Catholic Bishops Doing a Poor Job?

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It seems to me that collectively, the Catholic Bishops in the USA are doing a very poor job. Their poor performance is on display with the problems we see with the liturgy.

I see very little team work amongst the Bishops. Each one seems to focus on protecting their patch of turf, rather than projecting a unified voice that support what the Church actually teaches.

I look at the efficient organization and execution of other ecclesial groups in the USA and I shudder to think what they would accomplish in the name of Jesus Christ if they had the resources of the Catholic Church behind their efforts…
 
It seems to me that collectively, the Catholic Bishops in the USA are doing a very poor job. Their poor performance is on display with the problems we see with the liturgy.
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I see very little team work amongst the Bishops. Each one seems to focus on protecting their patch of turf, rather than projecting a unified voice that support what the Church actually teaches.
Click to expand...
I look at the efficient organization and execution of other ecclesial groups in the USA and I shudder to think what they would accomplish in the name of Jesus Christ if they had the resources of the Catholic Church behind their efforts…
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I guess that’s your opinion and I am sorry you feel that way. But as a Roman Catholic I feel that I owe obedience to my bishop and will not speak ill of him or his brothers, especially in public. Quite frankly you have no right, no authority, no idea, and no reason to offer your critique of their performance.

To be a faithful Catholic does not entail you to opine about your bishops on your whim. They have the graces associated with the fullness of ordination and they have the weight of tens of millions of souls on their shoulders. Cut them some slack.

Instead of whinning about them, pray for them. When WAS the last time that you prayed for the Holy Spirit to guide them. When was the last time YOU offered a novena for graces for them? When was the last time that YOU fasted for them? And I am not talking about praying so that they agree with what you believe is right and true, but that they follow God’s will. Hmmm. I bet it hasn’t happened since the last time you whinned about them.
 
Regretfuly for the bishops this is America. Americans have always been a little cantankerous.When they are dissappointed and humiliated they get Mad. Thats what many American Catholics are,mad.
Yes its Catholic teaching that the personal character of a bishop does not effect his ability to teach and lead,but.
Catholics still take their personal charcter into effect.
Keep in mind that the Catholic church instructs its folowers in every area of their life.These instructions are carried out by the clergy.
It has been proven that the some bishops have been protecting child mlesters.That they used the loyalty of Catholics to save child molesters from the authorities. The bishops of the Catholic church lied , publicly about what happened in their diocese.Over and over again.
This is not a secret, this is not being unchritable.It is the truth, From Boston to Orange California,Sacramento to Covington.Sights Catholics never in their wildest nightmares ever thought they’d see happen.
 
I don’t believe he was referring to the instances you are talking about he was specifically gripping about the liturgy. Being criminal is one thing and a tragic abuse of trust that cannot be tolerated. Holding an opinion that is not popular with some members of a diocese is something completely different.
 
I don’t want to give an in depth critique of our Bishops role in the Liturgy, its not my place, however, I do ask myself why is there so much confusion in the celebration of the Mass when the guidlines are pretty clear and whose responsibility is it to insure there isn’t mass confussion (forgive the pun - I couldn’t resist)

One thing further, a bishop’s personal life and actions do effect the main mission of the Bishops which is to carry out the mandate given to the Apostles to Evangelize. There are to clear references from scripture which stresses this. One is the incident at Antioch where Peter’s behavior was causing division and Paul had to correct Peter. The second and more important peice of scripture is Jesus warning about the consequences of scandle.
 
Certainly these fora are to discuss. Any of us is free to offer an opinion, and any of us is free to agree or disagree with that opinion. A Bishop is a public figure and is, therefore, open to public comment. I do not think the OP was commenting on or critizing anyone’s personal life, just the performance of their public duties. That’s what boards and fora are for, to discuss, and that often includes criticism.

Peace,
Linda
 
Well, I like my bishop. He is faithful to the Church including matters of liturgy, and he is not merely an intellectual, but has common sense.

I like Cardinal George. Bishop Jenky seems OK from Peoria. Diocese of Belleville was well-run. Bishop Doran is great. And we pray a lot for Bishop Imesch in Joliet.

There aren’t a great deal of arguments here in so-called “fly over country”.

BTW- Cardinal George is slated to be one of the celebrants of the TLM at World Youth Day!👍
 
It seems to me that collectively, the Catholic Bishops in the USA are doing a very poor job
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What do you expect from a bishop? They can’t be everywhere all the time , and the priests who are under them are supposed to be professionals too.

