Catholic View of Salvation as an Orthodox

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russialover

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As the title above reveals, I am inquiring about what the state of my soul would be at death, if I were to leave the Catholic Church and become Eastern Orthodox. That being said, I still would believe that the filioque, Immaculate Conception, Purgatory, Papal Infallibility, and the Assumption of the Theotokos as the Holy See has defined it to not be heretical. In addition, I would like to make it clear that I would join Holy Orthodoxy because of their pure and completely strict adherence to Easter Tradition. Any information? Christ is born! 🙂
 
russialover said:
As the title above reveals, I am inquiring about what the state of my soul would be at death, if I were to leave the Catholic Church and become Eastern Orthodox. That being said, I still would believe that the filioque, Immaculate Conception, Purgatory, Papal Infallibility, and the Assumption of the Theotokos as the Holy See has defined it to not be heretical. In addition, I would like to make it clear that I would join Holy Orthodoxy because of their pure and completely strict adherence to Easter Tradition. Any information? Christ is born! 🙂
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  1. This forum is about Eastern Catholicism, isn’t it? Wouldn’t your concerns be more appropriately addressed to and by Orthodox, maybe in the non-Catholic forum or on an Orthodox discussion board?
  2. If we are to continue, what precisely do you mean by “completely strict adherence to Easter Tradition”?
Glorify Him 🙂
 
You can move to Brampton, Ontario and go to St. Elias Ukrainian Catholic Church where you have strict adherence to Eastern Traditions while being fully Catholic 👍
 
russialover said:
As the title above reveals, I am inquiring about what the state of my soul would be at death, if I were to leave the Catholic Church and become Eastern Orthodox. That being said, I still would believe that the filioque, Immaculate Conception, Purgatory, Papal Infallibility, and the Assumption of the Theotokos as the Holy See has defined it to not be heretical. In addition, I would like to make it clear that I would join Holy Orthodoxy because of their pure and completely strict adherence to Easter Tradition. Any information? Christ is born! 🙂
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If you would believe all that, you should bloom where you are planted.
 
*Eastern. I am inquiring, because I want to know what state if sin my soul would be in if I indeed became Orthodox, from a Catholic perspective?
 
It sounds more like you’re interested in the trappings of Orthodoxy rather than actually accepting its teachings, in which case you would go to Eastern Catholicism, which is perfectly fine according to the teachings of Rome.
 
But are the teachings I’ve posted about actually condemned by an Oechimemical Council?
 
It is an interesting thought - one that I’ve questioned before but still am not sure of the answer.

From what I understand, if one leaves the Catholic Church and makes a profession of faith in another church, they would be excommunicated. At that point, they wouldn’t be able to receive the Eucharist in the Catholic Church.

However, if one moves from Catholicism specifically to Holy Orthodoxy, how does the Catholic Church view them after that move? I mean, an EO Christian can receive the Eucharist in a Catholic Church (according to the Catholic Church) if they are properly disposed to do so (ie, followed fasting rules, no mortal since, recent confession, etc.). Also, since EO sacraments are valid and licit, that would include EO Confession. Once that sacrament takes place in the EO Church then the sinner would be pardoned of all transgressions.

At that point, if a Catholic-turned-Orthodox Christian would receive Confession in an EO Church, wouldn’t that person then be forgiven of their sins and be able to receive Communion (from the Catholic Church’s view even in a Catholic Church)?

Do I have this right? If so, since they are allowed to receive Communion in a Catholic Church and had a recent confession, there would be no mortal sins any longer on the person’s soul.
 
It can indeed constitute a forfeiture of salvation.

Stick with the fullness of the Apostolic Faith and the unity of the Universal Church.
 
But are the teachings I’ve posted about actually condemned by an Oechimemical Council?
 
I would say that an Eastern Catholic parish would be what you’re looking for. You won’t find much sympathy for your views on issues that separate our churches in an average Orthodox parish, especially regarding the papacy.
 
russialover said:
But are the teachings I’ve posted about actually condemned by an Oechimemical Council?
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Well one of them (The assumption of Mary) is full accepted and taught by the Orthodox Church (although unlike the Catholic Church is not a required belief).

Some of them you could argue are a violation of the Ecumenical Councils, however nothing is clear cut.

