Catholics and Mental Ilness

[Holly3278]

Hey everyone. I am interested in Catholics and mental illness. I have two mental illnesses: Borderline Personality Disorder and Major Depression. I have been told by two priests plus a former spiritual director that it would be next to impossible for me to commit a mortal sin due to my mental illness. The reason is because my mental illness makes me very impulsive. I do almost everything impulsively and without much thought.

That said, I am also interested in any books or online resources you can provide. What resources would you recommend?

I am also wanting to discuss this subject here in this thread. Here is what the Catechism says:

**1860 **Unintentional ignorance can diminish or even remove the imputability of a grave offense. But no one is deemed to be ignorant of the principles of the moral law, which are written in the conscience of every man. The promptings of feelings and passions can also diminish the voluntary and free character of the offense, as can external pressures or pathological disorders. Sin committed through malice, by deliberate choice of evil, is the gravest.

As you can see, pathological disorders can diminish the voluntary and free character of the offense and that would therefore reduce one’s culpability. How much would my mental illness which always makes me impulsive affect my culpability?

 

[Job42]

I think it depends upon the severity of your illness. But if two priests plus a spiritual director told you that it is next to impossible for you to commit a mortal sin, I would take comfort in that and try to let that sink in so that you are not so scrupulous. Especially if those priests and spiritual director have dealt extensively with people with mental health issues, and most especially if one or more of them have any type of psychology background in their education.

 

[Holly3278]

I think it depends upon the severity of your illness. But if two priests plus a spiritual director told you that it is next to impossible for you to commit a mortal sin, I would take comfort in that and try to let that sink in so that you are not so scrupulous. Especially if those priests and spiritual director have dealt extensively with people with mental health issues, and most especially if one or more of them have any type of psychology background in their education.

Well, I know that one of the priests had taken some classes or something about psychology and so he is very knowledgeable. I trust what they say.

I guess since it is impossible for me to commit a mortal sin then that means I’ll definitely go to Heaven, right?

 

[Jerusha]

guess since it is impossible for me to commit a mortal sin then that means I’ll definitely go to Heaven, right?

Not necessarily. Only God can judge that. What I have read about BPD says that if a person with this disorder drinks, it is usually to excess, and that improvement of BPD depends on whether the individual quits drinking or not.

You are still responsible for managing your illness as best as you can. You are obligated to use all the resources that are given you. I am not being judgmental. I have been on meds most of my adult life, and it would be a sin to get off of them.

Managing a psychological disorder is not much different form managing a physical disorder, in terms of your responsibility to yourself. Mind and body are really not that separate from each other.

OH!! Holly!! I am not that surprised, given your posting history. I certainly hope that you don’t drink.

 

[Job42]

I don’t want to mislead you. If three people agreed on that, then that makes it more likely that it is true that it would be very difficult for you to lose your salvation. But only God knows for sure. It depends on the nature of your illness and how it affects your grasp on reality and your emotional stability.

As a fellow sufferer of mental illness I know your frustration. You know your own illness better than any other human being so in a way you know how serious your illness is. But on the other hand, your illness plays a part in how you judge yourself so you assess yourself based upon a distorted view of reality and in a fog of unstable emotions. I will remember you in my prayers.

 

[Holly3278]

I don’t want to mislead you. If three people agreed on that, then that makes it more likely that it is true that it would be very difficult for you to lose your salvation. But only God knows for sure. It depends on the nature of your illness and how it affects your grasp on reality and your emotional stability.

As a fellow sufferer of mental illness I know your frustration. You know your own illness better than any other human being so in a way you know how serious your illness is. But on the other hand, your illness plays a part in how you judge yourself so you assess yourself based upon a distorted view of reality and in a fog of unstable emotions. I will remember you in my prayers.

Well, let me tell you about my mental illness. My mental illness causes me to see things in black and white terms. In other words, just about everything is either bad or good with nothing in between. I also tend to be very impulsive. I don’t think before I do most things. I also deal with frequent mood swings. I can be happy one moment and in the next moment be deeply depressed.

 

[ubcgirl]

I am so glad you have mainly gotten supportive/helpful answers! Mental illness is very much (still) stigmatized in this day and age, and I could easily see how if someone did not understand either of those, especially BPD, would accuse you of using it as an excuse.

