Catholic response to James Kennedy’s EE?

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This may help my explanation:

St. Therese used to say that, when she gets to heaven she will spend all her time there doing good here on earth.

I plan on doing the same thing - I want to spend all my time in heaven doing good for people here.

Exactly when that will be, I will leave up to Christ.
 
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LSK:
I hope I don’t sound like I am dodging your question…
If I were an Evangelical Protestant, I would say that you are dodging the question! 😉

Does any good work that you do, even good works aided by grace, merit for you eternal life?
 
I would answer, 'Yes", because my faith without works is dead, as taught by both the Church and in Holy Scripture.

HOWEVER, I don’t think we can just do good works and expect to be rewarded with eternal salvation. There needs to be a flow between the two, so that “They shall know we are Christians by our Love”.

Matt- what has your experience taught you which you think would be the ‘right’ answer to these kind of questions?
 
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Matt16_18:
So your answer is to blow them off because they aren’t worth the effort to talk to. :rolleyes:

I could say that same thing about the Jehovah Witnesses and the Mormons that show up at my door. If I have time, I always invite these street evangelists into my house, make them comfortable, and try to engage them in an honest discussion. I also know that they are working from scripts and they are carrying around a lot of assumptions about what the “correct answers” are. Of course they do this, or they wouldn’t be out on the street knocking on doors trying to win members to their sects! I simply pray for the Holy Spirit to give me the words to say, bind any demonic forces that would disrupt the conversation, and witness to the truth. I pray that I may be the instrument that God uses to plant a seed that is harvested some time later.Always be prepared to make a defense to any one who calls you to account for the hope that is in you, yet do it with gentleness and reverence
1Peter 3:15
We were talking in the context of being accosted in the mall or grocery store not on our doorstep. I have talked to JW’s and Mormon’s at my door, but there are times, if I am too busy, when I simply tell them I am Catholic by choice and have no interest in their message with the follow up that they look into the true history of Christianity without bias and they will see the Catholic Church is and was the Church founded by Christ.

I didn’t say I never talk to them, but I don’t let them attack me on the streets with their made up idiotic questions as if I were required to answer them no matter how inconvenient to me. Rude behavior ought not to be encouraged just because they think they need to get one more soul saved according to their formulations. If I thought I had to answer every asinine question ever put out there by anti-Catholics I’d be doing nothing but that 27/7, which I do not believe is required of us.
 
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Della:
I didn’t say I never talk to them, but I don’t let them attack me on the streets with their made up idiotic questions as if I were required to answer them no matter how inconvenient to me. Rude behavior ought not to be encouraged just because they think they need to get one more soul saved according to their formulations.
I agree. 🙂 I am not saying that Catholics must drop everything whenever they bump into a street evangelist!

I can honestly say that not everyone that I have ever met that has asked me these questions has been rude or annoying. Some sincerely seemed to be concerned about my soul. And I haven’t always been asked the EE questions in the context of street evangelization either. These same questions (or slight variations of them) are constantly raised by Protestants posting to this board. I think that they are worth discussing, and that they are not as “simple” as some people seem to think.

You have said that you are familiar with these questions because of your membership in the AoG. That gives you a unique insight that I sincerely wish you would share.

What are the “correct answers” that a member of the AoG would expect?

Now that you are a Catholic, what do you see wrong with the AoG’s “correct answers”?
 
Here is something to make you scratch your head. I did a search on James Kennedy ee Catholics. This site comes up. It is critical of James Kennedy for being too friendly to Catholics!

wayoflife.org/fbns/ecum-djameskennedy.html

This is a pretty anti Catholic site, so be forewarned.
 
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Matt16_18:
James Kennedy’s “Evangelical Explosion” (EE) trains Evangelical Protestants to proselytize Catholics with these questions:“Suppose that you were to die tonight and stand before God and he were to say to you, ‘Why should I let you into my heaven?’ What would you say?”

And

“I would be interested in what you think the entrance requirements for anyone to get into heaven are. What would you say God’s requirements are for you to get into heaven?”
What would you say is the correct Catholic response to these questions?
I dont expect to be interrogated, I expect to be judged. The time for talk will have ended.

Phil
 
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Philthy:
I dont expect to be interrogated, I expect to be judged.
If your judgement involved giving honest answers to the questions asked, what answers would you give to God?
 
