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edwest211
Guest
Thank you.
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Imdaman
Guest
The document “Humane Vitae” is not infallible. Its main Idea is! here is the thought of Cardinal Mueller on the main teaching of the document.
"The Archbishop of Krakow sharply distinguishes two things: he distinguishes a dogmatic definition ex cathedra which is not given in Humanae vitae, and the presence of a teaching that is affirmed in Humanae vitae with the authority of the ordinary universal magisterium.
And since the Archbishop of Krakow thinks, on the basis of what Humanae vitae itself states, that the moral teaching of the Church is not an arbitrary decision, that the Magisterium is not an exercise of power but is a service to the truth, the Archbishop of Krakow is convinced that the teaching of Humanae vitae expresses a truth about the good, which the Church does not have the right, does not have the presumption to define or to change, but of which she is simply the depository and witness.
In this sense, the letter of 1969 simply invites Pope Paul VI to reconfirm what the encyclical Humanae vitae says, that is, that the teaching belongs to the universal ordinary magisterium, which according to the teaching of the Second Vatican Council in Lumen Gentium, 25, is infallible. Therefore, not the definition ex cathedra of a new dogmatic truth according to the teaching of Vatican I, but rather the acknowledgment of the truth as ordinary universal magisterium of what is written in Humane vitae itself."
"The Archbishop of Krakow sharply distinguishes two things: he distinguishes a dogmatic definition ex cathedra which is not given in Humanae vitae, and the presence of a teaching that is affirmed in Humanae vitae with the authority of the ordinary universal magisterium.
And since the Archbishop of Krakow thinks, on the basis of what Humanae vitae itself states, that the moral teaching of the Church is not an arbitrary decision, that the Magisterium is not an exercise of power but is a service to the truth, the Archbishop of Krakow is convinced that the teaching of Humanae vitae expresses a truth about the good, which the Church does not have the right, does not have the presumption to define or to change, but of which she is simply the depository and witness.
In this sense, the letter of 1969 simply invites Pope Paul VI to reconfirm what the encyclical Humanae vitae says, that is, that the teaching belongs to the universal ordinary magisterium, which according to the teaching of the Second Vatican Council in Lumen Gentium, 25, is infallible. Therefore, not the definition ex cathedra of a new dogmatic truth according to the teaching of Vatican I, but rather the acknowledgment of the truth as ordinary universal magisterium of what is written in Humane vitae itself."
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Imdaman
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Is AL infallible? how about it’s main teachings? Considering some of it is written to make a “Paradigm change” challenges the very fact that it can be considered a regular teaching of the church.
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Imdaman
Guest
Why would you want to change the subject…!
Unless of course you don’t want to answer the questions? The questions go to what is the idea Cardinal Mueller is putting forward. Only teachings on morals and faith can be infallible not books. Even the Catechism is not fallible.
Unless of course you don’t want to answer the questions? The questions go to what is the idea Cardinal Mueller is putting forward. Only teachings on morals and faith can be infallible not books. Even the Catechism is not fallible.
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Imdaman
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No we are talking about infallibility, please try to keep up!Imdaman:
I’m not changing the subject to AL, you were.
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Entwhistler
Guest
From what I understand.
Ordinary Magisterium of the Church: One must follow it unless it leads one to sin (Humanae Vitae does not lead one to sin).
Ordinary Magisterium of the Church: one must give obedient consent to it unless you do tons of research on it compared to what an expert in theology would do.
Ordinary Magisterium of the Church: One must follow it unless it leads one to sin (Humanae Vitae does not lead one to sin).
Ordinary Magisterium of the Church: one must give obedient consent to it unless you do tons of research on it compared to what an expert in theology would do.
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Imdaman
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OK you don’t understand what I was getting at with AL… we can leave it at that. Now to the main post I made about infallibility. This was a response to your remark about HV being infallible. Try to stay focused on the thread.Imdaman:
You brought up AL. That was a change in topic. If you can’t acknowledge that you changed the topic, then we are going to have a problem having a discussion.
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Imdaman
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Perhaps, but I notice you are still deflecting.
Have a nice day!
Have a nice day!
Mark121359
Well-known member
Humanae Vitae simply reaffirmed what the Church has always taught…all the way back to the early Church! (Read below)
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Genesis315
Guest
I think Humanae Vitae has a definitive (and therefore infallible) judgment on a moral doctrine in paragraph 14. That was a primary point of the document–Vatican II had explicitly left it to the Pope to pass the definitive judgment after the commission did its study.
Casti Connubii also does in paragraph 56. Is there any doubt that this was not intended to be irreformable? That was the point of passing the judgment then (an other ecclesial community had just reformed their teaching on the subject).
It has also been the uninterrupted teaching of the Church and a point of morality among the people of God all the way back to the early Fathers and even prior to the Incarnation. In fact, it wasn’t even debated by Protestants until the 20th century…
Casti Connubii also does in paragraph 56. Is there any doubt that this was not intended to be irreformable? That was the point of passing the judgment then (an other ecclesial community had just reformed their teaching on the subject).
It has also been the uninterrupted teaching of the Church and a point of morality among the people of God all the way back to the early Fathers and even prior to the Incarnation. In fact, it wasn’t even debated by Protestants until the 20th century…
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