Can the souls in purgatory pray for us here on earth?

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irishcolleen45

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I thought I had read recently that souls in purgatory can pray for us here on earth. If so, can you cite a reference for that?
 
Sorry but that doesn’t mention that the souls in purgatory can pray for us. I need something more specific.
 
irishcolleen45 said:
Sorry but that doesn’t mention that the souls in purgatory can pray for us. I need something more specific.
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Irish, I understand that the souls in Purgatory are there only to atone for temporal punishment ,
they are not yet with God.when they are finished atoning they will be joined with the saints in heaven and are then able to pray for us. Peace, Carlan
 
I guess if you were to say “the souls in purgatory” in a generic sense, then the answer is a qualified ‘yes’ – after all, if they’re in purgatory, then it’s certain that they will be in heaven, and so there will be a point that they will, definitively, be able to pray for you.

On the other hand, if you were thinking, “I wonder if my Aunt Edna, who passed away last year and whom I hope is at least in purgatory, can pray for me?”, then the answer is less certain. After all, we can’t really say for sure what the outcome of Aunt Edna’s particular judgment was, can we? So it would be a bit presumptuous to presume that she’s in purgatory, right?

Finally, if you’re asking the particular question about the souls in purgatory while they’re in purgatory, then that’s a bit difficult, too, isn’t it? After all, we don’t know ‘when’ or ‘how long’ they’re in purgatory (if those kinds of characterizations can even be made), and anyway, while they’re in purgatory, we’re supposed to be praying for them, not the other way around!

So, if you mean “will the souls in purgatory ‘eventually’ be able to pray for us?”, then yes. Otherwise, it’s not so clear…
 
Thanks for your insight.
Gorgias said:
I guess if you were to say “the souls in purgatory” in a generic sense, then the answer is a qualified ‘yes’ – after all, if they’re in purgatory, then it’s certain that they will be in heaven, and so there will be a point that they will, definitively, be able to pray for you.

On the other hand, if you were thinking, “I wonder if my Aunt Edna, who passed away last year and whom I hope is at least in purgatory, can pray for me?”, then the answer is less certain. After all, we can’t really say for sure what the outcome of Aunt Edna’s particular judgment was, can we? So it would be a bit presumptuous to presume that she’s in purgatory, right?

Finally, if you’re asking the particular question about the souls in purgatory while they’re in purgatory, then that’s a bit difficult, too, isn’t it? After all, we don’t know ‘when’ or ‘how long’ they’re in purgatory (if those kinds of characterizations can even be made), and anyway, while they’re in purgatory, we’re supposed to be praying for them, not the other way around!

So, if you mean “will the souls in purgatory ‘eventually’ be able to pray for us?”, then yes. Otherwise, it’s not so clear…
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If the Church Militant and the Church Triumphant can pray for other people, what would keep the Church Suffering from praying for others? There’s no specific teaching on it. St. Thomas Aquinas was actually against the premise-- just as he was also of the opinion that ensoulment was delayed rather than immediate. But there are several other saints who firmly believed that the Souls in Purgatory could pray for us.

Padre Pio-
“The souls in Purgatory pray for us, and their prayers are even more effective than ours,
because they are accompanied by their suffering.
So, let’s pray for them, and let’s pray them to pray for us.”
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“Holy Souls are eager for the prayers of the faithful which can gain indulgences for them. Their intercession is powerful. Pray unceasingly. We must empty Purgatory.”
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Saint Catherine of Bologna
“Whenever I am eager to obtain a certain grace, I appeal to these suffering souls to present my prayers to our common Father, and, as a rule, I feel that I owe the granting of my petition to their intercession.”
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The Cure d’Ars
"Oh, if all of us but knew what a wonderful influence these Holy Souls have over the heart of God, and what graces we can obtain through their intercession, they would not be so utterly forgotten; we must pray much for them, so that they may pray for us. "
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St. Alphonsus d’Liguori
Although the Holy Souls cannot merit for themselves, they can obtain for us great graces. They are not, formally speaking, intercessors, as the Saints are, but through the sweet Providence of God, they can obtain for us as astounding favors and deliver us from evils, sickness and dangers of every kind.
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MtnDwellar said:
missionbell.homestead.com/afavourgrantedbytheholysouls.html
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Quote:
St. John Vianney said: “If one knew what we may obtain from God by the intercession of the Poor Souls, they would not be so much abandoned. Let us pray a great deal for them, they will pray for us.” St. Theresa of Avila (Spain) said that she always obtained the favours, which she asked from God, through the intercession of the Poor Souls in Purgator
Yes, and may God forgive for our sins omission.
Peace, Carlan
 
