Can someone please refute something

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I keep getting these types of information (from atheists, and agnostics especially) that Jesus was simply a chosen pagan revived god which was invented by constantine (in around 300 AD) and thus formed the roman empire (which is supposedly how the catholic church was made according to them). Now, I am deeply confused here and the whole idea of Jesus being a pagan God sounds VERY fishy and disturbing.

How do you even deal with such a claim? Anyone knows any good sources (or arguments) which will demolish this “pagan jesus” theory? I know that this theory is very strange (obviously), so can someone please debunk this (cause I don’t know how to respond to these people who make the pagan jesus claim)?

BONUS QUESTION= If Jesus is the ultimate saviour (and the only God in the universe), why did other pagan cultures also have “saviour gods”? Is it because these pagan cultures were also waiting for the messiah, and thus worship their own version of the saviour. Or were they misguided or what?
 
I keep getting these types of information (from atheists, and agnostics especially) that Jesus was simply a chosen pagan revived god which was invented by constantine (in around 300 AD) and thus formed the roman empire (which is supposedly how the catholic church was made according to them). Now, I am deeply confused here and the whole idea of Jesus being a pagan God sounds VERY fishy and disturbing.
This is a prime example of pseudo-history. It’s so silly it really doesn’t deserve a response. Having said that, though, the onus is on them to prove this is true. They can’t because it isn’t. These people are not bona fide historians–they are people with an agenda who are rewriting history to make it fit their own ideas. Save yourself a lot of anxiety–don’t read such trash.
How do you even deal with such a claim? Anyone knows any good sources (or arguments) which will demolish this “pagan jesus” theory? I know that this theory is very strange (obviously), so can someone please debunk this (cause I don’t know how to respond to these people who make the pagan jesus claim)?
All you need to do is read a real history book on the era not material sent to you by atheists with an agenda. Real history doesn’t support a single word of their theories.
BONUS QUESTION= If Jesus is the ultimate saviour (and the only God in the universe), why did other pagan cultures also have “saviour gods”? Is it because these pagan cultures were also waiting for the messiah, and thus worship their own version of the saviour. Or were they misguided or what?
When God promised a deliverer to Adam and Eve (see Genesis 3:15), known as the protoevangelium, all the descendants of Adam and Eve were waiting for the one who would fulfill this role in human history. As mankind split apart into various peoples and nations the promise went with them. It became a common motif in religious mythology. When God called Abraham to be his own and his descendants his own people, God set the stage for the One who was to come through Abraham’s descendants.
 
So according to such atheists, how come Christians only worship one of the “pagan gods”? What’s so special about him? If people profess such expertise on history, sometimes I like to press them for details and remind them of their original claim.

Back to Jesus, one of the reasons why he was believed to be the Messiah is because of the prophecies he fulfilled and the witness of miracles seen by his followers and martyrs. One blog article on this subject that is good is Three Prophesies About Christ That Couldn’t Have Been Made Up over at Shameless Popery.

But if you are dealing with someone who believes that belief in a Creator God is tantamount to believing in a spaghetti monster, you might not be dealing with someone with sufficient reason faculties to analyze the historical testament fairly.
 
The thing is, we have extent Christian letters from the first three centuries of the Church–lots of them, in fact. And these writings aren’t up for debate. They’ve always been accepted as genuine even by secular scholars–my state college had the entire collection in its library.

Look them up. They’re usually referred to as the “early Christrian writings” or the “early Church Fathers.” You can see what people believed before Constantine and how its just what we believe today.
 
I keep getting these types of information (from atheists, and agnostics especially) that Jesus was simply a chosen pagan revived god which was invented by constantine (in around 300 AD) and thus formed the roman empire (which is supposedly how the catholic church was made according to them). Now, I am deeply confused here and the whole idea of Jesus being a pagan God sounds VERY fishy and disturbing.

How do you even deal with such a claim? Anyone knows any good sources (or arguments) which will demolish this “pagan jesus” theory? I know that this theory is very strange (obviously), so can someone please debunk this (cause I don’t know how to respond to these people who make the pagan jesus claim)?

