Can raped girls abort?

[vz71]

If it’s conceived of rape, it’s not just an inconvenience. It can cause mental and emotional problems.

A possible cause.

Speaking in absolutes to try to harden the case only weakens it.

In the case of rape, there are a number of things that would contribute to mental and emotional problems. The child may or may not…and it is unfair to characterize the child in this manner.

I have read articles written by women that kept the child and found that bringing the positive out of the situation had a healing effect.

 

[kage_ar]

If it’s conceived of rape, it’s not just an inconvenience. It can cause mental and emotional problems. I commend those who chose to keep a child who was a product of rape. However, I would kill myself. I already have severe depression, anxiety, PTSD, and BPD(Which for those who don’t know, borderline personality disorder.) stemming from rape. If I was pregnant, telling me to keep the baby and just give it up for adoption would be like sentencing me to a psychological and even societal prison, because of the stigma unmarried women face when pregnant. I’ve had to claw myself out of the hole I was placed in already, and I wasn’t pregnant. It wouldn’t be an inconvenience if I was, it would be a reminder to me every day that my rapist stole everything from me.

You, your friend and should have recieved the very best in spiritual support, counseling, medical and legal action. I am sorry that someone did not protect you, did not help you and I pray that someone in your life will help you find healing through Christ Jesus.

A baby is also as important as you, and that child also deserves support and love.

Those of us who work tirelessly in the pro-life movement, we spend our time, our emotions and our money to help women in exactly the situation you are in. I wonder, how many pro-abortion people here volunteer with crisis pregnancy centers, give money to help babies, buy tanks of gas for strangers, pay rent and light bills, move heaven and earth on a regular basis to support women and kids and dads and grandparents???

How many are willing to drive an hour and sit up all night with a rape victim just to hold her hand and be Jesus to her?

I have, I do and I know many other pro life workers who do the same thing.

 

[wanner47]

Look at Brazil, where abortion is illegal except for the case of rape and the threat to the woman’s life. Backalley abortions rose, and they’re very expensive, and on top off that, care for the resulting infections and injuries rose. And to top THAT off, all that is apparently no secret, so what’s the point of making it illegal?

What’s your source for this?

Research has shown that countries with permissive abortion laws actually have HIGHER rates of maternal mortality than countries with strict abortion laws. See *prolifecampaign.ie/pages.php?id=92

Moreover, to carry your logic out to your fullest extent, why don’t we just legalize ALL murder? I mean, people are going to kill each other regardless of the laws against it, so what’s the point of having murder be illegal?

For that matter, why have laws at all if people will just break them anyway?

 

[Apryl]

If it’s conceived of rape, it’s not just an inconvenience. It can cause mental and emotional problems. I commend those who chose to keep a child who was a product of rape. However, I would kill myself. I already have severe depression, anxiety, PTSD, and BPD(Which for those who don’t know, borderline personality disorder.) stemming from rape. If I was pregnant, telling me to keep the baby and just give it up for adoption would be like sentencing me to a psychological and even societal prison, because of the stigma unmarried women face when pregnant. I’ve had to claw myself out of the hole I was placed in already, and I wasn’t pregnant. It wouldn’t be an inconvenience if I was, it would be a reminder to me every day that my rapist stole everything from me.

And WHY is it that you are sure that you would want to kill yourself?

What I mean is: why is the pregnancy such a painful idea?

We have spent so much time telling ourselves, ‘being pregnant after being raped would be SO HORRIBLE’… rather than saying, ‘being raped is horrible’, and the pregnancy can be separate.

Just like imagine someone saying, ‘if you get a job, your boss should give you two weeks paid vacation’. You get the job, and you’re told you get five days. Bwah! Now you’re upset. Why? Because of what you expected, and what you thought of it.

You’re dealing with a bunch of psychotropic issues and that’s a bad thing. Nothing you can control, really, and something we can all pray for, but it’s a problem. In order to prepare yourself for whatever may come up, be it a pregnancy after a rape, or whether its being unemployed, or whether its missing a flight to take you to the funeral of a loved one, you need to prepare yourself to come out on the other side.

