Catholic Polygamy

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Fatboys said:
I am not sure why a LDS person would come here and inflame. I was actually looking for this reference to catholics allowed living polygamy because I remember reading about it from an article. I ran across this website and forum. The reason I was looking for this was because a relative of mine joined the catholic church and I asked why. They struggled with the Church living polygamy at one time. And so I search came here. Anyway as I read from the posts here I can tell that many here do not favor the LDS… And so if you have any questions about my faith, please ask. Love to answer. As well I will also ask questions of you. I have spent many years studying all religions as well as my own. Love to learn.
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I hope you are not going to tell your relative that Catholics were allowed to live polygamously because it’s not the case, and to try to justify LDS polygamy with false accusations is despicable. Besides no one buys the universal children’s wail “well he did it too” justification.
^ Leonhard Theobald, “Der angebliche Bigamiebeschluß des fränkischen Kreistages” “The So-called Bigamy Decision of the Franconian Kreistag”], Beitrage zur Bayerischen kirchengeschichte [Contributions to Bavarian Church History] 23 (1916 – bound volume dated 1917) Erlangen: 199–200 (Theobald reporting that the Franconian Kreistag did not hold session between 1645 and 1664, and that there is no record of such a law in the extant archives of Nürnberg, Ansbach, or Bamberg, Theobald believing that the editors of the Fränkisches Archiv must have misunderstood a draft of some other legislation from 1650).
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^ Alfred Altmann, “Verein für Geschichte der Stadt Nürnburg,” Jahresbericht über das 43 Vereinsjahr 1920 [Annual Report for the 43rd Year 1920 of the Historical Society of the City of Nuremberg] (Nürnberg 1920): 13–15 (Altmann reporting a lecture he had given discussing the polygamy permission said to have been granted in Nuremberg in 1650, Altmann characterizing the Fränkisches Archiv as “merely a popular journal, not an edition of state documents,” and describing the tradition as “a literary fantasy”).
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StephenKent is a former Catholic.

I asked him that back earlier this year on the thread regarding premortal existence and he claiming the Wisdom proves premortal existence. He missed the point this is the work of the Holy Spirit in its greatest fruit, Wisdom. Compared to other Mormon contributors here, his thought process still retained some manner of Catholic thinking. I asked and I lost. He refused to acknowledge that he was a former Catholic.

I visited a Mormon online news source, The Deseret News, and was reading posts, came across one of his where he did state he was a former Catholic.

He comes here because I believe he is still being drawn back to his Catholic roots, and is trying to find some justification for switching to Mormonism. I am curious as to why he picked polygamy this time…
 
Fatboys said:
I am not sure why a LDS person would come here and inflame. I was actually looking for this reference to catholics allowed living polygamy because I remember reading about it from an article. I ran across this website and forum. The reason I was looking for this was because a relative of mine joined the catholic church and I asked why. They struggled with the Church living polygamy at one time. And so I search came here. Anyway as I read from the posts here I can tell that many here do not favor the LDS… And so if you have any questions about my faith, please ask. Love to answer. As well I will also ask questions of you. I have spent many years studying all religions as well as my own. Love to learn.
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My own family has polygamy in it. One man who married 3 sisters plus two more women. I find it beyond creepy that a) anyone would think this is OK and b) would think it would not be a “struggle” to accept.
 
RebeccaJ said:
My own family has polygamy in it. One man who married 3 sisters.
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Brings to mind the concept of grooming. About the only thing more revolting is the person who had a family history of polygamy involving a mother and her daughters the guy boinked them all. That is utterly sick.
 
RebeccaJ said:
My own family has polygamy in it. One man who married 3 sisters plus two more women. I find it beyond creepy that a) anyone would think this is OK and b) would think it would not be a “struggle” to accept.
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I come from a polygamist ancestory. My great great grandfather had several wives. Some of his wives had husbands killed by mobbers, and some had husbands killed in the trek from Nauvoo having been driven out of their homes in the dead of winter. There were members of the church at that time who left the church because of polygamy. I have read many histories about Joseph Smith, both pro and con. Again I am not saying it is right or wrong, but perhaps help you understand why. I am active LDS and I believe that polygamy was a doctrine that God wanted to be brought back at that time. Many think of it as dirty old men being able to have sex with more than one wife. I have been married for 33 years, and one is all I can handle. Not all the church ever lived this principle. About 3-5% lived it. A man could not just go out and tell his wife he feels there shoud be more than her. It was a calling given to a couple by church leaders. And it was a struggle to live. Anti mormons usually want to paint polygamy lived during this time as very one sided leaning way towards the man. It had to be agreed by both and who was to join them. Again there were problems because of the nature of humans. There were jealousies and hurt feelings. And there were divorces. Again this is just the nature of humans. I believe that we are here to become like Christ and control our appetites and passions.
Code: 
   I also believe that this principle can be given and taken away. Because of the law and the feelings of the US government, the LDS were no longer to live this law. 

