Catholic Anti-Semitism?

[Carlton1993]

romancatholicism.org/accursed-race.htm

Though this site seems to be full of the normal sedevacantist anti-semitic stuff, after reading some of the quotes, and researching them, it seems that many great saints, Ss. Augustine, Padre Pio, Alphonus Liguori, were indeed very anti-semitic…Is it correct to hold these views, and how would you react if your priests were preaching some of these things?

 

[Lev23]

romancatholicism.org/accursed-race.htm

Though this site seems to be full of the normal sedevacantist anti-semitic stuff, after reading some of the quotes, and researching them, it seems that many great saints, Ss. Augustine, Padre Pio, Alphonus Liguori, were indeed very anti-semitic…Is it correct to hold these views, and how would you react if your priests were preaching some of these things?

One has got to wonder how their face to face meeting with the King of the Jews went over.

What is sad is these views are held by some Christians today.

 

[bankerdavid]

romancatholicism.org/accursed-race.htm

Though this site seems to be full of the normal sedevacantist anti-semitic stuff, after reading some of the quotes, and researching them, it seems that many great saints, Ss. Augustine, Padre Pio, Alphonus Liguori, were indeed very anti-semitic…Is it correct to hold these views, and how would you react if your priests were preaching some of these things?

I don’t see how you can say St. Augustine, etc. hold anti-semitic views…
Anti-semitism-used exclusively to refer to hostility towards Jews as a religious, racial, or ethnic group.

The ECFs are saying that the Jews just don’t have the fullness of Truth.

 

[Carlton1993]

How dare Christians have the slightest intercourse with Jews, those most miserable of all men. They are lustful, rapacious, greedy, perfidious bandits – pests of the universe! Indeed, an entire day would not suffice to tell of all their rapine, their avarice, their deception of the poor, their thievery, and their huckstering. Are they not inveterate murderers, destroyers, men possessed by the devil? Jews are impure and impious, and their synagogue is a house of prostitution, a lair of beasts, a place of shame and ridicule, the domicile of the devil, as is also the soul of the Jew. As a matter of fact, Jews worship the devil: their rites are criminal and unchaste; their religion a disease; their synagogue an assembly of crooks, a den of thieves, a cavern of devils, an abyss of perdition! Why are Jews degenerate? Because of their hateful assassination of Christ. This supreme crime lies at the root of their degradation and woes. The rejection and dispersion of the Jews was the work of God, not of emperors. It was done by the wrath of God and because of His absolute abandonment of the Jews. Thus, the Jew will live under the yoke of slavery without end. God hates the Jews, and on Judgment Day He will say to those who sympathize with them., “Depart from Me, for you have had intercourse with My murderers!” Flee, then, from their assemblies, fly from their houses, and, far from venerating the synagogue, hold it in hatred and aversion. ~ St. John Chrysostom

This seems to be a little more than sayin Jews do not have the fulnes of Truth, would’nt you agree?

 

[bankerdavid]

How dare Christians have the slightest intercourse with Jews, those most miserable of all men. They are lustful, rapacious, greedy, perfidious bandits – pests of the universe! Indeed, an entire day would not suffice to tell of all their rapine, their avarice, their deception of the poor, their thievery, and their huckstering. Are they not inveterate murderers, destroyers, men possessed by the devil? Jews are impure and impious, and their synagogue is a house of prostitution, a lair of beasts, a place of shame and ridicule, the domicile of the devil, as is also the soul of the Jew. As a matter of fact, Jews worship the devil: their rites are criminal and unchaste; their religion a disease; their synagogue an assembly of crooks, a den of thieves, a cavern of devils, an abyss of perdition! Why are Jews degenerate? Because of their hateful assassination of Christ. This supreme crime lies at the root of their degradation and woes. The rejection and dispersion of the Jews was the work of God, not of emperors. It was done by the wrath of God and because of His absolute abandonment of the Jews. Thus, the Jew will live under the yoke of slavery without end. God hates the Jews, and on Judgment Day He will say to those who sympathize with them., “Depart from Me, for you have had intercourse with My murderers!” Flee, then, from their assemblies, fly from their houses, and, far from venerating the synagogue, hold it in hatred and aversion. ~ St. John Chrysostom

This seems to be a little more than sayin Jews do not have the fulnes of Truth, would’nt you agree?

I disagree with your emphasis.

Why are Jews degenerate? Because of their hateful assassination of Christ. This supreme crime lies at the root of their degradation and woes.

seems to be the emphasis. I don’t think you can blame anyone who truly loves the Lord for hating what Jews did to Him. Does this mean we should hate Jews? Modern day Jews? No, but we can hate what those Phariseean Jews did with lies, deceit, rapaciousness.
I might agree that the wording is over-zealous, but drill down to the point-the Jews of the time hated Christ, conspired to murder him, and used the Romans to do so. Does that mark present day Jews? No more than present day families of people that owned slaves.

What’s also weird is that, if you do a google search on any of those ‘quotes’, you only come up with this website, and another Jewish website. Nothing shows what document/paragraph/sentence they’re quoting. Therefore there is room to doubt that any of these was actually said.