BONUS QUESTION= If Jesus is the ultimate saviour (and the only God in the universe), why did other pagan cultures also have “saviour gods”? Is it because these pagan cultures were also waiting for the messiah, and thus worship their own version of the saviour. Or were they misguided or what?
If you examined the actual tradition and history of these pagan gods and godesses, you’ll find a couple of things, namely some pretty imaginative and nasty sexual instances of bestiality and incest along with good old-fashioned personal selfishness.

Quite unlike the ideals of our Christian faith.

A lot of people were (and are) misguided, but really, it’s easy to reject Jesus in society today and people do it for all kinds of selfish reasons and try and hide behind everything from science to reason and trying to find all these bizarre connections that they think disprove the Gospel.

I don’t think a lot of them are as informed as they believe they are.
 
I can’t refute it…but I know that Jesus Christ is who he said he is…and he proved it…and the Catholic Church … Catholicism…is the real deal…“the whole enchilada”. The reason that I know this…faith, well yes…but also because I stayed at a Holiday Inn last night.

Make sure you stay away from beach front property salesmen…working out of Oklahoma.

Seriously…make these atheists and agnostics show you their proof…credible proof of their claims Tell them…just like that great theologian …Rod Tidwell.…would tell them:
Rod Tidwell: I wanna make sure you’re ready, brother. Here it is: Show me the money. Oh-ho-ho! SHOW! ME! THE! MONEY! A-ha-ha! Jerry, doesn’t it make you feel good just to say that! Say it with me one time, Jerry.
Jerry Maguire (1996)
Pax Christi
 
I keep getting these types of information (from atheists, and agnostics especially) that Jesus was simply a chosen pagan revived god which was invented by constantine (in around 300 AD) and thus formed the roman empire (which is supposedly how the catholic church was made according to them). Now, I am deeply confused here and the whole idea of Jesus being a pagan God sounds VERY fishy and disturbing.
And why do you think these people are telling the truth? Their whole purpose is to convince you Christianity is phony. They have already abandoned Christ, the source of Truth, so they will not hesitate to lie to you. You should not be following these debates or taking part in them until you know your faith backwards and forwards and until you are finished with College. You should be reading the Catechism of the Catholic Church and you should be living your Faith; if you aren’t how can you expect the grace to keep strong?
How do you even deal with such a claim? Anyone knows any good sources (or arguments) which will demolish this “pagan jesus” theory? I know that this theory is very strange (obviously), so can someone please debunk this (cause I don’t know how to respond to these people who make the pagan jesus claim)?
See my closing statements.
BONUS QUESTION= If Jesus is the ultimate saviour (and the only God in the universe), why did other pagan cultures also have “saviour gods”? Is it because these pagan cultures were also waiting for the messiah, and thus worship their own version of the saviour. Or were they misguided or what?
All men throughout history have been awaiting the Messiah, it is just that all but the Jews weren’t aware of it.

Take a look at this: " Historical Proofs for the Existence of Jesus

strangenotions.com/did-je…nate-approach/

Jimmy Akin has a very interesting article dealing with historical proofs for the existence of Jesus. Here is just a bit of it. Well worth reading.

" References to Christianity
Instead of looking, in the first instance, for references to Jesus, we can look at references to the Christian movement itself and see what we can learn about it.

Of course, the same sources that refer to Jesus tend to refer to the Christian movement. That means that we can quickly establish a number of quite early references to Christianity.

It is mentioned by:

◦Suetonius, writing around A.D. 121
◦Tacitus, writing around A.D. 116
◦Pliny the Younger, writing in A.D. 110 or 111
◦The Emperor Trajan, writing back to Pliny in A.D. 110 or 111
◦And Josephus, writing around A.D. 93
The inclusion of Josephus in this list is not dependent on the famous Testimonium Flavianum found in his Antiquities 18:3:3.

Even setting aside that reference, which is partially corrupted, Josephus elsewhere refers to Jesus having followers (noting that he “was called Christ”) in a passage for which we have no evidence of manuscript corruption (Antiquities 20:9:1).

