Cardinal Mahony: "There is no liturgical abuses in L.A"

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Dr. Bombay said:
**As a more contemplative-minded person, I much prefer the silent Canon since it allows me to more easily raise my heart and mind to God. **However, I appreciate the opinion of people who have a need to hear every word the priest speaks. I’m blessed that in my diocese, I’ve discovered several different Masses, both new and old, that are all said with reverence and dignity.

I think it’s wonderful that our Church allows us the opportunity to experience both the ancient and modern. :clapping:

Well, I think I’m fairly contemplative (I was rec. into the Church by Carmelites, at their hermitage, big huge chunks of silence, I’d recommend it to anyone). We’ve discussed this in another thread. I’ve been Catholic for 17 years. If I suddenly weren’t allowed to hear those amazing words “This is My Body,” “This is My Blood,” I’d be heartbroken.
 
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JKirkLVNV:
Well, I think I’m fairly contemplative (I was rec. into the Church by Carmelites, at their hermitage, big huge chunks of silence, I’d recommend it to anyone). We’ve discussed this in another thread. I’ve been Catholic for 17 years. If I suddenly weren’t allowed to hear those amazing words “This is My Body,” “This is My Blood,” I’d be heartbroken.
Ahhhh…the Carmelites… 🙂 As for me, I’ll be attending a retreat before the end of the year at a Benedictine Monastery. I can’t wait. Sometimes I wonder if it’s wrong to get excited about big chunks of silence??? 😉
 
Dr. Bombay:
Ahhhh…the Carmelites… 🙂 As for me, I’ll be attending a retreat before the end of the year at a Benedictine Monastery. I can’t wait. Sometimes I wonder if it’s wrong to get excited about big chunks of silence??? 😉
No, I miss the hermitage chapel. It’s odd, my ears rang in the silence, they were so accustomed to noise.
 
What goes on in those pics, is “normal” for parishes in LA
Really. Interesting. I live in LA and have attended Mass at seven different parishes within the diocese (St. Basil’s on Wilshire, St. Victor’s in West Hollywood, La Placita at Olvera Street, Mission San Buenaventura in Ventura, Mission San Fernando in San Fernando, St. John of God in Norwalk and the Cathedral). I’ve not seen a single liturgical dancers at any of the Masses I’ve attended. In fact, I’ll give a little review of the Masses I’ve been to.

Mission San Fernando was a TLM and it was beautifully done. No complaints whatsoever.

Mission San Buenaventura was a TLM by a priest who didn’t know what he was doing, so it took almost two hours to celebrate low mass. It got VERY tedious. Before the TLM, I attended the Pauline Mass and had found no liturgical abuses whatsoever…the only complaint was that the cantor sounded like a dying cow.

St. Victor, where I usually go, has the Pauline Mass celebrated with Gregorian Chant for the Kyrie, Gloira, Sanctus, Pater Noster and Agnus Dei. This is the Mass, IMO, celebrated the way it SHOULD be. It almost has the feel of the EWTN Mass. People even kneel after the Agnus Dei and there is an altar rail that is actually USED as an option for the reception of Communion. Only ONE EMHC is used and Communion is usually under one kind (I’ve not seen the chalice offered to the faithful).

La Placita is like a country Mexican church. Very devout people. Most of the Masses are in Spanish (there’s one English Mass on Sundays, the rest are Spanish) and the music in the Spanish Masses is usually Mexican in flavor. Aside from the flagon issue, no real abuses to speak of there.

St. Basil’s has a the army of EMHC’s that is just distracting. Also, the priest sits down while communion is still being distributed by EMHC’s and the chalice is offered to the faithful at EVERY SINGLE MASS, even weekday morning masses. This parish has the flagon issue as well.

St. John of God was celebrated mostly well except for the omission of the Gloria during a Saturday Vigil Mass. I don’t recall if I saw flagons at this mass but I believe they were present.

The Cathedral. Well, it’s the Cathedral. They have these incense bowls that they use during the offertory and it looks almost pagan the way the smoke billows up and over the crucifix (yes, they actually have one) from these bowls sitting on stands. The priest that usually celebrates is a total showman who walks around during the homily, makes grand, sweeping gestures during the liturgy and makes a show of the Words of Institution. Yes, flagons are there, too.

Five out of the seven parishes in LA that I’ve attended all celebrate Masses in accordance with the GIRM based on my observation with the exception of the consecrating the Precious Blood in flagons…which will be corrected once Mahony’s appeal is ultimately denied.
 