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deb1:
Here is something to make you scratch your head. I did a search on James Kennedy ee Catholics. This site comes up. It is critical of James Kennedy for being too friendly to Catholics!

wayoflife.org/fbns/ecum-djameskennedy.html
Interesting link. 👍 It shows the “correct" answers that antinomian Evangelical Protestants expect for the EE questions, and why they are outraged that Catholics could even think that they understand how man is saved:
To illustrate the duplicity of the Catholics in using Evangelism Explosion material, we quote from an interview … with Catholic Keith Fournier …“ …some of the early planning of our program had a lot to do with a Catholic parish that had James Kennedy’s program … The gospel is the gospel and everybody knows what the basic gospel truth is … denominational differences [are] in the follow-up … there were a couple of things in James Kennedy’s process that we as Catholics couldn’t accept because it wasn’t Catholic teaching. For example, too obvious was the total assurance of salvation … and the other one is salvation by faith alone. For Catholics we are saved by faith and also through obedience to Christ. We don’t earn our salvation but we believe that there are acts of obedience and cooperation in God’s spirit that are tied up with salvation.”Do you see the tremendous deception in this? Fournier says the gospel is the gospel, implying that we are all preaching the same basic gospel, yet he goes on to deny the very heart of the gospel, which is salvation through the grace of Christ alone by His blood alone without works or sacraments. He would call this difference merely a matter of “interpretation,” but to add any kind of works to Christ’s grace is a matter of heresy and blasphemy, and brings God’s curse upon anyone who preaches it (Gal. 1:8-10).
Fournier says “we are saved by faith AND ALSO through obedience to Christ,” yet he claims he doesn’t believe in earning salvation. This is Jesuit sophistry at its diabolic best.
What does it mean to say that we are saved by faith alone, and that it is diabolical heresy to say that we are NOT “saved by faith AND ALSO through obedience to Christ”? Apparently it means that a man can be saved by faith and disobedience to Christ! Non-Lordship Salvation. :rolleyes:

So how do Catholics avoid diabolical Jesuit sophistry when they explain that Catholics don’t believe that we earn our salvation through good works and obedience to Christ?
 
My apologies for entering this debate rather belatedly. I couldn’t help noticing that many participants refer to being “saved by faith.” Matt16_18 has rightly redirected many such responses towards God’s grace as our source and hope for salvation rather than our faith. In my experience as a former Evangelical, I think that many Christians (even Evangelicals and Fundamentalists) still think that our faith has the ability to save us. I hope the following anecdote may help illustrate how this is not the case:

A few years back as I attended a large Baptist worship service the pastor asked members of the congregation to raise their hands if they think that they are saved by their faith. A few of them did, including the pastor’s wife who was sitting directly behind the pulpit. Not knowing that his wife had done this, the pastor in no uncertain terms let those who raised their hands know that they were wrong and may be jeopardizing their hopes for salvation. The confusion, he explained, may be due to that several passages in the gospel quote Christ telling others that their faith has saved them.

Unlike his wife’s, the pastor’s theology regarding salvation by faith vs. grace is more in keeping with Catholic teaching. In every instance that Christ made such proclamations, each of his recipients were being saved from some sort of temporal condition, but never from their sins. The paralytic, the blind, the demoniac, the hemophiliac: all of them were saved from their ailments upon finding faith in Christ. Keeping this in mind, one can see how apart from knowing the context of these verses one can be confused about how one is actually being “saved” for eternity and prepared for the Final Judgment.

Grace is the only basis for our salvation. Faith, along with works, justifies us before God, is a gift of grace, and is a mark of our salvation. Therefore, they are said to be “salvific,” but never “saving.” If one has received God’s saving grace, then one would also be filled with faith.

Also keep in mind that our salvation is tenuous until we die. We all have the ability to squander our gift of faith by not allowing it to grow, develop and crystallize. So we can never say that our salvation is secure as many Evangelicals do. But a person can be reasonably sure that he is on the right path to heaven as he evaluates daily the progress of his faith journey. This is called by the Catholic Church as a having “moral assurance of salvation,” and what St. Paul simply calls “hope.”

I’ve heard the original question proposed to me in this way: “When you die, how do you know that you will go to heaven?” to which my response would be: “I don’t.” That’s because I don’t know whether I will still be under God’s grace by that time.

However, if I were asked the original question in this thread: "Suppose that you were to die tonight…" (emphasis mine), then having a reasonable and present sense of my current state of faith, my response would be “only by God’s grace as given by Christ on the cross can I have any hope of being received into heaven.”

I hope this helps to clear things up.

In Christ,
Mike
 
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trustmc:
In every instance that Christ made such proclamations, each of his recipients were being saved from some sort of temporal condition, but never from their sins.
And when Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralytic, “My son, your sins are forgiven.”
Mark 2:5
I couldn’t help noticing that many participants refer to being “saved by faith.”
Here are some some analogous questions that I hope shed some light on the EE questions, and the response “I should be allowed into heaven because of my faith”.

