Can this relationship work?

[Sonas]

Hi

I’m hoping someone here can help put a little bit of perspective on this for me. I been with my boyfriend for a little over a year. We have a bit of an age difference, which by itself is not a huge issue for me. However he has been married before and his wife died from cancer. He has always been open with me and has answered any questions I have. It was quite a long illness (7 years) and he has told me how he felt during that time. Whenever he talks about that time though it is always with resent and how he resents that time taken from him. He cared for her and their children (who are now pretty much grown up) for many years and I guess I can partly understand his feelings. But another part of me thinks that surely he should look back and see how difficult it would have been for her too and that when you get married caring for the other person is part of it. Of course he loved his wife. He has told me that. But I just never get that feeling when he talks. It’s very difficult to explain here what I mean. And of course having never been through something like that I can’t begin to understand the emotions involved. Maybe I’m just thinking too much about it. Any insights or comments would be really appreciated.

We’ve known each other for about 2 years but even though I liked him from the beginning I was reluctant to get together with him due to the age difference and his marriage. However I did eventually acknowledge my feelings for him and we are now happily together and have talked about marriage and the future. Another issue however is that he is not Catholic. He has never been baptised as he had a non religious upbringing. We have talked about it and he knows that should anything happen between us I want to get married in a church and our children will be Catholic. He is interested in my faith but due to his secular upbringing he doesn’t really have any beliefs. But he is very supportive of mine and has talked about coming with me to mass some Sunday. We do live about 3 hours apart so we mostly only see each other on weekends. However after much arranging, we are going to spent most of the next month together and really see how we get on. I’m really looking forward to it. I also want to have my eyes open here though. I realise that there are many many obstacles in our relationship and I’m just wondering if loving each other is enough. Can this relationship work? I really appreciate anyone taking the time to read through this and give their thoughts.

 

[nancymarie]

I’m only going to reply to the part of your post concerning your friend’s time as a caregiver to his wife, and the feelings of resentment he may have.

Caregiving is tough. The marriage changes, sometimes for better, sometimes for worse. Communication becomes more difficult, the caregiving spouse may find themselves in perpetual grieving mode, and may experience guilt for wishing the caregiving would end. Intimacy between the spouses may end. There is so much that changes, and unless someone walks this path it’s difficult to comprehend. It is very very difficult both for the ill spouse and the one that is caregiving.

I know because my husband has MS (we are separated but that is another story).

Please don’t think less of your friend for having these feelings. There is such a things as caregiver burnout or PTSD. The only other thing I would say is that if you were to marry him and then get ill yourself, he may not deal with it well owing to his past and the trauma both he and his former wife suffered. Nor does he have strong faith to see him through.

Just something to think about. I know this is a difficult time for you and I wish you both well.

God Bless.

 

[1ke]

“Love” is rarely enough-- by “love” I mean the squishy feelings most people call love.

Real love is always enough. But real love is sacrificial. Real love is centered in Christ. Real love is described by St Paul in 1 Corinthians 13 and is based on the three theological virtues and lived out through the cardinal virtues and the beatitudes. Real love is an act of our will.

 

[Sonas]

Thanks for your replies.

Nancymarie, it was really interesting to read your post. Everything you’ve said there is what he’s said to me. I don’t think less of him for having those feelings. It’s rather that I want to understand I guess. And it’s probably impossible for me to do this having never experienced anything like it.
I have thought about what would happen should we get married and I were to get sick. And I don’t have an answer. I haven’t ever discussed that with him either. Do you think it’s something I should or is it very early for that? I know he would find it extremely difficult and part of me right now thinks that should a situation like that arise I would just leave. But that’s not really a solution either.

I understand what you mean 1ke, about real love. I don’t know if that’s what we have. Perhaps it is too early to tell. But I do know that times before when I’ve felt like I’ve been in love, it wasn’t like this. So then I don’t want to throw what we have away. I really do love him and I think he feels the same about me. But I also know that it’s not going to be an easy path.

 

[KendraDZ1902]

I can see how someone would resent a tough and long illness. I think it would take me a long time to get over that. If my husband passed away, I think I would be angry about it for quite sometime. Be thankful that he is open about it, I probably wouldn’t be.

How old are you? I can’t tell you if the relationship will work. I wouldn’t tell anyone that they are going to last forever and always, things happen and I wouldn’t want someone to look back and say, “well Kendra told me that me and my boyfriend were meant to be. She lied!” You shouldn’t base your relationship on the opinions of a few people on the internet.

 

[nancymarie]

Sonas I sent you a pm .