As other posters have said, only God really knows! It sounds like the advice you’ve been given by your priests is solid advice. I encourage you to continue to seek out the appropriate therapy and medication necessary to help you get a handle on things. I have a friend who has both also, and although she has a fairly promiscuous past, has found the right meds and has learned the coping skills to control her behaviours, if not entirely her emotions.

 

[Job42]

Well, let me tell you about my mental illness. My mental illness causes me to see things in black and white terms. In other words, just about everything is either bad or good with nothing in between. I also tend to be very impulsive. I don’t think before I do most things. I also deal with frequent mood swings. I can be happy one moment and in the next moment be deeply depressed.

I didn’t mean to imply that I know exactly what you are going through because certainly I don’t. I suffer differently from you, and quite possibly not as much. But I think I can relate to your struggle in some way.

 

[Holly3278]

I am so glad you have mainly gotten supportive/helpful answers! Mental illness is very much (still) stigmatized in this day and age, and I could easily see how if someone did not understand either of those, especially BPD, would accuse you of using it as an excuse.

As other posters have said, only God really knows! It sounds like the advice you’ve been given by your priests is solid advice. I encourage you to continue to seek out the appropriate therapy and medication necessary to help you get a handle on things. I have a friend who has both also, and although she has a fairly promiscuous past, has found the right meds and has learned the coping skills to control her behaviours, if not entirely her emotions.

Thanks Ubcgirl. I appreciate this nice post of yours. That said, I also think the advice of my priests and my former spiritual director is correct. I really don’t know for sure but I trust them. They are certainly more wise and knowledgeable than I!

I didn’t mean to imply that I know exactly what you are going through because certainly I don’t. I suffer differently from you, and quite possibly not as much. But I think I can relate to your struggle in some way.

Thank you Job. I think just about anyone with mental illness can relate to others who have mental illness. I mean, all mental illnesses are similar in some way. We all suffer discrimination due to our mental illness from time to time and there is a lot of stigma out there about those with mental illness. That is very unfortunate.

That said, I have wanted to become a nun for several years now but I am afraid that I won’t be able to because of my mental illnesses. Since I can’t become a nun I will probably either live the single life or get married someday. I hope to get married someday rather than live the single life but I am open to whatever God has in store for me. He is infinitely wise and He has my well being in mind. I trust Him for I know He will choose only the best for me.

 

[prayerandstudy]

I really don’t have anything to add to the replies you have already received about your question. However, in reading this thread I am reminded of the Guild of St. Benedict Joseph Labre. I have a seriously ill brother-in-law suffering from BPD and we highly suspect that one of my nephews also has a mental disorder. While trying to help my sister in her situation, I stumbled upon this Guild which offers spiritual support to the mentally ill and their families and friends. When I wrote to them I received some literature. You might find it helpful. Their web site is www.guildbjlabre.com. I don’t think it is completed but if you go there you can click on a link to visit their old website.
God bless you.

 

[Job42]

Thank you Job. I think just about anyone with mental illness can relate to others who have mental illness. I mean, all mental illnesses are similar in some way. We all suffer discrimination due to our mental illness from time to time and there is a lot of stigma out there about those with mental illness. That is very unfortunate.

That said, I have wanted to become a nun for several years now but I am afraid that I won’t be able to because of my mental illnesses. Since I can’t become a nun I will probably either live the single life or get married someday. I hope to get married someday rather than live the single life but I am open to whatever God has in store for me. He is infinitely wise and He has my well being in mind. I trust Him for I know He will choose only the best for me.

I have my vocation on my mind these days, too. Early on in my conversion I really wanted to be a priest but I eventually decided that I don’t have what it takes. Now I want to get married but I have been advised against it by my confessor. I guess that leaves either the single life or becoming a brother. It will take a lot of prayer (and maybe fasting) for me to let go of my dreams of the married life.