Let us suppose that you are a convicted prisoner standing before a parole board, and the parole board asks you, “Why should you be let you free?” Certainly the correct response involves repentance and contrition for the crimes one has committed. This is a question involving both justice and mercy. It is right and just that you are in prison, but you are being asked, “ Why should the parole board be merciful?” The correct answer is, “Because I have repented of my criminal ways. I have kept my nose clean while I was in prison. Please show me mercy and I will be good from now on.”

The analogy can be made that we are like condemned prisoners standing before God, and God is asking us why he should show us mercy. But in the prisoner analogy, the prisoner is only desiring to return to world that he knew before he went to prison, so this analogy has its defects, since heaven is not anything we have ever known.

Suppose instead, that you were working for Microsoft and Bill Gates walked up to you and said, “Why should I give you a billion dollars?” What is the correct response to that question? Bill Gates’ question does not involve justice, but only unbelievable generosity. Your response might be, “I don’t know why should you give me a billion dollars. I would certainly be very grateful if you did, but I surely can’t think of anything I ever did that would merit such undeserved generosity.”

Heaven is a gift from God that is far, far more valuable than a billion dollars. The good works that we do are often only works that justice requires that we do anyway. We don’t expect a bonus of a billion dollars from the boss just because we did what we were supposed to do at work.

It seem to me that because Heaven is such a tremendously great gift from God, that to think that any work that I could ever do would merit for me the gift of heaven is presumptuous, to say the least. If God said to me, “Why should I let you into my heaven,” my response would be, “I don’t know why anyone should love me that much”.

I am like the guilty prisoner that deserves prison, but is being offered not just a release from prison by the parole board – I am the guilty convict being given an offer to live with the King of the Universe as his own beloved son. There is no justice involved in letting me, a guilty criminal, into heaven. Such an unmerited gift is only offered to me because of the unreasonable and unfathomable love of God. To say that God should let me into heaven because of my faith seems to me like a crazy thing to say to God.
 
Suppose that you were to die tonight and stand before God and he were to say to you, ‘Why should I let you into my heaven?’ What would you say?
“Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.”
I would be interested in what you think the entrance requirements for anyone to get into heaven are. What would you say God’s requirements are for you to get into heaven?
That you ask Jesus to remember you- and you remember Him.
 
Matt16_18 offers a very good analogy that I hope to use in future opportunities. Thanks for the explanation.

And thanks too for pointing out the following verse:
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Matt16_18:
And when Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralytic, “My son, your sins are forgiven.”
Mark 2:5
I could very well be wrong abou this, but reading this verse in context actually lends itself to what I said in my previous post. Consider Mark 2:3-12:
And they came, bringing to Him a paralytic, 4
Being unable to get to Him because of the crowd, they removed the roof above Him; and when they had dug an opening, they let down the pallet on which the paralytic was lying. carried by four men. 5 And Jesus seeing their faith said to the paralytic, “Son, your sins are forgiven.” 6 But some of the scribes were sitting there and reasoning in their hearts, 7 “Why does this man speak that way? He is blaspheming; who can forgive sins but God alone?” 8 Immediately Jesus, aware in His spirit that they were reasoning that way within themselves, said to them, "Why are you reasoning about these things in your hearts? 9 "Which is easier, to say to the paralytic, Your sins are forgiven'; or to say, Get up, and pick up your pallet and walk’? 10 “But so that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins”–He said to the paralytic, 11 “I say to you, get up, pick up your pallet and go home.” 12 And he got up and immediately picked up the pallet and went out in the sight of everyone, so that they were all amazed and were glorifying God, saying, “We have never seen anything like this.”
At first glance, it may appear that it was because of the faith of the men who brought the paralytic that his sins were forgiven. However, “seeing their faith” does not mean “because of their faith.” As stated before, faith and works are marks of our salvation, or in other words, that we are in a state of grace. In the above example, Christ either observes the fruits of the men’s faith, or can see into their hearts and know that their faith is genuine. Either way, he is able to declare that the paralytic’s sins are forgiven, and not necessarily because of their faith but rather because Christ is free to dispense his grace as he sees fit.

Notice, too, that the forgiveness was limited to only the paralytic and not the men who actually did the heavy lifting so to speak. Why is this when Jesus clearly pointed out “their faith” in reference to the rest of the men? The reason for this may be because of the more pressing point that needed to be made, particularly in the company of the Jewish scribes who understood that only God can forgive sins. Christ’s primary intent here is to make a very public and phenomenal claim to being God. Saying “I forgive your sins” as a Jew is the same as saying “I am God.” To further prove his claim, Christ challenges the scribes with a follow up question and then proceeds to heal the paralytic – a miracle that only God can do.

The final point here is to remember to read all bible verses in context to better understand their meaning. Otherwise, one risks the possibility of promulgating error as the fundamentalists do.

