Can we know Roughly when the Great Tribulation could start?

[abelville]

Thanks so much for all of your replies.

I had recently also read a view of things to come. IT stated that soon protestant Christians will join with us and we would be “one” faith, and that a lot of the Jewish faith would also join with us as Catholic (universal) Christians. After this happens, the church will undergo a severe trial someday (like the Tribulation). Could someone comment on this too?

Thanks!!

I appreciate all of you educating me on this.

Al

PS: SORRY I HAD TWO OF THE SAME THREAD.

 

[spedteacherita]

My names not Karl, but the Catholic Church takes Jesus at His word when He said, “No one but the Father knows the hour or the day.” Others have been predicting the “End of the World” for many, many years and so far they have ALL been wrong. Just be prepared always. God Bless, Memaw

I was going to say the same thing, Memaw!! Not even Jesus knows so it floors me when I read about a pastor or a group who maintains a certain time element or even a precise date and time of when Jesus is returning.

Looking at the “signs” that are happening all around us only gives us hope because not only does Jesus say that those things will happen but He will keep us safe through all of it.

God bless, all!

Rita

 

[abelville]

How about this link? It talks in great detail about the tribulation. It’s from the “National Catholic Register”.

taylormarshall.com/2015/03/book-of-revelation-who-are-the-beasts-and-the-whore-of-babylon.html

Is he talking about way off in the future, or near future? I subscribe to this Catholic news and find it has a lot of articles about the Great Tribulation and the Mark of the Beast.

Thanks!

Al

 

[mdgspencer]

Over the last two hundred years Protestant groups have established a year for the end times. Then when the date rolls around, nothing happens. Three or four years ago a Protestant in the news got an international following, a man who also established a date. When it came and nothing happened, he set a new date. Then then when this new date occurred, nothing happened again. This is just another prediction from Protestants about when the end of the world will occur. I would just disregard this new prediction. Don’t let your faith be detoured on this.
It seems someone told you that some Catholic theologians have agreed with this. I would discount this claim too.

 

[Tom_Baum]

My personal opinion is that there are at least three places in the Gospels where Jesus says we will not know ahead of time when it is (Mt. 24:37-44, Mt. 25:13, Mk. 13:32-37), so I don’t think we will know. Also, there were apparently a large number of people who were certain that Jesus would return at the end of the millennium–the first millennium, in 1000 AD. And very many times since then.

I’m pretty sure that the official Catholic teaching is that we will not know ahead of time, too (CCC #673), but I welcome correction by anyone who knows more about it.

I don’t think there is anything wrong with speculating about when Jesus will return, I just think it is pointless. It would be wrong to preach it in homilies except to mention it as a theory, since that is all it is, and not an official Church teaching.

Just MHO, though.

–Jen

You wrote, “Also, there were apparently a large number of people who were certain that Jesus would return at the end of the millennium–the first millennium, in 1000 AD. And very many times since then.”

It seems that it was “most” of the first Christians that thought Jesus was coming back in their lifetime.

So it wasn’t just from “the end of the millennium–the first millennium, in 1000 AD. And very many times since then.”, it was from the very beginning of Christianity.

 

[Nelka]

I don’t think we will know when the tribulation is until we enter day one.

 

[powerofk]

Honestly, we’ve been in the End Times since the death & resurrection of Jesus. The period of the Church IS the End Times. But, regardless, our job is to make sure that whenever it happens (whether it be our own personal end or the Second Coming) that we are ready. So we must “Stay Awake” and “Be Ready” for we do not know the day nor the hour.

 

[DavidFilmer]

I had recently also read a view of things to come. It stated that soon protestant Christians will join with us and we would be “one” faith, and that a lot of the Jewish faith would also join with us as Catholic (universal) Christians. After this happens, the church will undergo a severe trial someday (like the Tribulation). Could someone comment on this too?

The whole tribulation thing is pure speculation.

However, the part about “one faith” is fairly accurate. The Church teaches that we become one with the Body of Christ by Christian Baptism. Since most protestants have valid Christian Baptism, they are joined to the Body of Christ, just like Catholics. If they avoid mortal sin, they are assured salvation, just like Catholics. It has always been this way, even back to the days of the Arian heresy of the very early Church.

Jews are another matter, though. They don’t have Christian Baptism, and they don’t have any “advantage” by being Jewish (they need Jesus just like everyone else). That doesn’t mean Jews won’t attain salvation - God works through the Sacraments but is not limited by them, so it is certainly possible that someone could be saved without Baptism (and the Church actually teaches this) but nobody has the faintest idea how it works, so there are no guarantees apart from Baptism.