No matter the circumstance, you are not allowed to end any one else’s life. Period. It’s still murder. Even if you face the rapist who raped you years ago, you do not have the right or authority to end that persn’s life. You need to prepare yourself with how you can and will deal with it without ending his life, andmaking yourself a murderer.

I can pray for you, but you also need to pray for yourself, and ask for strength

 

[Fidelis_Unus]

It’s simple enough to require enquiries into all underage pregnancies so that incest will be uncovered. Of course banning abortions might only lead to the abuser forcing the abused to undergo a back street abortion with all the health risks inherent, but I expect the foetus’s rights outweigh the mother’s yet again.

Well, you make a good point about back street abortion; although it’s hard to know how often this would happen, it is valid concern.

In terms of being “simple enough to require inquiries into all underage pregnancies” experiences since Roe v Wade show that this often does not happen. This is where parental consent laws would help. Yes, if the abuser is a parent it is less helpful (although not being so hidden make it more likely the other parent would find out; however if the abuser is an older teen or another male figure the parents would at least be able to provide help and guidance and protect their child. IMHO

 

[Fidelis_Unus]

I agree with you, better for it to be legal that illegal where one would get a back street abortion. That would just cause more trouble than it’s worth.

If it weren’t for the cost of a human life, I could agree with this sentiment.

Look at Brazil, where abortion is illegal except for the case of rape and the threat to the woman’s life. Backalley abortions rose, and they’re very expensive, and on top off that, care for the resulting infections and injuries rose. …

This is interesting to me, I’d like to look at Brazil. Can you save me some time by directing me to somewhere that has information about Brazil. I’m always open to new information.

Thanks Rence. Hope your day is going well!

 

[Fidelis_Unus]

If it’s conceived of rape, it’s not just an inconvenience. It can cause mental and emotional problems. I commend those who chose to keep a child who was a product of rape. However, I would kill myself. I already have severe depression, anxiety, PTSD, and BPD(Which for those who don’t know, borderline personality disorder.) stemming from rape. If I was pregnant, telling me to keep the baby and just give it up for adoption would be like sentencing me to a psychological and even societal prison, because of the stigma unmarried women face when pregnant. I’ve had to claw myself out of the hole I was placed in already, and I wasn’t pregnant. It wouldn’t be an inconvenience if I was, it would be a reminder to me every day that my rapist stole everything from me.

Eris

I’m not sure where you are, but here women no longer experience a stigma, in fact, being a single mom in quite Vogue right now, sadly. I just don’t see a societal prison here, I am truly sorry that your experience has been so difficult and have no wish to discount those feelings. I wish that life were not so hard. There are ideas you bring up that I do disagree with, though.

Again, most women who become pregnant from rape disagree with you and carry the child to term, many keep their child. There are statistics that support a far greater incidence of PTSD, mental/emotional trauma in women who were encouraged to abort their child after having been raped than in those women who gave birth the to child.

In my understanding BPMD does not stem from rape or any other experience, it is a mental illness that is hereditary and caused more by a chemical imbalance. A traumatic experience, causing PTSD, can contribute to mental illness, but is not a cause. You cannot blame the pregnancy for the mental illness. The trauma is due to the rapist, the mental illness is due to the chemical imbalance and the child has does nothing.

I pray that you will able to find peace in the storm.

 

[Eris_Discordia]

A possible cause.

Speaking in absolutes to try to harden the case only weakens it.

In the case of rape, there are a number of things that would contribute to mental and emotional problems. The child may or may not…and it is unfair to characterize the child in this manner.

I have read articles written by women that kept the child and found that bringing the positive out of the situation had a healing effect.

That’s why I said can cause. Can as in may. Like I said, I commend the women who have the strength to go through with it and be able to have her child and make something positive out of it. It takes a lot of courage and self sacrifice. I am not someone who would be able to do that. Also, I have severe tokophobia, and I already never want to be pregnant anyway, and it would honestly worsen the situation, which is already horrible to begin with.

 

[Eris_Discordia]

Eris

I’m not sure where you are, but here women no longer experience a stigma, in fact, being a single mom in quite Vogue right now, sadly. I just don’t see a societal prison here, I am truly sorry that your experience has been so difficult and have no wish to discount those feelings. I wish that life were not so hard. There are ideas you bring up that I do disagree with, though.

