Can raped girls abort?

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You are right…and I say that respectfully this time…Forgive me for being…well…whatever I was being…
I totally see that abortion is murder…I am not disagreeing, but women who have been raped…(and I am one of them…as a child…by a brother 7 years older…who I had to face for the rest of his life, until he died just over a year ago)
Holding up signs saying abortion is murder and punishing women who are considering it to be their only option, may not see things the way all of you who know how precious life is…we are all children of God…and some of us dont know it yet…we should be praying for women who get pregnant by rape and dont yet know God…not condemning them…that is all I am saying…

I did over-react and for that I am sorry…but please under stand…I am just now for the first time in my life (at 43) recognizing that I am a child of God and although I have never had an abortion and would never consider it now…I have in the past…but did not…I ended up having a miscarriage though at just over 3 mons…and it was horrible. TO the medical profession…it seemed as though they didnt even consider it a person…THe doctor said I lost alot of ‘tissue’ in the toilet…meaning the baby…
I didnt even want a D & C, because I didnt believe the child had died, but I was assured otherwise…

I was hoping that these forums would be a place of compassion and healing, but I think with the issues I am facing right now…for my own sake…I need to stay away from certain topics (like rape) and then I will not over-react…and say things I regret…

I hope everyone will forgive me whom I have offended in any way
Oh wow, don’t worry about offending people. I didn’t feel offended at all; just surprised a bit and then very saddened because it was obvious you were suffering and I didn’t want you to leave. I’m so sorry at what happened to you. I’ve had two miscarriages and understand the experience. My doctor told me to abort and I told him no but it was too late anyway. My daughter was dead and, yes, she was delivered into a toilet, just like yours.

My doctor didn’t care. They took my child and dissected her, without our permission and then they threw her away like garbage. We never got to bury her - they called her “tissue” or “human tissue” but never “your baby.” Nobody said they were sorry or asked what they could do. My doctor sent me home without even telling me that I would go through delivery and when I did it hurt so much and I remember crying for my husband. Nobody knew what to do.

This all happened almost thirty years ago. I thought things would have to be better but now I wonder if they have improved at all. I’m so sorry. I’m just so sorry.

And I’m sorry that you were raped. It sounds like you have had a rough life. I can’t identify with you as a rape victim but believe me, I feel for you.

You are right about prayer. Prayer can be so powerful and we should pray for all women who feel the despair that leads them to such a drastic decision. Sometimes I forget to do that and you have reminded me about how important it is. Thank you.

I’ve known people who have had abortions and feel horrible about what they’ve done. But one thing I’ve learned while debating the abortion issue is that the mother shouldn’t be condemned. The mother is a victim. I get very angry at physicians who should know better and for places like Planned Parenthood that are very good at talking unsure women into having abortions and denying that any woman who goes through that experience develops emotional problems afterward. As a child of God you know that He loves you. I know God understands and is a merciful judge and will forgive anything. Anything and everything. Someone told me that the worst sin anyone can imagine is like a drop of water in an infinite sea of God’s love. That’s held me together at times. I hold onto God’s love like a life preserver.

There are groups that can help you grieve over your losses, both your baby and your innocence. I hope somebody here knows how to find out how to access them. You can try calling your church. If you’re not Catholic you can still call the local Catholic church and ask them. Or a local clinic or hospital should have that info. I’ve thought about going to some of these groups to deal with my losses.

I don’t know what else to say except that I am so happy that you have stayed. You are probably right about staying out of the abortion threads for now - they can get nasty, although many of the prolifers have lost children through abortion and/or miscarriage. You are very strong. I know that because it took guts to come back and post again.

Does anyone here know where she can go in CAF to get some support? I don’t know but it seems to me there must be a support group or two that can help.

I wish the best for you. Maybe if we all stand together we can stop atrocities like rape, abortion, and the way miscarried children and their parents are treated. You are in my prayers. I hope you find peace.