 

[marymary1975]

I am sorry to say this but the truth is love is not enough. Can it work? Yes, it can but in order to make it work you need to be extremely conscious of how difficult it is to make work and be very aware of those difficulties, and the second big issue is that being aware of those difficulties at this point in tour relationship is like trying to realize how much kidney stones hurt when you have never felt the pain of kidney stones.

I was.married to a man 14 years my senior, who even though baptized catholic was an atheist (though I dint know he was atheist after the marriage), who had been married before and who had an illness. When I got married I was a firm.believer of love is enough, and even in the very beginning I still.believed love was enough but today, and after five years into my marriage I realized you need way more than plain love to make things work. I have to say based on my experience that difference in religion and moral ideas and belief are a huge issue which is going to multiply times ten in marriage. Also remember, many things that are said before marriage may not happen after marriage specially when you start dealing with the everyday life difficulties. I have to say that couples that I know that have been successful with inter religious marriages, tend to be because they never talk about the issue. Pretty much they each live their religion fully independently as if they were not married. So I think you need to be fully aware that the religion is a major issue and you have to address it now, and I think the simply “just come to my faith and let’s raise the kids catholics” is not enough. You have to go deeper than that with the mind that he will change his mind.

Second, the age difference and the fact that he has been married before is another issue because both of you are going to enter with very different expectations into marriage. He unconsciously is going to expect you to be at the knowledge level of his (this happened to me) and that is very difficult. So you have to be aware of that. Another thing that would worry me, while I totally understand that taking care of an ill spouse takes a toll on.someone, if he is still complaining about it and saying he lost time, it gives me the impression that he is emotionally attached to that event which I don’t think iS good. I also would be worried about what happens if you get sick? I think that is a very valid concern on your part specially since he seems so attached to the situation.

I think you may benefit from talking to a priest and to try to look at your relationship more rationally and less with the mentality of “love is enough.” Again I am not saying is not doable, it is, but it requires a lot of rational thinking…the problem is x,y and z, how I am going to solve the problem, what if x happens, what of y happens, how are going to work out differences in experience, expectations, etc. I know it doesn’t sound romantic at all but marriage is a serious compromise with many challenges and if you want to have a happy marriage you need to start addressing and fixing possible problems now, because otherwise everything that seems minimum in dating, usually becomes a big issue in marriage.

 

[PennyinCanada]

Willing to ‘support’ raising kids Catholic is not the same as ‘being’ Catholic.

Let me describe the family in our little parish. The husband got married to a Catholic girl, in their 30’s because they would not date anyone who wasn’t a practicing Catholic. They have little ones now and they get to see daddy go up and kiss the icons. (we are Eastern Rite) and they know icons and that they get kissed. I saw daddy carrying the littlest one in his arms when we had a feast day and the priest anoints with oil. The little fella had the best seat in the house, watching daddy get the oil on his forehead in the sign of a cross. As they walked back to the pew, the little guy traced the sign of the cross on daddy’s forehead, like the priest had done. Daddy had a HUGE smile. I had tears.

“Being” Catholic means children see daddy kneeling in church, praying, holding his wife’s hand and praying together. They see daddy standing in line for confession and he makes sure the kids have the opportunity to go too. Daddy shuts off the TV and has a rosary in his hand. The parents have an icon table or statue to the Blessed Mother in their home, and it gets used. When mommy is sick, daddy takes the kids to church, and if he needs to split up the kids and go twice, he will. Catholic fathers know the faith and can teach the virtues. Have a look here…en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_virtues He gives thanks to God at the supper table, and when out somewhere. He puts the sign of the cross on his children to receive a blessing at bedtime. He observes Lent and the calendar of the Church, which is so rich and wonderful.

I can tell you, coming from an unbelieving home, a faithful spouse is priceless. Please consider that your children and *grandchildren *depend on the choice you make in a spouse. Don’t settle for less.

Scripture says:
Do not yoke yourselves in a mismatch with unbelievers. What do righteousness and lawlessness have in common, or what fellowship can light have with darkness? What common lot between believer and unbeliever?..You are the temple of the living God, just as God has said:
"I will dwell with them and walk among them.
I will be their God and they shall be my people.
Therefore, ‘Come out from among them and separate yourselves from them’, says the
Lord. 2 Cor 6:14

The choice before Israel, and us as well…
"Here, then, I have today set before you life and prosperity, death and doom. If you obey the commandments of the Lord your God, which I enjoin on you today, loving him, and walking in his ways, and keeping his commandments, statutes and decrees, you will live and grow numerous, and the Lord your God will bless you in the land you are entering to occupy. …I call heaven and earth today to witness against you: I have set before you life and death, the blessing and the curse. Choose life, then, that you and your descendants may live, by loving the Lord your God, heeding his voice, and holding fast to him. Deut 30:15

Think hard and be sober in your judgement. May God strengthen your resolve to have a Catholic home and family.

