Can someone help explain why abortion is much worse than the Iraqi War?

[Michaeljc4]

War is horrible and tragic but on the massive scale of 50,000,000 people killed in torturous ways through abortion there is no comparison. It is the same as taking a 1 day old child and tearing him or her apart alive.

I agree. I disagree about your view of the role of civilians in dictatorships; I don’t think it’s realistic. On that point, we can agree to disagree.

Fundamentalist Islam starts to teach hate for Americans and the west starting in first grade along with how to kill.

Once again, we disagree: I think they are taught to hate Americans much earlier than the first grade.

 

[Memaw]

Well…good news! No one is this discussion is making that arguement, at least as far as I can see.

My point remains: innocent people die in wars, including Iraq. That is a horrible tragedy. I’m not morally comfortable saying, “Yes, but they are all so much better off because Sadam is gone!” If you or anyone else wants to think that way, it’s between you, your conscience, and God.

All human beings–those we perceive as our enemies, the unborn, those on death row, those in hospitals hooked up to machines, the homeless, the drug addicted, the mentally ill, the violently insane, the desperately poor–have inherent worth and dignity. They are human beings created in the image of God. War kills human beings, most of them innocent of any real wrong doing. War falls especially hard on the poorest and the most vulnerable. War is evil, and while I fully admit that war may be necessary at times, it is never good.

I am no pacifist, but I have come to hate war. May God grant that we never have to fight another one.

So what would you suggest we should do, set back and let the terrorists take over, which is just what they are trying to do. Then what about the many innocent who will die under their kind of rule. No one likes war, but sometimes we have to be brave enough to risk our lives to help others live a free life. Evil only spreads when good men do nothing. God Bless, Memaw.

 

[c659smith]

I agree. I disagree about your view of the role of civilians in dictatorships; I don’t think it’s realistic. On that point, we can agree to disagree.

Once again, we disagree: I think they are taught to hate Americans much earlier than the first grade.

I agree with you it is much earlier than the first grade I was just being pragmatic where it can be proved through taped classroom activities rather than just making statements off the cuff.

However we disagree on the civilian populace situations as I feel they are not innocents. It is my opinion they do not wear pearly white suits and have wings.
Now I do not agree they should be purposely hunted down and killed for that would be murder and wrong but they are not innocents, except for the very young or old or the mentally challenged but the able bodied adults doing nothing but wringing their hands is unacceptable as others are persecuted, tortured, and murdered.

So let me get this straight there is a woman on a street corner and she is being beaten and raped. There are several people from a distance watching this uncover but for fear they do not intercede to stop this atrocity if necessary through force and then to testify aganist these men. You would call these peeople innocents.

For this is what the people of Iraq, Bosnia, Europe, U.N. etc… did till the U.S. stepped in there and forced their hand etc…

This is what the U.N. does everyday (watch) in the Sudan as women and children are being literally cut into pieces.

These observers are innocents?

That is why I thank God everyday Our soldiers to not wear the purple helmets.

I as a Human being and anyone with one grain of humanity could not possibly call themselves innocent never the less human if we allow such atrocities to occurr in our sight and do nothing.

 

[nancy_dalrymple]

If pragmatism is equated with cowardice, so be it. It’s all very well to risk your own safety to save someone else - however, if you die in the attempt, and fail to save the other person, then you have doubly failed. There is a big difference between courage and recklessness. And there is no point in dying for a cause if your sacrifice doesn’t further the cause. And then you have to ask whether you would have done more good to stick around to be there for the people who care about you. I could go on, but it’s kind of irrelevant to the thread, so I’ll leave it there.

You know no one dies in vain I suppose the saints who died on crosses and tourcher stakes did it all in vain,mabe they should have stayed home that day? and hid? God hates a coward.Greater hath love,for no man that he lay down his life for a friend.God dosent see it failer if you die trying to save someone,isnt that what Jesus did? John:15:13

 

[Michaeljc4]

We aren’t going to agree on this, so in the spirit of charity and brotherhood, I’ll stop arguing.

 

[kimmielittle]

IMHO, the greatest ‘coward’ would be the one who won’t state their convictions.

I see no “cowards” posting, here.
But, I’m just a kid.

 

[c659smith]

IMHO, the greatest ‘coward’ would be the one who won’t state their convictions.

I see no “cowards” posting, here.
But, I’m just a kid.

What is your definition of a coward?

Websters definition

1. a person who lacks courage in facing danger, difficulty, opposition, pain, etc.; a timid or easily intimidated person.
   –adjective 2. lacking courage; very fearful or timid.
2. proceeding from or expressive of fear or timidity: a coward cry.