 

[Randy_Carson]

A lot of what is taught in some circles is erroneous.

Matthew 24:4
Jesus answered: “Watch out that no one deceives you.

HOWEVER, this does not mean that we should not be aware of the times in which we are living.

Matthew 24:42
“Therefore keep watch, because you do not know on what day your Lord will come.

 

[Mr_Clean]

Thanks. I had read another of Currie’s books.

While learning of this one, (David Currie’s Rapture: The End-Times Error That Leaves the Bible Behind?) I wondered if it had a Catholic *Imprimatur *or Nihil Obstat - making it a (more formally? safer?) book per Catholic theology.

I didn’t find that (not yet anyway), but there was the fact that it is (was?) available on Catholic.com. And there was an accompanying video

catholic.com/video/what-jesus-really-said-about-the-end-of-the-world

If anyone has the book and knows of any

Imprimatur < Catholic Bishop who has determined it is useful for and beneficial to one’s Catholic faith

or Nihil Obstat < A Catholic expert who determines that there is formally “nothing objectionable” in the the book per the Catholic faith

that might be nice to know.

I have the Kindle version and it does not have either of the official stamps of approval. It does have a forward from Scott Hahn and it certainly strives to keep a Catholic view of eschatology. The Church is not very vocal about the topics dealt with in this type book. He does a nice job of highlighting what the early Church had to say about the scriptures that Rapturist frequently use to prove their point. It is a good book if you want to know how the first century Church interpreted Daniel’s 70 weeks and the book of Revelation.

 

[Gorgias]

Well, yes and no. It could be a question of terminology, since, “Before Christ’s second coming the Church must pass through a final trial that will shake the faith of many believers.” … And the Protestant document making those claims? The Catechism of the Catholic Church, #675.

Cute.

Yet, the ‘final trial’ isn’t what Protestants are talking about when they talk about the ‘tribulation’. They mean a period, before or during which the Rapture will occur; or in conjunction with which there will be a time in which believers will be persecuted.

Tell me… do you find this teaching in CCC 675? No.

But the idea of a period of tribulation before the second coming is Catholic.

The problem, of course, is that – at least in the States, where Protestant Rapture theology is manifest – the notion of ‘tribulation’ is conflated with ‘pre-trib’ or ‘post-trib’ rapture. Do you really think that, given the general state of catechesis of American Catholics, a discourse on the ‘period of tribulation’ is what is needed? When – as Pope Francis has himself stated – what’s really necessary is a proclamation of the saving message that Jesus proclaimed?

It probably wouldn’t hurt to mention it in a homily now and then … so that whenever it does come (whether next year, next century, next millennium, or what), we (as a Chruch) recognize it.

Jen, too many Catholics don’t recognize the True Presence of Christ in the Eucharist. I’m thinking that it’s a higher priority to recognize that than it is to recognize the Parousia before it occurs…

 

[Memaw]

Thanks. I had read another of Currie’s books.

While learning of this one, (David Currie’s Rapture: The End-Times Error That Leaves the Bible Behind?) I wondered if it had a Catholic *Imprimatur *or Nihil Obstat - making it a (more formally? safer?) book per Catholic theology.

I didn’t find that (not yet anyway), but there was the fact that it is (was?) available on Catholic.com. And there was an accompanying video

catholic.com/video/what-jesus-really-said-about-the-end-of-the-world

If anyone has the book and knows of any

Imprimatur < Catholic Bishop who has determined it is useful for and beneficial to one’s Catholic faith

or Nihil Obstat < A Catholic expert who determines that there is formally “nothing objectionable” in the the book per the Catholic faith

that might be nice to know.

I don’t think they put these on non Catholic writers. God Bless, Memaw

 

[Gorgias]

How about this link? It talks in great detail about the tribulation. It’s from the “National Catholic Register”.

Al,

Your link neither discusses the ‘tribulation’, nor does it come from the National Catholic Register. Perhaps you meant to paste a different link?

 

[abelville]

Al,

Your link neither discusses the ‘tribulation’, nor does it come from the National Catholic Register. Perhaps you meant to paste a different link?

Sorry,

I guess I goofed up. Now I can’t remember where the link is.

thanks!!