  I know you think I am just a member who is following blindly, but I am not. I am probably the biggest LDS skeptic and have always done research to search out answers to my questions. So far I have found answers to my questions. I hope this helps you understand. If you have any other questions I will try to answer them. I know what I want to say, but many times it does not translate into writting as well.
 
Fatboys said:
. Again I am not saying it is right or wrong
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I know what I want to say, but many times it does not translate into writting as well
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Fatboy, you are confusing. So which do you want to say? Is Polygamy right or wrong? :confused:

One answer leads you to, hopefully, Christianity and one leads you to Joseph Smith.

LDS follows a different gospel than what was taught by Christ. St Paul warns us not to follow another gospel in Galatians 1:8
But though we, or an angel (Moroni) from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
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Porknpie
 
StephenKent said:
The following is a question calling for a “yes” or “no” answer, to which you may then append your reasoning.
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No! The parliament of a country does not determine the dogma, doctrine, and beliefs of the Latin Catholic Church. The decision of that parliament is NOT the teaching of the Catholic Church.

Can you please explain what made you think this had anything to do with the Latin Catholic Church?
 
Porknpie said:
Fatboy, you are confusing. So which do you want to say? Is Polygamy right or wrong? :confused:

One answer leads you to, hopefully, Christianity and one leads you to Joseph Smith.

LDS follows a different gospel than what was taught by Christ. St Paul warns us not to follow another gospel in Galatians 1:8

Porknpie
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If God commands it, then it is right. If he does not command it or it has been removed then it is wrong to live it. And LDS are followers of Christ. Anyone who follows Christ is a christian. I have spent many many years debating what I believe with anti mormons. Paul’s warning is a good one. And if you want me to go down step by step and show biblically how the foundation of the church Christ built was restored I will… But that is not why I am here. I believe that any thing good is of God.
 
Fatboys said:
I come from a polygamist ancestory. My great great grandfather had several wives. Some of his wives had husbands killed by mobbers, and some had husbands killed in the trek from Nauvoo having been driven out of their homes in the dead of winter. There were members of the church at that time who left the church because of polygamy. I have read many histories about Joseph Smith, both pro and con. Again I am not saying it is right or wrong, but perhaps help you understand why. I am active LDS and I believe that polygamy was a doctrine that God wanted to be brought back at that time. Many think of it as dirty old men being able to have sex with more than one wife. I have been married for 33 years, and one is all I can handle. Not all the church ever lived this principle. About 3-5% lived it. A man could not just go out and tell his wife he feels there shoud be more than her. It was a calling given to a couple by church leaders. And it was a struggle to live. Anti mormons usually want to paint polygamy lived during this time as very one sided leaning way towards the man. It had to be agreed by both and who was to join them. Again there were problems because of the nature of humans. There were jealousies and hurt feelings. And there were divorces. Again this is just the nature of humans. I believe that we are here to become like Christ and control our appetites and passions.
Code: 
   I also believe that this principle can be given and taken away. Because of the law and the feelings of the US government, the LDS were no longer to live this law. 

  I know you think I am just a member who is following blindly, but I am not. I am probably the biggest LDS skeptic and have always done research to search out answers to my questions. So far I have found answers to my questions. I hope this helps you understand. If you have any other questions I will try to answer them. I know what I want to say, but many times it does not translate into writting as well.
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🤷 I still think polygamy is creepy. It also goes against what Jesus taught. So, no, it isn’t from God, it is from the mind of humans, particularly Smith, who when caught in his adulterous affairs made up his whole “doctrine” of polygamy.