They have their hands full now, with keeping their parishes staffed, handling the sexual abuse crisis, as well as embezzlement problems in too many places.

In addition, many dioceses in the US have shrinking populations, others growing populations. Property disposition and acquisition always are delicate issues that require a bishop’s attention.

Priests making non-critical errors in the liturgical prayer is pretty low on their to-do lists, I think that the priests are supposed to be mostly policing themselves in such matters.
 
Certainly these fora are to discuss. Any of us is free to offer an opinion, and any of us is free to agree or disagree with that opinion. A Bishop is a public figure and is, therefore, open to public comment. I do not think the OP was commenting on or critizing anyone’s personal life, just the performance of their public duties. That’s what boards and fora are for, to discuss, and that often includes criticism.
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I disagree. There is a line that you are crossing that you shouldn’t be. A bishop is not like other ‘public’ officials. He is a direct successor to the Apostles. He has the fullness of ordination. Honor your father and mother is a God given commandment. People who opine about this, that or the other thing concerning their bishops implimentation, control over their diocese, etc have to do some serious soul searching. Being a good Catholic does not give you a right to offer any comments on how the bishop is running the Church. This includes parish closers, moving priests, implementing liturgical norms, etc. These are holy men and they ARE your spiritual fathers. They know best. If they fall out of line of Church teaching it is the Vatican and God that they answer to. Like I said previously, criminal behavior is something completely different and wasn’t being addressed in this string. Criminal behavior is criminal and shouldn’t be tolerated, but I will leave that to civil authorities and again the Church to decide. I would rather not judge these holy men who have given everything to serve the Church based on what the media has to say.
 
flamingsword # 9
The bishops used the loyalty of Catholics to protect pedophiles.Not once,not twice, not 100 times. More times than one can count. Not one bishop and not 2 the number is over 12 and at least one Cardinal,at least. This is not my opinion, or the Boston Globe or the Los Angeles Times. They have confessed,under oath. They have Cardinal Law admitting what he did on video tape.
They obstructed the civil authorities from doing their job for decades.
If it wasn’t for the statutes of limitations you would have seen more than one bishop in an Orange jump suit.
The church,on its own has not punished one bishop,not one.Any bishop that has been punished,it was by the civil authorities. Without any help from the church.
 
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Kielbasi:
What do you expect from a bishop? They can’t be everywhere all the time , and the priests who are under them are supposed to be professionals too.

They have their hands full now, with keeping their parishes staffed, handling the sexual abuse crisis, as well as embezzlement problems in too many places.

In addition, many dioceses in the US have shrinking populations, others growing populations. Property disposition and acquisition always are delicate issues that require a bishop’s attention.

Priests making non-critical errors in the liturgical prayer is pretty low on their to-do lists, I think that the priests are supposed to be mostly policing themselves in such matters.
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It was funny reading this because when I read the first post I thought how bishops should be most concerned with the immortal souls in their care and not all the secular stuff. Your post is propable very accurate. That may very well be how most of the bishops view their position.
 
JohnyJ

Let me ask you this. 12 bishops, if you can believe the media, have acted in a criminal manner. That leaves a heck of a lot of very faithful bishops throughout the United States. But, again you are basing your extremely well informed opinions on what the media has chosen to report and how they have chosen to spin what they report. Do you have information that no one else does? What exactly happened? Can you honestly say that you know the entirety of what happened? I doubt it.

These bishops are holy men who have devoted their lives to the service of God. If they did something in their ministry that caused scandal, they will answer before God. I would not presume to judge them based on what the media has reported. We all will answer before God. If you are using the fact that some bishops may have abused the trust placed in them to hate the Catholic faith, you will answer before God to that as well.

It is sad that anyone would presume to judge their spiritual fathers, and using that judgement they place on the bishops to turn away from the Catholic faith, ultimately putting their immortal souls at risk, all based on what the media says.
 