We thus have multiple references for the existence of a Christian movement that date to the end of the first century and the beginning of the second. "

Take a look at the Apologetics Section of EWTN Books and see what you might be interested in. ewtnreligiouscatalogue.com/Apologetics/cid=238/page_no=1/get_all=/shop.axd/Category

Google Jimmie Akin, Dr. Peter J. Kreeft, Karl Keating, and Dr. Scott Hahn and look for titles which may interest you.

If you would like other suggestions after looking these over, P.M. me and let me know what specific subjects you are interested in. One thing, I’m not going to argue your cases for you. I have my own backon to fry.

Linus2nd
 
I keep getting these types of information (from atheists, and agnostics especially) that Jesus was simply a chosen pagan revived god which was invented by constantine (in around 300 AD) and thus formed the roman empire (which is supposedly how the catholic church was made according to them). Now, I am deeply confused here and the whole idea of Jesus being a pagan God sounds VERY fishy and disturbing.

How do you even deal with such a claim? Anyone knows any good sources (or arguments) which will demolish this “pagan jesus” theory? I know that this theory is very strange (obviously), so can someone please debunk this (cause I don’t know how to respond to these people who make the pagan jesus claim)?
We have lots and lots of evidence from the centuries before Constantine - in fact, the Church was all over the world before Constantine was even born!

Read this for instance - Christianity from the Pentecost to about 313 AD.
Early Christianity (generally considered the time period from its start to 325), spread from the Eastern Mediterranean throughout the Roman Empire and beyond, perhaps reaching as far east as India. Originally, this progression was closely connected to already established Jewish centers, in the Holy Land and the Jewish diaspora.
The Apostolic Sees claim to have been founded by one or more of the Apostles of Jesus:
Code:
Rome, in Italy (Saint Peter and Saint Paul)
Constantinople, now Istanbul in present-day Turkey (Saint Andrew)
Alexandria, in Egypt (Saint Mark the Evangelist)
Antioch, in present-day Turkey (Saint Peter).
Jerusalem, in the Holy Land (Saint Peter and Saint James)
Early Christians gathered in small private homes, but a city’s whole Christian community would also be called a church – the Greek noun εκκλησια (or Ecclesia) literally means assembly, gathering, or congregation.
Many of these Early Christians were merchants and others who had practical reasons for traveling to northern Africa, Asia Minor, Arabia, Greece, and other places. Over 40 such communities were established by the year 100, many in Anatolia, also known as Asia Minor, such as the Seven Churches of Asia.
Code:
Ephesus (Metropolis of Ephesus)
Smyrna (Metropolis of Smyrna)
Pergamon (Metropolis of Pergamon)
Thyatira
Sardis (See of Sardis)
Philadelphia (Metropolis of Philadelphia)
and Laodicea, near Denizli
By the end of the first century, Christianity had already spread to Rome, India, and major cities in Armenia, Greece and Syria.
Christianity already faced the challenge of heresies, including adoptionism, arianism, docetism, monarchianism, sabellianism, manichaeism, naasseneism, valentianism, marcionism, montanism.

All of this before Constantine was even born.

See how hopelessly ridiculous their claim is?
BONUS QUESTION= If Jesus is the ultimate saviour (and the only God in the universe), why did other pagan cultures also have “saviour gods”? Is it because these pagan cultures were also waiting for the messiah, and thus worship their own version of the saviour. Or were they misguided or what?
Christ embodies the maximum aspiration of mankind, He is God’s promise for mankind fulfilled. Why would it be strange that others had desired or thought in the shadows of polytheism about savior gods? Furthermore, we do profess that all good in every religion comes from God and predisposes men to the Good News that is faith in Christ, so it is no surprise that many in the past (and even in our modern day!) find in Christ the fulfillment of many aspirations, desires, thoughts, some of them personal, some of them part of a religious system.

Suggested readings:

“History of the Catholic Church: From the Apostolic Age to the Third Millennium”, by James Hitchcock

“Handbook of Catholic Apologetics”, by Peter Kreeft and Ronald Tacelli SJ
Unbelievers, doubters and skeptics continue to attack the truths of Christianity. Handbook of Catholic Apologetics is the only book that categorizes and summarizes all the major arguments in support of the main Christian beliefs, including key distinctively Catholic doctrines. Also included is a Protestant-friendly treatment of Catholic-Protestant issues. The Catholic answers to Protestant questions show how Catholicism is the fullness of the Christian faith.
Also, I made this for fun.
 
