Caring for Premature Babies: Cruel?

[karea]

This whole story is shocking to me, and is making me really examine the issue (especially how it ties in with the issues of abortion, there are quite a few layers to this story). I’d really like to hear some Christian perspectives on this.

Here’s two different sides of the story. They’re both good to read. Reading the nurse’s side, about some of the things very pre-mature babies go through broke my heart.

However, I have to disagree with the nurse…as my cousins (triplets, 2 girls and a boy aw!) were born pre-mature, weighing only a pound each. They’re now 12 years old and not suffering from any health issues or having an difficulties in school. In fact, one of them, the boy, actually ended up skipping a grade in school! It makes me ill that they may not have been here today if it was only up to doctors… I’m glad we fought for them.

The main story:

parentdish.com/2009/09/15/british-doctors-leave-preemie-to-die/

The other point of view:

realityrounds.com/2009/09/15/is-letting-a-21-week-premature-baby-die-considered-health-care-rationing/

What do you guys think? Is trying to treat very pre-mature infants extremely cruel? Should it be up to the parents? The doctors? I know this happened in Britain, but I think it’s important to look at (it probably has happened here as well, I just don’t know about it).

 

[larsenl1]

This story breaks my heart.

Normal gestation for human babies is 40 weeks. 21 or 22 weeks is just over 5 months pregnant and I don’t think that the baby’s lungs and other organs are ready to sustain life. I think that there is a difference in premature and unable to sustain life.

I have a daughter who was born 2 months premature and she is a healthy 18 year old. I don’t know what the magestarium says about this and I don’t have my catechism with me. However I do find some truth in the argument that sometimes the effort to save the live of the neonatal infant is more for the mother/father than actually for the baby. I just hope that the baby in this story was baptised and that people are praying for his immortal soul.

 

[Whitacre_Girl]

I think that to deny care to any living human being that has the possibility to be saved is itself very cruel.

Some medical treatments are awful (chemotherapy, interferon treatments, etc…) but if it means saving the life of an ill patient, why not? Morality aside, how could parents let a child slip away without knowing that htey did all they could to save its life? Could anyone live with themselves after that?

 

[Calliso]

I think it could be considered cruel to try and care for babies that are extremely premature like the article talks about. I didn;t even know some of the things that can happen until I read that article…and wow…horrifying. I think in most cases like this it is probably best to let them die. Rather then subject them to possiblely more agony just for a 10% chance at living at best…then possibly condemn them to a short life filled with suffering.

I should make a note though that I am not saying that all premature babies should be denied care. I am talking specifically about the really premature ones.

 

[Mrs_Sally]

I think that to deny care to any living human being that has the possibility to be saved is itself very cruel.
Some medical treatments are awful (chemotherapy, interferon treatments, etc…) but if it means saving the life of an ill patient, why not? Morality aside, how could parents let a child slip away without knowing that htey did all they could to save its life? Could anyone live with themselves after that?

The issue is wheather a baby at this stage (about 4 months pregnant) can be saved. There are women who may not even realize that they are pregnant at the point that she delivered. I went to the website she set up and the pictures of her child do not show a baby who just needs a bit of oxygen and time to mature!

Sometimes our heroics in medicine and the ‘tear-jerker’ stories the media presents gives us a very skewed picture of what is possible. For whatever reason, that child was not ready to live outside his mother’s womb.

Lord, please watch over that tiny baby and may he rest in peace.

 

[dixieagle]

I think that to deny care to any living human being that has the possibility to be saved is itself very cruel.

Some medical treatments are awful (chemotherapy, interferon treatments, etc…) but if it means saving the life of an ill patient, why not? Morality aside, how could parents let a child slip away without knowing that htey did all they could to save its life? Could anyone live with themselves after that?

The situation being discussed here is an extreme one. Preemies of 21-22 weeks gestational age have between 0-10% chance of survival; most of those who survive at 22 weeks do so with profound disabilities (read the link to the nurse’s account in the OP.)

While I think that any preemie born alive, no matter how early, should receive warmth, fluids, and perhaps a nasal cannula or CPAP for oxygen, I have serious reservations about employing “extraordinary means” that can inflict injury and discomfort, due to the extreme fragility of the skin and organ systems of “micro-preemies.” (Actually, at that stage the skin is so fragile that even an IV can cause damage.)

To what extremes - invariably costly, invasive, and almost always futile - should we go with extremely tiny, early preemies? There are times when the truly moral thing to do is to love the little one, keep him/her comfortable, and entrust him to God’s care.

 

[Ceil-1]

Perhaps we should ask the opinions of some people who were once babies who were preemies and survived and see what they think about the whole business.