Again, most women who become pregnant from rape disagree with you and carry the child to term, many keep their child. There are statistics that support a far greater incidence of PTSD, mental/emotional trauma in women who were encouraged to abort their child after having been raped than in those women who gave birth the to child.

In my understanding BPMD does not stem from rape or any other experience, it is a mental illness that is hereditary and caused more by a chemical imbalance. A traumatic experience, causing PTSD, can contribute to mental illness, but is not a cause. You cannot blame the pregnancy for the mental illness. The trauma is due to the rapist, the mental illness is due to the chemical imbalance and the child has does nothing.

I pray that you will able to find peace in the storm.

BDMP? I’ve never heard it referred to as that. Also, maybe BDP or BDMP is not the right term. I’ve been trying to find a term that’s acurate, but they either aren’t describing it well, or it sounds to extreme. Also, it makes me sound crazy, and while it’s true, I hate sounding crazy to people who don’t know me very well. So BPD isn’t exactly what it is. It’s actually less severe DID. I had developed multiple alters to deal with what happened. It’s more accurately MPD, but I know that it is not classified as that anymore. I developed 3 other personalities to deal with it, because I had blocked out memories of it. And as for the PTSD, It compounds the depression and anxiety. I’ve also never had depression or anxiety before being raped. Also, as I mentioned, I have tokophobia, which is the phobia of being pregnant. If I were to get pregnant, I wouldn’t be able to handle it in any case, but compounded with being raped, I would either kill myself, or be in a psych ward. Neither is a good option. Also, being encouraged or forced into abortion is going to cause problems. Being coerced into it is terrible, and the person should be able to make their own decisions, even in the case of rape and incest. I have thought about it long and hard, and I know that if I didn’t have an abortion, I would be 6 feet under. Especially being a student, I can’t afford to miss that much school for any reason, because it’s already hard enough to pay for as it is. It would ruin my mom and I financially, and I can’t do that to her.

 

[Fidelis_Unus]

In reading my previous post I realize that it sounds more clinical than I’d like. I tried to not seem judgmental, as I am not judging anyone in this situation.

Perhaps if I share that I, too, was raped in my twenties where I was alone and had no one to turn to. It completely destroyed the plans I had and there was no one to tell, no one to help. Even so, while I did not become pregnant, there is no way I would have gotten an abortion. It’s easy to think that we each dodged a bullet, except that later … when I had my daughter I finally made choices to protect her, when I had not protected myself. It not only gave me a better life, but in doing so I learned to love myself, too, and not allow people to treat me the badly. It’s hard to know, so I simply trust in God’s Plan for me. In having a child, God brought me to a better life and a place where i could love Him and love others.

I also suffer from BMPD. All my siblings do as well (bipolar schitzo-affective, depressive disorder and schitzphrenia, etc.) Some handle it better than others, some get better help, some have addictions. I finally found a very good doctor and no one would ever know if I didn’t tell them. I suffer from Fibromyalgia, too, perhaps triggered by this single traumatic experience. For whatever reason God has put these things in my life and I willingly accept them. For, “There but for the grace of God go I.”

Thank you for having the courage to share your experience. This is such an emotional issue and, yes, there are always some very unkind postings. I hope you find mostly love and compassion. I hope, too, that you are able to find the healing and the practical help to be able to find joy and be at rest. I wish there was a magic answer to give you, I truly do. For me, the answer was and is, Trusting in Him.

 

[Eris_Discordia]

Thank you for having the bravery to speak up Eris. I don’t know that anyone who hasn’t been through such an ordeal could possibly know what it would be like, which is why I find it impossible to condemn a woman making the decision to have an abortion in those circumstances.

Bless you sister, you are in my prayers.

Thanks a lot. Your kind words are really appreciated. It means a lot.

 

[Eris_Discordia]

You, your friend and should have recieved the very best in spiritual support, counseling, medical and legal action. I am sorry that someone did not protect you, did not help you and I pray that someone in your life will help you find healing through Christ Jesus.

A baby is also as important as you, and that child also deserves support and love.

Those of us who work tirelessly in the pro-life movement, we spend our time, our emotions and our money to help women in exactly the situation you are in. I wonder, how many pro-abortion people here volunteer with crisis pregnancy centers, give money to help babies, buy tanks of gas for strangers, pay rent and light bills, move heaven and earth on a regular basis to support women and kids and dads and grandparents???