But back to the topic of the thread. Speaking for myself, my schizophrenia causes me to practically live inside my own head, paranoid and afraid to try new things, afraid of Hell, afraid of the anger and rejection of others, constantly second-guessing and ruminating over my own actions and words (whether spoken or typed ), frequently dwelling on the past and the mistakes and traumatizing events therein. With all that in mind, there must be some level of decrease in culpability that occurs when I commit a sin, or at least certain types of sins (such as sins done in order to keep others from getting mad at me). But only God truly knows the amount, not even do I myself truly know. But I still believe that I have to work hard at overcoming my vices, even the ones that are part of my illness (and therefore maybe are better defined as “disorders” rather than “vices”). And I still confess those mistakes (whatever you want to call them) as if I were fully culpable for them. And if my confessor tells me that I don’t need to worry about a particular sin or type of sin anymore, then I try my best to not worry about it (which at times is difficult again because of the illness). Anyway, this is just my experience and my life and how I deal with my illness. Maybe my reflections can help you, Holly (and any lurkers) in some way.

 

[TiggerS]

penitents.org/mentalillness.htm

God’s Image In the Mentally Ill Person
**Cardinal Lozano Barragán’s Address at World Day of the Sick **

**ADELAIDE, Australia, FEB. 18, 2006 Here is an excerpt of an address Cardinal Javier Lozano Barragán, president of the Pontifical Council for Health Care Workers, prepared for World Day of the Sick. The main events of the World Day were held Feb. 9-11 in Adelaide. **

1. Faithful Image of God

Therefore, once the mental illness has caused such a disorder as to take away from the mentally ill patient any responsibility for his actions – qualifying them as separation from the divine will, as a sin – **the mental patient cannot separate from God. **

In other words, the image of God in him cannot be distorted. In this case his knowledge or his volitive option is no longer sufficient to motivate any human action that separates him from God. His bodily and psychic conditions do not allow him to commit a grave sin, given that in his state of disequilibrium he does not have that full knowledge and ability of assent required to sin.
If we approach the argument from this point of view, whereby the mentally ill patient does not have the knowledge or the faculty of full consent required to commit a mortal sin, his is not a deformed image of God, since that image can only be deformed by sin. Certainly, it is the suffering image of God, but not a deformed image. He is a reflection of the mystery of the victorious Cross of the Lord. Inspired by the image of the Suffering Servant of Yahweh (Isaiah 53:1-7) we are drawn to a conscious act of faith in the suffering Christ.

It is not by chance that in the old popular Mexican language, a mad person was called “bandito,” that is, “blessed”; …] without the full use of reasoning, he was unable to commit sin and was, therefore, destined to eternal life.

It is true that the objective disorder of sin and its consequences are manifest in the mentally ill patient; however, at the same time, there is in him the historical equilibrium of the only possible order,** the order and equilibrium of the Redemption**

.

The full text of Cardinal Barragan’s address can be found here on Catholic Culture : catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=6824

It can make for laborious reading for non medical readers; however the section on “Faithful Image of God” would contain much comfort for sufferers themselves. I have quoted this section above and the whole section is worth a read.
If a sufferer is in doubt as to whether they have committed a mortal sin (some mental illness sufferers can have stretches when they are ‘normal’[whatever this is!)] and function as a non sufferer with all faculties functioning normally. Such forms of mental illness tends to come in episodes only.) It is difficult to know the precise moral situation with absolute accuracy sometimes as though the person to all intent is functioning completely normally, features of their illness will still be an undercurrent having affect. The best way to resolve this doubt is through seeking the advice of a priest in Confession and spiritually to rely totally on our Compassionate, Understanding and Loving God of Mercy more prone to pardon than to condemnation. And well, the Good Lord knows, that mental illness is a cruel suffering that can create many confusions and even non understandings in the mind, emotions and heart, free will, of a sufferer. Such problems may be recognized by the sufferer, or they may not. Mental Illness is indeed a cruel life suffering and life journey to have to endure.

 

[Justicia_et_Pax]

Hey everyone. I am interested in Catholics and mental illness. I have two mental illnesses: Borderline Personality Disorder and Major Depression. I have been told by two priests plus a former spiritual director that it would be next to impossible for me to commit a mortal sin due to my mental illness. The reason is because my mental illness makes me very impulsive. I do almost everything impulsively and without much thought.

That said, I am also interested in any books or online resources you can provide. What resources would you recommend?

I am also wanting to discuss this subject here in this thread. Here is what the Catechism says:

As you can see, pathological disorders can diminish the voluntary and free character of the offense and that would therefore reduce one’s culpability. How much would my mental illness which always makes me impulsive affect my culpability?

Hi Holly,

I think we’ve crossed paths once or twice and certainly I have followed a number of your posts silently.