I have a feeling they will tell you they don’t remember a thing. And if they do, I am willing to bet they are glad they went through it.

It is all a ploy. Playing on peoples’ fears of pain and suffering to, as Scrooge said, “decrease the surplus population”.

I am scared for the future.

 

[Calliso]

Perhaps we should ask the opinions of some people who were once babies who were preemies and survived and see what they think about the whole business.

I have a feeling they will tell you they don’t remember a thing. And if they do, I am willing to bet they are glad they went through it.

It is all a ploy. Playing on peoples’ fears of pain and suffering to, as Scrooge said, “decrease the surplus population”.

I am scared for the future.

And I am willing to bet that most of them were not extreme premies like the ones being talked about in the article. It;s one thing to be born at 7-8 monthes…it;s another to try and save a 5 month just born baby.

 

[dixieagle]

Perhaps we should ask the opinions of some people who were once babies who were preemies and survived and see what they think about the whole business.

I have a feeling they will tell you they don’t remember a thing. And if they do, I am willing to bet they are glad they went through it.

It is all a ploy. Playing on peoples’ fears of pain and suffering to, as Scrooge said, “decrease the surplus population”.

I am scared for the future.

Of the minuscule number of 22 week babies who survive, there are few who would be able to tell you “they’re glad they went through it”, as they are so often profoundly disabled.

We’re not talking about preemies who were born just a few weeks early, but those at the extreme edges of viability. This is an issue that requires serious thought, in light of Catholic teachings on the value of each human life, the difference between ordinary and extraordinary means, and our belief in eternal life.

 

[AskSeekKnock]

I was born at 30 weeks long enough ago that at that time, my parents were told I simply could not possibly survive. When, months later, I was discharged from the hospital, they were told I would be severely retarded and it was recommended I be institutionalized.

There will always be a “current” stage considered “too premature to survive” and we must recognize this is a temporary distinction - the threshold will inevitably continue to change.

 

[dixieagle]

I was born at 30 weeks long enough ago that at that time, my parents were told I simply could not possibly survive. When, months later, I was discharged from the hospital, they were told I would be severely retarded and it was recommended I be institutionalized.

There will always be a “current” stage considered “too premature to survive” and we must recognize this is a temporary distinction - the threshold will inevitably continue to change.

Is there not some threshold beneath which survival is simply impossible, due to underdeveloped organ systems?

I wonder if there will be ever be some technology developed which would allow extreme micro-preemies to develop in a womb-like atmosphere? I suppose stranger things will happen.

At any rate, we must deal with these sad situations in light of our present capabilities.

 

[leonie]

I was born at 30 weeks long enough ago that at that time, my parents were told I simply could not possibly survive. When, months later, I was discharged from the hospital, they were told I would be severely retarded and it was recommended I be institutionalized.

There will always be a “current” stage considered “too premature to survive” and we must recognize this is a temporary distinction - the threshold will inevitably continue to change.

I remember my mom talking about how they (the medical staff) convinced one of their moms to let her 25 week old baby die rather than subject her baby to painful and futile medical treatments. That was in the mid-80s when my mom was a labor and delivery nurse.

Now, 25 week old babies have very good chances of survival. It’s incredible what medical care can do. My daughter’s softball coach told us that his very healthy and intelligent daughter was born at 24 weeks. She’s 8 years old. I was amazed.

 

[centurionguard]

I don’t want to sound callous in all this without having great sympathy and compassionate
concerns for premature babies who have to endure great suffering in extreme medical procedures for survival. Every single human soul is born into suffering in this world as part of their spiritual evolution and most importantly sharing something in common with Christ’s sufferings. I think its rewarding that medical professionals go to great lengths to sustain human life at all stages from birth to death. Who here can argue that perhaps God ordained it that some premature babies would have to endure such sufferings even if their lives were very short. Its not human suffering that God primarily looks at but, rather the human soul is what is Gods major concern. In our own human weakness we sometimes attach an excessive amount of time to human suffering. I say this without trying to sound callous as I stated before. We are after all human.

 

[Ceil-1]

Oh, I see. So, those older babies don’t remember the pain, but the younger ones do. Nice sarcastic response.

If the physicians who worked like mad on the preemies of the past had not “pushed the envelope”, we would not have the know-how and technology of today that allows us to save 25 weeks and up.

It sounds to me as if some of you are looking for an excuse not to spend the time, effort and expense on children who “probably won’t make it anyway”. I don’t believe it’s about compassion at all. I think it’s about inconvenience and money.

 "Let them die then!  And decrease the surplus population."
                                                               
                                                                             --Scrooge

 

[Calliso]

Oh, I see. So, those older babies don’t remember the pain, but the younger ones do. Nice sarcastic response.