Quote from prevous post of Sair below

If pragmatism is equated with cowardice, so be it. It’s all very well to risk your own safety to save someone else - however, if you die in the attempt, and fail to save the other person, then you have doubly failed. There is a big difference between courage and recklessness. And there is no point in dying for a cause if your sacrifice doesn’t further the cause. And then you have to ask whether you would have done more good to stick around to be there for the people who care about you. I could go on, but it’s kind of irrelevant to the thread, so I’ll leave it there

The above meets the definition for a cowardly act for one must have the courage to affect change or to stop another from causing harm to the weak. If one knew the outcome prior to taking action then there would be nothing courageous about it.

If one fails to take action then that is being a coward.

There would be no hero’s in this world if everyone thinks that way.

 

[c659smith]

We aren’t going to agree on this, so in the spirit of charity and brotherhood, I’ll stop arguing.

youtube.com/watch?v=vcgCTneQ7Y8

Please open the above!!

Are these what your talking about concerning innocents?

These people voted Hamas into office, why do they not vote them out?

These people have no where to run because the other Arab countries have completed the other side of the cage to keep them out.

Until a people seek peace there willl be no peace. They do not even realize they are being used as pawns. In that case they are innocents. May God Bless them all

 

[Michaeljc4]

When I think of innocents, I think of children, mothers, the weak and elderly, the sick, the disabled, and all of those who–through no real fault of their own–are hurt or killed in war. I suspect you think of those kinds of folks as well.

If you are looking for someone to defend Hamas, look elsewhere. They are murderers, and I’m glad Israel just kicked their ***es. However, like any other sane human being, I am saddened and sickened by the loss of innocent human life during this all too necessary war.

That’s* all *I’m saying, c659smith. I hate war, and I hate seeing children blown up for any reason. I can only imagine that you feel the same way.

 

[KLIBERA]

The Act Of Abortion Is So Abominable Because It Is Destroying That Which God Created (remember I Knew You In The Womb). It Is An Expression That Because This Group Of Cells Is Not So Tangible That It Is Okay To Some To Play God & You Can’t. What God Does With The Abortionist-only God Can Know. Wars Are Different In The Sense That The Church Has A Just War Doctrine. It Realizes Our World Is Imperfect. The True Target Of A War Is Not So Much Killing Humans But Destroying The Machinery Of War So That It Cannot Be Used. Soldiers Are There Executing Orders From Above. God Does Not Give Them A Free Pass On Shame. Witness The Gore & The Haunting Post-traumatic Stress These Soldiers Endure. We Have 40,000 Soldiers Out With It Right Now. The Answer. That Is The Price You Pay–its A Psychological Purgatory. War Is Not Meant To Be A Spoil For Victors. There Is A Human Price Exacted On Both Sides–those That Have Been Murdered, Executed, Or Tortured, & Those Who Perform The Act. Just Watch Saving Private Ryan & See Just What A Mental Toll The Soldiers Incurred. We All Bear A Cross. Nothing Comes Without Struggle.

 

[c659smith]

When I think of innocents, I think of children, mothers, the weak and elderly, the sick, the disabled, and all of those who–through no real fault of their own–are hurt or killed in war. I suspect you think of those kinds of folks as well.

If you are looking for someone to defend Hamas, look elsewhere. They are murderers, and I’m glad Israel just kicked their ***es. However, like any other sane human being, I am saddened and sickened by the loss of innocent human life during this all too necessary war.

That’s* all *I’m saying, c659smith. I hate war, and I hate seeing children blown up for any reason. I can only imagine that you feel the same way.

I agree and pray for peace and an end to all wars.

We both have seen the immediate end of a war esspecially clean ups and no one wins there. I pray for all the souls not only the good or bad / right or wrong and esspecially their loved ones that have suffered such a tragedy.

 

[nancy_dalrymple]

I agree and pray for peace and an end to all wars.

We both have seen the immediate end of a war esspecially clean ups and no one wins there. I pray for all the souls not only the good or bad / right or wrong and esspecially their loved ones that have suffered such a tragedy.

You have a beautiful heart God Bless You Always Nancy

 

[kimmielittle]

I know use to know ] a boy who jumped off a 85 foot bridge. It is speculated that he jumped off - to save his friend who fell off - 10 seconds before him.

Some of my friends think he was courageous. Some wonder if he knew the basics of physics.

We attended two funerals.