God bless you!!
Christina
 
You are right…and I say that respectfully this time…Forgive me for being…well…whatever I was being…
I totally see that abortion is murder…I am not disagreeing, but women who have been raped…(and I am one of them…as a child…by a brother 7 years older…who I had to face for the rest of his life, until he died just over a year ago)
Holding up signs saying abortion is murder and punishing women who are considering it to be their only option, may not see things the way all of you who know how precious life is…we are all children of God…and some of us dont know it yet…we should be praying for women who get pregnant by rape and dont yet know God…not condemning them…that is all I am saying…

I did over-react and for that I am sorry…but please under stand…I am just now for the first time in my life (at 43) recognizing that I am a child of God and although I have never had an abortion and would never consider it now…I have in the past…but did not…I ended up having a miscarriage though at just over 3 mons…and it was horrible. TO the medical profession…it seemed as though they didnt even consider it a person…THe doctor said I lost alot of ‘tissue’ in the toilet…meaning the baby…
I didnt even want a D & C, because I didnt believe the child had died, but I was assured otherwise…

I was hoping that these forums would be a place of compassion and healing, but I think with the issues I am facing right now…for my own sake…I need to stay away from certain topics (like rape) and then I will not over-react…and say things I regret…

I hope everyone will forgive me whom I have offended in any way
I am sure that writing this was difficult for you, but it is good to see you are still here.

My priest has often sent me to Psalm 139, particularly…

III
You formed my inmost being;
you knit me in my mother’s womb.
I praise you, so wonderfully you made me;
wonderful are your works!

My very self you knew;
my bones were not hidden from you,
When I was being made in secret,
fashioned as in the depths of the earth.
Your eyes foresaw my actions;
in your book all are written down;
my days were shaped, before one came to be.


You ARE a child of God, and God loves all His children unconditionally.

I will continue to keep you in prayer, and will pray for you to find peace and healing.

God bless
 
Has any one else noticed that the OP hasn’t posted again on this topic? :rolleyes:

I tend to avoid these topics, esp when they are started by ‘New Members’. 😦
 
Thanks for the prayers…
Just to clariify from an earlier post , in case of any misunderstandings…I never had an abortion …I did consider it…that was when I was at a very messed up time in my life, but I ended up having the miscarriage at just past 3 mons

I did do a lot of grieving and healing…and when I find the poem I wrote, I’ll share it somewhere…not sure what category.

Healing from the sexual abuse is something I deal with everyday…I know I am in good hands…and I have healed alot already…
My sufferings have brought me closer to Jesus though than I ever dreamed possible.

I will continue with my journey and pray that I may someday be in full communion with the RC church…
 
Thanks for the prayers…
Just to clariify from an earlier post , in case of any misunderstandings…I never had an abortion …I did consider it…that was when I was at a very messed up time in my life, but I ended up having the miscarriage at just past 3 mons

I did do a lot of grieving and healing…and when I find the poem I wrote, I’ll share it somewhere…not sure what category.

Healing from the sexual abuse is something I deal with everyday…I know I am in good hands…and I have healed alot already…
My sufferings have brought me closer to Jesus though than I ever dreamed possible.

I will continue with my journey and pray that I may someday be in full communion with the RC church…
:hug1: God bless you. . .He loves you and so do we. You are one courageous and remarkable woman. Please keep us in your prayers as you journey and know you’ll be in ours as well.
 
I’ve followed your link and I’m a bit confused about this group. I don’t know if it is an organization formally affiliated with the Catholic Church - I have my doubts. I tried to email the group but I wasn’t able to (computer problems). I tried to phone them and someone did answer but he transferred me and then nobody answered the phone.

I don’t think this is Church teaching.

Do you or does anybody else have any further info on this group?

Thanks - I don’t mean to question you or anything but I’ve run across some other websites that don’t conform to Church teaching even though they use the word “Catholic” in their title.
Its the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops, as mandated by the Vatican.

The Church has only spoken on the contraceptive use of BC within a marriage relationship, a woman has the natural and moral right to protect herself from an unwanted pregnancy.
 