LCMS_No_More said:
Really. Interesting. I live in LA and have attended Mass at seven different parishes within the diocese (St. Basil’s on Wilshire, St. Victor’s in West Hollywood, La Placita at Olvera Street, Mission San Buenaventura in Ventura, Mission San Fernando in San Fernando, St. John of God in Norwalk and the Cathedral). I’ve not seen a single liturgical dancers at any of the Masses I’ve attended. In fact, I’ll give a little review of the Masses I’ve been to.

Mission San Fernando was a TLM and it was beautifully done. No complaints whatsoever.

Mission San Buenaventura was a TLM by a priest who didn’t know what he was doing, so it took almost two hours to celebrate low mass. It got VERY tedious. Before the TLM, I attended the Pauline Mass and had found no liturgical abuses whatsoever…the only complaint was that the cantor sounded like a dying cow.

St. Victor, where I usually go, has the Pauline Mass celebrated with Gregorian Chant for the Kyrie, Gloira, Sanctus, Pater Noster and Agnus Dei. This is the Mass, IMO, celebrated the way it SHOULD be. It almost has the feel of the EWTN Mass. People even kneel after the Agnus Dei and there is an altar rail that is actually USED as an option for the reception of Communion. Only ONE EMHC is used and Communion is usually under one kind (I’ve not seen the chalice offered to the faithful).

La Placita is like a country Mexican church. Very devout people. Most of the Masses are in Spanish (there’s one English Mass on Sundays, the rest are Spanish) and the music in the Spanish Masses is usually Mexican in flavor. Aside from the flagon issue, no real abuses to speak of there.

St. Basil’s has a the army of EMHC’s that is just distracting. Also, the priest sits down while communion is still being distributed by EMHC’s and the chalice is offered to the faithful at EVERY SINGLE MASS, even weekday morning masses. This parish has the flagon issue as well.

St. John of God was celebrated mostly well except for the omission of the Gloria during a Saturday Vigil Mass. I don’t recall if I saw flagons at this mass but I believe they were present.

The Cathedral. Well, it’s the Cathedral. They have these incense bowls that they use during the offertory and it looks almost pagan the way the smoke billows up and over the crucifix (yes, they actually have one) from these bowls sitting on stands. The priest that usually celebrates is a total showman who walks around during the homily, makes grand, sweeping gestures during the liturgy and makes a show of the Words of Institution. Yes, flagons are there, too.

Five out of the seven parishes in LA that I’ve attended all celebrate Masses in accordance with the GIRM based on my observation with the exception of the consecrating the Precious Blood in flagons…which will be corrected once Mahony’s appeal is ultimately denied.

Thank you for this information. It’s nice to know that the Archdiocese is not the “Paganville” we’ve been lead to believe. I suspected it was mostly exageration. ***Some ***people who want to roll back the clock to before Vatican II (what it called for and what it didn’t being beside the point) will use fantastic exageration about the Mass of Paul VI or an incident here or there to cast aspersions and divide the faithful. They also make citations from “rad trad” websites that are outright untruths. If we’re wise, we’ll worry as much about these people (not the loyal and obedient Catholics who manifest a devotion to the TLM and attend the Indult) as we do about the liberals they are constantly pointing at and screaming over.
 
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JKirkLVNV:
I used to worship in the Episcopal Church, where the “mass” was celebrated by the “priest” ad orientum. It isn’t the most earthshaking change to have it done ad populum. AND I truly don’t think in the grand scheme of things that it matters that much.
I’m going to have to respectfully disagree, here. Ad populum makes some priests into actors and the Sanctuary is their stage. It opens the door for a plethora of abuses.
 
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Strider:
I’m going to have to respectfully disagree, here. Ad populum makes some priests into actors and the Sanctuary is their stage. It opens the door for a plethora of abuses.
And I’m going to respectfully disagree as well. A showman with an ego is a showman with an ego, whether he’s got his back to the congregation or his front to them. It “opens the door” is an argument that doesn’t fly, IMHO. Priest who are capable of sticking to the rubrics are capable of sticking to the rubrics, regardless of where they are facing. I don’t oppose ad orientum, I just don’t think anyone is saved by it and I think we waste a great deal of precious energy and further division in the Church by spinning our wheels on it. I also very much doubt that Our Lord celebrated the first Mass that way and I doubt that the Apostles or the Fathers did, either.
 
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