Can you be both Catholic and liberal?

[Timbothefiveth]

Being liberal on some issues (abortion) is against church teaching. Being conservative on some issues also is. The difference is that the issues where you are supposed to have a conservative view, such as abortion, are the most important ones.

 

[7_Sorrows]

can you be both Catholic and liberal? since converting to Catholicism, i have met many people who call themselves Catholic who are pro-choice, pro-Obama, pro-female ordinations, etc. so i guess the answer would have to be yes.

 

[tomarin]

can you be both Catholic and liberal? since converting to Catholicism, i have met many people who call themselves Catholic who are pro-choice, pro-Obama, pro-female ordinations, etc. so i guess the answer would have to be yes.

That’s because they want to change the Church, rather than let the Church change them.

 

[tomarin]

I know that you cannot be both Catholic and pro-choice due to what we believe and practice as Catholics, but is it possible to be a liberal and still be a good Catholic?

The Catholic Church is a fundamentally conservative institution (some would say one of the most conservative in existence); in normal circumstances, to the degree that it changes it changes very slowly. So it’s probably easier to be conservative rather than liberal and be a Catholic. But I don’t think it’s impossible to be liberal and Catholic. One would just have to reject the standard liberal line on abortion and other life issues.

However at a deeper level, the level of anthropology (in the philosophical, “science of man” sense) I think there’s a fundamental difference in the way Catholics (those who “think with the Church” that is) and secular progressives/liberals view the relationship of humans to each other and the relationship of humans to God (naturally enough). And the traditional Catholic view is of course much more conservative than the progressive one which, as I see it, regards human nature as a pliable and open-ended phenomenon rather than one defined by eternal fixed constraints like original sin. Therefore Catholics will be, or should be, more sceptical about utopian movements to remake society according to rationalist schemes like Marxism, over and above whether the principles these movements are based on are atheistic or not.

(Then again how does one explain the case of an impeccably Catholic writer like Hilaire Beloc who, inexplicably, was an enthusiastic proponent of the French Revolution – although I think he reconsidered this when he was older and wiser and had served a few terms as a member of the British Parliament.)

 

[manualman]

A good catholic with a properly informed conscience will likely provoke rage from BOTH Rush Limbaugh AND Nancy Pelosi. If you find yourself completely agreeing with either one of them - WORRY and then PRAY!

 

[Shin]

May I suggest the following book, provided by EWTN for free entitled:

Liberalism is a Sin

 

[johngh]

If you are referring to the modern day use of the word liberal, then the answer is no, you cannot be both that and a good Catholic.

 

[lil_flower_luv]

May I suggest the following book, provided by EWTN for free entitled:

Liberalism is a Sin

Thank you! That hit the nail on the head!

 

[adowcday]

Garment. Seamless garment. If you’re going to misrepresent the Cardinal’s teaching, at least do him the good service of not misquoting him.

You’re correct, I misstated – it is “seamless garment.” However, I didn’t misrepresent his teaching.

 

[Texas_Roofer]

Thank you! That hit the nail on the head!

I hope you realize that writing would condemn all supporters of the USA?

 

[lil_flower_luv]

I hope you realize that writing would condemn all supporters of the USA?

Read this thread again and you will see what is condemning our country.

 

[gearhead]

“Pro-life” and “Obama” cannot be in the same sentence. Surely you must be joking!

There are more issues in the world than abortion.

One of my online friends likes to joke that you could take a monkey, put a t-shirt on him that says “I (heart) Jesus” and put a sign in his hand that says “no abortions”, and the religious right would vote for him. Sometimes I wonder whether there might be a kernel of truth in that.

Abortion is one issue where both sides are deeply entrenched, unlikely to change their minds, and movement in the short term by either side is unlikely. In terms of actual effect, there’s not that much difference between voting for a an anti-abortion candidate who’ll be blocked by pro-choice representatives and voting for a pro-choice candidate who’ll be blocked by anti-abortion representatives. Meanwhile, there are countless other issues with moral ramifications where real change can take place. I think it makes perfect sense to take those other issues into account when deciding who to vote for, and making a candidate’s position on abortion, which is likely to be ineffective at producing change, whatever it is, secondary.

 

[Texas_Roofer]

Read this thread again and you will see what is condemning our country.

That is the problem with today’s self proclaimed conservatives they are clueless on what conservative means.

 

[Texas_Roofer]

…Abortion is one issue where both sides are deeply entrenched…

And neither trench is full of conservatives nor libereals, both trenches have both conservatives and libereals.

 

[lil_flower_luv]

There are more issues in the world than abortion.

One of my online friends likes to joke that you could take a monkey, put a t-shirt on him that says “I (heart) Jesus” and put a sign in his hand that says “no abortions”, and the religious right would vote for him. Sometimes I wonder whether there might be a kernel of truth in that.