Originally posted by General
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It seems to me that collectively, the Catholic Bishops in the USA are doing a very poor job. Their poor performance is on display with the problems we see with the liturgy.
Click to expand...
I see very little team work amongst the Bishops. Each one seems to focus on protecting their patch of turf, rather than projecting a unified voice that support what the Church actually teaches.
Click to expand...
I do not much care what the bishops do collectively. I care what my Bishop and my Priest say and do. My Bishop needs to be leading in accordance with the Pope. My priest must obey our Bishop. They must provide sacramental Grace, bear witness to Christ and teach the Truth. The laity must support their Deacons, Priests, Bishop and Pope as faithful practicing Catholics. If we do our best in this regard the Church will take care of itself. I am sure I will be imperfect in my role; I imagine our clerics will be as well. We really must pray hard and do our best.

Does somebody know what authority the national Bishops conferences have over their members?

Christ’s Peace,

TJD
 
flamingsword # 12
Not one news paper has been sued for liable or slander by any bishop or diocese,not one. When Cardinal Law accused the Boson Globe of printing lies, he had to publicly apologize. THe Newspaper went on to win the Pulitzer Prize ! For its uncovering of the scandal in Cardinal Laws administration and his predacessors.
You make it sound like the Media is inventing this stuff. The payments for what the Media has reported is nearing 2 billon dollars !You think the Bishops would payout $ 2,000,000,000.00 for nothing?
It is blind belief like yours that was used to keep the crimes secret for decades.They used the faith of Catholics to protect the pedophiles and themselves. To this day, not even the bishops named by the USCCB’s own investigators have been punished.
Oh its zero tolerance for the priests. Its reported that many innocent priests have been removed from their duties on very flimsy evidence.
Yet bishops that facilitated the molestation of children they are still in ofice. The bishops are protecting their own,just like cops,lawyers & docters.
 
JohnyJ
Not one news paper has been sued for liable or slander by any bishop or diocese,not one.
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Perhaps not, but there are three cases that happened in my local area that could have easily been pursued as libel. They were plastered on the front page when they were accused. When their names were finally cleared, the newspapers only printed a five inch article on one of them.
When Cardinal Law accused the Boson Globe of printing lies, he had to publicly apologize. THe Newspaper went on to win the Pulitzer Prize !
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The fact that they got a pulitzer means nothing. I am not ignoring the facts that criminal acts may have been commited, but I don’t know all the facts, I don’t know what Cardinal Law was thinking/being told by experts of his day, I don’t know his motivation. Don’t judge him, let God.
You think the Bishops would payout $ 2,000,000,000.00 for nothing?
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Not necessarily for nothing, but a lot of cases that involve fradulant claims are settled in all areas of society because insurance companies are more willing to settle rather than let cases go to court. In case you haven’t noticed, civil juries are completely unrealiable in meting out justice. McDonald’s being sued because someone spilled coffee on her lap is only the start of a very long list.
It is blind belief like yours that was used to keep the crimes secret for decades.
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I don’t have blind faith. I have said numerous times in this string that criminal acts are criminal, yet I am not the one who will be judging these holy men, nor should you. There are some wretched priests out there who have abused the trust of the Church and their flock. They will face God and answer for what they did, and yes some of these people should be locked up in jail. Some bishops made mistakes placing these men back in ministry, yet at the time all the psychologists were saying that these guys were rehabilitated. We now know that this is not the case, people like this cannot be rehabilitated.
They used the faith of Catholics to protect the pedophiles and themselves. To this day, not even the bishops named by the USCCB’s own investigators have been punished.
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How do you know. What are your sources. Who have you been talking to? If they are guilty, they will answer before God. If they are found to be acting criminally I would suspect that civil authorities would press charges.
Oh its zero tolerance for the priests. Its reported that many innocent priests have been removed from their duties on very flimsy evidence.
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The media frenzy has caused this injustice as well. In the Church today it is guilty until proven innocent. Many, many innocent priests have been hurt by this policy. The same policy applies to bishops as well.
Yet bishops that facilitated the molestation of children they are still in ofice.
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Lets do some quick math, much of the scandal happened over 30-40 years ago. Most bishops are conscecrated bishops around the age of 45. They usually don’t get control over a diocese for at least 10 years that puts them at 55 on average. Now they are required to submit their resignations at the age of 75, meaning they have about 20 years as bishops incharge of a diocese. Hence most bishops today were not in office at the time the greatest atrocities were taking place. Some, but not many.
The bishops are protecting their own,just like cops,lawyers & docters.
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Wow you really have such a great view of society. I am sorry you live in such a depressing world where you think everyone around you is evil. Some of the greatest people I know are bishops, priests, cops, and doctors who have sacrificed their entire lives in order to be of service to our society. It is sad that the people they sacrificed so much for (you) have no appreciation for what they have done.

