMEN” and recieve communion, because by that AMEN you agree to all the Church teaches, including that She is the Bride of Christ and that She cannot err in teaching Faith and Morals.

 

[lizaanne]

In Faith and Morals, the Church CAN do no wrong. If She does, then Jesus is a liar and we should all pack up and go home.

Individuals CAN sin, they do sin.

The Church cannot and does not.

If you do not believe this, think twice before you say “AMEN” and recieve communion, because by that AMEN you agree to all the Church teaches, including that She is the Bride of Christ and that She cannot err in teaching Faith and Morals.

AMEN SISTAH!!!

~Liza

 

[curlycool89]

The RCC has abandoned reason. Reason tells us that it is right, not sinful, for a married couple to use reliable methods of family planning.

It’s not reason, it’s selfishness. Plain and simple. We want what we want and to that end we say “get out of the way God”. The Church can only teach what is true.

Another example: A young couple, barely out of their teens, falls in love and marries in all good faith. The marriage turns out to be a disaster, for whatever reason, and they divorce, still in their early twenties. The Catholic Church insists that those two loyal Catholics must either reconcile (which, for the sake of argument we’ll say is not a viable option) or remain celibate until one of them dies, effectively ruining their lives, and the Church bases this teaching on nothing more than one offhand remark by Jesus. That is contrary to reason, no reasonable person would believe that that is what God wants or requires in such a situation.

From the mouth of Jesus Himself:

The same principle applies to female clergy, no logical reason to imagine that God does not call women, or to imagine that the calling, the ‘tap on the shoulder’, experienced by those women who have had to leave the Catholic Church for the Episcopal in order to answer that call, is any less real than when experienced by a male.

There is no such thing as women priests. How is this so hard to understand? There’s no such thing. Again, there’s no theological reason for women priests, and there’s a boatload to support a male-only priesthood. In the Catholic Church, unlike every other Christian community, we work on theology, not emotion laden reasonless arguments.

In Faith and Morals, the Church CAN do no wrong. If She does, then Jesus is a liar and we should all pack up and go home.

Individuals CAN sin, they do sin.

The Church cannot and does not.

If you do not believe this, think twice before you say “AMEN” and recieve communion, because by that AMEN you agree to all the Church teaches, including that She is the Bride of Christ and that She cannot err in teaching Faith and Morals.

Amen.

 

[beeliner]

It’s pretty clear to me what God requires. You can’t divorce and get remarried. It’s as simple as that. You commit adultry (which in case I have to remind you, one of the 10 Commandments is “Thou shall not commit adultery”).

Just curious, curly, and anyone else who would care to reply, for whom did you vote in the last election? The president or the guy who divorced his wife, married another, and, according to the Catholic Church, is living in a state of continuing adultery and therefore bereft of God’s sanctifying grace?

You don’t have to answer, it’s more like a rhetorical question.

I think REASON, there’s that word again, would lead reasonable people to assume that Jesus was referring to a man who puts his wife away specifically for the purpose of marrying another, which is, of course, exactly what John McCain did

Jesus also said that anyone who even LOOKS AT a woman other than his wife lustfully has committed adultery. Ever done that, curly? (I’m assuming you are male). Another rhetorical question, no answer required.

I said in my previous post that I didn’t intend to continue posting to this thread because it has run its course, so I’m outa here. Tata.

 

[curlycool89]

Just curious, curly, and anyone else who would care to reply, for whom did you vote in the last election? The president or the guy who divorced his wife, married another, and, according to the Catholic Church, is living in a state of continuing adultery and therefore bereft of God’s sanctifying grace?

You don’t have to answer, it’s more like a rhetorical question.

I’m not American, and therefore didn’t vote. I can’t remember who I voted for in the last Canadian election.

Jesus also said that anyone who even LOOKS AT a woman other than his wife lustfully has committed adultery. Ever done that, curly? (I’m assuming you are male). Another rhetorical question, no answer required.

That’s what confession is for. Because we sure excel at falling short of that high bar. But through God’s grace we can separate ourselves from sin. It’s a high bar, but that’s what God’s set up for us and so it is our job to get there. When God says jump and we ask “how high”, it’s pretty high, but that is what we have to do. If you love God, then you just do it.

 

[kage_ar]

Just curious, curly, and anyone else who would care to reply, for whom did you vote in the last election? The president or the guy who divorced his wife, married another, and, according to the Catholic Church, is living in a state of continuing adultery and therefore bereft of God’s sanctifying grace?

.

Last I checked, Jesus did not run for election so all the canidates are sinners, just like me.

I voted for the person who would kill the fewest babies.