Can only Males incense the congregation at Mass?

[JimR-OCDS]

Yes I understand.

However, when our dioceses began a program for training Acolytes, they were told to stop.

A guy im my parish was one and I inquired with my pastor on how I could become an Acolyte.

He said it was stopped.

Jim

 

[Maximilian75]

That’s a pity…

It’s a beautiful office, and all of those minor orders have amazing liturgical patrimonies extending well before Trent.

 

[PetraG]

Since it is likely enough that the incense will be in use again for Trinity Sunday or Corpus Christi, you may as well get this cleared up right away. The other servers ought to be given the heads-up about how Father wants this handled, one way or the other.

If you have someone in charge of training the altar servers (rather than just scheduling them), you might want to ask them about it. This may be an asked-and-answered matter that you don’t have to bother Father with. Certainly, if there is a “new policy” or a question on policy, those in charge of keeping the altar servers informed on that sort of thing will want to know.

 

[TheOldColonel]

Since 1994, Males and females may be altar servers and thurifers in U.S. dioceses where the bishops do not object. It has been my experience that thurifers can be quite territorial. I have actually seen terrible arguments break out before Mass over who gets to be thurifer.

Just ask your priest to train your daughter and make clear to ALL when she may be thurifer. If the sacristan persists, then he must prove his claim via any current directives of your diocese. If he cannot, then he should stop interfering immediately.

 

[TheOldColonel]

You are correct, Acolyte is not a restored ministry as it was never suppressed. It remains, however, only open to men.

One who has not been Instituted by a Bishop or Archbishop as an Acolyte via the Roman Rite is errantly referred to as an Acolyte. Rather, he or she is an Altar Server regardless of age. Some distinction should be make regarding vestments for one who is Instituted. The proper attire for an Instituted Acolyte is Cassock with Collar and Cassock Rabat and belt cincture and Surplice or Cotta. An Intituted Acolyte may traditionally also wear a simple, black biretta without Pom, though this has long since fallen out of practice in most places. Since, 1972, being Instituted no longer places one in a Clerical State. Therefore, the ministry was opened to laymen regardless of whether they were in formation. But Institution is binding for life and should not be received or entered into lightly.

The Instituted Acolyte may perform duties Altar Servers may not such as purifying vessels, transporting the Eucharist to and from the tabernacle and placing vessels on or removing them from the altar. An Instituted Acolyte may also perform, in the absence of a deacon, other liturgical duties similar to the functions of a subdeacon.

 

[vallancec]

If she is 19 she needs to talk to your pastor about this. If the sacristan is doing this to her chances are good he’s doing it with other people.

 

[vallancec]

It’s sad that in the last month or two we’ve had threads where young people are getting spoken to just for doing the job as an alter sever.

 

[JohnLilburne]

The Instituted Acolyte may perform duties Altar Servers may not such as purifying vessels, transporting the Eucharist to and from the tabernacle and placing vessels on or removing them from the altar.

Only males can purify vessels at Mass. The Roman Missal has this in a number of places. For example, in the General Instruction of the Roman Missal:
“279. The sacred vessels are purified by the Priest, the Deacon, or an instituted acolyte after Communion or after Mass, insofar as possible at the credence table.

Also in the Order of Mass: “137. When the distribution of Communion is over, the Priest or a Deacon or an acolyte purifies the paten over the chalice and also the chalice itself.”

But there are so similar instructions about using the thurible.

Also there are no similar instructions about “placing vessels on or removing them from the altar” (as TheOldColonel wrote).

The Order of Mass has: “21. When all this has been done, the Offertory Chant begins. Meanwhile, the ministers place the corporal, the purificatory, the chalice, the pall, and the Missal on the altar.”

 

[BartholomewB]

Acolyte is not a restored ministry as it was never suppressed. It remains, however, only open to men.

From PetraG’s post #9:
Then the acolyte incenses the Priest and the people.