All

 

[revert_jen]

It seems that it was “most” of the first Christians that thought Jesus was coming back in their lifetime.

So it wasn’t just from “the end of the millennium–the first millennium, in 1000 AD. And very many times since then.”, it was from the very beginning of Christianity.

Sorry, I didn’t mean to imply that I was giving a complete history of end-times speculation.

–Jen

 

[revert_jen]

Yet, the ‘final trial’ isn’t what Protestants are talking about when they talk about the ‘tribulation’. They mean a period, before or during which the Rapture will occur; or in conjunction with which there will be a time in which believers will be persecuted.

Tell me… do you find this teaching in CCC 675? No.

Well, since my point was that it was “a question of terminology” (which is to say that Protestants and Catholics may mean something different), and since I specifically said that the idea of the rapture was not Catholic, I really don’t understand your point here.

The problem, of course, is that – at least in the States, where Protestant Rapture theology is manifest – the notion of ‘tribulation’ is conflated with ‘pre-trib’ or ‘post-trib’ rapture. Do you really think that, given the general state of catechesis of American Catholics, a discourse on the ‘period of tribulation’ is what is needed? When – as Pope Francis has himself stated – what’s really necessary is a proclamation of the saving message that Jesus proclaimed?

Jen, too many Catholics don’t recognize the True Presence of Christ in the Eucharist. I’m thinking that it’s a higher priority to recognize that than it is to recognize the Parousia before it occurs…

I’m sorry, I didn’t know that having homilies on salvation and the Eucharist precluded ever having one that touched on the end times.

And yes, since you ask, I think an occasional homily (assuming it was relevant to the Gospel of the day) that explained what Catholics believe about the end times (and maybe how this is different from what Protestants believe) would be useful.

–Jen

 

[Gorgias]

Well, since my point was that it was “a question of terminology” (which is to say that Protestants and Catholics may mean something different), and since I specifically said that the idea of the rapture was not Catholic, I really don’t understand your point here.

OK, gotcha. So, you’re calling for homilies on the “final trial”, not on the “Great Tribulation”. Makes sense.

I’m sorry, I didn’t know that having homilies on salvation and the Eucharist precluded ever having one that touched on the end times.

It doesn’t. Yet, preaching the ‘end times’, when a person doesn’t have a grip on Christ’s message of love, isn’t really helpful, don’t you think?

And yes, since you ask, I think an occasional homily (assuming it was relevant to the Gospel of the day) that explained what Catholics believe about the end times (and maybe how this is different from what Protestants believe) would be useful.

Agreed. Even in leading Bible studies, it’s surprised me how many Catholics think all that Rapture stuff is not only true, but also actually is taught by the Church. One of the reasons I was once given was, “well, I never heard a priest preach from the pulpit that it’s not true!” :sad_yes:

 

[BernadetteM]

Personally I am offended by those within the protestant community that profess all these lies about the end times and the tribulation. To be honest most of them sound like they have severe mental or emotional problems.

My daughter, who was bi-polar and was severely ill, was starting to become very close to our Lord through the Blessed Sacrament and His Mother. Because of her condition, she became friends with a man who she felt was an angel as he treated her in a kind way. He was not a Christian, still isn’t, but decided to convert her to all this end times stuff. He only read the old Testament and Revelation. Then she started going to all the websites written by these NUTS and decided they were true. We are talking about having her head chopped off, being interned in a FEMA camp, being giving vaccinations that would control her etc. etc. Before when her Catholic faith was strong she was at peace, after this started she was in daily fear.

After a year of this she became more and more delusional with the help of that man and those on these websites who would befriend her. They all had dates based on the blood moon or something else and would state the end would be here between tomorrow and maybe 2018. The end result is that my daughter had an enlarged heart, which we didn’t know about and all the stress she was under appeared to contribute to her dying a month ago.

My family is very angry that people like this are able to use people with brain disabilities to buy into their lies. From my understanding these websites make a financial gain if they have enough followers.

As the Bible says we are always to be ready for the Second Coming, we are to keep our light burning at all times.

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette

 

[Bonnie]

I don’t think they put these on non Catholic writers. God Bless, Memaw

David Currie is Catholic. Like me, he’s a convert. His books are excellent for understanding the point of view of the few Protestant sects that believe end-times prediction, etc., and why the Catholic Church does not agree with these. Most Protestants don’t believe, but the few who do are very loud!

 

[hazcompat]

ecatholic2000.com/pohle/untitled.shtml

Peace