Before you respond again. Ask yourself this question. Do I hate the Catholic Church and am I using the sexual abuse scandal as an excuse to persist in hating the Church. I think you may find the answer is yes. If it is don’t even bother responding again because there is no point of it. Your issue is not with sexual abuse scandal, it is that you don’t believe in Christ’s Church. If the answer is no. Then you need to do some serious soul searching and then seek out spiritual direction because you have serious issues that cannot be dealt with on these boards.

Enough said.

PS. if you are in SNAP or Voice of the Faithful, I would leave those groups because they have become seriously anti-Catholic.
 
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flamingsword:
I guess that’s your opinion and I am sorry you feel that way. But as a Roman Catholic I feel that I owe obedience to my bishop and will not speak ill of him or his brothers, especially in public. Quite frankly you have no right, no authority, no idea, and no reason to offer your critique of their performance.
To be a faithful Catholic does not entail you to opine about your bishops on your whim. They have the graces associated with the fullness of ordination and they have the weight of tens of millions of souls on their shoulders. Cut them some slack.

Instead of whinning about them, pray for them. When WAS the last time that you prayed for the Holy Spirit to guide them. When was the last time YOU offered a novena for graces for them? When was the last time that YOU fasted for them? And I am not talking about praying so that they agree with what you believe is right and true, but that they follow God’s will. Hmmm. I bet it hasn’t happened since the last time you whinned about them.
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That’s just plain silly…

While one should not opine about other lightly, it is our duty as Catholic Christians to do all that we can to support the Church – even if it means fairly critiquing our bishops.

There are plenty of excellent bishops out there. Sadly, there seems to be quite a few horrible ones as well…
 
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TJD:
I do not much care what the bishops do collectively. I care what my Bishop and my Priest say and do. My Bishop needs to be leading in accordance with the Pope. My priest must obey our Bishop. They must provide sacramental Grace, bear witness to Christ and teach the Truth. The laity must support their Deacons, Priests, Bishop and Pope as faithful practicing Catholics. If we do our best in this regard the Church will take care of itself. I am sure I will be imperfect in my role; I imagine our clerics will be as well. We really must pray hard and do our best.

Does somebody know what authority the national Bishops conferences have over their members?

Christ’s Peace,

TJD
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I certainly care what the US Bishops do collectively – they should *all * follow the Bishop of Rome.
 
There are definately a few bishops (and Cardinals too!) that need to be retired before they can do any more damage… :mad:
 
Flamingsword # 15
You would be surprised at how many bishops are still in office that aided pedophiles.
The Investigating panel of the USCCB when it issued its report recommended that 4 bishops resign.Because of their involvement in the scandal. They didn’t, no bishop has been removed by the church for involvement in the scandal.More than 4 Bishops have been forced to resign by the Media when it publicised their involvement with pedophiles or for other sexual type offenses.Two bishops have been forced to submit to ongoing oversight by the attorney Generals office of 2 states.
In Massachusetts 85 pieces of church property must be sold to help pay the victims.This includes the Episcopal residence.
Usualy the bishops prefer judges to preside over the cases they do not want juries.They hope the Judge is protestant,because. its been shown that Catholic judges are harder on the bishops.
The bishops have been saved from criminal prosecution ,because. In most instances the statute of limitations has expired. Thats also why so many have in the end confessed.Knowing they couldn’t be criminaly prosecuted.Most states have corrected that Many states have passed new laws, some that can only be called draconian when it comes to the punishment. When California was holding hearings on its new laws. The bishops conference of California asked to be heard. They were told their opinion was not wanted.
You completly miss something very important. We gave our enamies the scandal and they are beating us over the head wth it.Also it is not Catholic haters that are going after the bishops.Its loyal Catholics that have been betrayed and humiliated by people who were sapose to be in Gods Service !
The Scandal will continue until the church decides to clean house for real!
 
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flamingsword:
I guess that’s your opinion and I am sorry you feel that way. But as a Roman Catholic I feel that I owe obedience to my bishop and will not speak ill of him or his brothers, especially in public. Quite frankly you have no right, no authority, no idea, and no reason to offer your critique of their performance.
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True, we must pray for our bishops, but I’ve definitely seen the Angelic Doctor quoted on here as to the duty of the laity to call out their clergy when they need correction.
 
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