You are right…and I say that respectfully this time…Forgive me for being…well…whatever I was being…
I totally see that abortion is murder…I am not disagreeing, but women who have been raped…(and I am one of them…as a child…by a brother 7 years older…who I had to face for the rest of his life, until he died just over a year ago)
Holding up signs saying abortion is murder and punishing women who are considering it to be their only option, may not see things the way all of you who know how precious life is…we are all children of God…and some of us dont know it yet…we should be praying for women who get pregnant by rape and dont yet know God…not condemning them…that is all I am saying…

I did over-react and for that I am sorry…but please under stand…I am just now for the first time in my life (at 43) recognizing that I am a child of God and although I have never had an abortion and would never consider it now…I have in the past…but did not…I ended up having a miscarriage though at just over 3 mons…and it was horrible. TO the medical profession…it seemed as though they didnt even consider it a person…THe doctor said I lost alot of ‘tissue’ in the toilet…meaning the baby…
I didnt even want a D & C, because I didnt believe the child had died, but I was assured otherwise…

I was hoping that these forums would be a place of compassion and healing, but I think with the issues I am facing right now…for my own sake…I need to stay away from certain topics (like rape) and then I will not over-react…and say things I regret…

I hope everyone will forgive me whom I have offended in any way
Fear Not - Nothing really to forgive. We all get testy at times, especially when something hist close to home.
Your testimony enlightens us greatly on why you spoke as you did, and I am exceedingly glad that you posted it. Thank you very much for coming back to the conversation.

Praise God

Peace
James
 
Its the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops, as mandated by the Vatican.

The Church has only spoken on the contraceptive use of BC within a marriage relationship, a woman has the natural and moral right to protect herself from an unwanted pregnancy.
Thank you for the clarification. What I’ve been able to find out so far (by asking around) that someone I know believes that there is a special rule for cases of rape, carefully worded, which makes sense because in a rape there is no renewal of the covenant that is necessary in marriage. But she thinks it must be an actual contraceptive which is what I believe some “emergency medications” are.

Now I understand a little bit more. It’s difficult to trust websites that use the word “Catholic” in their names because it can be very misleading. I looked at the website and couldn’t find anything anti-Catholic or non-Catholic so I really didn’t know what I was looking at and got very confused (which is a normal state for me).

Thanks again!! 🙂
 
Has any one else noticed that the OP hasn’t posted again on this topic? :rolleyes:

I tend to avoid these topics, esp when they are started by ‘New Members’. 😦
:hmmm: I do believe you’re right. That’s the second time this has happened to me. I’m the OP of a thread right now and I try to keep a close eye on it so that it doesn’t go off-topic.

I wonder why anyone would start a thread and then just leave.
 
:hmmm: I do believe you’re right. That’s the second time this has happened to me. I’m the OP of a thread right now and I try to keep a close eye on it so that it doesn’t go off-topic.

I wonder why anyone would start a thread and then just leave.
I think the Hit-N-Run topic starters just want to try to turn up muck, and watch it go (NOT THAT I’M SAYING THAT’S WHAT HAPPENED THIS TIME)

I only noticed because EVERY post on the thread was saying that it is not a good thing to abort the human product of a rape… but no one was saying why it should be an available option, or why any one would want to do it. :rolleyes:

I was looking for that so that I could post in a response to such claims. 🙂

The OP had bad spelling and grammar, and the question was suspect (to me) :confused:

I realize that there are a lot of people who think that abortion is the answer, and I was afriad that some people think that abortion should be supported by the church… and sadly, some folx WITHIN the church agree with this assessment. :eek:

I came in here to try to keep that from happening. Whether it was the intent of the OP or not. 😊
 
Thanks for the prayers…
Just to clariify from an earlier post , in case of any misunderstandings…I never had an abortion …I did consider it…that was when I was at a very messed up time in my life, but I ended up having the miscarriage at just past 3 mons

I did do a lot of grieving and healing…and when I find the poem I wrote, I’ll share it somewhere…not sure what category.

Healing from the sexual abuse is something I deal with everyday…I know I am in good hands…and I have healed alot already…
My sufferings have brought me closer to Jesus though than I ever dreamed possible.

I will continue with my journey and pray that I may someday be in full communion with the RC church…
You can get through this pain, I promise. My wife did (it was her biological father who abused her) and she is just your age. It took time, counselling and God.

