Canonisations, Orthodox Saints in the future

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With Eastern Catholics, do their saints need to be proclaimed by the Pope, or can their own Patriarchs do it? How about in cases of Eastern Major Archbishops and Metropolitans?

When we do get re-united with the Orthodox, will the Latin Church be obliged to accept Orthodox saints into the Canon? Likewise, would the Orthodox Churches be obliged to accept Latin saints into their Canons as well? Or would they just need their cultus confirmed or something else?

Can anyone suggest any uniate saints who would have been in the same sort of situation?
 
I think you’ve hit on one of the key barriers to unification. Moving forward together into the future is easy. Acknowledging the past is what’s difficult.

Both the Catholic and Orthodox Churches cannot acknowledge that their churches were in a state of material heresy without invalidating their theology and ecclesiology.

If the Pope canonizes a saint, that is an infallible declaration, and if the Pope promulgates a dogma ex cathedra, that is also an infallible declaration, true for all time, past as well as present. Thus the Pope cannot promulgate a dogma which would lead to the conclusion that a large group of saints in the Church’s history had taught material heresy and died in a state of mortal sin. That would be a contradiction.

As I understand it, for the Orthodox, it’s not quite so black and white, but it’s similar.

Where there’s a difficulty, it’s with acknowledging that both Catholics and Orthodox have canonized saints for nothing other than their work towards converting, and in some cases persecuting, Christians from the other communion. Saying that two people are blessed by God for arguing with eachother is difficult without advancing a disordered view of conscience as the final arbiter of sanctity, which would lead to the canonization of Luther, the gnostics, Mohammed, Lenin, and anybody else who acted in the belief that they were ‘doing the right thing’.
 
I think you’ve hit on one of the key barriers to unification. Moving forward together into the future is easy. Acknowledging the past is what’s difficult.

Both the Catholic and Orthodox Churches cannot acknowledge that their churches were in a state of material heresy without invalidating their theology and ecclesiology.

If the Pope canonizes a saint, that is an infallible declaration, and if the Pope promulgates a dogma ex cathedra, that is also an infallible declaration, true for all time, past as well as present. Thus the Pope cannot promulgate a dogma which would lead to the conclusion that a large group of saints in the Church’s history had taught material heresy and died in a state of mortal sin. That would be a contradiction.

As I understand it, for the Orthodox, it’s not quite so black and white, but it’s similar.

Where there’s a difficulty, it’s with acknowledging that both Catholics and Orthodox have canonized saints for nothing other than their work towards converting, and in some cases persecuting, Christians from the other communion. Saying that two people are blessed by God for arguing with eachother is difficult without advancing a disordered view of conscience as the final arbiter of sanctity, which would lead to the canonization of Luther, the gnostics, Mohammed, Lenin, and anybody else who acted in the belief that they were ‘doing the right thing’.
Sorry I need to ask a basic question like this, but, what’s material heresy?
 
Sorry I need to ask a basic question like this, but, what’s material heresy?
I think it just means heresy that is a mortal sin, or at least, that was how I intended it to be used.

For heresy to be mortal sin, it would have to be grave matter, which means it would have to be heresy about something significant, such as the nature of God and His salvific plan for humanity, and it would have to be taught, not just held in your own head.

It would also have to be done wilfully, not just through involuntary doubt or ignorance, and in full awareness that it was against the teaching of the Church. That’s where it becomes difficult, if you’re Catholic, the teaching of the Church means the teaching of Rome, but if you’re Orthodox, the teaching of the Church means the teaching of the Ecumenical Patriarchs. If you don’t know which Church is the Church, but you do know that Rome or Constantinople regards your teaching as heresy, are you in full awareness?
 
I think it just means heresy that is a mortal sin, or at least, that was how I intended it to be used.

For heresy to be mortal sin, it would have to be grave matter, which means it would have to be heresy about something significant, such as the nature of God and His salvific plan for humanity, and it would have to be taught, not just held in your own head.

It would also have to be done wilfully, not just through involuntary doubt or ignorance, and in full awareness that it was against the teaching of the Church. That’s where it becomes difficult, if you’re Catholic, the teaching of the Church means the teaching of Rome, but if you’re Orthodox, the teaching of the Church means the teaching of the Ecumenical Patriarchs. If you don’t know which Church is the Church, but you do know that Rome or Constantinople regards your teaching as heresy, are you in full awareness?
Has there ever been a case of disagreement with the two Communions that were that big though? Like, we mutually believe practically all of the major things. There are some nuts and bolts where we differ, but those seem like very small issues that lack essence.

On the issue of Papal Primacy, from what I understand, the Ecumenical Patriarchate already has acknowledged that the Pope has Primacy at least in terms of honour, but not yet in jurisdiction. This appears to be the only area where there’s a difference.

On the issue of salvation, the Catholic Church never actually taught that salvation was limited to Catholics only; though individuals claimed this, it was never an official teaching, and in fact Popes have taught the opposite. So, though I’d see why a lot of people would think this is a problem, in reality, it is not.

I know we differ on the issue of the Immaculate Conception, but as the Easterners love Mary as much as we do, I’d imagine that this wouldn’t be a stumbling block.

Now, on the issue of saints, a Byzantine Saint disputing a Latin Saint doesn’t seem to be such a big issue. With the Avignon schism, different saints chose different sides. There was also a case of a nun who was relatively recently-beatified who had disputes with her bishop, who himself was beatified too.

If an Orthodox Saint were against, say, the Immaculate Conception, perhaps this too might not be a problem. Even Thomas Aquinas didn’t believe in the Immaculate Conception. This of course isn’t to say that the Immaculate Conception is in any way wrong – it’s completely right – but it just wasn’t a required component of faith for Saint Thomas in his time just as it wouldn’t have been a necessary component for the Orthodox Saint in his or her time either. If a saint in his own time believed in things that would be heresy in a later time, the saint would not necessarily be at fault.
 
I think it just means heresy that is a mortal sin, or at least, that was how I intended it to be used.

For heresy to be mortal sin, it would have to be grave matter, which means it would have to be heresy about something significant, such as the nature of God and His salvific plan for humanity, and it would have to be taught, not just held in your own head.

It would also have to be done wilfully, not just through involuntary doubt or ignorance, and in full awareness that it was against the teaching of the Church. That’s where it becomes difficult, if you’re Catholic, the teaching of the Church means the teaching of Rome, but if you’re Orthodox, the teaching of the Church means the teaching of the Ecumenical Patriarchs. If you don’t know which Church is the Church, but you do know that Rome or Constantinople regards your teaching as heresy, are you in full awareness?
“Material Heresy is is a matter of error that is not culpably held: it is to hold to an error without knowing better, or without realizing that it is an error.”

Formal Heresy is a matter of error when that is culpably held: is to hold to an error when one should know better or when realizing that it is an error.

the-supplement.blogspot.com/2007/10/formal-vs-material-heresy.html

newadvent.org/cathen/07256b.htm#REF_III
 

Well all salvationed people are Saints. For start the official veneration a person must be honored and venerated by believers. Any deceased EO Christian can be venerated by believers in their privete homes. If the veneration is widely spread Holy Synod of the local Church does a formal canonisation (including writing special prayers dedicated to the Saint, painting an icon, writing an official biography and setting the date for the commemoration). Holy Synod also sends the act of canonisation to the Holy Synods of the rest of the autocephalous Churhes which can also put the Saint in their lists.​

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