Catholic teaching not found in the Bible

[someotherguy]

Not you, then?
youtube.com/watch?v=EUpN5gl43jQ
These guys aren’t using megaphones and they aren’t disrupting the mass.

Nope. Not even remotely us. Look at the sign in the background. They’re protestors.

We weren’t there to protest. We were there to share the Gospel.

They also have a trumpet player for some reason. We wouldn’t do that.

 

[estesbob]

Nope. Not even remotely us. Look at the sign in the background. They’re protestors.

We weren’t there to protest. We were there to share the Gospel.

They also have a trumpet player for some reason. We wouldn’t do that.

Now that is delicious irony-there to share Gospel with the Church that gave you the Gospel!

 

[someotherguy]

Now that is delicious irony-there to share Gospel with the Church that gave you the Gospel!

Actually, the Gospel was around long before the Roman Catholic church.

I think the real (sad) irony is that so many of the Roman Catholics we spoke with didn’t know the Gospel.

 

[estesbob]

Actually, the Gospel was around long before the Roman Catholic church.

I think the real (sad) irony is that so many of the Roman Catholics we spoke with didn’t know the Gospel.

The Gospel was around before 33 AD? That’s news to me. is this what the denomination you belong to teaches???

Let me guess-you have come to CAF to “save” us poor ignorant Catholics. And you are sure if you make enough snarky remarks and snide asides we will all recognize our ignorance and come sit at you knee and let you impart the wisdom our church has denied us.

I should let you know that what must of us at CAF wonder when guys like you show up is just who are you trying to convince that theOne True Church is wrong? Us Catholics or yourself? I mean you must be mighty insecure about your faith if the only way you can affirm it is to run down that of others.

 

[someotherguy]

estesbob:

The Gospel was around before 33 AD? That’s news to me. is this what the denomination you belong to teaches???

Yes, Christianity teaches that the first mentions of the Gospel can be found long before 33ad.

Isaiah has some beautiful explanations of the Gospel and, really, you can go back as far as Gen 3:15.

Let me guess-you have come to CAF to “save” us poor ignorant Catholics.

No, not really. I’ve got a couple hundred posts here. If I was going to try to save anybody, you’d think I’d have done it before now.

But, then again, I also know the Bible well enough to know that I can’t save anyone.

I mean you must be mighty insecure about your faith if the only way you can affirm it is to run down that of others.

That’s a pretty ironic statement, considering the abuse my “faith” has taken at the hands of the Roman Catholics here.

 

[Benadam]

Actually, the Gospel was around long before the Roman Catholic church.

I think the real (sad) irony is that so many of the Roman Catholics we spoke with didn’t know the Gospel.

Well, if you have ever tried to argue the existence of God to an atheist you know it seems like the atheist insists God doesn’t exist because they can’t see God. They don’t say they don’t see God, they say there is no God because they can’t see God. To Catholics it is the same with folks like those in the video posted above. They don’t say they don’t see, they say it isn’t there.

For the most part what protestants see in Scriptures Catholics see, but what Catholics say is there protestants say isn’t. This isn’t something that is reciprocated.

 

[adrift]

I say that the Bible does not say because I’m the only one here intellectually honest enough to examine that passage in it’s context and according to the analogy of scripture.

Your are not honest. You said

The first is that, before I was a Christian, I was very much infatuated with Roman Catholicism and very nearly became a Roman Catholic. I’m very familiar with what Roman Catholicism teaches and I think that my history shows that I do not have a “blind eye”.

The second is that the Roman Catholics, themselves, are unable to show where these things are taught. Are you then going to claim that Roman Catholics have a “blind eye”

You claim to be familiar not only familiar but VERY familiar and yet what you post is not what the Church teaches. If you deliberately misrepresent the Church’s teaching than that is dishonest.

You do not answer but evade by saying you are ignored, you have already answered (when you haven’t) or silly comments “are fire trucks red”.

Oh, OK. That’s quite a bit different from the commonly accepted definition of analogy, which is a fictional story meant to impart a lesson.

The commonly accepted definition of analogy is
1: inference that if two or more things agree with one another in some respects they will probably agree in others2 a: resemblance in some particulars between things otherwise unlike : similarity b: comparison based on such resemblance3: correspondence between the members of pairs or sets of linguistic forms that serves as a basis for the creation of another form4: correspondence in function between anatomical parts of different structure and origin

No mention of a fictionalized lesson to impart a lesson that would be the definition of a parable.

There are 72 books in the bible.