 

[MJJean]

“Love” is rarely enough-- by “love” I mean the squishy feelings most people call love.

Real love is always enough. But real love is sacrificial. Real love is centered in Christ. Real love is described by St Paul in 1 Corinthians 13 and is based on the three theological virtues and lived out through the cardinal virtues and the beatitudes. Real love is an act of our will.

Yes. Even though this man is not religious he has shown real love. I have been a caregiver. I didn’t care for a spouse, but I do know what it is like to be a chroncially and terminally ill persons caregiver. Taking care of an ill spouse for 7 years is an act of real honest to goodness loving will. He seems to have demonstrated an understanding that marriage is for life, too.

As for understanding how he feels, Sonas, you are correct that you really can’t. It’s so very complicated. During the worst of the illness and suffering the loving caregiver has difficulty feeling the warm fuzzies of romantic love. In order to be able to do what is needed for the loved one it’s necessary to more or less focus on duty and obligation and the nuts and bolts of caregiving. If you really feel the emotions you tend to fall apart when the loved one needs you the most and you simply cannot allow yourself to do that. In cases like this, love is very much a verb. It’s not what you feel, it’s what you do based on the romantic love or the memory of romantic love felt before the big bad thing changed everything.

What would happen if you married this man and became ill? Bah, we can’t live our lives like that. Sure, it could happen. Sure, it’s something to consider. My husband and I talked about what we would do if one or the other became seriously ill. The reality is that you never know for sure until you get there. He could cut and run or he could care for you the same way he cared for his first wife. It’s also entirely possible he could become ill and you’d be the one who had to take care of him or who would cut and run.

Yes, he is still dealing with the trauma of his wife’s illness and death. Of course, he resents what happened to his marriage and his life. He wanted a normal, grow old together, marriage to a healthy wife. It’s not what he got. Those feelings are quite natural. He does have some baggage, but then don’t we all?

Sometimes I think finding the right person to marry has a lot to do with finding someone whose baggage you can deal with and who can deal with your baggage. Imperfectly perfect for each other.

This man has been tested and he passed. He stayed, he loved, he did the right thing. He sounds like a good man. If he’s truly supporting your religious beliefs and even willing to go to Mass with you then I think the relationship could work out.

 

[St_Francis]

Another thing to cnsider is that children very often follow the father in religious matters–his attitude is the one more likely to be the one the children end up with. Mothers can take their children to Mass every single week, supplement the CCD classes at home and do all that, and the end is that up to 75% of the children will follow their dad, esp the boys.

A hige part of what ought to be your shared life, the foundation of each of your lives and of your lives together, will be missing. That’s a huge area of intimacy.

There will be times at the dinner table or on a car ride when your husband will start saying things that while not overtly anti-Catholic are undermining things, and you won’t be able to do anything about it.

And that’s completely aside from the age issue! He has grown children–how does he feel about starting that phase of life all over again? Right now, he may be ok with it, but if you are say, 30 and he is say, 50… you may still want to have children in 10 years and he may think–I am 60 years old, I am ready to be a grandfather and not a father! He would be 78 years old when this child was 18…

And if he is a lot older than you are, the likelihood is that you will be caring for him…possibly at the same time you are trying to care for your own parents.

I may be wrong about the age difference, but I thought it might be great the way you mentioned it.

Marriage is really tough. It doesn’t help when additional pressures are put in.

 

[McMcMe]

I think you really need to examine your reaction to his resentments of his first wife. Do you fear that he would not care for you if you were sick. Do you lose respect for him when he speaks this way? Are you embarrassed that a man you love would speak this way? You need to be really honest with yourself here. Do not marry a man whom you don’t respect or of whom you are ashamed–even if you know intellectually that it is caused by PTSD or something else. That is a recipe for disaster.

The age difference concerns me and it should concern you too. Do you both want to have children? If not, you cannot enter into a Catholic marriage. You also mention that he has adult children. Do not discount the amount of work that a blended family takes emotionally on a marriage. Have you interacted with his children very much?

It concerns me that he isn’t religious at all. I think it much easier if you share some sort faith–even just a faith in God and nothing more. If you want to raise Catholic children, marry a Catholic. If you want to raise Christian children, marry a Christian. If you want to marry a God-fearing child, marry a theist. If you want to raise atheists, marry an atheist. Of course there is no guarantee as to the faith of your children but your actions on who you choose to marry speaks VOLUMES to them about your hopes and dreams and the importance of faith in your life.