I keep getting these types of information (from atheists, and agnostics especially) that Jesus was simply a chosen pagan revived god which was invented by constantine (in around 300 AD) and thus formed the roman empire (which is supposedly how the catholic church was made according to them). Now, I am deeply confused here and the whole idea of Jesus being a pagan God sounds VERY fishy and disturbing . . .
It sounds to me like these are your own doubts.

I would guess that you have constructed a distorted view of what happened in history and of the reality of your own existence.

The Truth is struggling to come out but these sorts of ideas are suffocating it. It has been suggested above: broaden your understanding of Scripture and the Cathechism.
 
I keep getting these types of information (from atheists, and agnostics especially) that Jesus was simply a chosen pagan revived god which was invented by constantine (in around 300 AD) and thus formed the roman empire (which is supposedly how the catholic church was made according to them). Now, I am deeply confused here and the whole idea of Jesus being a pagan God sounds VERY fishy and disturbing.

How do you even deal with such a claim? Anyone knows any good sources (or arguments) which will demolish this “pagan jesus” theory? I know that this theory is very strange (obviously), so can someone please debunk this (cause I don’t know how to respond to these people who make the pagan jesus claim)?

BONUS QUESTION= If Jesus is the ultimate saviour (and the only God in the universe), why did other pagan cultures also have “saviour gods”? Is it because these pagan cultures were also waiting for the messiah, and thus worship their own version of the saviour. Or were they misguided or what?
So, in order to secure his political power and legitimacy as Emperor of the Roman Empire Constantine “invented” a religion based on another religion that was already persecuted/look down on by the pagan political elite (Judaism, and yes I’m ignoring the fact that Christianity the minor Jewish sect and later the independent religion is historically documented as existing well before Constantine) with a completely new minor pagan god (I guess he didn’t want to be like every other power player of the era/culture and trace his lineage back to a more well know pagan god)? Yeah, makes absolutely no sense. Tell whoever is trying to feed you this idiotic argument that they need to go to the local library and check out the versions of the “X for dummies” books that deal with the history of the Roman Empire and critical thinking.
 
And why do you think these people are telling the truth? Their whole purpose is to convince you Christianity is phony. They have already abandoned Christ, the source of Truth, so they will not hesitate to lie to you. You should not be following these debates or taking part in them until you know your faith backwards and forwards and until you are finished with College. You should be reading the Catechism of the Catholic Church and you should be living your Faith; if you aren’t how can you expect the grace to keep strong?
How can one even have a faith… “possess” it… before one even knows what it is?
 
How can one even have a faith… “possess” it… before one even knows what it is?
…inasmuch as it is a theological gift…he may have it without even being aware of it…and one day echo the prophet who said: “truly God is in this place and I did not know…”.
 
I keep getting these types of information (from atheists, and agnostics especially) that Jesus was simply a chosen pagan revived god which was invented by constantine (in around 300 AD) and thus formed the roman empire (which is supposedly how the catholic church was made according to them). Now, I am deeply confused here and the whole idea of Jesus being a pagan God sounds VERY fishy and disturbing.
Wow. I’ve heard the Constantinian argument from Protestants many times, but the atheist twist is new to me.

Fear not! The answer is as follows:

Constantine did not invent Christianity, he simply ended the persecution of an existing religious group by issuing the Edict of Milan in 313 (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edict_of_Milan). When he did so, according to modern skeptics, pagans flocked to the Church in hopes of secular preferment, but the Church could not assimilate so many new members.

It soon compromised its principles and became paganized by adopting pagan beliefs and practices. It developed the doctrines with which the Catholic Church is identified today. Simply put, it apostatized and became the Catholic Church.

The trouble with this history is that there are no historical facts whatsoever to back it up. Distinctively Catholic beliefs—the papacy, priesthood, invocation of saints, sacraments, veneration of Mary, purgatory—were evident long before the fourth century, before Constantine. They were believed by Christians before this supposed “paganization” took place.