 

[bankerdavid]

I need to make a retraction. I’ve seen some of Chrysostom’s homilies, now, and while the content itself may be found offensive, the point is not:
Quote from his 1st homily on Adversus Judaeos

(5) What is this disease? The festivals of the pitiful and miserable Jews are soon to march upon us one after the other and in quick succession: the feast of Trumpets, the feast of Tabernacles, the fasts. There are many in our ranks who say they think as we do. Yet some of these are going to watch the festivals and others will join the Jews in keeping their feasts and observing their fasts. I wish to drive this perverse custom from the Church right now. My homilies against the Anomians can be put off to another time, and the postponement would cause no harm. But now that the Jewish festivals are close by and at the very door, if I should fail to cure those who are sick with the Judaizing disease. I am afraid that, because of their ill-suited association and deep ignorance, some Christians may partake in the Jews’ transgressions; once they have done so, I fear my homilies on these transgressions will be in vain. For if they hear no word from me today, they will then join the Jews in their fasts; once they have committed this sin it will be useless for me to apply the remedy.

Seems to tell his audience to remain true to their faith.

From Homily II

(3) Nothing is more miserable than those people who never failed to attack their own salvation. When there was need to observe the Law, they trampled it under foot. Now that the Law has ceased to bind, they obstinately strive to observe it. What could be more pitiable that those who provoke God not only by transgressing the Law but also by keeping it? On this account Stephen said: “You stiff-necked and uncircumcised in heart, you always resist the Holy Spirit”, not only by transgressing the Law but also by wishing to observe it at the wrong time.

(4) Stephen was right in calling them stiff-necked. For they failed to take up the yoke of Christ, although it was sweet and had nothing about it which was either burdensome or oppressive. For he said: “Learn from me for I am meek and humble of heart”, and “Take my yoke upon you, for my yoke is sweet and my burden light”. Nonetheless they failed to take up the yoke because of the stiffness of their necks. Not only did they fail to take it up but they broke it and destroyed it. For Jeremiah said: “Long ago you broke your yoke and burst your bonds”. It was not Paul who said this but the voice of the prophet speaking loud and clear. When he spoke of the yoke and the bonds, he meant the symbols of rule, because the Jews rejected the rule of Christ when they said: “We have no king but Caesar”. You Jews broke the yoke, you burst the bonds, you cast yourselves out of the kingdom of heaven, and you made yourselves subject to the rule of men. Please consider with me how accurately the prophet hinted that their hearts were uncontrolled. He did not say: “You set aside the yoke”, but “You broke the yoke” and this is the crime of untamed beasts, who are uncontrolled and reject rule.

Explains why they are pitiable.

And I could go on. It sounds like a man who is zealous in his faith, and wants as many of the faithful to be with him as possible. I’ve heard worse from fire and brimstone evangelicals.

 

[rpp]

How dare Christians have the slightest intercourse with Jews, those most miserable of all men. They are lustful, rapacious, greedy, perfidious bandits – pests of the universe! Indeed, an entire day would not suffice to tell of all their rapine, their avarice, their deception of the poor, their thievery, and their huckstering. Are they not inveterate murderers, destroyers, men possessed by the devil? Jews are impure and impious, and their synagogue is a house of prostitution, a lair of beasts, a place of shame and ridicule, the domicile of the devil, as is also the soul of the Jew. As a matter of fact, Jews worship the devil: their rites are criminal and unchaste; their religion a disease; their synagogue an assembly of crooks, a den of thieves, a cavern of devils, an abyss of perdition! Why are Jews degenerate? Because of their hateful assassination of Christ. This supreme crime lies at the root of their degradation and woes. The rejection and dispersion of the Jews was the work of God, not of emperors. It was done by the wrath of God and because of His absolute abandonment of the Jews. Thus, the Jew will live under the yoke of slavery without end. God hates the Jews, and on Judgment Day He will say to those who sympathize with them., “Depart from Me, for you have had intercourse with My murderers!” Flee, then, from their assemblies, fly from their houses, and, far from venerating the synagogue, hold it in hatred and aversion. ~ St. John Chrysostom

This seems to be a little more than sayin Jews do not have the fulnes of Truth, would’nt you agree?

One thing to remember is the context in which these words were written. When it came to the early persecutions, it was the Jews, not the Romans, who most vigoroulsly attacked Christians. Though this was long past by St. John Chrysostom’s time, I am sure the bitter memory lingered in many Christians.

 

[Jaypeeto4]

The Saints were not perfect in every thing and in every way.
Even the most godfearing people have, and express, their biases.

In Chrysostom’s case, early church histories were filled with examples of how the Jewish people (generalizing here) persecuted Jews who became Christians and attacked the Christian movement in general. Many Jews today still say they would disown any son or daughter who embraced Jesus Christ as the Messiah, so the hostility toward Christ still exists.

Still, today’s Jews are not firsthand witnesses of Christ’s
miracles and cannot be blamed for their disbelief as, say,
the Pharisees who did not deny Jesus’s miracles but attributed
them to Satan.

