Catholics And The Creation Account

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THE CREATION STORY

Bible readers fall into two groups. For the sake of simplicity, we may split Bible readers into two primary groups: Literalists and Contextualists. Literalists, also called fundamentalists, interpret the Bible literally, saying it means exactly what it says. Contextualists interpret the Bible contextually, saying we must consider the historical, cultural and literary context in which the Bible was written. This is particularly true of the first eleven chapters of the Book of Genesis, where the stories deal with prehistory, that twilight time between the appearance of people on earth and the telling of their story. Catholics use the Contextualist method of interpreting the Bible.

The first creation story reads like a poem. Each day of creation follows a pattern.

Day 1 God created light and SEPARATED it from the darkness.
Day 2 God SEPARATED the water above (rain) from the water below (sea).
Day 3 God SEPARATED the water below (sea) from the dry land.
Day 4 God POPULATED the sky with sun, moon, and stars.
Day 5 God POPULATED the air with birds and the sea with fish.
Day 6 God POPULATED the land with animals and people.
Day 7 God CELEBRATED; He blessed the day and rested on it.

Thee literary patterns of the Creation story suggests that we are dealing with a special kind of writing. It is not the kind found in eyewitness accounts or in science books. Rather, it is the kind found in children’s books. The authors of children’s books use simple, poetic stories to teach children about life. Such stories are easy to read and easy to remember.

The Genesis writer chose a similar approach to teach about God, because most ancient peoples could not read or write. They learned everything by word of mouth. Thus a poetic story was easy to remember, entertaining, and instructive.

The author of Genesis thought to teach three truths:

FIRST, that there is only one God. (Any other so-called Gods that were falsely worshiped could not be Gods since God, the creator, also created those so-called God’s and therefore they would be subject to God, the supreme ruler of the Universe.)

SECOND, that God planned creation. (Creation did not happen by chance or accident).

THIRD, that God created everything good.

Some readers of the Bible are surprised to discover that the Book of Genesis contains two creation stories. The second story begins in Chapter 2.

Why was this second story added? To answer this question we need to recall that the first five books of the Bible, called the Torah (“instruction”), or Penteuch (“five scrolls”), which were passed on orally for centuries. Only later were they written down. Apparently there were two oral traditions about creation. When the bible writer was inspired to record the Torah, he included both versions. They complemented one another. Both stories agree with the three truths as noted above.

The Second creation story also portrays God as working patiently over the body of the first man, much as a potter works patiently over a vase. This is important as it underscores the close relationship that exists between God and the first man.

Also the second story of creations teaches about the intimacy of marriage. God instructed the couple to be “one body” They are to have an intimacy toward one another similar to the one God has toward them. Thus God indicates that the purpose of marriage involves more than having children. It also involves an intimate relationship of love and support between husband and wife.

In summary, the second creation story complements the first one in two special ways. The second story underscores:

(1) The intimacy between God and humans, and
(2) The intimacy and equality between the sexes.

Some additional information about Genesis:

At a general audience on April 16, 1986, Pope John Paul II said that the theory of evolution is “only a probability, not a scientific certainty.” He went on to say that “the doctrine of faith, however, invariably affirms that a human’s spiritual soul is directly created by God. According to the hypothesis mentioned, it is possible that the human body, following the order impressed by the Creator on the energies of life, could have been gradually prepared in the forms of antecedent living beings. But the human soul, on which man’s humanity definitively depends, cannot emerge from matter because it is of a spiritual nature.”

In other words, God could have fashioned the universe through an evolutionary process. But whether He did it that way or by direct creation, He still must be acknowledged as its Maker. With this basic premise established, the Church encourages scientists and scholars to continue their investigation so that someday we may know with certainty the method God used to bring human beings and the universe to their present state of development. The ultimate answer will involve no conflict between scientific and religious truth, for God is the Author of both.

However, the Genesis account of creation is not to be shunned. Nor is it to be regarded as a scientific and anthropological account of the origins of the universe and the human race. Rather, the beautiful and inspiring passages in Genesis are to be read as religious history in which the author used figurative language and popular descriptions to teach fundamental religious truths about salvation. Some of those truths are that God in His goodness created the universe out of nothing; that everything He created was good; that He created the first humans in His image and likeness; that those first humans lost their state of perfect happiness through the sins of pride and disobedience; that the whole human race suffers from the consequences of their sins; and that one day there will be a Redeemer for fallen humanity.
 