Putting 2 and 2 together, maybe the sacristan is right, after all. If incensing the priest and the people is to be done by the acolyte, not the thurifer, and if only a man can be an acolyte …

 

[thistle]

My daughter has been an Altar Server at our parish for 13 years. Recently, she was told to by a male sacristan that only men are allowed to incense the congregation. He lets her be the thurifer up until that point and then he takes it upon himself to do the task. My daughter asked a priest and he said if she is the thurifer, then she is to incense the congregation as well. However, the sacristan still refuses to allow her to do it and insists he is right. Is the sacristan correct?

Here in the Philippines females are not permitted to be altar servers or EMHC’s. That is restricted to males.
Females are generally the announcers, readers, and ushers here.

 

[PetraG]

Only males can purify vessels at Mass. The Roman Missal has this in a number of places. For example, in the General Instruction of the Roman Missal:
“279. The sacred vessels are purified by the Priest, the Deacon, or an instituted acolyte after Communion or after Mass, insofar as possible at the credence table.

Only the priest, deacon or an instituted acolyte may do it and only males can be ordained to those ministries, but males not ordained to those ministries are no more to be preferred than females.

I think that is a fairly important distinction. Laypeople are not second-class citizens, but there are also no second-class laypeople. If women and girls are allowed to do something within the Church, they are allowed to do it with the same dignity of station as men and boys. The men and boys who aren’t ordained in that way are no more to be preferred than any other lay person.

rom PetraG’s post #9:
Then the acolyte incenses the Priest and the people.

Putting 2 and 2 together, maybe the sacristan is right, after all. If incensing the priest and the people is to be done by the acolyte, not the thurifer, and if only a man can be an acolyte …

No, read what the USCCB says more carefully. They are very clear that if females are allowed to be altar servers there are not to be functions of an altar server open only to males but not to females. The women and girls are either to be allowed to be altar servers on the same basis as men and boys or else not allowed to do it at all. There is to be no creation of a “second class citizen” level of altar serving for females only.

 

[PetraG]

He is not an acolyte, he is only a sacristan.

This, by the way, is what the GIRM says are the duties of the sacristan:
105. A liturgical function is also exercised by:
a) The sacristan, who diligently arranges the liturgical books, the vestments, and other things that are necessary for the celebration of Mass.

The USCCB recognizes an altar server as someone who may fulfill the duties of an instituted acolyte, if the bishop approves.

The role of sacristan is a different role entirely; it has nothing to do with assisting the priest with the incense or anything else during Mass. Sacristans get to make sure the old ashes are cleaned out of the censer and perhaps lights the charcoal and fills the incense boat; we don’t assist the priest during Mass itself.

 

[BartholomewB]

No, read what the USCCB says more carefully. They are very clear that if females are allowed to be altar servers there are not to be functions of an altar server open only to males but not to females.

Yes, that is true about altar servers. But on the other hand, according to @TheOldColonel, an acolyte is not the same as an altar server:

The Instituted Acolyte may perform duties Altar Servers may not such as purifying vessels, transporting the Eucharist to and from the tabernacle and placing vessels on or removing them from the altar.

 

[PetraG]

The USCCB says this of altar servers:
Although institution into the ministry of acolyte is reserved to lay men, the diocesan bishop may permit the liturgical functions of the instituted acolyte to be carried out by altar servers, men and women, boys and girls. Such persons may carry out all the functions listed in no. 100 (with the exception of the distribution of Holy Communion) and nos. 187 - 190 and no. 193 of the General Instruction of the Roman Missal.

This is 190 and 193 (boldface mine: PetraG)
190. In the absence of a Deacon, after the Universal Prayer and while the Priest remains at the chair, the acolyte places the corporal, the purificator, the chalice, the pall, and the Missal on the altar. Then, if necessary, the acolyte assists the Priest in receiving the gifts of the people and, if appropriate, brings the bread and wine to the altar and hands them to the Priest. If incense is being used, the acolyte presents the thurible to the Priest and assists him while he incenses the offerings, the cross, and the altar. Then the acolyte incenses the Priest and the people…

193. After the celebration of Mass, the acolyte and other ministers return together with the Deacon and the Priest in procession to the sacristy, in the same manner and in the same order in which they entered.