How many are willing to drive an hour and sit up all night with a rape victim just to hold her hand and be Jesus to her?

I have, I do and I know many other pro life workers who do the same thing.

I know many pro choice people who have done this for me as well. I do this, too. I can’t do very much with distance because of not owning a vehicle, but I have and do reach out to other survivors as much as possible. I started a thread on my other forum, which has helped a number of other survivors, and am planing on starting a support group at my school. And if I had more than a dollar to my name, I would help with bills and things like that. There are also many, many pro choice people who take care of rape survivors. Feminists especially care for rape survivors, and many of them donate to support groups and shelters for DV victims. I’ve heard more about denouncing rape from them than the Church. Most of my friends here are pro-choice, and all of us would do anything for each other. An example is when I counseled a friend who had been raped until 4 in the morning over the phone, because I was unable to get to her. Pro choice doesn’t automatically mean that you don’t care about the children involved, because many of us do. If I had more time and money, I would be doing so much more for women in general, who choose to keep their child against all odds, adopt the child out, or abort.

 

[Fidelis_Unus]

BDMP? I’ve never heard it referred to as that. Also, maybe BDP or BDMP is not the right term.

Sorry, you’re right. Can’t type, can’t see the screen, must be getting old.

It sounds like you have so much going on, I wish it were easier.

Being coerced into it is terrible, and the person should be able to make their own decisions, even in the case of rape and incest.

I wish I could agree with this, but there are two points: a) the pregnancy happened, we did not 'cause it any more than we caused the rape and b) there is another human life involved, just as precious, just as deserving.

Especially being a student, I can’t afford to miss that much school for any reason, because it’s already hard enough to pay for as it is. It would ruin my mom and I financially, and I can’t do that to her.

Financial reasons for getting an abortion are simply not valid to me. I was a single mother over a decade with no help. It was hard, but not impossible. There is a lot of help here for single parents, including assistance to allow women to go to school. Did you know that there are adoption agencies that actually provide scholarships to cover college education for women who give their child up for adoption?

 

[Doc_Keele]

I know many pro choice people who have done this for me as well. I do this, too. I can’t do very much with distance because of not owning a vehicle, but I have and do reach out to other survivors as much as possible. I started a thread on my other forum, which has helped a number of other survivors, and am planing on starting a support group at my school. And if I had more than a dollar to my name, I would help with bills and things like that. There are also many, many pro choice people who take care of rape survivors. Feminists especially care for rape survivors, and many of them donate to support groups and shelters for DV victims. I’ve heard more about denouncing rape from them than the Church. Most of my friends here are pro-choice, and all of us would do anything for each other. An example is when I counseled a friend who had been raped until 4 in the morning over the phone, because I was unable to get to her. Pro choice doesn’t automatically mean that you don’t care about the children involved, because many of us do. If I had more time and money, I would be doing so much more for women in general, who choose to keep their child against all odds, adopt the child out, or abort.

Great to hear some concrete examples of how people who are pro-choice don’t have horns growing out of their head! Refreshing to hear from a different perspective:thumbsup:

Thanks a lot. Your kind words are really appreciated. It means a lot

You’re welcome.
What a brave lady you are :hug1: I must tell you about my mother by PM sometime.

 

[jweath11]

I agree that the child isn’t at fault in any way shape or form.

What I would hope is that I could help this girl, be supportive after such a tramatic ordeal.
In my own experience knowing that I wasn’t alone is what saved me. I couldn’t have made it through such a nightmare, without knowing that god was always there for me. My faith was never so important, it got me through something I thought I could never come back from.

"“Being unwanted, unloved, uncared for, forgotten by everybody, I think that is a much greater hunger, a much greater poverty than the person who has nothing to eat…We must find each other.”
Mother Teresa

 

[vz71]

… it would honestly worsen the situation, which is already horrible to begin with.

How can you be so certain?