My prayers are with you!:gopray:
 
You are right…and I say that respectfully this time…Forgive me for being…well…whatever I was being…
I totally see that abortion is murder…I am not disagreeing, but women who have been raped…(and I am one of them…as a child…by a brother 7 years older…who I had to face for the rest of his life, until he died just over a year ago)
Holding up signs saying abortion is murder and punishing women who are considering it to be their only option, may not see things the way all of you who know how precious life is…we are all children of God…and some of us dont know it yet…we should be praying for women who get pregnant by rape and dont yet know God…not condemning them…that is all I am saying…

**Not to mention the posttraumatic stress, the fear, the depression, the anxiety, the confusion, the misplaced embarassment and shame. Victims of rape need understanding and lots of help get them through coping with this. In addition to all of the mind, body and spiritual responses to the event itself, they now have hormones adding to the equation. Though, this is not what this post was about. The OP asked if it was acceptable to have an abortion in the case of rape (and then disappeared 😉 )

You also have to remember that a VERY small percentage of abortions are performed due to rape.

No, it’s not acceptable, but it is understandible in light of the mental and emotional anquish that a rape victim goes through.

Some women, whether they have a solid spiritual foundation or not, may be able to see clearly though all that turmoil to be able to have that child. Others aren’t going to be able to do that. The whirlwind inside of themselves is not going to let them cope with it, no matter which choice they make.

As to taking emergency contraception if the doctors can detect if the patient is already pregnant or not, I don’t see how that can happen. Plan B Emergency contraception must be given in two doses: the first dose within 120 hours after the event, and the second does 12 hours later. That’s because you need to take it before ovulation, which is prevented by EC because inhibits follicular development. After ovulation, Plan B won’t work to prevent a pregnancy. So it must be taken as soon as possible. EC doesn’t disturb an implanted pregnancy, so EC is ineffective if given after a woman is pregnant. In other words, it’s not an ‘abortion pill’, it simply inhibits ovulation. However, it takes 7-10 days to detect pregnancy via blood or urine tests. Considering EC doesn’t have any effect on a current pregnancy, it would be in the best interest of the person taking it to take it while in the emergency room. But I’m sure I’ll be contradicted by someone :rolleyes: And that’s okay: The knowledge and resources I have available to me is what I will stick with, and of course, if someone else is sold on another piece of research, they’ll be sold on that. No sense in arguing about it.

I don’t know what the Church’s official stance on taking EC after a rape is. I’m sure there’s an Encyclical or some document that covers it. Does anyone have a resource handy?

Also, has anyone read a study on the effects on the mother of continuing verses terminating a pregnancy incurred due to rape? I haven’t seen such a study, but it would be interesting to read. I’m very sure the situation is difficult no matter what the choice. If anyone has a link to such a study, please let me know.**

I was hoping that these forums would be a place of compassion and healing,
**
It is, so please stay 🙂 **

but I think with the issues I am facing right now…for my own sake…I need to stay away from certain topics (like rape) and then I will not over-react…and say things I regret…

**I do too. Folks on this forum are very caring and very dedicated, but sometimes they get a bit emotional about these high-controversy posts and forget there are actually people on the other side of the computer 🙂 I do too when I get upset. But I really try to respond to posts without sarcasm or without being condescending or judgemental, and if I fail, I expect others to be just as human as I am. But I wish we could all be a little bit more understanding and compassionate with each other.

Controversial issues are difficult issues, otherwise they wouldn’t be so fun for some people to ‘hit and run’ the forum with 🙂 **
 
If a girl or woman’s life or health is put at great risk …why does the unborn baby’s life come first? Allowing the mother to die is ok?
This is an important question to address, I am glad that you asked. This is where dialogue starts and I pray that I can find words to share my thoughts clearly. I am, in no way judging women who make this choice, I volunteer at 2 maternity homes and have good friends and immediate family who are homeless, some by choice, some not. I say this only so you know that I am not walking around with blinders on, oblivious to the hardships of people who suffer mental illness and addition.

There are guidelines from the Church and a woman or spouse having to make such a horrible decision should discuss with their priest, who will be far more knowledgeable than I about Humane Vitae.

I will try, with my limited ability to explain how this decision is made and (with my humble understanding) and I DREAD even saying this for fear someone will read it wrong or use my words to justify a terrible, terrible decision. That being said, I believe within Church teaching, there are cases where termination of the pregnancy may be done. It is EXTREMELY rare. Far more rare than cases of rape. So rare that talking about it even gives the situation more attention than I believe it deserves.

