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Tomdstone
Guest
They say that you are wrong and you say that they are wrong. How do you know who is right?
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Michael68
Guest
I will go with the Church Jesus Christ started. Not the one a man named Luther started
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Tomdstone
Guest
They say that they are the ones who are with the original Church. And so do the Eastern Orthodox.
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jmcrae
Guest
By which of them is One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church.
**One **with the Church established by Jesus Christ - not something else that was started at a later date.
Holy in that it focuses on the things of God and provides the means for holiness to its members.
Catholic in that it is the same Church no matter where we find it in place or in time.
Apostolic in that it is directly connected to the Apostles through its teachings and authority.
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Michael68
Guest
Thank YouBy which of them is One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church.
**One **with the Church established by Jesus Christ - not something else that was started at a later date.
Holy in that it focuses on the things of God and provides the means for holiness to its members.
Catholic in that it is the same Church no matter where we find it in place or in time.
Apostolic in that it is directly connected to the Apostles through its teachings and authority.
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Tomdstone
Guest
One: Are the Catholic Churches one? It is a question since they have a different creed in the Eastern Catholic Churches. According to the creed in the Eastern Catholic Churches, the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father. I went to a Mass here locally, and the priest said that the Blood was shed for all, but at other Masses the priest says that the Blood was shed for many. At some Masses the eucharistic minister gives the Holy Communion, whereas this is not allowed at other Masses. Some priests are allowed to be married, others not. In some Churches the Bread is leavened, in others it must be unleavened. Some Masses allow only the Gregorian chant, others allow more modern guitar music with singers at the altar. Some Catholics believe in limbo, others do not. Some Catholics believe that Purgatory has a fire similar to the fire of hell, others do not. Some Catholics believe that it is OK for Catholic colleges to host Planned Parenthood, others do not. Some Catholics believe it is OK for Catholic colleges to host off-color plays such as the V-monologus, others do not. Some Catholics believe that capital punishment is allowed, others do not. According to the polls, many Catholics do not accept the teaching on artificial birth control. Some Catholic priests have given Holy Communion to non-Catholics others have not.By which of them is One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church.
**One **with the Church established by Jesus Christ - not something else that was started at a later date.
Holy in that it focuses on the things of God and provides the means for holiness to its members.
Catholic in that it is the same Church no matter where we find it in place or in time.
Apostolic in that it is directly connected to the Apostles through its teachings and authority.
Holy: The non-Catholics point to the fact that the Holy Father Pope Alexander VI was not holy, as he had several mistresses and several children out of wedlock. They also point to the unholy activities of some Catholic priests.
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adf417
Guest
So which one of these Catholics is it that Carm considers heretical? It always seems they are speaking about ONE group.
Peace!!!
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Tomdstone
Guest
Not sure, but I guess they think that many Catholics are heretical. I don;t think that they are speaking about one group, since they say on their site that some
but not all, Catholics can be or will be saved.
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adf417
Guest
Yes but its pretty clear they mean only Catholics that leave the Catholic church. And they have never used the term “the Catholic church” in the plural tense in this context.
Peace!!!
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Peter_J
Guest
Just ask.
(Well, unless you’re shy.)
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jmcrae
Guest
We all look to the same Pope for leadership, and the variations in wording are within tolerable limits. Unity doesn’t (and never has) imply absolute uniformity.
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jmcrae
Guest
There is also this. Clearly, we are a single identifiable group to our enemies.
It puts me in mind of something St. Augustine said once - everyone is “[c]atholic” until someone asks, where is the Catholic Church, and then, without exception, they all point to us - never to themselves.
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CatholicHockey7
Guest
I’ve never been to ChristianChat.com (and probably won’t), but I’m not talking about spending time in the forums. I’m talking about their apologetics pages.
And no, I don’t get enough non-Catholics here. The ones I do see are usually here genuinely seeking the Truth, not making an argument against it. That’s a totally different dynamic.
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SuperLuigi
Guest
These folks should read up on Fatima.
Devotion to Mary and the Saints isn’t idol worship—it’s serious and has great benefits.
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estesbob
Guest
Are the main reasons that groups like this do not consider Catholics Christian because we:
- Reject Sola Scriptura
2.Reject Sola Fidelis
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heart4home
Guest
Not all but many of the people who spend time on the CARM Roman Catholic Forums have left the Catholic Church.
Many of them are seemingly very angry people and I sincerely believe that a lot of it is because deep in their hearts they are nagged by many questions and concerns about their own faith walk.
I would guess that at some point in their life, they were likely hurting or searching for something more (friendship, reassurance of forgiveness for a past sin, whatever) and instead of looking within the Church they bought into the Roman Road to salvation that somebody offered to them either in person, online or on tv.
I think after a while, many start to see holes in sola scripture and so they are really there trying to convince themselves to believe that they haven’t made a mistake.
It truly amazes me the arrogance some of them show in their replies. It’s as if anyone should realize that what ever is spoken by one of them is true. Others give silly answers or love to go in circles, twisting and stretching things until they become something totally different than what was originally said. They certainly don’t exude the Joy of Christ that they claim to possess.
They can never answer questions like why there are so many denominations if each is being lead properly by the same Holy Spirit, they can never answer what early Christians did when the Bible wasn’t canonized or easily available. They call Catholics lazy all the time, since they really believe that most of us have never picked up the Bible or even considered for one minute if what we believe is the truth.
With all that being said, I do pray for them, that the Holy Spirt will open their eyes to the truth and that they will unite with or return to the One Holy Catholic Apostolic Church.
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In_His_Grace
Guest
I posted at CARM for a while, just couldn’t take it anymore so I left. I was very fond of some of the posters there, both C&P, a kind of bonding.
P.S. I believe most Catholics are Christians.
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Tomdstone
Guest
But many Catholics do not agree with the Pope on immigration. And there are pro-choice
Catholic politicians and judges who apparently do not follow the Pope. Some Protestants look to the Catholic Pope for leadership, but don’t agree with everything he says.
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simspt
Guest
the same way i negotiate with my 1 year old, very patiently…knowing in advance not to expect too much…
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zz912
Guest
And? We are free to disagree with a bishop/Pope and their opinion on the best way to handle immigration and country boundaries.
They are in apostasy, and have severed their communion with the Church.
That’s great if they do. But they reject communion with Peter, so they reject communion with Jesus’ Church.
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