The long distance thing is interesting. You are very wise to try to spend more consecutive time together in light of the three big mismatches above to see if there is enough in common to continue this relationship. Early love can be so intoxicating – its good to take your time before making a lifelong commitment.

 

[Anglewannabe]

What would happen if you married this man and became ill? Bah, we can’t live our lives like that. Sure, it could happen. Sure, it’s something to consider. My husband and I talked about what we would do if one or the other became seriously ill. The reality is that you never know for sure until you get there. He could cut and run or he could care for you the same way he cared for his first wife. It’s also entirely possible he could become ill and you’d be the one who had to take care of him or who would cut and run.

.

Talking about these things now is useless, you just can not predict future emotions.

I am going to be totally honest with you. If I was in your shoes, I wouldn’t feel like I was his girlfriend half as much as I would feel like his therapist (and by the way, marrying your therapist is always a mistake). It is one thing to be honest about your past, it is another to seek healing from your spouse. The type of grief he feels can only be healed by God and since he is not a believer, it won’t be happening anytime soon

Two years ago, I lost 2 loved ones within 2 months. And I got to see how God really touches our lives. One was 94 and in a nursing home. I dutifully visited him regularly. It was so draining to see him suffer like that. I can not count how many times I just wanted to tell him ‘I can’t take this anymore, I will say my goodbyes now since I don’t plan on coming back’.

Now that my friend is gone, I cherish all the memories of the times I went to see him. I don’t remember the frustration as a bad thing but as a thing that touches my heart. I can honestly say, caring for him was the best time of our friendship.

If this man still resents all the time he spent caring for his wife instead of being grateful for all the time he had with her, he is seriously stuck in his grief. She is still the #1 woman in his heart and you are not. Sorry to be blunt. And by allowed him to openly discuss this with you, you are teaching him it is OK to have 2 women.

He should not forget his first wife and he should have fond memories. But if he can not realise that is over and you are now #1, you are in for a lonely marriage

Angie

 

[Sonas]

I can see how someone would resent a tough and long illness. I think it would take me a long time to get over that. If my husband passed away, I think I would be angry about it for quite sometime. Be thankful that he is open about it, I probably wouldn’t be.

How old are you? I can’t tell you if the relationship will work. I wouldn’t tell anyone that they are going to last forever and always, things happen and I wouldn’t want someone to look back and say, “well Kendra told me that me and my boyfriend were meant to be. She lied!” You shouldn’t base your relationship on the opinions of a few people on the internet.

Thanks for your reply. I am very grateful that he is open with me about it and I’ve told him this.

I’m not going to make a decision based on what any one person says to me here. I’m just looking to see what other people would say about my situation. Sometimes an impartial listener can see something that you cannot. I’m just looking for a little advice/perspective so that I don’t go into this with my eyes closed.

 

[Sonas]

Thanks to everyone who replied. Taking the time to think about the issues you’ve raised has really helped me.

I have to say based on my experience that difference in religion and moral ideas and belief are a huge issue which is going to multiply times ten in marriage. Also remember, many things that are said before marriage may not happen after marriage specially when you start dealing with the everyday life difficulties. I have to say that couples that I know that have been successful with inter religious marriages, tend to be because they never talk about the issue. Pretty much they each live their religion fully independently as if they were not married. So I think you need to be fully aware that the religion is a major issue and you have to address it now, and I think the simply “just come to my faith and let’s raise the kids catholics” is not enough. You have to go deeper than that with the mind that he will change his mind.

Willing to ‘support’ raising kids Catholic is not the same as ‘being’ Catholic.
“Being” Catholic means children see daddy kneeling in church, praying, holding his wife’s hand and praying together. They see daddy standing in line for confession and he makes sure the kids have the opportunity to go too. Daddy shuts off the TV and has a rosary in his hand. The parents have an icon table or statue to the Blessed Mother in their home, and it gets used. When mommy is sick, daddy takes the kids to church, and if he needs to split up the kids and go twice, he will. Catholic fathers know the faith and can teach the virtues. Have a look here…en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_virtues He gives thanks to God at the supper table, and when out somewhere. He puts the sign of the cross on his children to receive a blessing at bedtime. He observes Lent and the calendar of the Church, which is so rich and wonderful.

I can tell you, coming from an unbelieving home, a faithful spouse is priceless. Please consider that your children and *grandchildren *depend on the choice you make in a spouse. Don’t settle for less.