Thank you for this information. I posted the question because I mentioned to my husband that I had begun praying to the souls in purgatory to pray for me and he said he had never heard about this.
Glad I can show him your quotes of various saints.
midori said:
If the Church Militant and the Church Triumphant can pray for other people, what would keep the Church Suffering from praying for others? There’s no specific teaching on it. St. Thomas Aquinas was actually against the premise-- just as he was also of the opinion that ensoulment was delayed rather than immediate. But there are several other saints who firmly believed that the Souls in Purgatory could pray for us.

Padre Pio-

Saint Catherine of Bologna

The Cure d’Ars

St. Alphonsus d’Liguori
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i may be straying from the issue here but i just read extracts from a book written by seven catholic Colombian youths who claim they had visions of heaven and hell. They claim they discovered there was no purgatory. Their vivid descriptions of judgement dispatched and scenes of torment kept me awake all night. Is there a possibility that the church might have been wrong? The thought really is terrifying.
 
midori said:
If the Church Militant and the Church Triumphant can pray for other people, what would keep the Church Suffering from praying for others?
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A question for you: your assertion is that a member of the Church Suffering cannot pray for himself, but can pray for others, right? Then, all they need to do is ‘pair up’ with another soul in Purgatory – “you pray for me, and I’ll pray for you”. That way, all the souls in Purgatory can pray for each other and there’s no need for us to pray for them! Yet, we’re told that we must pray for the souls in Purgatory; therefore, it seems, the poor souls in Purgatory aren’t able to pray for others. 😉
There’s no specific teaching on it.
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Agreed – no magisterial teaching exists that suggests that the souls in Purgatory can pray for us.
St. Thomas Aquinas was actually against the premise-- just as he was also of the opinion that ensoulment was delayed rather than immediate.
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Wow. Way to smear a Doctor of the Church, who happens to be against your thesis… 👍
 
nguemo said:
i may be straying from the issue here but i just read extracts from a book written by seven catholic Colombian youths who claim they had visions of heaven and hell. They claim they discovered there was no purgatory. Their vivid descriptions of judgement dispatched and scenes of torment kept me awake all night.
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Two thoughts here: first, are their claims upheld by the Church? If so, then you’re asking a valid question. If not… well, talk is cheap. 😉

Second: even if their claims get the thumbs-up from the Church, it’s still just private revelation, which has no binding force on the faithul (unlike public revelation, to which we must assent).
Is there a possibility that the church might have been wrong? The thought really is terrifying.
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In this corner: the Church, founded by Christ himself, against which the gates of hell will not prevail! And in this corner: seven Catholic youths who claim that they have had visions of heaven and hell!

I know who I’ll be betting on… 😉
 
nguemo said:
i may be straying from the issue here but i just read extracts from a book written by seven catholic Colombian youths who claim they had visions of heaven and hell. They claim they discovered there was no purgatory. Their vivid descriptions of judgement dispatched and scenes of torment kept me awake all night. Is there a possibility that the church might have been wrong? The thought really is terrifying.
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Here’s a talk by Marino Restrepo a lay Catholic missionary who gives his testimony under the direction of his bishop. He speaks about his experience of Purgatory…
WATCH VIDEO TESTIMONY
 
Excellent video.

I had made a note next to Matt 5:25 the other night. I was pretyy sure it was a reference to purgatory.

Pray for your ancestors.
 