However believing the Pope is infallible when speaking ex-cathedra on issues of faith and morals and belonging to a Church which flat out denies this, and which itself would lose all its moral authority if one were to admit such was true.

If you like the Divine Liturgy, I suggest attending Eastern Catholic Churches, with whom you are already in Communion.
 
BusterMartin said:
It is an interesting thought - one that I’ve questioned before but still am not sure of the answer.

From what I understand, if one leaves the Catholic Church and makes a profession of faith in another church, they would be excommunicated. At that point, they wouldn’t be able to receive the Eucharist in the Catholic Church.

However, if one moves from Catholicism specifically to Holy Orthodoxy, how does the Catholic Church view them after that move? I mean, an EO Christian can receive the Eucharist in a Catholic Church (according to the Catholic Church) if they are properly disposed to do so (ie, followed fasting rules, no mortal since, recent confession, etc.). Also, since EO sacraments are valid and licit, that would include EO Confession. Once that sacrament takes place in the EO Church then the sinner would be pardoned of all transgressions.

At that point, if a Catholic-turned-Orthodox Christian would receive Confession in an EO Church, wouldn’t that person then be forgiven of their sins and be able to receive Communion (from the Catholic Church’s view even in a Catholic Church)?

Do I have this right? If so, since they are allowed to receive Communion in a Catholic Church and had a recent confession, there would be no mortal sins any longer on the person’s soul.
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The permission for Orthodox who are otherwise properly disposed to receive communion in the Catholic Church should not be confused with full communion between the Catholic Church and the separated Eastern Churches. Despite their many good points and Apostolic heritage such full communion does not currently exist, and so entering such a Church constitutes an abandonment of the One Church.
 
Note from Moderator:

This thread asks what the Catholic Church teaches about the salvation of a person who converts from Catholicism to Orthodoxy under the circumstances described. Discussion of any other topic should be moved to a new thread.
 
Do not leave the communion of the Catholic Church - if you believe in the primacy of Rome, as understood by Catholics, to sever communion with Rome is no small matter. Consider the words of Optatus of Milevus:
“In the city of Rome the episcopal chair was given first to Peter; the chair in which Peter sat, the same who was head—that is why he is also called Cephas ‘Rock’]—of all the apostles, the one chair in which unity is maintained by all. Neither do the apostles proceed individually on their own, and anyone who would [presume to] set up another chair in opposition to that single chair would, by that very fact, be a schismatic and a sinner. . . . Recall, then, the origins of your chair, those of you who wish to claim for yourselves the title of holy Church” (The Schism of the Donatists2:2 [A.D. 367]).
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Or St. Jerome:
“The church here is split into three parts, each eager to seize me for its own. . . . Meanwhile I keep crying, ‘He that is joined to the chair of Peter is accepted by me!’ . . . Therefore, I implore your blessedness [Pope Damasus I] . . . tell me by letter with whom it is that I should communicate in Syria” (Letters.16:2).
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Visit a number of Eastern Catholic parishes of various Slavic traditions (Ukrainian, Ruthenian…Russian if you can find one - they do exist), as I can see from your handle that you are interested in that particular branch of the Byzantine tradition, and find one that appears to live the Eastern faith to the fullest…some will be more Latinized than others. There is nothing to stop you from being fully Orthodox in communion with Rome…
 
If you are unwilling to forgo these Latin dogmas, then you would not really believe what Orthodox believe. Why not try Eastern Catholic churches? 🙂
 
RUSSIALOVER,

My friend, I think it is interesting that you are so interested in Orthodoxy and are a lover of Russia and its culture and religion.

But in all this there are 2 problems

\I do not understand why you care what Catholics say about you as an Orthodox. If you believe in Orthodoxy, that is enough - do not expect Catholics to be helpful in this decision.

I agree with Hesychios - if you believe all such modern Roman Catholic doctrines which we do not - why do you want to be Orthodox?? We have our faith - and you have another faith. If what you like are icons, long fasts, churches without benches - go to such GrekoCatholic church as was suggested in Canada. They believe (I guess) what you Latin Catholics are believing.
 
It’s not that I’m unwilling to forgo them, I just don’t see a problem with the west holding them, nor do I see these teachings as heretical. Please pray for me! 😦
 
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