That you are skeptical is good. That you believe such a charlatan, is not.
 
zaffiroborant said:
Brings to mind the concept of grooming. About the only thing more revolting is the person who had a family history of polygamy involving a mother and her daughters the guy boinked them all. That is utterly sick.
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That would be Joseph Smith, who married mother and daughter, in more than one instance.
 
Fatboys said:
If God commands it, then it is right. If he does not command it or it has been removed then it is wrong to live it.
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God didn’t command polygamy.
And LDS are followers of Christ. Anyone who follows Christ is a christian.
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Mormons follow an idea they have about Christ, but it isn’t Christ who you follow. Smith built a false God.

I do think LDS have a desire to follow Jesus, they just don’t have any idea who He is. To begin with, Jesus isn’t a god among many gods, including the potential godhood of yourself. Jesus is God.
I have spent many many years debating what I believe with anti mormons. Paul’s warning is a good one. And if you want me to go down step by step and show biblically how the foundation of the church Christ built was restored I will… But that is not why I am here. I believe that any thing good is of God.
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There was nothing to restore.
 
IF, and that’s a big If…polygamy was commanded by God, why did JS practice it for 5 years before it became “revelation”?

Which by the way happened to coincide with Emma catching him messing around.

I am amazed that the coincidental timing of many mormon revelations in the context of the current events of the time. 🤷
 
robwar said:
Yes, there was polygamy in the OT times and it is recorded in the Bible with a number of different OT characters.
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There ya go. So much for “traditional marriage”. It all depends on how far back one goes. What is marriage has changed over the course of time.
 
In the ancient Christian liturgies…note liturgies that have the same form and structure as today…that the Christians would profess vows…not to lie, steal or commit adultery.

One husband and one wife were the norm at the beginning of Christianity. It is Christ Himself…we married to Christ as well as to each other, Who sustains the marriage so that in time, the spouses encounter Christ with each other.

That is also a foretaste of heaven…Christ the Groom united with His Bride, the Church.
 
Well not everyone on earth believes in the Son of God. Or others who do, might not agree with your church’s or another faith’s interpretation of Scripture. But in Matt 19 when He answered a question of the Pharisees, He spoke of man and woman. But then in the same chapter when responding to His disciples, Jesus said not everyone can accept this, accept it who can. The Pharisees or disciples had not asked about polygamy or for that matter whether SS marriage was always outside the traditional marriage covenant. On the latter Jesus said very little. The Apostle Paul had some things to say. Including that people should have relations which come natural to them.
 
KathleenGee said:
In the ancient Christian liturgies…note liturgies that have the same form and structure as today…that the Christians would profess vows…not to lie, steal or commit adultery.

One husband and one wife were the norm at the beginning of Christianity. It is Christ Himself…we married to Christ as well as to each other, Who sustains the marriage so that in time, the spouses encounter Christ with each other.

That is also a foretaste of heaven…Christ the Groom united with His Bride, the Church.
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This is not correct. Augustus spoke about it and suggested that polygamy was not right, but it was lived by early Christians. I think it was pope Benedict VIII Banned it in 1134… Before that time it was legal to not only have wives but mistresses. This is what the history calls them but I would rather use the word concubines, which is a lesser wife. If a person is married to more than one wife, it is not considered adultery.
 
RebeccaJ said:
God didn’t command polygamy.

Mormons follow an idea they have about Christ, but it isn’t Christ who you follow. Smith built a false God.

I do think LDS have a desire to follow Jesus, they just don’t have any idea who He is. To begin with, Jesus isn’t a god among many gods, including the potential godhood of yourself. Jesus is God.

There was nothing to restore.
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I’m sorry you feel that way. I disagree. I know that Joseph Smith is a prophet of God. I know this because I asked the author of all truth, God. Through the power of the Holy Ghost God has revealed to me that a restoration has taken place. I am not some kind of a nut, although if you ask the kids on the bus I drive they would disagree with me. I am just a normal guy.
 
Fatboys said:
I’m sorry you feel that way. I disagree. I know that Joseph Smith is a prophet of God. I know this because I asked the author of all truth, God. Through the power of the Holy Ghost God has revealed to me that a restoration has taken place. I am not some kind of a nut, although if you ask the kids on the bus I drive they would disagree with me. I am just a normal guy.
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Just to clarify, are you saying that God talks directly to you?
 
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