The altar servers may not distribute Holy Communion. They may be allowed to do other things that an instituted acolyte does, provided that is not distributing Holy Communion, including the things listed in

The USCCB specifically says that altar servers duties specifically include “carry the cross, the processional candles, hold the book for the priest celebrant when he is not at the altar, carry the incense and censer, present the bread, wine, and water to the priest during the preparation of the gifts or assist him when he receives the gifts from the people, wash the hands of the priest, assist the priest celebrant and deacon as necessary (7)” but that they “may not distribute holy communion unless they have been mandated for this function by the bishop.” (10)

 

[PetraG]

As for what altar servers or Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion MAY NOT do, there is this:
The USCCB specifically excluded no. 191 and 192 from the list of acolyte duties that an altar server could also perform:
191. A duly instituted acolyte, as an extraordinary minister, may, if necessary, assist the Priest in distributing Communion to the people.[99] If Communion is given under both kinds, in the absence of a Deacon, the acolyte administers the chalice to the communicants or holds the chalice if Communion is given by intinction.

192. Likewise, after the distribution of Communion is complete, a duly instituted acolyte helps the Priest or Deacon to purify and arrange the sacred vessels. In the absence of a Deacon, a duly instituted acolyte carries the sacred vessels to the credence table and there purifies them, wipes them, and arranges them as usual.

In other words, “after the distribution of Communion is complete,” the altar servers do not “purify and arrange the sacred vessels” nor is an altar server the one who “carries the sacred vessels to the credence table…purifies them, wipes them, and arranges them…”

As for purifying vessels: “In those instances when there remains more consecrated wine than was necessary, if needs dictate, Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion may consume what remains of the Precious Blood from their cup of distribution with the permission of the diocesan bishop. The sacred vessles are to be purified by the priest, the deacon or an instituted acolyte.”

In other words, even though Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion may consume what remains of the Precious Blood from their cup of distribution, the purification of vessels itself is to be done by a priest, deacon or instituted acolyte only. No one else, neither male nor female, may do that.

 

[SuscipeMeDomine]

Can I suggest that at 19, it’s time for daddy to give his daughter the skills to stand up for herself. Now that you know the sacristan is wrong, help your daughter figure out how best to handle this on her own. Should she talk to the pastor? Should she deal with the sacristan directly? You might practice with her how she should address the issue.

 

[PetraG]

Can I suggest that at 19, it’s time for daddy to give his daughter the skills to stand up for herself. Now that you know the sacristan is wrong, help your daughter figure out how best to handle this on her own. Should she talk to the pastor? Should she deal with the sacristan directly? You might practice with her how she should address the issue.

I have eighteen year olds who were altar servers for many years. They are men now, old enough to vote and serve in the military, but they still have respect for their elders, especially at church.

There are sacristans at our church who were sacristans before our sons received their First Holy Communion. When it comes time when confrontation may be in order, it is not out of place for them to enlist the aid of older parishioners, whether their parents or someone else, so that the older person in need of correction is not losing face by being put into his or her place by someone so much younger. Our sons will be old enough to marry and be heads of their own households before they are going to feel it proper to be in the position of correcting their elders when they could avoid it.

 

[hkgranados]

Thank you for the clarification everyone! I think I will take it to the priest myself.

Yes, I know my daughter is an adult. She has asked a priest about this issue, and he said she should be the one to incense the congregation when she is the thurifer. Especially, since she has done it before in the past. The sacristan, however, refuses to allow her to do it. He claims that only men are allowed to incense. When my daughter tried to bring it up what the priest said, he wouldn’t let her speak, and kept saying he was right.

 

[hkgranados]

Yes, that is the confusion I am having. He has been taking it upon himself to do the job of the Altar Server, because he says only a male is supposed to incense the congregation.

 

[OsculeturMeOsculo]

I feel bad for the sacristan or is that just me.