 

[nancy_dalrymple]

I know use to know ] a boy who jumped off a 85 foot bridge. It is speculated that he jumped off - to save his friend who fell off - 10 seconds before him.

Some of my friends think he was courageous. Some wonder if he knew the basics of physics.

We attended two funerals.

Thats sad.I believe he was courageous,and his death was not in vain.God knew the intent of his heart,he cared and that was his way of showing how much.I’m sorry for your loss but it bought out the part of you that makes you who you realy are God Bless you Kimmielittle,Nancy

 

[Sair]

What is your definition of a coward?

If one fails to take action then that is being a coward.

There would be no hero’s in this world if everyone thinks that way.

I would agree that sitting idly by and doing nothing if you know that you could act effectively is cowardice. But there is a great deal of territory between doing nothing and recklessly jumping in and getting yourself killed as well. Would you run into a burning building that was about to collapse in an attempt to save someone who was trapped inside? I’ll wager we’d all like to think we would have the guts and the presence of mind to act, but as I’ve said before, we can’t know unless we’re in the situation. Everyone reacts differently to a crisis. If you run into the burning building, there’s every likelihood that you’d die without saving anyone. In a situation like that, I don’t think you can judge a person as being a coward for avoiding almost certain death to no actual purpose. If you can do something effective without getting yourself killed, that is always better.

 

[nancy_dalrymple]

I would agree that sitting idly by and doing nothing if you know that you could act effectively is cowardice. But there is a great deal of territory between doing nothing and recklessly jumping in and getting yourself killed as well. Would you run into a burning building that was about to collapse in an attempt to save someone who was trapped inside? I’ll wager we’d all like to think we would have the guts and the presence of mind to act, but as I’ve said before, we can’t know unless we’re in the situation. Everyone reacts differently to a crisis. If you run into the burning building, there’s every likelihood that you’d die without saving anyone. In a situation like that, I don’t think you can judge a person as being a coward for avoiding almost certain death to no actual purpose. If you can do something effective without getting yourself killed, that is always better.

I know now that if I was in a burning building with you I’d have to get to the door first:sad_yes:

 

[nancy_dalrymple]

I would agree that sitting idly by and doing nothing if you know that you could act effectively is cowardice. But there is a great deal of territory between doing nothing and recklessly jumping in and getting yourself killed as well. Would you run into a burning building that was about to collapse in an attempt to save someone who was trapped inside? I’ll wager we’d all like to think we would have the guts and the presence of mind to act, but as I’ve said before, we can’t know unless we’re in the situation. Everyone reacts differently to a crisis. If you run into the burning building, there’s every likelihood that you’d die without saving anyone. In a situation like that, I don’t think you can judge a person as being a coward for avoiding almost certain death to no actual purpose. If you can do something effective without getting yourself killed, that is always better.

I know now that if I was in a burning building with you I’d have to get to the door first:sad_yes: Thank God for the brave men and woman September,11th 2001

 

[Sair]

I know now that if I was in a burning building with you I’d have to get to the door first:sad_yes: Thank God for the brave men and woman September,11th 2001

Well, first up, if I was going to be running into the building to get you out, I wouldn’t be in there with you…

Second…well, I didn’t have a second point actually. I think the first said enough.

 

[nancy_dalrymple]

Well, first up, if I was going to be running into the building to get you out, I wouldn’t be in there with you…

Second…well, I didn’t have a second point actually. I think the first said enough.

Quite enough Nancy

 

[c659smith]

I would agree that sitting idly by and doing nothing if you know that you could act effectively is cowardice. But there is a great deal of territory between doing nothing and recklessly jumping in and getting yourself killed as well. Would you run into a burning building that was about to collapse in an attempt to save someone who was trapped inside? I’ll wager we’d all like to think we would have the guts and the presence of mind to act, but as I’ve said before, we can’t know unless we’re in the situation. Everyone reacts differently to a crisis. If you run into the burning building, there’s every likelihood that you’d die without saving anyone. In a situation like that, I don’t think you can judge a person as being a coward for avoiding almost certain death to no actual purpose. If you can do something effective without getting yourself killed, that is always better.

Yes I would do everything physically possible to get you out of that burning building. A person deciding not to go in I would not consider a coward
However failure to do some type of immediate action would make a person a coward.

Failure to stand by and observe someone being injured, tortured, and killed by another would define a coward and inhumane esspecially if you have the means to react and do not.

(A thousand people Iraqui’s) watching a (dozen thugs like Sadam’s henchman) terrorize a few.

The U.N. armed Forces with automatic weapons watching and in proximity of some thugs machette people to death. Thats cowardice and inhumane.