Catholic school changing tradition: "In the name of the Creator, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit"

[monika1]

I am currently in grade 12 so I’m not any theologian who knows a lot about Catholicism but i am still learning, however, i know that tradition is important especially in today’s world where everyone wants change. I attend a catholic all girls school and i moved to that school in grade 10 and something that stood out to me was how they said the sign of the cross. I attend church every Sunday so i know that it is supposed to be ‘In the name Father, the son and the holy spirit’, however, they say ‘In the name of the creator, Jesus and the holy spirit’. I find this a bit alarming seeing as in today’s society gender is becoming fluid and even ‘non-existent’ which is linked to how we are growing apart from Jesus and close to the devil because the devil has no gender. I want to ask why but i doubt they would change it based off of me because i doubt any one else has any problem with this seeing as it hasn’t changed. I don’t know about this school anymore because they say they are catholic but in religion class they teach about scepticism (is truth even real? for e.g.) rather than actual truths which has more damaging effects for students than teaching actual truths. Any suggestion for what i should do ?

 

[27lw]

Oh dear! May I ask what country you live in? This is concerning to me. Have you talked to your parents about this?

 

[AlNg]

however, they say ‘In the name of the creator, Jesus and the holy spirit’.

i don’t know why Catholic schools are now changing Catholic teaching. Could this be one reason why some Catholics are attending churches and schools of the SSPX which only says the Tridentine Latin Mass? In my bible it is written that Jesus prayed: Our Father who art in heaven. He also said to his disciples to go forth and teach all nations baptizing them in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. There are also some Catholic colleges which are reported to have off beat teachings. AFAIK the Russian Orthodox church seems more to keep to the older traditions.

 

[monika1]

Hello, i live in Australia. It is very saddening to me too so i told my mum who raised me as catholic but she told me not to worry as I only have to endure it for another few months and to keep to the traditional version. However, there is just something inside me that is telling me it isn’t right to let it continue. I just thought i would get some opinions on it. I greatly appreciate your reply

 

[Vico]

I am currently in grade 12 so I’m not any theologian who knows a lot about Catholicism but i am still learning, however, i know that tradition is important especially in today’s world where everyone wants change. I attend a catholic all girls school and i moved to that school in grade 10 and something that stood out to me was how they said the sign of the cross. I attend church every Sunday so i know that it is supposed to be ‘In the name Father, the son and the holy spirit’, however, they say ‘In the name of the creator, Jesus and the holy spirit’. I find this a bit alarming seeing as in today’s society gender is becoming fluid and even ‘non-existent’ which is linked to how we are growing apart from Jesus and close to the devil because the devil has no gender. I want to ask why but i doubt they would change it based off of me because i doubt any one else has any problem with this seeing as it hasn’t changed. I don’t know about this school anymore because they say they are catholic but in religion class they teach about scepticism (is truth even real? for e.g.) rather than actual truths which has more damaging effects for students than teaching actual truths. Any suggestion for what i should do ?

This was addressed by the Catholic Church in 2008, regarding validity of Baptism:

… substituting other names for Father and Son undermines our faith in the Trinity. …

The trinitarian faith is not adequately expressed when the three divine Persons are designated by names common to the three, while attributing by appropriation each individual name to a Person. And this is what happens in the formulas considered by the Response. All three divine Persons are Creator, Sanctifier, Liberator, and Sustainer. “The whole divine economy is the common work of the three divine Persons. For as the Trinity has only one and the same nature, so too does it have only one and the same operation.”[21] Redemption is also the work of the entire Trinity as its first cause even though the name Redeemer is proper to Christ as man because, in his humanity, he suffered and died on the Cross.[22]

http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/c...oc_20080201_validity-baptism-miralles_en.html

https://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/..._cfaith_doc_20080201_validity-baptism_en.html

The first question addressed to which the answer was negative is:

First question: Whether the Baptism conferred with the formulas « I baptize you in the name of the Creator, and of the Redeemer, and of the Sanctifier» and « I baptize you in the name of the Creator, and of the Liberator, and of the Sustainer» is valid?

 

[Irishmom2]

OP, while I agree with your mother to just wait it out and continue to say what you would normally say, I am wondering if you have ever asked any of your teachers why they are not saying “Father, Son and Holy Spirit?” If so, what was their response? If you have not asked, perhaps you could ask someone.

 

[Bithynian]

I only have to endure it for another few months

I agree. It’s almost halfway through the academic year, and I’m not sure the cost-benefit ratio is sufficient enough to enter into a protracted dispute with the teaching staff.

(In case it is different in the US: in Australia’s educational system, year 12 is the final year of high school, after which students can go onto university.)

 

[HomeschoolDad]

I am currently in grade 12 so I’m not any theologian who knows a lot about Catholicism but i am still learning, however, i know that tradition is important especially in today’s world where everyone wants change. I attend a catholic all girls school and i moved to that school in grade 10 and something that stood out to me was how they said the sign of the cross. I attend church every Sunday so i know that it is supposed to be ‘In the name Father, the son and the holy spirit’, however, they say ‘In the name of the creator, Jesus and the holy spirit’. I find this a bit alarming seeing as in today’s society gender is becoming fluid and even ‘non-existent’ which is linked to how we are growing apart from Jesus and close to the devil because the devil has no gender. I want to ask why but i doubt they would change it based off of me because i doubt any one else has any problem with this seeing as it hasn’t changed. I don’t know about this school anymore because they say they are catholic but in religion class they teach about scepticism (is truth even real? for e.g.) rather than actual truths which has more damaging effects for students than teaching actual truths. Any suggestion for what i should do ?

Stick to Catholic tradition, and do not accept any of this nonsense. You are right and they are wrong. Follow the traditional practices. What the priest and the other students do at Mass is not your problem, it is theirs.

If Australian education works like that in the US, you are in the last few weeks of high school. Just ride it out, get your diploma, and move on to bigger and better things.

If you live near the Traditional Latin Mass, consider going to it.

FSSP | District of Oceania

https://fssp.net/houses.html

 

[Genesis315]

This is usually motivated by gender nonsense where referring to God in masculine terms is considered sexist or something.

But one of the important parts of being a Christian is that through Christ and the Holy Spirit we can know God as more than creator, but also as a Father and call out to Him as such.

Romans 8:14 For those who are led by the Spirit of God are children of God. 15 For you did not receive a spirit of slavery to fall back into fear, but you received a spirit of adoption, through which we cry, “Abba, Father!”16 The Spirit itself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God, 17 and if children, then heirs, heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ, if only we suffer with him so that we may also be glorified with him.

Galatians 4:4 But when the fullness of time had come, God sent his Son, born of a woman, born under the law, 5 to ransom those under the law, so that we might receive adoption. 6 As proof that you are children, God sent the spirit of his Son into our hearts, crying out, “Abba, Father!” 7 So you are no longer a slave but a child, and if a child then also an heir, through God.

Choosing not to acknowledge God as Father seems to imply the Holy Spirit is not dwelling in one’s heart and one is not an adopted child or heir of God. Not good!

 

[27lw]

If you’re almost done, then you can “make a mess” (in the words of our Holy Father) after you graduate!

 

[IanM]

https://fssp.net/houses.html

and here are a few more:

https://www.latinmassdir.org/country/au/

 

[phil19034]

This is a shame, and is heresy.

Personally, I would start collecting signatures from other students to ask the school to stop this heresy and return to the Trinity.

 

[HomeschoolDad]

If you’re almost done, then you can “make a mess” (in the words of our Holy Father) after you graduate!

I respectfully disagree with the Holy Father, and I respectfully disagreed with him at the time, that “making a mess” is a good idea where the Church is concerned.

This is commonly employed even in the secular world, where the “new boss” comes in and starts shaking things up, not for any good reason, but just to put people off-balance, to make a lot of work for people, and to break up existing structures and synergies. More often than not, “things are the way they’ve always been” because those things have been proven to work. Secular bosses who do this are very much disliked by their subordinates. I’ve seen it and experienced it myself.

Traditionally, Popes saw themselves much more as caretakers and custodians of what they received from previous generations, than as innovators and change agents.

 

[27lw]

Yeah well, in this case the Catholic school is the irritator and change agent!
I wonder if the bishop knows this is being promulgated in Catholic school?

 

[Dovekin]

I don’t know about this school anymore because they say they are catholic but in religion class they teach about scepticism (is truth even real? for e.g.)

Personally, I think it is important to consider philosophical questions like this. They are the foundation for a secure faith.

Anyway, if they are teaching you to be skeptical, then do it. Ask about their sign of the cross. Why not use the baptismal formula? The sign of the cross is not just an invocation of the cross, it also recalls our baptism by using the same words used at baptism.

You do not have to be confrontational about it. It would be good to hear their explanation before making any decisions about whether they are right or wrond.

 

[Genesis315]

Personally, I think it is important to consider philosophical questions like this. They are the foundation for a secure faith.

I agree, but it shouldn’t just be “here’s what skepticism is” but also include why and how skepticism is wrong. Here’s an example from the Church:

Fifth Lateran Council

Moreover we strictly enjoin on each and every philosopher who teaches publicly in the universities or elsewhere, that when they explain or address to their audience the principles or conclusions of philosophers, where these are known to deviate from the true faith — as in the assertion of the soul’s mortality or of there being only one soul or of the eternity of the world and other topics of this kind — they are obliged to devote their every effort to clarify for their listeners the truth of the christian religion, to teach it by convincing arguments, so far as this is possible, and to apply themselves to the full extent of their energies to refuting and disposing of the philosophers’ opposing arguments, since all the solutions are available.

 

[Dovekin]

I agree with most of what you quote. I just think that people need to learn when it is right to be skeptical and when it is not. The Church is skeptical of private revelations, of new interpretations of Scripture, etc. it is an important part of affirming faith to know you are making a choice to believe.

 

[phil19034]

Yeah well, in this case the Catholic school is the irritator and change agent!
I wonder if the bishop knows this is being promulgated in Catholic school?

As a parent, I would be calling the bishop ASAP.

 

[HomeschoolDad]

Yeah well, in this case the Catholic school is the irritator and change agent!
I wonder if the bishop knows this is being promulgated in Catholic school?

The bishop may be well aware.

One thing I have noticed about the various “progressive” social movements of the past 50-odd years, is that they dearly love the whole notion of change, fluidity, and everything being in the present moment and subject to massive, unforeseen, unwanted change at any moment. They lampoon people who don’t like this — “who moved my cheese?”.

Traditional and time-honored, proven practices exist for a reason. Many times, things are best left alone. I like at least an attenuated version of the Amish approach to new things — “Will it help us? Do we need it? Will it do harm? Will it benefit us as a community? Or will it work to the community’s detriment? What does it give us, that we do not already have? Will it have repercussions that perhaps we can’t foresee right now?”. And so on.

(And keep in mind that whenever something changes in an organization or a social structure, someone makes money off it, someone has work to do, someone has a job. Just something to consider.)

 

[phil19034]

Do you know if your school is diocesan or founded/ran by a religious order (like a group of sisters)?