Another thing to cnsider is that children very often follow the father in religious matters–his attitude is the one more likely to be the one the children end up with. Mothers can take their children to Mass every single week, supplement the CCD classes at home and do all that, and the end is that up to 75% of the children will follow their dad, esp the boys.

It concerns me that he isn’t religious at all. I think it much easier if you share some sort faith–even just a faith in God and nothing more. If you want to raise Catholic children, marry a Catholic. If you want to raise Christian children, marry a Christian. If you want to marry a God-fearing child, marry a theist. If you want to raise atheists, marry an atheist. Of course there is no guarantee as to the faith of your children but your actions on who you choose to marry speaks VOLUMES to them about your hopes and dreams and the importance of faith in your life.

I understand all the points that you are making here about having a Catholic husband. But there is nothing I can do to change the fact that my boyfriend is not. I also look back to my childhood. I’m Catholic and was raised as such but it was never obvious in our home. We went to mass every weekend but that was it. I actually attribute my faith today to someone outside the family who had an unshakeable faith and helped me in so many ways. I guess I’m hoping that my faith will show and any children we may possibly have will see this as they grow up.

 

[Sonas]

Yes. Even though this man is not religious he has shown real love. I have been a caregiver. I didn’t care for a spouse, but I do know what it is like to be a chroncially and terminally ill persons caregiver. Taking care of an ill spouse for 7 years is an act of real honest to goodness loving will. He seems to have demonstrated an understanding that marriage is for life, too.

As for understanding how he feels, Sonas, you are correct that you really can’t. It’s so very complicated. During the worst of the illness and suffering the loving caregiver has difficulty feeling the warm fuzzies of romantic love. In order to be able to do what is needed for the loved one it’s necessary to more or less focus on duty and obligation and the nuts and bolts of caregiving. If you really feel the emotions you tend to fall apart when the loved one needs you the most and you simply cannot allow yourself to do that. In cases like this, love is very much a verb. It’s not what you feel, it’s what you do based on the romantic love or the memory of romantic love felt before the big bad thing changed everything.

What would happen if you married this man and became ill? Bah, we can’t live our lives like that. Sure, it could happen. Sure, it’s something to consider. My husband and I talked about what we would do if one or the other became seriously ill. The reality is that you never know for sure until you get there. He could cut and run or he could care for you the same way he cared for his first wife. It’s also entirely possible he could become ill and you’d be the one who had to take care of him or who would cut and run.

Yes, he is still dealing with the trauma of his wife’s illness and death. Of course, he resents what happened to his marriage and his life. He wanted a normal, grow old together, marriage to a healthy wife. It’s not what he got. Those feelings are quite natural. He does have some baggage, but then don’t we all?

Sometimes I think finding the right person to marry has a lot to do with finding someone whose baggage you can deal with and who can deal with your baggage. Imperfectly perfect for each other.

This man has been tested and he passed. He stayed, he loved, he did the right thing. He sounds like a good man. If he’s truly supporting your religious beliefs and even willing to go to Mass with you then I think the relationship could work out.

Thanks for this. It was really helpful to read. And also helped me to put a lot in perspective.

 

[PennyinCanada]

I understand all the points that you are making here about having a Catholic husband. But there is nothing I can do to change the fact that my boyfriend is not. I also look back to my childhood. I’m Catholic and was raised as such but it was never obvious in our home. We went to mass every weekend but that was it. I actually attribute my faith today to someone outside the family who had an unshakeable faith and helped me in so many ways. I guess I’m hoping that my faith will show and any children we may possibly have will see this as they grow up.

there is nothing I can do to change the fact that my boyfriend is not.*
Yes, there is something you can do. Pray, and find a Catholic boyfriend.

I had a Catholic girlfriend who married an unbeliever. They used the pill before they got married when they lived together. They used the pill during their married life, and he got sterilized after the 2nd child. She begged and pleaded for a 2nd child because after 1, well, he was done. When I visited their home, there was plenty of compromises because, as she explained, those kids were half his.

If you want a Catholic husband with faith in action, look to God and ask for that. You are the Temple of the Living God!! Come into the fullness of that. Don’t live a life that will be full of compromises. Narrow is the way to the kingdom of God, and so few follow that path because there’s so many temptations along the way to pull them off course.

Mark well the parable of the sower who throws seeds along the path. Part of the seed fell on rocky ground, where it had little soil. It sprouted at once since the soil had no depth, but when the sun rose and scorched it, it began to wither for lack of root. How do you plan to yield thirty, or sixty, or a hundredfold by yoking yourself to an unbeliever?