My understanding is this, in cases where the baby cannot possible survive outside the womb and not terminating the pregnancy would most certainly end the mother’s life, ergo the baby’s life, (then and only then) it MAY be permissible to terminate the pregnancy. This is a decision that someone is to make in close discussion with their priest and their doctor. It is NOT an excuse to allow abortion on demand. It is not a cut and dried as many people believe and is done in such a way that Life will be most likely to prevail, that of the mother’s and baby’s, if possible. I hope this helps.

Honestly, this is far less credible example than the highly unlikely case of rape. There simply are not that many situations that arise like this; however, people use this as an excuse to put in “for health or psychological reasons” clause that has made it possible for anyone, for any reason to get an abortion, often at taxpayers expense. Even the Planned Parenthood’s statistics don’t support this as being an issue.

Sadly, though, playing on people’s heartstrings like this particular rationale has been responsible for the deaths of MILLIONS of children and untold suffering for women who think that this is a harmless choice and find themselves dealing with mental health issues that no one warned them about. These women, all of them, need love, compassion and understanding. They need all the love that we can give them, they have suffered so. With that, we must still stand up for God’s Truth, this is also part of loving.

My personal experience is that this is an extremely painful situation and any efforts at speaking the Truth are often met with anger and heard as being judgmental because people have been told over and over and over about those judgmental right-wing fanatics who want to take away your rights, etc. Mostly it is painful because of how these women suffer and how highly highly sensitive they are. I hope that doesn’t sound defensive, it’s not meant to. Just being realistic about the influences in the world. The bottom line for me? a life is a life is a life and only God gets to “choose”.

I pray that helps, at least to give you something to think about.

Blessings
 
If a girl or woman’s life or health is put at great risk …why does the unborn baby’s life come first? Allowing the mother to die is ok?
This is an important question to address, I am glad that you asked. This is where dialogue starts and I pray that I can find words to share my thoughts clearly. I am, in no way judging women who make this choice, I volunteer at 2 maternity homes and have good friends and immediate family who are homeless, some by choice, some not. I say this only so you know that I am not walking around with blinders on, oblivious to the hardships of people who suffer mental illness and addition.

There are guidelines from the Church and a woman or spouse having to make such a horrible decision should discuss with their priest, who will be far more knowledgeable than I about Humane Vitae.

I will try, with my limited ability to explain how this decision is made and (with my humble understanding) and I DREAD even saying this for fear someone will read it wrong or use my words to justify a terrible, terrible decision. That being said, I believe within Church teaching, there are cases where termination of the pregnancy may be done. It is EXTREMELY rare. Far more rare than cases of rape. So rare that talking about it even gives the situation more attention than I believe it deserves.

My understanding is this, in cases where the baby cannot possible survive outside the womb and not terminating the pregnancy would most certainly end the mother’s life, ergo the baby’s life, (then and only then) it MAY be permissible to terminate the pregnancy. This is a decision that someone is to make in close discussion with their priest and their doctor. It is NOT an excuse to allow abortion on demand. It is not a cut and dried as many people believe and is done in such a way that Life will be most likely to prevail, that of the mother’s and baby’s, if possible. I hope this helps.

Honestly, this is far less credible example than the highly unlikely case of rape. There simply are not that many situations that arise like this; however, people use this as an excuse to put in “for health or psychological reasons” clause that has made it possible for anyone, for any reason to get an abortion, often at taxpayers expense. Even the Planned Parenthood’s statistics don’t support this as being an issue.

Sadly, though, playing on people’s heartstrings like this particular rationale has been responsible for the deaths of MILLIONS of children and untold suffering for women who think that this is a harmless choice and find themselves dealing with mental health issues that no one warned them about. These women, all of them, need love, compassion and understanding. They need all the love that we can give them, they have suffered so. With that, we must still stand up for God’s Truth, this is also part of loving.