You may recall I have schizoaffective disorder and post-traumatic stress disorder. I am very blessed with the priest I eventually approached to be my spiritual director/confessor. Before he felt called to the Church, he had been an Anglican priest; before that, he had been a mental health social worker. So he has a very thorough, indepth knowledge of the conditions I am plagued with.

Confession is quite new to and terrifying for me but my confessor is a very gentle man. The times I have been overwhelmed by my supposed “sin” and have confessed to him or texted him hysterically, he has told me that these are not sins: they are merely part of my illness, or just human nature in general. Being the kind soul he is, he offers me absolution anyway and this has a tremendous effect on me. When I receive absolution, I feel freed from these sins and am able to let them go.

I have never spoken to my confessor about my general culpability for sin but I am of the opinion that the advice you have been given is correct

Anyway, this is just my experience and my life and how I deal with my illness. Maybe my reflections can help you, Holly (and any lurkers) in some way.

Thank you for your post. Obviously I am saddened that you have schizophrenia and will pray for you but it is nice to read something from a Catholic with a similar condition to mine

penitents.org/mentalillness.htm

The full text of Cardinal Barragan’s address can be found here on Catholic Culture : catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=6824

It can make for laborious reading for non medical readers; however the section on “Faithful Image of God” would contain much comfort for sufferers themselves. I have quoted this section above and the whole section is worth a read.
If a sufferer is in doubt as to whether they have committed a mortal sin (some mental illness sufferers can have stretches when they are ‘normal’[whatever this is!)] and function as a non sufferer with all faculties functioning normally. Such forms of mental illness tends to come in episodes only.) It is difficult to know the precise moral situation with absolute accuracy sometimes as though the person to all intent is functioning completely normally, features of their illness will still be an undercurrent having affect. The best way to resolve this doubt is through seeking the advice of a priest in Confession and spiritually to rely totally on our Compassionate, Understanding and Loving God of Mercy more prone to pardon than to condemnation. And well, the Good Lord knows, that mental illness is a cruel suffering that can create many confusions and even non understandings in the mind, emotions and heart, free will, of a sufferer. Such problems may be recognized by the sufferer, or they may not. Mental Illness is indeed a cruel life suffering and life journey to have to endure.

God bless you for this post

 

[ubcgirl]

I have my vocation on my mind these days, too. Early on in my conversion I really wanted to be a priest but I eventually decided that I don’t have what it takes. Now I want to get married but I have been advised against it by my confessor. I guess that leaves either the single life or becoming a brother. It will take a lot of prayer (and maybe fasting) for me to let go of my dreams of the married life.

But back to the topic of the thread. Speaking for myself, my schizophrenia causes me to practically live inside my own head, paranoid and afraid to try new things, afraid of Hell, afraid of the anger and rejection of others, constantly second-guessing and ruminating over my own actions and words (whether spoken or typed ), frequently dwelling on the past and the mistakes and traumatizing events therein. With all that in mind, there must be some level of decrease in culpability that occurs when I commit a sin, or at least certain types of sins (such as sins done in order to keep others from getting mad at me). But only God truly knows the amount, not even do I myself truly know. But I still believe that I have to work hard at overcoming my vices, even the ones that are part of my illness (and therefore maybe are better defined as “disorders” rather than “vices”). And I still confess those mistakes (whatever you want to call them) as if I were fully culpable for them. And if my confessor tells me that I don’t need to worry about a particular sin or type of sin anymore, then I try my best to not worry about it (which at times is difficult again because of the illness). Anyway, this is just my experience and my life and how I deal with my illness. Maybe my reflections can help you, Holly (and any lurkers) in some way.

I kinda want to say “who am I to butt in here” but it makes me sad that your Confessor advised against marriage. Does he have a strong background in mental health? It is possible and there are many couples married where one has schizophrenia, or even another mental illness. Especially if you have already begun treatment and are able to get to a place where you’re mainly stable - i.e. when it becomes your new normal. I don’t know you, so maybe your Confessor has his reasons, but I hope they are good reasons, and not because of mental illness.

As I may have stated in other posts, I am wanting to specialize in mental health nursing, after specializing in acute psychiatric for a couple years (starting this summer!), then moving on to the families and how they can be supported and help support their loved one. Its a place very near and dear to my heart.