Cancelling David Haas

[stpurl]

Absolutely. Classical guitar can be beautiful. Of course for classical guitar Gregorian chant mass I picture the guitar giving the initial pitch setting for the motet and then. . .letting the voices do the rest. No strumming, no accompanying. Think how much more classy it would sound than a pitch pipe. And for all the people worried about how expensive an organ is, well, it seems everybody has a guitar and wants to play it in the worst way anyhow, so win-win situation.

 

[humilityseeker]

I didn’t want to post the whole report but it really seems like some of you guys don’t understand the seriousness of the accusations and the fact that there are a very large number of them. So here it is.

I fully understand the seriousness of any accusations like this. It seems to be an unending tragedy within the Catholic Church, one needing so many prayers. Ultimately the Liturgy Committees at each Diocese, headed by their Ordinary make decisions on Ordo hymns each week.

But it seems there are big events and composers can become celebrities.

It can be. In today’s world of social media, these hymns can also be sent around to gauge reception, especially now everyone has discovered zoom et al. I find each Parish and even each different Mass population has its own preferences. Dont dare play Eagles Wings in some, and dont dare leave it out in others.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

I further note there’s a partial list on his Wiki page of the dioceses that have banned or restricted the use of his music.

David Haas - Wikipedia

 

[Dlee]

I was just checking our hymnal. We sing many of his songs. Very sad situation, very serious. I just realized we use his Mass Setting Mass for a New World.

 

[27lw]

Honestly, I don’t care for that style of music (actually it’s not liturgical music at all and we’re being deprived of our actual Catholic musical heritage – but, hey “whatever”) but what is the determining factor for whose hymns are allowed? What if he was accused by, say five women rather than twenty. What is the cutoff point?
Why do we sing “A mighty fortress”? By that instigator?

 

[NeedANap]

My parish definitely has sung a number of his songs in the past. But I suspect we no longer will. When the allegations first came out my choir director said she had met him previously and because of that she believes the accusers. She did not say anything else.

 

[yankeesouth]

Lol…post of the day!

 

[otjm]

There is a phrase which has been around for a long time: “Not every statement by a heretic is a heresy”.

People are free to pick whatever music they wish within some very broad guidelines; eliminating his music because of whatever behavior or misbehavior Mr. Haas has engaged in seems a little bit of the pot calling the kettle black; according to St. Paul we are all sinners.

Whatever. His music should stand on its own merits; there are clearly some who do not like his music, and there are some who think it is to die for, and likely a whole lot somewhere between those two ends who may not even realize he was the composer.

I don’t have a dog in this one, but it seems a bit pharisaical to cast out his music for his behavior - which was not reflected in the music.

 

[Anesti33]

People are free to pick whatever music they wish within some very broad guidelines; eliminating his music because of whatever behavior or misbehavior Mr. Haas has engaged in seems a little bit of the pot calling the kettle black; according to St. Paul we are all sinners.

Haas has committed the Unforgivable Sin Against Women. The penalty is Damnatio Memoriae.

 

[otjm]

Which amusingly is playing right into the hands of the cancel culture people. The irony escapes those who do not have cancel culture as a norm; for those who do, it is business as usual.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

Why do we sing “A mighty fortress”? By that instigator?

My mother couldn’t stand that song. I remember asking her as a child why we shouldn’t sing it because it was in the Catholic Missalette and she snapped, “Because it’s Protestant!” in a voice that let me know not to ask any more questions. I didn’t figure out till I was much older what the problem was with it. I was just thinking of that last weekend when the organist launched into it for the recessional.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

eliminating his music because of whatever behavior or misbehavior Mr. Haas has engaged in seems a little bit of the pot calling the kettle black; according to St. Paul we are all sinners.

His music is being restricted by dioceses in large part because they don’t want to be perceived as insensitive to the victims. Given that the Church is having a huge sex abuse scandal involving minors for years now, and that several priests and bishops are implicated in the Haas report/ investigation as either having helped cover up Haas’ abuse or sexually abusing minors themselves at his music workshop events, I can see why the Church doesn’t want to be seen as supporting him.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

Haas has committed the Unforgivable Sin Against Women.

Many of these “women” were minors when he was allegedly abusing them.

 

[OddBird]

composers can become celebrities

Here in my Francophone sphere, there are a few “big name” composers, mostly going out of fashion, I think, as I hear their hymns less and less. These are very “seventies-ish”, and although my parish does not shy from piano/drums Masses on less formal occasions than the Sunday sung Mass, its priests do have a problem with their lyrics’ theology. (If you were to sing Frappe à ma porte, toi qui viens me déranger – “Knock at my door, you who come to bother me” – the pastor would become apoplectic).

Most of the most recent hymns which get a lot of use actually come from monastic or charismatic communities, like the communauté de l’Emmanuel, the Chemin Neuf, or Taizé. In most cases, we don’t even know who came up with the music. Texts most often are from the Bible or traditional devotional texts.

Father André Gouzes is a bit of an exception, he is a well-loved “big name” but he gets to try out what he composes on the lay community centered on the abbey where he lives (alone) before they make it out in the open.

 

[27lw]

I’ve been known to slam the hymnal shut myself for the Anthem of the Protestant Reformation! And I formerly identified as Lutheran.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

I mostly just smile wryly and think of Mom…and Davey and Goliath.

The version above is the one I remember from my childhood. I had no clue it was Lutheran/ Protestant whatever. Apparently a few years later, they updated it to a truly wacky jazz version…

 

[27lw]

Yes! Fond memories of Davey and Goliath as well.

 

[Phemie]

The ones we use most often are “Send Us Your Spirit”, “I Am the Living Bread”, and “Blest Are They”. Haven’t heard anything about this controversy in my little outpost in Canada.

Even if it becomes known in Canada I suspect we’ll be told to stop using his hymns the day after they tell us rip the title page of the CBW III to get rid of the foreword by defrocked, convicted child porn aficionado Raymond Lahey and to stop using its “God Created Earth and Heaven” and “Hail Queen of Heaven the Ocean Star” as part of the lyrics were penned by him – IOW, never.

 

[pnewton]

The thread is not about you personally boycotting.

I know, but I was under the impression people could still post their own opinions. I am do not give this particular issue any thought. I choose titles, not composers.

The issue of sexual abuse is one that always has two sides though. One of which is innocent until proven guilty. While it might be two long since this happened to prosecute or even sue, the reason we have these time limits is exactly why I take decades old accusations with a grain of salt. Time makes gathering of everything but testimony impossible. The human mind is notoriously unreliable over time.

I understand sexual predators need to be stopped, but they only be stopped by timely reporting.

 

[pnewton]

Given that the Church is having a huge sex abuse scandal involving minors for years now, and that several priests and bishops are implicated in the Haas report/ investigation as either having helped cover up Haas’ abuse or sexually abusing minors themselves at his music workshop events, I can see why the Church doesn’t want to be seen as supporting him.

Yes, I understand the position of GIA on this. It is best that people like this, even if it is only probable, not continue in current positions. Workshops and continued employment are a separate issue than discontinuing current songs. There is no other precedent from choosing songs only from people free of this sin, or that sin, but they sins against others mean that some jobs should not be held. A womanizer and abuser should not be holding workshops; an embezzler and thief should not be the bookkeeper; etc.