Catholic bible and the Deuterocanon

[PerryJ]

The Puritans in 1599 removed the printing of the Deutercanon from the Geneva Bible; but, not the pages. They left them blank and unnumbered.

From Gary Michuta Author of why Catholic Bibles are Bigger “No strange as it may seem the… the demise of the Deutercanon can be attributed to another influence…economics. Put simply smaller Bibles…were cheaper to make…Yet despite the growing number of Protestant Bibles without them, Bibles which included the Deutercanon remained the norm.” Page 285

The British and Foreign Bible Society (BFSB) in 1804 was formed, the organization wase formed to print Bibles and distribute them to individuals. This particular group became powerful by supporting other Bibles societies with the same agenda. In 1822 the Scottish Society along with the BFSB stopped paying for parts of the Bibles that included the Deutercanon. This transfer of cost influenced how many Bibles could be printed with the DCs in them.

In extension the Edinburgh and Glasgow societies removed their support if the BFSB continued to print Bibles that contained the DCs. In 1827 the BFBS removed all funding that included the printing of the DCs.

As shown the major driver with regards to removing the DCs from a cost perspective was funding from the Protestant Bible Societies and not from the printers.

Again, I could go on; however, this demonstrates the DCs were removed by Protestant organizations with a clear agenda of removing the DC. Note these societies were controlled by their Protestant denominations or affiliations.

 

[PerryJ]

I found your statements interesting. At times very insulting and other times attempting to be cordial. If my posts were offensive they were not meant to be. I am leaving this thread though. I have to admit your insults were enough for me to pick up a few of the books I read in the past to prove your thought process to be in error or at least over stated.

Neither of us win or lose a discussion such as this as we only know what God has given to us with reason and knowledge. As God has granted me the blessing of both I can not use that to diminish the truly blessed. (Nor can I guide one to Christ without his intercession.) The individuals that Love Christ without reason or knowledge; but, out of pure faith and love. I will always be second to Christians such as Mother Theresa that loved Christ without the need for knowledge to support her faith. I do Christ a diservice to enter a thread that has negative over tones and if I did this then I apologize to you and to Christ as that is not his way.

Bless you on your path

 

[PerryJ]

For Anna if you have not already read “Mass of the Early Christians” I would highly recommend it. I believe it will be able to guide you on the path that I was attempting to show you. The Church was founded before the Bible and as such the Bible does not stand alone. The Church, Apostles (writings not included in the Bible for example the Didache) the first generation of Christians taught by the Apostles and the Bible form our faith. All Catholic Bibles, even with different text, have the same meaning. They do not differ in intent as the Bible is not our only source for understanding Christ. Nor has Christ left us in this world alone. The Bible does not rule our faith it is part of our faith. As such all Catholic Bibles have the same message. There is only one truth and that is Christ.

 

[CopticChristian]

For Anna if you have not already read “Mass of the Early Christians” I would highly recommend it. I believe it will be able to guide you on the path that I was attempting to show you. The Church was founded before the Bible and as such the Bible does not stand alone. The Church, Apostles (writings not included in the Bible for example the Didache) the first generation of Christians taught by the Apostles and the Bible form our faith. All Catholic Bibles, even with different text, have the same meaning. They do not differ in intent as the Bible is not our only source for understanding Christ. Nor has Christ left us in this world alone. The Bible does not rule our faith it is part of our faith. As such all Catholic Bibles have the same message. There is only one truth and that is Christ.

Welcome back. Your summary here is consistent.

From Gary Michuta Author of why Catholic Bibles are Bigger “No strange as it may seem the… the demise of the Deutercanon can be attributed to another influence…economics. Put simply smaller Bibles…were cheaper to make…Yet despite the growing number of Protestant Bibles without them, Bibles which included the Deutercanon remained the norm.” Page 285

The British and Foreign Bible Society (BFSB) in 1804 was formed, the organization wase formed to print Bibles and distribute them to individuals. This particular group became powerful by supporting other Bibles societies with the same agenda. In 1822 the Scottish Society along with the BFSB stopped paying for parts of the Bibles that included the Deutercanon. This transfer of cost influenced how many Bibles could be printed with the DCs in them.

In extension the Edinburgh and Glasgow societies removed their support if the BFSB continued to print Bibles that contained the DCs. In 1827 the BFBS removed all funding that included the printing of the DCs.

As shown the major driver with regards to removing the DCs from a cost perspective was funding from the Protestant Bible Societies and not from the printers.

The unschooled Protestant may read your list of confessions not knowing how or who formulated them. You are aware but others may not be that the Westminster confession was used as a template for other such confessions on your list.

reformation-scotland.org.uk/articles/scotland-and-wcf.html

Then two years later in 1642, the English Parliament sent what was called a Declaration to the General Assembly of the Church of Scotland, meeting that year in St Andrews. The Declaration went like this: it was a message earnestly desiring “a most firm and stable union between the two kingdoms of England and Scotland, and that in view of the prevailing situation.” Now the prevailing situation was one of tension between King and Parliament, and all sorts of tensions were creating a very ugly and threatening atmosphere in the southern kingdom.

These declarations were by motivation of government/parliament. My premise is that there is no ecclesial body that removed the DC and you prove my point.

I am so grateful for your return.:console::thankyou:

 

[Anna_Scott]

. . .The Bible we use is based upon the teachings of the apostles. . . .Our Mass and our Bible have been proven to have been used by the very first Christians that were Catholic.