2 Maccabees 12:46 Maccabees was removed by Protestants for the reason that it showed prayers for those who died so that they may be released from purgatory.
The following is more support of purgatory

1 Cor 3:15

Mat 5:26

Luke 12:59

Actually, the Gospel was around long before the Roman Catholic church.

Shame on you.:tsktsk: This is historically inaccurate only promoted by the most vile anti catholics. The Catholic Church began at Pentecost before the first word of the Gospel was written. To say otherwise is intellectually dishonest.

 

[someotherguy]

Shame on you.:tsktsk: This is historically inaccurate only promoted by the most vile anti catholics. The Catholic Church began at Pentecost before the first word of the Gospel was written. To say otherwise is intellectually dishonest.

I take it you’ve never read the book of Isaiah.

 

[someotherguy]

Well, if you have ever tried to argue the existence of God to an atheist you know it seems like the atheist insists God doesn’t exist because they can’t see God. They don’t say they don’t see God, they say there is no God because they can’t see God. To Catholics it is the same with folks like those in the video posted above. They don’t say they don’t see, they say it isn’t there.

Oh, that’s not true at all. I talk to atheists all the time. They never say they can’t see God. Just the opposite, they have to rely on other arguments like “how can a loving God…” or “but what about the pygmies…” precisely because they can see God.

They see God so clearly that they have to abandon the “there is no God” argument in favor of “well, there may be a God, but I won’t worship Him” argument. It’s pretty much exactly what John 3and Romans 1-2 says.

For the most part what protestants see in Scriptures Catholics see, but what Catholics say is there protestants say isn’t. This isn’t something that is reciprocated.

But the problem is that, then, when you ask these Roman Catholics who supposedly see it to explain to you where it is, they can’t do it.

Go ahead and try to get a Roman Catholic to show you where in the Bible Purgatory is sometime.

 

[adrift]

I take it you’ve never read the book of Isaiah.

Meaningless but I suspect you think it is an answer. Just like the rest of your non answers.

 

[someotherguy]

Meaningless but I suspect you think it is an answer. Just like the rest of your non answers.

It isn’t meaningless at all. You claim that the Gospel originated with the Roman Catholic church, but the truth is, it’s found all through out the OT, very clearly in the book of Isaiah.

That’s why it’s’ so much fun to share the Gospel with Jews. They’re absolutely shocked when you show them these things from their own scriptures.

In fact, take the time to read Isaiah 53:5-6,10-11 sometime.

Using the language of the Old Testament sacrificial system, Isaiah says this Person will lay down his righteous life as an atoning sacrifice for Israel’s sins.

This confirms what the sacrificial system implied, that God’s ultimate atonement would require the voluntary death of a unique Person, not animals.

Because he is God’s perfect sacrifice, his death will purchase full forgiveness of sins. Therefore, it will not have to be repeated over and over again like the animal sacrifices. (In fact, it puts them out of business altogether.)

And His death will provide not only for Israel’s forgiveness, but also for the rest of the world. Read Isa. 52:15.

This reads so much like a “Cliff Notes” of the Christian gospel that many skeptics charged that it was a Christian forgery inserted back into the Old Testament.

 

[estesbob]

Yes, Christianity teaches that the first mentions of the Gospel can be found long before 33ad.

Isaiah has some beautiful explanations of the Gospel and, really, you can go back as far as Gen 3:15.

Let me guess-based on your personal interpretation which you know is correct becuase the Spirit is whispering the truth in your ear, right?

No, not really. I’ve got a couple hundred posts here. If I was going to try to save anybody, you’d think I’d have done it before now.

So your purpose was to show us how ignorant you are of Catholicism? You could have done that with a lot fewer posts

But, then again, I also know the Bible well enough to know that I can’t save anyone.

I am sure you know the Bible-the problem is you dont understand it very well. A problem that afflicts most people who rely on their personal interpreation of Scripture.

That’s a pretty ironic statement, considering the abuse my “faith” has taken at the hands of the Roman Catholics here.

i dont have any idea what your faith is. i hope you understaqnd it better thaan you do our faith. I am still curious as why you felt the need to come to CAF to tear down our faith?

 

[Benadam]

Oh, that’s not true at all. I talk to atheists all the time. They never say they can’t see God. Just the opposite, they have to rely on other arguments like “how can a loving God…” or “but what about the pygmies…” precisely because they can see God.

They see God so clearly that they have to abandon the “there is no God” argument in favor of “well, there may be a God, but I won’t worship Him” argument. It’s pretty much exactly what John 3and Romans 1-2 says.