My personal experience is that this is an extremely painful situation and any efforts at speaking the Truth are often met with anger and heard as being judgmental because people have been told over and over and over about those judgmental right-wing fanatics who want to take away your rights, etc. Mostly it is painful because of how these women suffer and how highly highly sensitive they are. I hope that doesn’t sound defensive, it’s not meant to. Just being realistic about the influences in the world. The bottom line for me? a life is a life is a life and only God gets to “choose”.

I pray that helps, at least to give you something to think about.

Blessings
 
I will try, with my limited ability to explain how this decision is made and (with my humble understanding) and I DREAD even saying this for fear someone will read it wrong or use my words to justify a terrible, terrible decision. That being said, I believe within Church teaching, there are cases where termination of the pregnancy may be done.
To be VERY clear. Direct abortion is never permitted.

There are times when a meical procedure to save mom results in the death of the child, however, the death of the child can never be intentional or direct. Ever.

The doctor must do everything to save both patients.
 
Thanks for the prayers…
Just to clariify from an earlier post , in case of any misunderstandings…I never had an abortion …I did consider it…that was when I was at a very messed up time in my life, but I ended up having the miscarriage at just past 3 mons

I did do a lot of grieving and healing…and when I find the poem I wrote, I’ll share it somewhere…not sure what category.

Healing from the sexual abuse is something I deal with everyday…I know I am in good hands…and I have healed alot already…
My sufferings have brought me closer to Jesus though than I ever dreamed possible.

I will continue with my journey and pray that I may someday be in full communion with the RC church…
I’m pretty sure that there will be many others here who will be praying for you, too. I’m amazed at your strength - many would have completely fallen apart and here you are still trying and still taking the right path. You are an inspiration to me and you are in my prayers.

Christina
 
To be VERY clear. Direct abortion is never permitted.

There are times when a meical procedure to save mom results in the death of the child, however, the death of the child can never be intentional or direct. Ever.

The doctor must do everything to save both patients.
I know it’s in the Catechism but I can’t find it. I know it’s there because this has come up before on other abortion threads and you are right. There is a huge difference between taking the life of an unborn child just to end a pregnancy and being forced to allow an unborn child to die in order to save the mother’s life.

I’m sure this sort of decision is never taken lightly. I know ectopic pregnancy is one of the conditions where the Church supports removal of the pregnancy. And that’s because if the pregnancy is not removed the mother is going to die. The child will die anyway (that sounds awful). I don’t mean to sound like I don’t care. It’s difficult to discuss this issue, especially when I can’t find it in the Catechism! They need to work on their index - it’s not very good. 😦
 
I know it’s in the Catechism but I can’t find it. I know it’s there because this has come up before on other abortion threads and you are right. There is a huge difference between taking the life of an unborn child just to end a pregnancy and being forced to allow an unborn child to die in order to save the mother’s life.

I’m sure this sort of decision is never taken lightly. I know ectopic pregnancy is one of the conditions where the Church supports removal of the pregnancy. And that’s because if the pregnancy is not removed the mother is going to die. The child will die anyway (that sounds awful). I don’t mean to sound like I don’t care. It’s difficult to discuss this issue, especially when I can’t find it in the Catechism! They need to work on their index - it’s not very good. 😦
The ruptured tube may be removed to save a woman’s life. The baby will die when the tube is removed. This is in no way a direct abortion. The death of the child is unintended.

Type in the word “abortion” in the search and you will find every reference in the Catechism:

scborromeo.org/ccc.htm
 
Thank you for the clarification. What I’ve been able to find out so far (by asking around) that someone I know believes that there is a special rule for cases of rape, carefully worded, which makes sense because in a rape there is no renewal of the covenant that is necessary in marriage. But she thinks it must be an actual contraceptive which is what I believe some “emergency medications” are.

Now I understand a little bit more. It’s difficult to trust websites that use the word “Catholic” in their names because it can be very misleading. I looked at the website and couldn’t find anything anti-Catholic or non-Catholic so I really didn’t know what I was looking at and got very confused (which is a normal state for me).

Thanks again!! 🙂
Yes the Morning after “pill” does have contraceptive properties, please remember that sperm can live up 4-5 days.
 
Yes the Morning after “pill” does have contraceptive properties, please remember that sperm can live up 4-5 days.
Yep! In order for it to be usend in a moral way, tests must determine that ovulaiton has NOT taken place.
 
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