Which Bible?

. . .The Bibles that the Catholic Church approves have the thought processes of the first Bibles written in the original Aramic. As they have been translated into new languages any Bible will vary from the Aramic because of sentence structures and word differentiation. . . .

. . Are you implying Catholics have better and more accurate Bible translations than Protestants and other non-Catholics?

. . . .All Catholic Bibles, even with different text, have the same meaning. . . . .As such all Catholic Bibles have the same message. There is only one truth and that is Christ.

PerryJ,
You still didn’t answer my question: Are you implying Catholics have better and more accurate Bible translations than Protestants and other non-Catholics?

Peace,
Anna

 

[PerryJ]

Welcome back. Your summary here is consistent.

The unschooled Protestant may read your list of confessions not knowing how or who formulated them. You are aware but others may not be that the Westminster confession was used as a template for other such confessions on your list.

reformation-scotland.org.uk/articles/scotland-and-wcf.html

These declarations were by motivation of government/parliament. My premise is that there is no ecclesial body that removed the DC and you prove my point.

I am so grateful for your return.:console::thankyou:

Government and religion were one and the same. Their was no concept of separation of Church and State until th e1970s in the United States. Luther moved the hierarchy to the German monarch. The British etc did the same thing. The monarchy became the religious government for lack of a better term. They intitiated Protestant movements. This was easy as the people felt that God annoited the Monarchs.

 

[CopticChristian]

Government and religion were one and the same. Their was no concept of separation of Church and State until th e1970s in the United States. Luther moved the hierarchy to the German monarch. The British etc did the same thing. The monarchy became the religious government for lack of a better term. They intitiated Protestant movements. This was easy as the people felt that God annoited the Monarchs.

Perry,

You are on to something. You are giving good information. Let’s complete this.

There were no Protestant councils prior to Dort or Westminster.You have all this researched.

Which governmental body called for the Synod of Dort?

Which government or political body initiated and called for The Council of Trent?

Which Political or government body called for the preceeding Council, The Lateran Council?

Amen, Perry…welcome back…:thankyou:

 

[CopticChristian]

Government and religion were one and the same. Their was no concept of separation of Church and State until th e1970s in the United States. Luther moved the hierarchy to the German monarch. The British etc did the same thing. The monarchy became the religious government for lack of a better term. They intitiated Protestant movements. This was easy as the people felt that God annoited the Monarchs.

Did the United States exist at the time of Trent, Dort, Westminster or any of the other declarations?

 

[CopticChristian]

Government and religion were one and the same. Their was no concept of separation of Church and State until th e1970s in the United States. Luther moved the hierarchy to the German monarch. The British etc did the same thing. The monarchy became the religious government for lack of a better term. They intitiated Protestant movements. This was easy as the people felt that God annoited the Monarchs.

So then you would conclude that no ecclesial body was involved rather monarchial bodies.

 

[Nicea325]

PerryJ,
You still didn’t answer my question: Are you implying Catholics have better and more accurate Bible translations than Protestants and other non-Catholics?

Peace,
Anna

I do not think that is the case. I am no Bible scholar,but I think translations have improved on both sides. I personally like NKJV Study Bible and the St.Ignatius C-RSV 2nd Edition Bible.

 

[Anna_Scott]

I do not think that is the case. I am no Bible scholar,but I think translations have improved on both sides. I personally like NKJV Study Bible and the St.Ignatius C-RSV 2nd Edition Bible.

Nicea,
Indeed, translations have improved on both sides. The RSV/NRSV are ecumenical translations which lead to the RSV-CE. I would like to buy a Catholic edition for the commentary.

Peace,
Anna

 

[Anna_Scott]

So then you would conclude that no ecclesial body was involved rather monarchial bodies.

What happened to PerryJ? I’ve been following your discussion; but it seems to have stalled.

Anna

 

[KathleenGee]

From my source my pastor gave me on Church history, yes nationalism and much of Germany during Luther’s revolt were wanting their own jurisdiction was eye opening…the other Protestant countries also seemed to culturally and nationally break away as well…I think of Scandinavia…of course France…which fell more into liberalism and secularism…

I think about life and it seems when there is a great catastrophe…it is not just one or two factors…but may be even 6 factors that all come together.

 

[UnlikelyHomeDad]

I read enough to know that I don’t want to keep up with this thread since it incites such unnecessary animosity between faiths. I only wanted to post that once, about 4 years ago, I was buying a KJV because it was the original reprint that contained the deuterocanonical texts that most Protestants seem to reject. The young lady was a Baptist and said that many of the seminaries were returning to reading it. There really is not reason for them not to accept the scripture as scripture since they basically justify their existence by other means anyhow. Kind of a mute argument these days it seems, with exception of those out of the loop.

 

[Anna_Scott]

Government and religion were one and the same. . . . .

PerryJ,

Where did you go. I was following your discussion with CopticChristian.

Anna

 

[Anna_Scott]

I read enough to know that I don’t want to keep up with this thread since it incites such unnecessary animosity between faiths. I only wanted to post that once, about 4 years ago, I was buying a KJV because it was the original reprint that contained the deuterocanonical texts that most Protestants seem to reject. The young lady was a Baptist and said that many of the seminaries were returning to reading it. There really is not reason for them not to accept the scripture as scripture since they basically justify their existence by other means anyhow. Kind of a mute argument these days it seems, with exception of those out of the loop.

Hey, UnlikelyHomeDad,

What animosity are you talking about???

Anna