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Catholic World Looks at Orthodox Church With Hope – Vatican Ambassador
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jaimeleglise
Guest
Thank you very much for sharing this. It makes me feel better because I recently read a well written article that stated there was little hope of the Catholic Church and the Orthodox Church reuniting.
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FollowChrist34
Guest
Why can’t we just be friends?
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Peter_J
Guest
In my humble opinion, not only Catholics but Anglicans, Lutherans, Methodists, etc. should looks at the Orthodox positively. 
Will it always fall to us Catholics to set the good example?
Will it always fall to us Catholics to set the good example?
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peter26
Guest
There is no reason that all Christians holding to the essence of the faith (Catholic, Orthodox, Lutherans and Anglicans for sure) can not cooperate more closely and build stronger relations. Unfortunately, while the Catholic Church has a very charitable attitude to the Orthodox Churches, this is not always reciprocated.
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FollowChrist34
Guest
I think a lot of that hostility is really motivated by vulnerability and a need for self-justification. As far as I am concerned both “wings” of the original Church have their share of deep-seated problems (of course the Church is not pure in this world, etc. etc.) but the Orthodox are much more fragmented and smaller with their host of problems - secularization, nationalism, lack of consensus on doctrine, etc. Holding their identity intact necessarily involves pushing away the “charity” of the Catholic ecumenical advance. They rightly or wrongly see their death knell in it.
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Peter_J
Guest
Although I’m Catholic too, I find this statement highly unfair – well, except for the “smaller” comment, which is obviously true.
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FollowChrist34
Guest
Oh, and why is that?
Do you deny that the Orthodox have multiple jurisdictions and only recognize the authority of their jurisdiction on any given matter? One jurisdiction issues a statement about the death penalty, for example, another doesn’t. Whether or not the laity adhere to the beliefs of a particular jurisdiction is as open a question in Orthodoxy as in Catholicism. If you kiss icons and participate in the weekly liturgy I think that about covers it - the rest is icing on the cake. Not unlike some Catholics…
I see many Catholics who paint the Orthodox Church as this great bastion of tradition and liturgy - the reality is that there is just as much difference of opinion on doctrinal matters (on topics such as contraception, gay rights/homosexuality, divorce, married priests, mercy vs. justice in modern Christianity, etc etc). They rarely have any form of central or higher control on bishops and clergy - financial scandals occur, etc. The hierarchy of the jurisdictions answer to themselves for themselves. (Perhaps you can post the Catechism of the Orthodox Church when you have a moment for our perusal.)
The Orthodox Church Catholics picture is an abstract little Rebecca of Sunnybrook Farm from about 10 centuries ago, if it ever was. Now why we do that would be an interesting thread.
I don’t mean to sound negative. I just think we need to see the trees through the forest, or even just an accurate shot of the forest here would be nice.
(I am critical of our Church too as needed, right?)
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truthseeker32
Guest
In what way is Orthodoxy fragmented that Roman Catholicism isn’t?
Catholicism is just as much a victim to secularization, the “nationalism” claim is hyperbole, and Orthodoxy agrees on all its doctrines. There is a lack of consensus on theologumen, or theological opinions.
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Mongo
Guest
Oddly through my reading about the orthodox I tend to think they are far more united than the catholic west.
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FollowChrist34
Guest
I don’t deny that Catholicism is every bit as much a victim to the threat of secular values. It is a great battle in all of Christianity, the wolves and sheep from the Gospel …Catholics often romanticize the Orthodox, as if they have somehow escaped the wolves in a pure, ancient, icon-filled Eastern time capsule. To admit that Orthodoxy is as victimized by the forces of modernity and secularism as Catholics is unfortunately to admit to a LOT of it. (feels like the Titanic on a bad day - my Church, that is) I merely add in the multiple theological opinions of the jurisdictions on top of that. Again, I recognize that the Orthodox claim to doctrinal coherence; my point is - it is questionable if that is true, on the ground, plus the multiple jurisdictions, some in communion with the Church, some not. I am always particularly interested in observing the various responses to ecumenism with the RCC, all over the board.
The woes of nationalism:
catholicculture.org/news/headlines/index.cfm?storyid=27053
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Peter_J
Guest
The interesting thing is, if that were about a Pope rather than a Patriarch, then Catholics on this forum would say “Yeah, so what? I never claimed that Popes are sinless.”