But the problem is that, then, when you ask these Roman Catholics who supposedly see it to explain to you where it is, they can’t do it.

Go ahead and try to get a Roman Catholic to show you where in the Bible Purgatory is sometime.

I have run into the more intellectually honest type of atheist as you have. Apparently the fundy atheist is outside of your experience.

In regards of Purgatory, it depends on what you mean by ‘show’. If you mean show as in where does scripture reveal that a soul must have or has entered a state of purgation there are quite a few. Plenty written here at Catholic Answers. If you haven’t encountered Catholics who can’t show you Purgatory revealed in Sacred Scripture you haven’t encountered the Catholics who have posted to you on this thread.

 

[adrift]

Gospel means good news which is what Jesus brought. Of course the Old Testament was all about the coming of Jesus. You like to define things out of the ordinary. When speaking of the Gospel it is commonly meant the written testimony in the New Testament.

 

[someotherguy]

In regards of Purgatory, it depends on what you mean by ‘show’. If you mean show as in where does scripture reveal that a soul must have or has entered a state of purgation there are quite a few. Plenty written here at Catholic Answers. If you haven’t encountered Catholics who can’t show you Purgatory revealed in Sacred Scripture you haven’t encountered the Catholics who have posted to you on this thread.

I have not seen one Roman Catholic who can find it in scripture. Usually, they just point to Paul’s account of the Bema Seat in 1 Cor and then, when I show them that that doesn’t refer to Purgatory, they just get mad and start calling me names.

 

[someotherguy]

Gospel means good news which is what Jesus brought. Of course the Old Testament was all about the coming of Jesus. You like to define things out of the ordinary. When speaking of the Gospel it is commonly meant the written testimony in the New Testament.

And this is where Roman Catholics and Christians speak two different languages.

Typically, when a Roman Catholic says “the Gospel”, he actually means the synoptic Gospels.

However, when a Christian says “the Gospel”, we mean the Bible’s explanation of God’s plan to redeem sinful mankind.

 

[Benadam]

It isn’t meaningless at all. You claim that the Gospel originated with the Roman Catholic church, but the truth is, it’s found all through out the OT, very clearly in the book of Isaiah.

That’s why it’s’ so much fun to share the Gospel with Jews. They’re absolutely shocked when you show them these things from their own scriptures.

In fact, take the time to read Isaiah 53:5-6,10-11 sometime.

Using the language of the Old Testament sacrificial system, Isaiah says this Person will lay down his righteous life as an atoning sacrifice for Israel’s sins.

This confirms what the sacrificial system implied, that God’s ultimate atonement would require the voluntary death of a unique Person, not animals.

Because he is God’s perfect sacrifice, his death will purchase full forgiveness of sins. Therefore, it will not have to be repeated over and over again like the animal sacrifices. (In fact, it puts them out of business altogether.)

And His death will provide not only for Israel’s forgiveness, but also for the rest of the world. Read Isa. 52:15.

This reads so much like a “Cliff Notes” of the Christian gospel that many skeptics charged that it was a Christian forgery inserted back into the Old Testament.

Truth Happened. That is the Good News.

 

[someotherguy]

Let me guess-based on your personal interpretation which you know is correct becuase the Spirit is whispering the truth in your ear, right?

No, it has nothing to do with my interpretation.

No, wait a second. Let’s say for a moment that it is just “my interpretation”. How about explaining, from the scriptures, why “my interpretation is wrong”?

 

[mercygate]

I have run into the more intellectually honest type of atheist as you have. Apparently the fundy atheist is outside of your experience.

In regards of Purgatory, it depends on what you mean by ‘show’. If you mean show as in where does scripture reveal that a soul must have or has entered a state of purgation there are quite a few. Plenty written here at Catholic Answers. If you haven’t encountered Catholics who can’t show you Purgatory revealed in Sacred Scripture you haven’t encountered the Catholics who have posted to you on this thread.

Someotherguy has been directed more than once to the concise tracts in the CA Library that answer his challenges using citations from Scripture and from the early Church Fathers.

But he is so busy on at least three different threads that even if he were sincere in asking his supposedly unanswerable questions, he would have no time to read them.

Gotta go pray Compline. Night now.

 

[estesbob]

No, it has nothing to do with my interpretation.

No, wait a second. Let’s say for a moment that it is just “my interpretation”. How about explaining, from the scriptures, why “my interpretation is wrong”?

Well to start with we have to accept you interpretation of what “Gospel” means. When one makes up his own defintions its kind of had to have a reasonable discussion. For instance ill bet under your definition Catholics are not Christians. Correct?