Carthusian (nuns)

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Thepeug said:
The Monastery of St. Benedict in Norcia, Italy, is also growing at a rapid pace. The community was founded by a monk from St. Meinrad’s Archabbey in Indiana, and most of the monks are American, with an average age of 25. I spent a month there this past summer and will never forget it.

website: osbnorcia.org
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Always good to hear numbers increasing but, one must not be complacent as the numbers at Parkminster rose exponentially following the ‘Into Great Silence’ movie and the book 'An Infinity of Little Hours by Nancy Kline Maguire. The numbers have dropped off somewhat.
Numbers are not so important. Its those who stay and are not seeking an ideal is what is important.

Peace
 
Interesting to note that a young Irish nun spent many years trying to found an Order based on Carthusian principles on the West Coast of Ireland but was defeated only to find that there were no priests who could celebrate the Latin Mass. There are many Charterhouses who could use her talents.
 
The Carthusians are not dying out by any means. But the vocation has and always will be rare. But so too the Carmelite vocation. I am familiar with both.

The Carthusian nuns do not make solemn vows and until only recently have begun to live the life of the monks. Before that they lived closer to the life of the Carthusian Brothers and in a more cenobial way. One thing the Carthusian nuns do have which the Carmelites do not have is the ceremony of the consecration of Virgins.

Both Orders require a great deal of sacrifice and mortifications. The joy is there but it is a quiet spiritual joy on the whole. Most Carmels do have more recreation except for the eremitical expressions for the nuns as in Chester NJ and in Minnesota where recreation is only once a week. But the true austerity of the life is not in many penances nor in enclosure but in the spiritutal purgations of the eremiticsl life that happen in the hermitage known only to God alone… Too may young vocations look for the corporal penances only to find in time that they are only a means albeit a good one to further deepening of ones spiritual life. Faithful perseverence is the true penance in an enclosed community where day to day sameness wears away at ones own way of looking at things. Living with the quirks of others can be a great penance,

It is a place of solitude where the community you live in will be with you for most of your life. It is the silent purgations of the soul in solitude that purifies the heart and embracing them in love is the key to holiness and true spiritual joy. The joy of being conformed to the image and likeness of the beloved in spousal love.

But this process can happen in any community that one is genuinely called too. So giving all and radicalness of the gospel can be found in any form of religious life faithfully lived. No one order has the corner on the market so to say.

Carmel was a true purification for me in ways i never expected and i suspect the same to be in the Carthusians . One of hardest things i found was to be totally anonymous to the world forgotten by all. But in time it becomes a deep desire to be known only to god alone. Another mortification is complete obedience in love.

Keep on discerning and God will inevitably show you the way. Infused contemplation is a free gift of God. All we can do is remotely prepare ourselves for this gift. Both Carmel and he Carthusian nuns require a soul willing to abandon itself completely to God in totality; and so the need for the attitude of silence, solitude and a prayer which is unceasing.

The Carthusians have their own statutes which you can find on line and are the older of the two orders. The carmelites are originally hermits too but with the exceptions above have a more cenobitical bent in theTteresian reform which has produced many great saints but there is also the ancient observance which tends to be a little more obscure. In any event you wil find that totality you seek.

Both are beautiful orders.

I hope this helps a little.

Blessings in your discernment.

O Adonai
 
O_Adonai said:
The Carthusians are not dying out by any means. But the vocation has and always will be rare. But so too the Carmelite vocation. I am familiar with both.

The Carthusian nuns do not make solemn vows and until only recently have begun to live the life of the monks. Before that they lived closer to the life of the Carthusian Brothers and in a more cenobial way. One thing the Carthusian nuns do have which the Carmelites do not have is the ceremony of the consecration of Virgins.