If the physicians who worked like mad on the preemies of the past had not “pushed the envelope”, we would not have the know-how and technology of today that allows us to save 25 weeks and up.

It sounds to me as if some of you are looking for an excuse not to spend the time, effort and expense on children who “probably won’t make it anyway”. I don’t believe it’s about compassion at all. I think it’s about inconvenience and money.

 "Let them die then!  And decrease the surplus population."
                                                               
                                                                             --Scrooge

Ummm no I think we are just trying to point out that the vast majority of premies alive today probably aren;t the extreme 21-23 week cases.

However about the inconvience and money thing…I do personally think that the time and money could be better spent on people that actually have a decent chance of survival. We have to remember that yes time money and medical resources are limited. So it;s not just a matter of a little inconvience to care for these extreme premies. It could also mean that less time money and medical resources are going to those that actually have a good chance at survival. So for me it is a matter of compassion as well as time and money and resources. Which I will point out once again are limited.

 

[centurionguard]

Maybe I’m missing something here. Why should money and resources have anything to do with saving a human life ? Typical world where the greed of money is everything even to hospitals and medical professionals.

 

[JMJ_coder]

Low chance of survival (well, no one is going to leave this world alive)
Painful treatments
Possibly disabled afterwards

With those criteria, we should stop treating cancer patients. And we should also just let the AIDS patients die as well as those with spinal cord injuries, organ transplants – the list could go on for quite some time.

 

[Mrs_Sally]

Is there not some threshold beneath which survival is simply impossible, due to underdeveloped organ systems?

I wonder if there will be ever be some technology developed which would allow extreme micro-preemies to develop in a womb-like atmosphere? I suppose stranger things will happen.

At any rate, we must deal with these sad situations in light of our present capabilities.

I am still concerned about our society’s sense that all heroic measures should be taken so preserve life and that a doctor that doesn’t do so is somehow negligent. Technology that could fully replicate a mother’s womb is not something I dream about happening. Imagine where we would be with IVF and then artificial wombs! And yet still, people as a whole would be demanding the ‘right’ to abortion just as they demanded the ‘right’ to the perfect baby born without any inconvenience to themselves. Shiver!

It just becomes one more step on the march to saying the life we do want needs to be perfect and the lives that aren’t can be snuffed out through abortion or euthanasia.

 

[Mrs_Sally]

Maybe I’m missing something here. Why should money and resources have anything to do with saving a human life ? Typical world where the greed of money is everything even to hospitals and medical professionals.

It’s not necessarily greed. It is mostly simply a matter of physical limitations on a hospital. If there are only 20 isolettes in the NICU, the hospital can only help 20 babies. You can’t leave a premie out in a cot on the hall like you might be able to do with an adult in the ER. So the Drs and nurses have the very unenviable task of having to say, we can help this baby, but not this. The term “triage” came from battlefield hospitals that truly did have limited resources and could only give pallative care and the services of the chaplain to the dying. NICUs are very similar to the battle fields of old.

I highly recommend the book Baby ER : the heoric doctors and nurses who perform medicine’s tiniest miracles by Edward Humes. It will give you a whole new prespective on what can happen in a NICU and what still can’t. And as I said before, I think we should think very carefully and clearly before trying to push the envelope all the way to a completely artificial womb.

 

[centurionguard]

It’s not necessarily greed. It is mostly simply a matter of physical limitations on a hospital. If there are only 20 isolettes in the NICU, the hospital can only help 20 babies. You can’t leave a premie out in a cot on the hall like you might be able to do with an adult in the ER. So the Drs and nurses have the very unenviable task of having to say, we can help this baby, but not this. The term “triage” came from battlefield hospitals that truly did have limited resources and could only give pallative care and the services of the chaplain to the dying. NICUs are very similar to the battle fields of old.

I highly recommend the book Baby ER : the heoric doctors and nurses who perform medicine’s tiniest miracles by Edward Humes. It will give you a whole new prespective on what can happen in a NICU and what still can’t. And as I said before, I think we should think very carefully and clearly before trying to push the envelope all the way to a completely artificial womb.

I can understand what you are saying to a point concerning the triage aspect and the criteria of who gets admitted into a N.I.C.U. or Pediatric Intensive Care Unit.
Doctors continually weigh the odds of which human life has the best odds of surviving and which patient child or elderly gets their life support plugins shut off. Lets just say that I’ve been in and out of hospitals enough as both a patient and as a medical staff worker to know that a legalized form of euthanasia is ordered on patients everyday.
They also tried this on my father who spent 14 months in the N.I.C.U. My family brought him home as an invalid on full life support and he survived another eleven years. The sanctity of human life has no meaning in this world.