Abortion is one issue where both sides are deeply entrenched, unlikely to change their minds, and movement in the short term by either side is unlikely. In terms of actual effect, there’s not that much difference between voting for a an anti-abortion candidate who’ll be blocked by pro-choice representatives and voting for a pro-choice candidate who’ll be blocked by anti-abortion representatives. Meanwhile, there are countless other issues with moral ramifications where real change can take place. I think it makes perfect sense to take those other issues into account when deciding who to vote for, and making a candidate’s position on abortion, which is likely to be ineffective at producing change, whatever it is, secondary.

The issue of life should be first and foremost.
What you said about the the life issue being second, is WRONG.

Yes ~ There are other issues.

Yes ~ They should be considered.

BUT, not before the issue of life, God’s greatest gift to us.

“Among important issues involving the dignity of human life with which the Church is concerned, abortion necessarily plays a central role. Abortion, the direct killing of an innocent human being, is always gravely immoral (The Gospel of Life, no. 57); its victims are the most vulnerable and defenseless members of the human family. It is imperative that those who are called to serve the least among us give urgent attention and priority to this issue of justice.” ~U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops

Believe what you want, friend, but Catholics will not tuck the battle against abortion in our back pockets. ** It comes* first*.**

 

[lil_flower_luv]

That is the problem with today’s self proclaimed conservatives they are clueless on what conservative means.

This isn’t about politics. This is about where we stand as a country. Forget about people’s political views; look at how they are living their life.…and the choices they are making.

 

[gearhead]

The issue of life should be first and foremost.
What you said about the the life issue being second, is WRONG.

Yes ~ There are other issues.

Yes ~ They should be considered.

BUT, not before the issue of life, God’s greatest gift to us.

And abortion is not the only issue of life. War concerns life. Social programs concern life. Famine relief concerns life. Heck - even the maintenance budget of the Army Corps of Engineers concerns life, as evidenced by what happened during Hurricane Katrina.

And if it’s life you’re concerned with, those things should matter to you. Making noise on the deadlocked abortion issue will not cause any more or any fewer fetuses or embryos to be aborted. If you forget the issues where you actually can save lives to just push on the abortion issue against those who push right back, then you do life a disservice.

 

[MarkInOregon]

Hi all~

I know that you cannot be both Catholic and pro-choice due to what we believe and practice as Catholics, but is it possible to be a liberal and still be a good Catholic? A lot of my extended family is left-wing, yet claim to be Catholic. My immediate family is fully conservative, however, and I have never doubted that. Is it that I don’t fully understand the term “liberal” and think that you must automatically be conservative if you’re Catholic?

Please help me understand and excuse my political ignorance…

~Therese

I think as Catholics–we need to get past political labels.
I don’t think of myself as liberal or conservative but as Catholic. Now on issues like abortion, euthenasia (sp), homosexuality - that unites me with conservatives. There are other social issues like healthcare–where I think Catholics can disagree on the best way to provide it and that could align them with either liberals or conservatives–without violating Catholic teaching. It is possible for two people to have the same goal but have two different opinions on the best way to acheive that goal.
Now when someone says they’re Catholic I think we need to find out what they mean by that–faithful to the magisterium or simply “culturally” Catholic ie raised that way but don’t agree with everything and attend church occasionally.

Anyway I am uncomfortable being labeled anything but Catholic.
Thats my two cents.

Peace,
Mark

 

[lil_flower_luv]

And abortion is not the only issue of life. War concerns life. Social programs concern life. Famine relief concerns life. Heck - even the maintenance budget of the Army Corps of Engineers concerns life, as evidenced by what happened during Hurricane Katrina.

And if it’s life you’re concerned with, those things should matter to you. Making noise on the deadlocked abortion issue will not cause any more or any fewer fetuses or embryos to be aborted. If you forget the issues where you actually can save lives to just push on the abortion issue against those who push right back, then you do life a disservice.

Did you read my quotation? I know there are other life issues. But do they take 4,000 lives a day just in the US? Do they take as many as *1,300,000 *a year? Like I said, the ***most important ***issue at hand is abortion. It must be stopped.

 

[lil_flower_luv]

I think as Catholics–we need to get past political labels.
I don’t think of myself as liberal or conservative but as Catholic. Now on issues like abortion, euthenasia (sp), homosexuality - that unites me with conservatives. There are other social issues like healthcare–where I think Catholics can disagree on the best way to provide it and that could align them with either liberals or conservatives–without violating Catholic teaching. It is possible for two people to have the same goal but have two different opinions on the best way to acheive that goal.
Now when someone says they’re Catholic I think we need to find out what they mean by that–faithful to the magisterium or simply “culturally” Catholic ie raised that way but don’t agree with everything and attend church occasionally.

Anyway I am uncomfortable being labeled anything but Catholic.
Thats my two cents.

Peace,
Mark

Thank you!
I feel the very same now.