Both Orders require a great deal of sacrifice and mortifications. The joy is there but it is a quiet spiritual joy on the whole. Most Carmels do have more recreation except for the eremitical expressions for the nuns as in Chester NJ and in Minnesota where recreation is only once a week. But the true austerity of the life is not in many penances nor in enclosure but in the spiritutal purgations of the eremiticsl life that happen in the hermitage known only to God alone… Too may young vocations look for the corporal penances only to find in time that they are only a means albeit a good one to further deepening of ones spiritual life. Faithful perseverence is the true penance in an enclosed community where day to day sameness wears away at ones own way of looking at things. Living with the quirks of others can be a great penance,

It is a place of solitude where the community you live in will be with you for most of your life. It is the silent purgations of the soul in solitude that purifies the heart and embracing them in love is the key to holiness and true spiritual joy. The joy of being conformed to the image and likeness of the beloved in spousal love.

But this process can happen in any community that one is genuinely called too. So giving all and radicalness of the gospel can be found in any form of religious life faithfully lived. No one order has the corner on the market so to say.

Carmel was a true purification for me in ways i never expected and i suspect the same to be in the Carthusians . One of hardest things i found was to be totally anonymous to the world forgotten by all. But in time it becomes a deep desire to be known only to god alone. Another mortification is complete obedience in love.

Keep on discerning and God will inevitably show you the way. Infused contemplation is a free gift of God. All we can do is remotely prepare ourselves for this gift. Both Carmel and he Carthusian nuns require a soul willing to abandon itself completely to God in totality; and so the need for the attitude of silence, solitude and a prayer which is unceasing.

The Carthusians have their own statutes which you can find on line and are the older of the two orders. The carmelites are originally hermits too but with the exceptions above have a more cenobitical bent in theTteresian reform which has produced many great saints but there is also the ancient observance which tends to be a little more obscure. In any event you wil find that totality you seek.

Both are beautiful orders.

I hope this helps a little.

Blessings in your discernment.

O Adonai
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There are certain privaleges extentended to Carthusian Choir Nuns which make them unique in the the church.
I do not think you can seriously compare the rigours of the Carthusians and Carmelites.
 
That is a personal opinion. Have you ever lived in a real 1990 Carmel? Not a piece of cake by any means. The fasting in the 1990’s is stricter than in the carthusians. But is austerity the point or Love? Austerity exists only to increase love and purity of heart.

Yes as I stated the Carthusian nuns have the privilege of consecration of Virgins and act as deaconesses as they may read the Gospel at mass They receive the stole, ring and veil at the consecration and final profession but it is usually worn only three times in a nuns life, on the day of her consecration, on her golden jubilee and at death. Carmelites do not have this privilege.

Only in the 1970’s were the Carthusian nuns allowed to begin to live the father’s lifestyle. Prior to that women were considered too weak to endure such solitude and so lived a much more cenobial life nearer to the Carmelites but with a different rule of course.

On the other hand some Carmelite hermit nun communities have only one hour of recreation a week, all the office is said alone in the hermitage and other than that they come together only for mass. They do not have the 4 hour spatiamentum that the Carthusians do on Sundays. I know because i lived with them.

All in all comparisons like these do no good in the long run. What is important is the vocation one is called too for it is only there one will find true fulfillment and holiness.

O Adonai
 
Cowfold said:
Thanks for enlightening the membership
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I tried to post this yesterday but it was lost on the 'Ask an Apologist forum.

I see no conflict in the use of Yoga and other techniques if it helps. If your faith is stong and the the technique helps , why not. Believe me, you would be surprised at the techniques used in some Monastic orders to help in contemplation
 
Hi Sian Therese

I was wondering if you were interested in O Carm or OCD? There is an OCD Monastery in South Dakota that is very cloistered. Their contact info is Carmelite Monastery P.O. Box 67, Alexandria SD 57311. Just a thought if you wanted to check it out. Also I read the book, An Infinity of Little Hours recently and in reply to 1234’s post. Dom Ignatius who had discovered he had homosexual attractions was not run out of the order. The book states that his confessor Dom Colomba advised him to continue and to make solemn profession but only if he did not have any doubts about whether the life of a Carthusian was for him. The author states that “With that in mind, and still in doubt, Dom Ignatius decided to leave.” Just to clarify. Good luck with your search.
 