 

[Rence]

Thanks. It’s hard sometimes, though. Unless you’ve been through it, you really can’t understand. God forbid that happens, I’d rather have people not know what I am talking about than go through what I did. I’m glad I never had to make that decision, either. I’m “Lucky” in some regards because what happened to me wasn’t as bad as some of the things I’ve heard. I have a thread for survivors on another forum, and I don’t know how some of the others function. But anyway, I’m glad someone doesn’t judge, though I’m sure some will. I had apprehensions about commenting on this, because of how some of the posters react. I just can’t sit idly anymore, because far to many people have made a lot of comments that lack compassion for the mother in this case, who is a survivor of a horrible event. I’m protective of other survivors, whether IRL and online.

Listen, only Eris should tell Eris what to do in Eris’ situation. Especially when such advice is not asked for. You have to live with you and your decisions. It’s easy for someone else to tell you what you should do in your situation, or to tell YOU what are capable of enduring, or what you can deal with, what you should tolerate, what you should choose, but in the end, you’re the one who has to make the choices and live with them. Not anyone else. Who am I to judge you? I don’t live your life. You do.

 

[Rence]

If it weren’t for the cost of a human life, I could agree with this sentiment.

**It does cost lives, on both sides, either way the coin is tossed. **

This is interesting to me, I’d like to look at Brazil. Can you save me some time by directing me to somewhere that has information about Brazil. I’m always open to new information.

**Yes Fidelis, a few pages back there was a post about a 9 year old girl who was raped by her stepfather and pregnant as a result, with twins. She had an abortion and everyone involved was excommunicated. If you follow the link to that article, you’ll read about how abortions there are illegal except for cases of rape and the woman’s life being in danger. But people just go to illegal abortionists, which are very expensive, and then the after-care is dealt with in legitimate hospitals. **

Thanks Rence. Hope your day is going well!

Yours too!

 

[Rence]

BDMP? I’ve never heard it referred to as that. Also, maybe BDP or BDMP is not the right term. I’ve been trying to find a term that’s acurate, but they either aren’t describing it well, or it sounds to extreme. Also, it makes me sound crazy, and while it’s true, I hate sounding crazy to people who don’t know me very well. So BPD isn’t exactly what it is. It’s actually less severe DID. I had developed multiple alters to deal with what happened. It’s more accurately MPD, but I know that it is not classified as that anymore. I developed 3 other personalities to deal with it, because I had blocked out memories of it. And as for the PTSD, It compounds the depression and anxiety. I’ve also never had depression or anxiety before being raped. Also, as I mentioned, I have tokophobia, which is the phobia of being pregnant. If I were to get pregnant, I wouldn’t be able to handle it in any case, but compounded with being raped, I would either kill myself, or be in a psych ward. Neither is a good option. Also, being encouraged or forced into abortion is going to cause problems. Being coerced into it is terrible, and the person should be able to make their own decisions, even in the case of rape and incest. I have thought about it long and hard, and I know that if I didn’t have an abortion, I would be 6 feet under. Especially being a student, I can’t afford to miss that much school for any reason, because it’s already hard enough to pay for as it is. It would ruin my mom and I financially, and I can’t do that to her.

Wow, you’ve really been through a lot Eris. I’m so glad that you formed the support group here on CAF. I hope it helps you. I think it would be a great idea for you to form a similar one at school. Rape is so horrible and scarring, and women don’t seem to get the support they need enough (or men for that matter). I wish you success in forming that group so that you all can explore your feelings and talk about it.

You’re right that it takes a different person to consent to being pregnant after a rape. I’m glad these women can overcome the terror and trauma well enough. But like you, I don’t think I could either. And at the very least, we have THAT choice.

 

[Rence]

This is interesting to me, I’d like to look at Brazil. Can you save me some time by directing me to somewhere that has information about Brazil. I’m always open to new information.

Here Eris:
time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1883598,00.html

"Abortion is illegal in Brazil except in cases of rape or when the mother’s life is in danger, both of which apply in this case. "…“Although abortion is illegal, an estimated 1 million women each year have one. The poor are forced into clandestine clinics or take medication, while the better-off are treated by qualified physicians at well-appointed surgeries known to anyone with money and overlooked by colluding authorities.
That secrecy has a price. More than 200,000 women each year are treated in public hospitals for complications arising from illegal abortions, according to Health Ministry figures”.

Which is kind of what I expected. So no surprise there.