Gorgias said:
A question for you: your assertion is that a member of the Church Suffering cannot pray for himself, but can pray for others, right? Then, all they need to do is ‘pair up’ with another soul in Purgatory – “you pray for me, and I’ll pray for you”. That way, all the souls in Purgatory can pray for each other and there’s no need for us to pray for them! Yet, we’re told that we must pray for the souls in Purgatory; therefore, it seems, the poor souls in Purgatory aren’t able to pray for others. 😉
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I agree to a point-- the only person for whom a soul cannot pray is themself. There’s nothing I’m aware of that says they can’t pray for each other. Of course, I don’t know how aware they are of each other. Is Purgatory some sort of social club where everyone grabs a prayer partner and circulates amongst punch and cookies? 😛

I think your argument is a little fallacious-- if I’m able to bake a cake, that doesn’t mean that there’s no need for you to bring ice cream, too. 😃 If my toddler is able to put his shoes on, it doesn’t mean that he won’t get dressed ten times more quickly if I’m there to lend a hand. If I’m perfectly literate myself, it doesn’t mean that I don’t enjoy being read to when I’m driving in the car. The Souls’ ability to pray for each other has no reflection on our obligation to pray for them… and how much of our obligation to pray for them is for their merit, and how much of it is an opportunity to obtain merit for ourselves? Love and charity are powerful things.

Maccabees says “It is a holy and wholesome thought to pray for the dead that they may be loosed from sins.” And even Thomas Aquinas said, “Of all prayers, the most meritorious, the most acceptable to God are prayers for the dead because they employ all the works of charity, both corporal and spiritual.”
Gorgias said:
Wow. Way to smear a Doctor of the Church, who happens to be against your thesis… 👍
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Ahh… you’ve never had that happen? You’re reading a perfectly awesome theological book written by someone a million times closer to God than you are, and then all of a sudden a very medieval worldview smacks you right in the face? It’s jarring and unpleasant and annoying and makes you want to throw your book against a convenient wall because there’s this horribly out-of-tune passage marring a fabulously thought-provoking work. But it’s also a good reminder that saints were humans, and viewed the world through the filters of their time and culture, and to be a little cautious about accepting every word they write as gospel truth. Or recognizing that different saints hold different opinions at different points in their life as their theology develops and their relationship with God matures. What was that thread about saints and chess… St. Peter Damian took a bishop to task for playing chess in public and considered it immoral, whereas St. Frances de Sales encouraged his people to play chess. 🤷 Or any thread about early Church Fathers that disagreed on x point… 😛 Disagreement happens, and I don’t mind acknowledging it before someone else points it out for me. 😉
 
midori said:
I agree to a point-- the only person for whom a soul cannot pray is themself. There’s nothing I’m aware of that says they can’t pray for each other. Of course, I don’t know how aware they are of each other. Is Purgatory some sort of social club where everyone grabs a prayer partner and circulates amongst punch and cookies?
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RIght – that’s the point. Inasmuch as Purgation is a state of becoming perfected, there’s nothing to suggest that they’re actively aware of their surroundings.
I think your argument is a little fallacious-- if I’m able to bake a cake, that doesn’t mean that there’s no need for you to bring ice cream, too. 😃
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😉
how much of it is an opportunity to obtain merit for ourselves?
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Hmm… no, I don’t think that this holds water – a soul in Purgatory no longer acts on its own behalf (which is why we’re told to pray for them!), so there’s no opportunity to obtain merit on one’s own behalf, either…
Ahh… you’ve never had that happen? You’re reading a perfectly awesome theological book written by someone a million times closer to God than you are, and then all of a sudden a very medieval worldview smacks you right in the face?
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Oh, yeah, absolutely! There are some things attributed to Aquinas and to Augustine that are completely at odds with later Church teaching! However, your statement was completely fallacious: ‘Aquinas disagrees with me on X. Remember, he was wrong about Y, too!’. One has nothing to do with the other, and the assertion, on its face, is prejudicial…!
 
The correct answer to the OP’s question is simply we don’t know. The Church does not know, it is something that was not revealed and not enough of revealed information is provided to support the position one way or another.
 
Yes. Jesus Christ himself describes the soul of a dead rich man in torment interceding for his living brothers in Luke 16:19-31.
 
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