Another difficulty is that there are no historical records—none at all—which imply an underground Proto-protestant church existed from the early fourth century to the Reformation. In those years there were many schisms and heresies, most now vanished, but present-day Protestants cannot find among them their missing Protestant church. There were no groups that believed in all or even most, of the doctrines espoused by the Protestant Reformers (e.g. sola scriptura, salvation by “faith alone,” and an invisible church). No wonder Protestant writers dislike discussing Church history!

Since the Christian Church was to exist historically and be like a city set on a mountain for all to see (Matt. 5:14), it had to be visible and easily identifiable. A church that exists only in the hearts of believers is not visible and is more like the candle hidden under the bushel basket (Matt. 5:15). But any visible church would necessarily be an institutional church that would need an earthly head. It would need an authority to which Christians could turn for the final resolution of doctrinal and disciplinary disputes. Christ appointed Peter and his successors to that position.

Christ designated Peter head of the Church when he said, “And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my Church” (Matt. 16:18). Protestants, desiring to avoid the natural sense of the passage, say “rock” refers not to Peter, but to his profession of faith or to Christ himself. But Peter’s profession of faith is two sentences away and can’t be what is meant. Similarly, the reference can’t be to Christ. The fact that he is elsewhere, by a quite different metaphor, called the cornerstone (Eph. 2:20, 1 Pet. 2:4–8) does not mean Peter was not appointed the earthly foundation.

The apostles were also described as foundation stones in a sense (Eph. 2:20, Rev. 21:14), meaning that Christ is not the only person the Bible speaks of as being the Church’s foundation. In one sense the foundation was Christ, in another it was the apostles, and in another it was Peter. In Matthew 16:18 Christ has Peter in mind. He himself would be the Church’s invisible foundation since he was returning to heaven, from where he would invisibly rule the Church. He needed to leave behind a visible authority, one people could locate when searching for religious truth.

That visible authority is the papacy.
 
the atheist twist is new to me
Yeah by atheist/agnostic I actually meant this new-age sort of movement members which apparently try to discredit catholicism, and its foundation, by stating that christianity is pagan itself in origin like any other religion. This is why they make the argument that Jesus was a Guru (and so apparently the catholic version of Jesus, is believed by them to be a pagan political hoax). I am personally puzzled by the whole issue, and hence I made this post to clear up the confusion. I also read what you wrote below, thanks for clearing up history a bit :). I now know that Constantine simply defended rights of christians.
 
I keep getting these types of information (from atheists, and agnostics especially) that Jesus was simply a chosen pagan revived god which was invented by constantine (in around 300 AD) and thus formed the roman empire (which is supposedly how the catholic church was made according to them). Now, I am deeply confused here and the whole idea of Jesus being a pagan God sounds VERY fishy and disturbing.

How do you even deal with such a claim? Anyone knows any good sources (or arguments) which will demolish this “pagan jesus” theory? I know that this theory is very strange (obviously), so can someone please debunk this (cause I don’t know how to respond to these people who make the pagan jesus claim)?

BONUS QUESTION= If Jesus is the ultimate saviour (and the only God in the universe), why did other pagan cultures also have “saviour gods”? Is it because these pagan cultures were also waiting for the messiah, and thus worship their own version of the saviour. Or were they misguided or what?
Irenaeus in ~180 a.d., one man away from St John the apostle, wrote in “Against Heresies” against gnostics. See if any of this helps

Chapter 16 Proofs from the apostolic writings, that Jesus Christ was one and the same, the only begotten Son of God, perfect God and perfect man
Chapter 18 Continuation of the foregoing argument. Proofs from the writings of St. Paul, and from the words of our Lord, that Christ and Jesus cannot be considered as distinct beings; neither can it be alleged that the Son of God became man merely in appearance, but that he did so truly and actually.
Chapter 19 Jesus Christ was not a mere man, begotten from Joseph in the ordinary course of nature, but was true God, begotten of the Father Most High, and true man, born of the Virgin
 
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