Mike
 
m134e5 said:
“Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.”

That you ask Jesus to remember you- and you remember Him.

On Christ the solid Rock I stand, all other ground is sinking sand.
 
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Matt16_18:
James Kennedy’s “Evangelical Explosion” (EE) trains Evangelical Protestants to proselytize Catholics with these questions:“Suppose that you were to die tonight and stand before God and he were to say to you, ‘Why should I let you into my heaven?’ What would you say?”

And

“I would be interested in what you think the entrance requirements for anyone to get into heaven are. What would you say God’s requirements are for you to get into heaven?”
What would you say is the correct Catholic response to these questions?
I would say that there is no reason that God should allow me into heaven because I am sinfull and do not deserve it because I have rejected Him. But, I desire with all my being to be filled with the Love of God(both senses of the statement).
For the second answer, the one requirement is love. If you love God with all your heart, all your mind, all your soul, and all your strength you will recieve communion with God. If you do not love God, then you will not recieve communion with Him.
 
“Suppose that you were to die tonight and stand before God and he were to say to you, ‘Why should I let you into my heaven?’ What would you say?”

I don’t deserve heaven, but for some mysterious reason you sent your Son to die for me so that I can have eternal life. I place all my hope and trust in Him and your mercy. Do with me as you will.

And

“I would be interested in what you think the entrance requirements for anyone to get into heaven are. What would you say God’s requirements are for you to get into heaven?”

This one I find more difficult to answer, since the mercy of God is far-reaching. I do believe some, perhaps many, go to Hell, but that no one goes to heaven who has not been purified. Therefore, purgatory. Jesus said, “If you love me, keep my commandments.” Jesus encounters us to show us the way we should live, but knowing that all will struggle.

What is mysterious to me is what difference there will be, if any, between a person who accepts many crosses in his life for love of God and who bears much fruit, and one who accepts perhaps a few, but rejects many crosses as well, and is not as fruitful as he could’ve been. In other words, how important is it to not only live our lives for love of God, but to live it well?
 
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Matt16_18:
James Kennedy’s “Evangelical Explosion” (EE) trains Evangelical Protestants to proselytize Catholics with these questions:“Suppose that you were to die tonight and stand before God and he were to say to you, ‘Why should I let you into my heaven?’ What would you say?”

And

“I would be interested in what you think the entrance requirements for anyone to get into heaven are. What would you say God’s requirements are for you to get into heaven?” What would you say is the correct Catholic response to these questions?
I would say;
**“I no longer deserve to be called your son, …Treat me like one of your hired hands …” **

That is…if I could think and talk with a clear mind, …from trying to compose myself due to the overwhelming awesomeness of His Glory ! 😃

To the requirements
I would say; …(quoting Him)
"No one can come to me unless the Father DRAWS him…"
and
"All who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God."

gusano
 
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Matt16_18:
James Kennedy’s “Evangelical Explosion” (EE) trains Evangelical Protestants to proselytize Catholics with these questions:“Suppose that you were to die tonight and stand before God and he were to say to you, ‘Why should I let you into my heaven?’ What would you say?”

And

“I would be interested in what you think the entrance requirements for anyone to get into heaven are. What would you say God’s requirements are for you to get into heaven?”
What would you say is the correct Catholic response to these questions?
After these questions, they say …

“May I share with you how I came to know that I have eternal life?”
Then EE shares the following verse …

These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. 1 John 5:13
 
“Suppose that you were to die tonight and stand before God and he were to say to you, ‘Why should I let you into my heaven?’ What would you say?”
*What I would say: **“God, I plead for pardon and mercy because I understand I have done nothing of myself whereby I deserve to enter heaven. Therefore, I hide myself within the wounds of Jesus, my Savior and my God. I humbly trust in the promise that the blood and water that Jesus has shed during his sorrowful passion on the cross was for me, a miserable sinner, so that I may enter into your Kingdom. Be merciful, oh God, don’t look upon my sins but on the merits that Jesus has gained for me through the shedding of his blood. ***
*Then all I can do is hope for God to be merciful. I would continue praying: **Lord, Jesus Christ, I place all my trust in Thee!
**

And

“I would be interested in what you think the entrance requirements for anyone to get into heaven are. What would you say God’s requirements are for you to get into heaven?”*
***“Whoever humbles himself as a little child, he is the greatest in the Kingdom of Heaven.” ***

“He who does the will of the Father in heaven will enter into the kingdom of heaven.”

  • A good child will humbly listen, trust and obey his parents. A follower of Christ has to do the same. Only this time Christ’s (authentic) church takes the place of parents. Subject yourself to this parent.*

“He who will abide in Me, I will abide in him.”

God bless you all.
 
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