We should not blame modern Jewish people for the sins
of SOME of their forefathers. It’s good that the Church and the
Jewish Communities are on much better speaking terms today.
I pray for God to bless the Jewish people and lead them to the fulness of Truth concerning Christ (whether they want me to pray for them for that or not ). Peace be upon the sons of Abraham.

Jaypeeto4
+JMJ+

 

[mlchance]

How about someone dredge up quotes from Jewish people saying nasty things about Christians, and then we call the game even and get back to more important things?

– Mark L. Chance.

 

[Dauphin]

How dare Christians have the slightest intercourse with Jews, those most miserable of all men. They are lustful, rapacious, greedy, perfidious bandits – pests of the universe! Indeed, an entire day would not suffice to tell of all their rapine, their avarice, their deception of the poor, their thievery, and their huckstering. Are they not inveterate murderers, destroyers, men possessed by the devil? Jews are impure and impious, and their synagogue is a house of prostitution, a lair of beasts, a place of shame and ridicule, the domicile of the devil, as is also the soul of the Jew. As a matter of fact, Jews worship the devil: their rites are criminal and unchaste; their religion a disease; their synagogue an assembly of crooks, a den of thieves, a cavern of devils, an abyss of perdition! Why are Jews degenerate? Because of their hateful assassination of Christ. This supreme crime lies at the root of their degradation and woes. The rejection and dispersion of the Jews was the work of God, not of emperors. It was done by the wrath of God and because of His absolute abandonment of the Jews. Thus, the Jew will live under the yoke of slavery without end. God hates the Jews, and on Judgment Day He will say to those who sympathize with them., “Depart from Me, for you have had intercourse with My murderers!” Flee, then, from their assemblies, fly from their houses, and, far from venerating the synagogue, hold it in hatred and aversion. ~ St. John Chrysostom

This seems to be a little more than sayin Jews do not have the fulnes of Truth, would’nt you agree?

Wow! I’ve never read a thrashing like that! Nothing in modern politics even compares (not even Ahmadinejad’s introduction at Columbia)!

 

[Jaypeeto4]

You have never heard a thrashing like that?
LOL,
you must have never read the Prophets of the Old Testament.
No one ever uttered more fiery denunciations of the
Jewish nation than the Jewish prophets themselves.

In both cases, in the case of the prophets and in the case
of Chrysostom, the denunciations were uttered because
both believed the Jewish people to be in a state of
apostasy from God. It was not racially motivated.

Comparing Iran’s racist president to St. Chrysostom
is bordering on sacrilege.

Jaypeeto4
+JMJ+

 

[Dauphin]

You have never heard a thrashing like that?
LOL,
you must have never read the Prophets of the Old Testament.
No one ever uttered more fiery denunciations of the
Jewish nation than the Jewish prophets themselves.

In both cases, in the case of the prophets and in the case
of Chrysostom, the denunciations were uttered because
both believed the Jewish people to be in a state of
apostasy from God. It was not racially motivated.

Comparing Iran’s racist president to St. Chrysostom
is bordering on sacrilege.

Jaypeeto4
+JMJ+

Wow! Wait a moment! I never made that comparison! I was referring to the speech Columbia’s president made when introducing Ahmadinejad, in which he forcefully denounced him. I brought it up not to compare the Saint to anyone, but to compare the tone of his sermon to the tone of that more modern statement.

 

[Lev23]

How about someone dredge up quotes from Jewish people saying nasty things about Christians, and then we call the game even and get back to more important things?

– Mark L. Chance.

Wow, way to make them jealous for their Messiah.

Romans 11:1-2
I ask then: Did God reject his people? By no means! I am an Israelite myself, a descendant of Abraham, from the tribe of Benjamin. God dod not reject his people, whom he foreknew.

Notice how St.Paul confirms they are still God’s people? Anyways, in light of just these 2 verses over those ECF comments posted here, its easy to see there is no excuse for a Christian to make such blanket statements of hate or condemnation over the Jews or any ethnic peoples.

St.Stephan calls his own unbelieving people “stiff-necked”, this ECF calls them “pests of the universe”!


What about the Christian Jews at that time these writings came out? We will never know how much harder it was for them to witness to their Jewish families after such condeming proclaimations.

 

[Mannyfit75]

Wow, way to make them jealous for their Messiah.

Romans 11:1-2
I ask then: Did God reject his people? By no means! I am an Israelite myself, a descendant of Abraham, from the tribe of Benjamin. God dod not reject his people, whom he foreknew.

Notice how St.Paul confirms they are still God’s people? Anyways, in light of just these 2 verses over those ECF comments posted here, its easy to see there is no excuse for a Christian to make such blanket statements of hate or condemnation over the Jews or any ethnic peoples.

St.Stephan calls his own unbelieving people “stiff-necked”, this ECF calls them “pests of the universe”!


What about the Christian Jews at that time these writings came out? We will never know how much harder it was for them to witness to their Jewish families after such condeming proclaimations.

I think the best saint of all is Pope John Paul II. He saw their suffering during the Holocaust. I can also avocate those priests who were killed in the Concentration Camp.

Saints like Saint Maximillian Kolbe.

 

[Lev23]

Saint Maximillian Kolbe.

:yup: