Catholic School Uniforms Questions

[MissRose73]

Are you sure they were wearing actual “skirts” and not “skorts”? Skorts tend to be shorter.

Even from a distance, I could tell they were definitely wearing skirts especially when some of them were doing some of ministry like reading a reading or with Communion distribution. I’ve own skorts in the past, and mine have reached my knees as I don’t wish to display my large thighs bare.

 

[PatriceA]

Even from a distance, I could tell they were definitely wearing skirts especially when some of them were doing some of ministry like reading a reading or with Communion distribution. I’ve own skorts in the past, and mine have reached my knees as I don’t wish to display my large thighs bare.

I’m just going by what my daughter use to wear for Catholic school, and the skorts were pretty short. But she wore them with opaque stockings and leggings, no bare legs. I’d rather that she wore the stockings and the leggings than any skirt to be honest.

I just would be cautious to not presume too much if you are not 100% absolute certain there is a case to be upset about the school uniforms. It may appear something immodest is going on, or there could be a ton of presuming as well.

 

[Gearoidin]

It’s been quite a while since I left secondary school. We had a school policy about skirt length but we rolled them up using a belt to keep the pleats lined up. Since I left the skirts got shorter and shorter till a few years back the school gave up and brought in dress pants for girls. It solved the problem with skirt lengths.

 

[Irishmom2]

I suggest penning a note to the parish and school and let you know what you observed.

I was told to just worry about what my own child was wearing when I said something to the school. And my daughter wore her skirt by the schools guidelines, by the way.

But I would think a parent would notice that their daughter’s skirt for Catholic school was too short, and get her the next size and/or length of skirt if she did indeed go through a growth spurt.

I do not ask the teachers to be the clothing police but they should notice if a skirt is too high, and find out either if its the rolling up thing or a growth spurt in a private setting, and deal with it based on their findings.

Sometimes the parents are involved in the length of the skirt–they are the ones that took the uniform to the tailor and had the hem shortened! They say they think it looks cute…

A teacher at our school gave out many many 'demerits" one day at school. In stead of backing the teacher for saying something, the school told the teacher to stop saying anything. Why? too many parents were calling the school to complain because their sweet, perfect child’s skirt was noticed and why not go after someone or something else? There were also a lot of threats made to leave the school by the parents if they didn’t leave their child alone.

Some girls probably always have and some always will roll their skirts.

When a staff person mentions it, the staff person can be accused of harassment, because, as one poster already mentioned, the students can accuse staff of looking at the skirt area. So, ideally, the parents should be the ones saying something; however, a student can walk out of the house perfectly in uniform, but roll immediately upon arrival at school.

Nope. they get to school that way. They walk through the parking lot and into the school with their shirts hanging out and skirts as short as a cheerleader.

What is wrong with the school for not enforcing their own rules?

And incidentally, some of the girls do not have the legs I even want to see so much of. Heaven forbid they have to bend over in school…

[/QUOTE]

 

[TheRealJuliane]

I have gone through this for almost 8 years now. The nun who is in charge of the girls’ high school (next door to the boys’ Jesuit school) is very lax in this department. Their skirts are pleated, which lends itself to looking too short in any case, and as far as I can tell, as long as they actually are wearing the plaid skirt, they are not going to get an infraction. Some of them look pretty slutty, really. Skirts seem like they are at least 3-4" above the knee.

It comes from the administration. Even at our boys’ school, the Jesuit brother who was the enforcer of dress code has changed his duties and I see many boys WAY out of haircut compliance now. It has to be someone’s job and if it isn’t…well…

 

[Dakota_Roberts]

I have gone through this for almost 8 years now. The nun who is in charge of the girls’ high school (next door to the boys’ Jesuit school) is very lax in this department. Their skirts are pleated, which lends itself to looking too short in any case, and as far as I can tell, as long as they actually are wearing the plaid skirt, they are not going to get an infraction. Some of them look pretty slutty, really. Skirts seem like they are at least 3-4" above the knee.

It comes from the administration. Even at our boys’ school, the Jesuit brother who was the enforcer of dress code has changed his duties and I see many boys WAY out of haircut compliance now. It has to be someone’s job and if it isn’t…well…

“Catholic schoolgirl” look is now a fetish, I think that says a lot.

 

[MissRose73]

The haircuts of boys tended not to be at issue at this school from the young men that were there. It was many of the girls with the short skirts that could have been causing the male students possible occasions of sin with their short skirts that if some bent over to pick up a missalette they dropped, you would know the type and color of underwear they were wearing.

 

[Corki]

I have gone through this for almost 8 years now. The nun who is in charge of the girls’ high school (next door to the boys’ Jesuit school) is very lax in this department. Their skirts are pleated, which lends itself to looking too short in any case, and as far as I can tell, as long as they actually are wearing the plaid skirt, they are not going to get an infraction. Some of them look pretty slutty, really. Skirts seem like they are at least 3-4" above the knee.

It comes from the administration. Even at our boys’ school, the Jesuit brother who was the enforcer of dress code has changed his duties and I see many boys WAY out of haircut compliance now. It has to be someone’s job and if it isn’t…well…

I think I know the school you are referring to! LOL If I have it right, even with the hair problems, the boys seem to do a better job with just a “dress code” than the girls do with a full uniform requirement.

At my kids school, they have a video newscast every day. A few years ago, the news crew went out and filmed students (no faces) as a reminder that they don’t always look to others as they think they do. It helped for a while.

 

[pentecostbaby]

Are you somehow proud of this exchange?

What is so wrong with following these rules? Why is it that girls want to display as much of their bodies as they can get away with?

\

I was fifteen . I’m now double that and with baby #2 on the way. I was trying to illustrate the problems with having male teachers police skirt length. Really, they ought to go to khakis.

 

[StJudePray4Me]

\

I was fifteen . I’m now double that and with baby #2 on the way. I was trying to illustrate** the problems with having male teachers police skirt length.** Really, they ought to go to khakis.

Are you saying that you think male teachers should not police skirt length? Or are you just making an observation?

When I was in high school in the 80s, we wore our skirts fairly short (we rolled them up). One of the Sisters used to stand in the hallway with a ruler at the change of classes. She would call over those of us whose skirts were too short, measure, and then hand out detentions appropriately. We thought she was so nasty…and then, much later, I found out that she did this partly on BEHALF of the few male teachers we had. It was an all-girls’ school, and the few men teaching there had mentioned in faculty meetings that they felt uncomfortable with how short the skirts were being worn.

I think male teachers have the right to insist that girls adhere to modesty standards. It is tragic to me that our society would encourage that the offender “turn it around” on him, like “Are you looking at my body???” Well – of course he looked at you – you are in his classroom! And for the record, looking is not necessarily leering. Observing that a girl is wearing a too-short skirt is not the same as lusting after her!

 

[Serap]

In Canada many schools are now enforcing that girls also wear pants as their uniform and they have abandoned the skirt.

It’s a good step in the right direction. It sends out a bad message about Catholic girls when they wear their skirts so short.

 

[catholicmamajoy]

Are you saying that you think male teachers should not police skirt length? Or are you just making an observation?

When I was in high school in the 80s, we wore our skirts fairly short (we rolled them up). One of the Sisters used to stand in the hallway with a ruler at the change of classes. She would call over those of us whose skirts were too short, measure, and then hand out detentions appropriately. We thought she was so nasty…and then, much later, I found out that she did this partly on BEHALF of the few male teachers we had. It was an all-girls’ school, and the few men teaching there had mentioned in faculty meetings that they felt uncomfortable with how short the skirts were being worn.

I think male teachers have the right to insist that girls adhere to modesty standards. It is tragic to me that our society would encourage that the offender “turn it around” on him, like “Are you looking at my body???” Well – of course he looked at you – you are in his classroom! And for the record, looking is not necessarily leering. Observing that a girl is wearing a too-short skirt is not the same as lusting after her!

I agree that they have the right to insist that the students (all the students, female or male*)*** are dressed appropriately, but I don’t think it’s a good idea for a male teacher/staff member to directly comment to a female student (or her parents) on the length of her skirt. It would be far more appropriate for the male teacher to present this concern to the dean of girls (or whatever she’s called these days) and have her address it.

 

[Corki]

I don’t think it’s appropriate for a male teacher/staff member to directly comment to a student (or her parents) on the length of her skirt. It would be far more appropriate for the male teacher to present this concern to the dean of girls (or whatever she’s called these days) and have her address it.

If it’s part of the school’s code of conduct, it would be more inappropriate for a male teacher to treat the issue (dress code violation) any differently due to the gender of the offender.

In my kids school, they do spot dress code checks. On a given day (unannounced to the students), all the teachers (male and female) check the dress code compliance of all the students (male and female) in their home rooms. Students who are given a “card” for being out of compliance report to the dean. Occassionally a teacher’s assessment is overturned but that’s not too often. The dean is the one that sends the letter to the parents and who determines penalties for the dress code infraction (usually points but occassionally the student is sent home or required to call home for compliant clothes).

The same rules and procedures apply to all dress and grooming violations whether it is a girl with a too-short skirt or a boy who didn’t shave. The way to avoid any concerns of inappropriateness is to apply the standards consistently, not to skirt (pun intended) the issue out of fear of political incorrectness. If the issue is modesty, should it be any surprise that a male teacher might notice?

 

[catholicmamajoy]

If it’s part of the school’s code of conduct, it would be more inappropriate for a male teacher to treat the issue (dress code violation) any differently due to the gender of the offender.

In my kids school, they do spot dress code checks. On a given day (unannounced to the students), all the teachers (male and female) check the dress code compliance of all the students (male and female) in their home rooms. Students who are given a “card” for being out of compliance report to the dean. Occassionally a teacher’s assessment is overturned but that’s not too often. The dean is the one that sends the letter to the parents and who determines penalties for the dress code infraction (usually points but occassionally the student is sent home or required to call home for compliant clothes).

The same rules and procedures apply to all dress and grooming violations whether it is a girl with a too-short skirt or a boy who didn’t shave. The way to avoid any concerns of inappropriateness is to apply the standards consistently, not to skirt (pun intended) the issue out of fear of political incorrectness. If the issue is modesty, should it be any surprise that a male teacher might notice?

Agreed, and it’s no surprise that a male teacher might notice a shorter skirt, but in today’s world, having him comment to the student directly (especially a teenager) could lead to some allegations that I think he’d prefer to avoid. That’s why I think it’s inappropriate it for him to address it directly with the student, especially if it’s an individual situation instead of a quick uniform compliance check" in the classroom when all are being checked.

 

[PaulinVA]

\

I was fifteen . I’m now double that and with baby #2 on the way. I was trying to illustrate the problems with having male teachers police skirt length. Really, they ought to go to khakis.

Your post quite well illustrates the problem. Girls want to have power over men, get away with breaking rules, and fit in with their peers. Part of the “my body has power over men” mentality is to just dare a male teacher to try to rebuke them for breaking the rules and fitting in with peers.

So, to break that attitude, yes, men should call these girls/young women on their skirt length and other manner of dress. The girls need to know that they can not try to exercise the “power of their body” like that.

My response to pentacostbaby in the hallway would be, “I simply looked down the hallway and your skirt length stood out beside your peers. Don’t try to get out of with by being disrespectful as well. You know the rules”

 

[Corki]

Agreed, and it’s no surprise that a male teacher might notice a shorter skirt, but in today’s world, having him comment to the student directly (especially a teenager) could lead to some allegations that I think he’d prefer to avoid. That’s why I think it’s inappropriate it for him to address it directly with the student, especially if it’s an individual situation instead of a quick uniform compliance check" in the classroom when all are being checked.

That’s only a problem if the school has failed to communicate a consistent uniform policy to the students and the responsiblily of consistent enforcement to the teachers.

I think the only way to address the issue is directly to the student, individually or as part of a group “spot check”. But one of the advantages of the classroom-wide check is that a girl can’t get away with a dress code violation by accusing her teacher of inappropriate looking.

As for allegations, if somehow the male teacher ONLY ever reported girls for short skirts and never reported anyone else for dress code or conduct violations, he might have a problem. But if reporting short skirt violations are part of a consistent pattern of adhering to school policy, he has nothing to fear. After the first one or two of those feeble tries, the word would get out and the girls wouldn’t try that dodge again.

 

[L_piperatus]

Something about our culture makes women desire to be objectified, our culture teaches them that when men want your body you are powerful

(bolded emphasis mine)

Father Dominick Mary made exactly the same point in a televised homily on EWTN. It’s a power play. If the other man looks at your body with lust, you are clearly wielding power over him. And if he simply feels uncomfortable by your body being displayed, and if he looks away, trying to avoid the sight of your naked body parts intruding into his visual field, you are still wielding power over him.

Where I went to high school in the 1980s, girls had a uniform with a skirt that went below the knees, and also the upper part of the uniform covered the upper part of their chests, so that no cleavages and breasts were ever displayed, not even if they leaned forward. As a matter of fact, I don’t remember any occasion, not even a single time, being distracted by a girl’s body during class hours in high school. We boys noticed during physical education classes that girls’ bodies were changing and starting to look very feminine, but that was only at phys ed. Girls’ uniforms did a fabulous job of keeping distractions away for the rest of the day, such as in our classes of mathematics, literature, and so on.

In retrospect, it was probably a blessing, and I wish our children would have the same opportunity today. The opportunity to concentrate on their school curriculum, without the distraction provided by girls’ scanty attire around them.

 

[catholicmamajoy]

Putting all students in polo shirts and khakis would solve the skirt-length and modesty issue. In fact, most Catholic school already use polos and khakis as the uniform, allowing for khaki bermudas or walking shorts in warm weather. Of course, there will be students of both genders who will find some way to rebel, even in those clothes.

 

[MissRose73]

I only attended public schools, and we had dress codes but they were not heavily enforced either. Many students, mostly girls pushed the boundaries of what was allowed. I did not get that chance as my mother bought most of my clothes, was with me when I picked them out at the store before the new school year, and approved ahead of time of what I was allowed to get. I did not get to drive (or be dropped off) to the mall alone and buy what I wanted. That privilege was allowed after graduation from high school.

The uniform checks remind me of an episode of Little House on the Prairie where Mrs Oleson takes over the class, and everyone must wear a uniform: girls in sailor type dresses with white tall socks that went to their knees or below, and the boys had to wear a white shirt, string tie and black pants with black socks. She gave everyone the once over each day.

 

[Corki]

Putting all students in polo shirts and khakis would solve the skirt-length and modesty issue. In fact, most Catholic school already use polos and khakis as the uniform, allowing for khaki bermudas or walking shorts in warm weather. Of course, there will be students of both genders who will find some way to rebel, even in those clothes.

Since it is a Catholic school, we would have quite a few parents that would object to the girls only being allowed to wear pants and not skirts. (and it’s Texas, we only have warm weather) Our school has the option for girls to wear khakis or skorts on non-Mass days but few do. You would still have the skirt problem for Mass days. It’s full dress uniform for all - ties for the boys, skirts for the girls.