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FollowChrist34
Guest
You are preaching to the choir. I think I have said in writing I can’t quite believe in papal infallibility and I have been a very vocal critic of corruption in the Curia, corruption at any level of the Church. (of course I think if one engages in this kind of criticism, he must be just as up front about his own failings as a Christian)
The day I run into an Orthodox who speaks to me as honestly about the state of his Church as he and I both do about mine, I will be one happy camper - it will bode well for the health of Christianity over there. This isn’t a water-relieving contest.
:tiphat:
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prodromos
Guest
Reading up on recent history of Catholic/Orthodox interaction in the Balkans should cure you of that misconception.
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FollowChrist34
Guest
Ah, yes, good point. I forgot the long shared history of regional ethnic/religious/nationalist bullying and bloodshedding.Reading up on recent history of Catholic/Orthodox interaction in the Balkans should cure you of that misconception.
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commenter
Guest
Where on Earth does one find much to read about the Orthodox?
In the USA, the Media must focus on the Catholic Church possibly 100 times as much as on Eastern Orthodox. In recent years, the great majority of the coverage is negative: the Church is cruel, outdated, divided, corrupt, trying to impose vicious dogmas, narrow minded, etc. Even when they have a “positive” feature on Pope Francis, it often shows him (out of context) criticizing the Church, especially the hierarchy; and that the hierarchy is divided from the people.
The anti-Christian media constantly does polls to show the Catholic church is wrong, out of touch with real people. The anti-Christian media is become essentially fixated on Catholicism. Seen any anti-EO, or for that matter, anti-Lutheran movies coming out of Hollywood lately?
If the Catholic Church is taking most of the bullets internationally it’s because we’re on the front lines - on abortion, sanctity of marriage, religious liberty, and other issues that EO and some Protestant churches also favor, but quietly.
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FollowChrist34
Guest
Agreed the Catholic Church (at least some of it) is in the front lines on abortion, sanctity of marriage, religious liberty, etc. But it is a bit unfair to slight our fundamentalist buddies, the Baptists, the Evangelicals, on these issues. They are out there too, (in all their rural bible belt right wing fury
- imho of course) and for that I feel compelled to give them credit. They’ve inspired me many a time (along with frightening me). Though I do scratch my head to think of one EO leader I’ve seen out there, at least in the US. They are, truth be told, much more vocal on these issues in Greece and Eastern Europe I believe.Oh, and as for the Lutherans, check out this dude:
youtube.com/watch?v=527spTZiwBU
:tiphat:
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commenter
Guest
I realize many non Catholic groups are supporting the good causes, but the secular culture is overwealmingly focused on undermining the Catholic Church. Anti Catholicism is the one permitted bigotry today, especially in higher education and the media.Agreed the Catholic Church (at least some of it) is in the front lines on abortion, sanctity of marriage, religious liberty, etc. But it is a bit unfair to slight our fundamentalist buddies, the Baptists, the Evangelicals, on these issues. They are out there too, (in all their rural bible belt right wing fury
Oh, and as for the Lutherans, check out this dude:
youtube.com/watch?v=527spTZiwBU
:tiphat:
Seen any anti-Methodist TV shows lately? Check out your local large bookstore or downtown library. You will find at least several books opposing the Catholic Church. How many anti Eastern Orthodox or anti-Baptist books?
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FollowChrist34
Guest
I agree on the bull’s eye on the Catholic Church. I take that as a good sign - of “election” if you will. In spite of my criticisms of the state of the Church I still believe it is the only game in town, otherwise I would leave it tomorrow, today for that matter. There is breathing room in it for the real thing.
But I think when Jon Stewart or Bill Maher or Christopher Hitchens or ISIL line up Christians, they DO NOT distinguish a denomination. Due to numbers and high visibility, the Catholic Church may get more hits, but Christianity as a faith is under attack. Think Kim Davis vs. secular media, meeting with the Pope. I rest my case. Oh, and Davis walked the gauntlet for the faith there, in all the glory of her Flannery O’Connor Kentucky Evangelicalism (not a small number of Catholics failed to support her).
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