billy555 said:
Hi Sian Therese

I was wondering if you were interested in O Carm or OCD? There is an OCD Monastery in South Dakota that is very cloistered. Their contact info is Carmelite Monastery P.O. Box 67, Alexandria SD 57311. Just a thought if you wanted to check it out. Also I read the book, An Infinity of Little Hours recently and in reply to 1234’s post. Dom Ignatius who had discovered he had homosexual attractions was not run out of the order. The book states that his confessor Dom Colomba advised him to continue and to make solemn profession but only if he did not have any doubts about whether the life of a Carthusian was for him. The author states that “With that in mind, and still in doubt, Dom Ignatius decided to leave.” Just to clarify. Good luck with your search.
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Re: Infinity of Little Hours:
Dom Ignatious was certainly not ‘run out of the order’ as this would never happen in any case. The rigorous training of Carthusian novices leaves these 'reasonings ’ up to the individual, In passing Dom Columba (not his real name of course, but nonetheless an Irishman), died last Easter at the age of 93.
As for the book itself there were many inaccuracies, probably derived from nearly 50 years of nostalgia, which did not gain the book much approval from the Order.

From my point of view Vatican II did not change the Order in any substantive way. Parkminster is as unchanged under the present French Prior as it has ever been and true to the orders motto in this respect.
 
i know that this thread hasnt been replied to in a while but still…
I think its really good when cloistered religious orders dont spend lots of time on the internet. The whole point of their life is to leave the world and enter the seclusion of a monastery. i think that posting everything they do on the internet would ruin that to some extent.

i am also considering a vocation to the carthusian nuns, and i have started to learn italian with a view to applying to a charterhouse in Italy.
 
curumba13 said:
i am also considering a vocation to the carthusian nuns, and i have started to learn italian with a view to applying to a charterhouse in Italy.
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God bless you. May Christ hold you close and you find comfort in his arms.
 
I am sorry my English language, becouse I am French, and now in Finnland.
I will be Carthusian nun, I practise liturgy in my home, long, long time, Vespers, Vigilies, Matins…etc… I was in Postulation in France 6 months, and now I weiting for comming to the Carthusian Order. I dont know how posting in this forum pictures, but I posting to facebook, where I am like " Inger de Torquemada". In my facebook I have so many pictures of the Charterhouse in France, and of the Carthusian spirituality.
I have very interes for this Order about 20 years, but now, I will go to Charterhouse.
 
Inge_Torquemada said:
I am sorry my English language, becouse I am French, and now in Finnland.
I will be Carthusian nun, I practise liturgy in my home, long, long time, Vespers, Vigilies, Matins…etc… I was in Postulation in France 6 months, and now I weiting for comming to the Carthusian Order. I dont know how posting in this forum pictures, but I posting to facebook, where I am like " Inger de Torquemada". In my facebook I have so many pictures of the Charterhouse in France, and of the Carthusian spirituality.
I have very interes for this Order about 20 years, but now, I will go to Charterhouse.
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Congratulations!!
 
Inge_Torquemada said:
I am sorry my English language, becouse I am French, and now in Finnland.
I will be Carthusian nun, I practise liturgy in my home, long, long time, Vespers, Vigilies, Matins…etc… I was in Postulation in France 6 months, and now I weiting for comming to the Carthusian Order. I dont know how posting in this forum pictures, but I posting to facebook, where I am like " Inger de Torquemada". In my facebook I have so many pictures of the Charterhouse in France, and of the Carthusian spirituality.
I have very interes for this Order about 20 years, but now, I will go to Charterhouse.
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Congratulations on your upcoming entrance! Which of the French Charterhouses are you joining - Nonenque or Notre Dame in Reillanne?

If you are interested, there is a Yahoo Group to which I belong, IFSB (International Fellowship of St. Bruno), with over 1,000 members who are interested in and follow Carthusian spirituality, with some members former monks of the order. In addition to posted messages, the site also includes interesting files and photos. This is the IFSB’s description:

"International Fellowship of St. Bruno (IFSB)had its beginning as a small, unnamed discussion group in 1999, to share thoughts and published information about the Carthusian Order. After a time it became known as the Carthusian Lay Contemplatives. In discussions with the Superior General of the Order, the organization was named the IFSB, and a new level of participation, the St. Bruno Lay Contemplatives, was formed to serve IFSB members who feel called to follow Christ as St. Bruno and his first companions did, albeit while remaining in the world outside of the Charterhouse.

The IFSB forum is used to introduce the Order to those unfamiliar with the Carthusians and also as a place of fellowship for those that seek to deepen their relationship with God through exposure to Christian contemplative living.This forum has many features such as articles and documents written by and about the Carthusians and other materials pertaining to monastic and lay contemplative life. Our web site, www.Saintbruno.org also has valuable information about the Carthusians and the IFSB.

Though this fellowship is Catholic in nature and scope, we invite people of all faiths to explore the Carthusian Order and join us in fellowship. Please review our guidelines for the forum before applying to participate."

I am not on Facebook, but I believe IFSB has a FB page.

Blessings to you while awaiting your entrance date.

Pax
 
Laudetur Iesus Christus!
Thank You very much, but this site I cannot openning. I have some problem with my computer, and so I will openning this site of St. Bruno, I cannot oppening. Problem in maybe in my computer, I have old notebook.
I give my mail adress. This is: pikkuirwin1@luukku.com
Please, send my mail! I have little bit problems, becouse I am 41 years old, and I have problems with my health.
I practise the Carthusian spirituality over 20 years, I am hermit, now in Finnland, but is problem join to Order, becouse I have “age”,and I have so much problems with health.
I practise Vespers, and night Office, I have life like in Charterhouse, I have all liturgic books in my home…but I am little bit old for the joing to Order.
Have You skype? I am in skype like “Torquemada711”.
Please, contact me. I have many questions. I am alone in Finnland, and this country is for me absoluttely strange.
Thank You very much Dear Friend!
PAX.
Inger
 
I have question. Why this age is so important? I am 42 years old! 42 years is not old women, 42 years is middle, not age for retirement.
Why is this age so important? I am very sad, I am alone in Finnland and I will speaking about this with some people who have same experience.
Catholic priest is not in Kuopio town, and I living in forest 30km from town. Catholics priests in Finland dont understand this my contemplative way, they are all ultraliberals.
Please, contact me…
I also seeking place, where is possible to visite the Holy Mass, in old Carthusian rite for lay people…???
 
Religious orders are scant in Finland. Some American nuns had to found the Carmel of Espoo.

what about diocesan hermit?

blessings,
cloisters
 
Are You from Finnland? The spirituality in Finnland is zero! These people dont understand this. In Finnland are only “carmelites”, but they are ultraliberals, ecumenicals, not real carmelites! This society is “ekumeeniset karmeliitat”, not really carmelites!
Catholic church in Finnland is poor, and traditional Tridentine Mass is possible only in Helsinki, and for me 450km, I make travel 900km for the Holy Mass!
I dont like this country. But why this age is so important? 42 years old, is not to old. Why 42 years old women is old for the Carthusian Order? I am very sad for this…
 
Communities usually like to receive younger vocations so that they have a chance to mature and grow in the spirituality.

contact the TLM people in Helsinki and let them help you.

blessings,
cloisters
 
Which is TLM?
Contemplation is offered to all Catholics…for those of us not actually living in a Charterhouse, we need to personalize our quest for silence and solitude.
But these people in Finnland, priests, and social workers donr uderstand this!
I chose this contemplative way about 23 years a go, and I worked in Funeral Home. But now I have many sicknesess, and not possible work in Funeral home, social workers will “resocialize me”, but I will not serv this Finnish Godless society. I will serv only God in silence and solitude, but these people dont understand this.
 
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