They didn’t even teach you how to spell it right. Hmmm. Another “expert” opinion I suppose. But what you said is not proof.
I appologize. I misspell terribly in English, and French, and Hebrew, and Greek. I guess I’ll just have to give back my Master of Divinity, my Master of Sacred Theology, my Clinical ratings, and my Ordination. Oh the damage I must have caused as chairman of a department of theology! Oh the humanity who perished because of my lectures. Dante must have a ring of hell just for me. But then not being able to do the times tables didn’t keep me from being an extremely successful engineering researcher in my first career. Really: I just dismiss the triveality of the anel retentitive.:rolleyes:
 
Hello:)

I’ve been away a little while, and only have a moment to post, but I wanted to share something a very dear priest told me a few years back…

We should remember that the hebrews were not writing the creation account to explain HOW God created the universe… but rather WHY He created it.

It is not a scientific analysis or a “how to” guide for creating the world… It is a poetic portrayal of our loving creator and the very reason for all that exists.

There are some great studies out there that explain the imagery the Hebrews used, based on their understanding of the world and the universe:) Reading the creation account with their perspective in mind, helps to understand it much more clearly.
 
Hello:)

I’ve been away a little while, and only have a moment to post, but I wanted to share something a very dear priest told me a few years back…

We should remember that the hebrews were not writing the creation account to explain HOW God created the universe… but rather WHY He created it.

It is not a scientific analysis or a “how to” guide for creating the world… It is a poetic portrayal of our loving creator and the very reason for all that exists.

There are some great studies out there that explain the imagery the Hebrews used, based on their understanding of the world and the universe:) Reading the creation account with their perspective in mind, helps to understand it much more clearly.
Amen and amen! Those studies you sight go under the heading of “historic redaction analysis,” which takes in social-anthropoligy, archeology and several other fields, and it is my vocation. Consider if you will the nomadic Hebrew, litterally “the dusty ones” grazing their flocks between and unfortunatily all over the fields of the newly emerged city states. Ever wonder why they had so many wars? How would you like it if you found a bunch of
nomads fattening their sheep on your corn field? Every people they encountered had their own gods and a myth assurting it’s, therefore their own authority. All Genesis says is “YHWH made it so it’s YAWY’s and we are His people so it’s ours!” Everything in Genesis is to ancient convention, including the seven orders of creation from 1, the least perfect to 7, the most. Why did God rest on the seventh? Because He created nothing as perfect as Himself of course! Days? A common convention in ancient mythology for a distinct event. If that sets anyone’s kettle to boiling, you should see what I do with John the Seer, sitting in exile on Patmos (something I’m researching for a book), flashing gang signs back to his homies in Rome. Disclaimer: All of this informes, it does not invalidate the mythology. I just work to see to it that the mythology doesn’t get too far out of hand. My favorite creation myth by the way is the prolog to the Gospel according to John, this in disagreement with those who classify it as a hymn of prase. Both are acceptable under the Magesterium.
 
Wow i cant believe what i just read, how are we to know God if not through the Bible?

Through His Church? The authors of the Bible?

Its his love letter to us. Some of it. other parts are History, fables, whatever

Also the Bible will interpret itself,

Sure it will!freesmileys.org/smileys/signs053.gif

there is one truth. If you say it can not be treated as actual history, then you deny him as our creator.

**And how did you get there, from there? **

Quote: Actually, it’s a book, written thousands of years ago, and it cannot prove itself.
I just dont no where you have your faith, because its apparently not in God

In His word and The correct interpretation of His word By His church?

Quote:
If the bible, is their proof and their interpretation of it, is the truth, what happens when it’s challenged? Poof…there goes their proof.

The scripture is to be compared with scripture, in this way you can only come to one conclution/interpretation, ‘TRUTH’. With this no faith can be shaken.

OK Einstein please tell me who was at the Empty Tomb? Is it:

MAT 28:1 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.

MAR 16:1 And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him.

JOH 20:1 The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.

Is Jesus equal to or lesser than?

Good question…:whacky:

May Gods people be unshaken.

**Why thank you! We are, and we wish all you non-believers would also be and come to Jesus’ church which He founded 2,000 years ago. We got it right! The sabbath was made for man not man for the sabbath. We worship Jesus on Sunday the way He wanted us to do. We never follow false prophets they will make you lose your soul!

God Bless
**
 
THE CREATION STORY

Bible readers fall into two groups. For the sake of simplicity, we may split Bible readers into two primary groups: Literalists and Contextualists. Literalists, also called fundamentalists, interpret the Bible literally, saying it means exactly what it says. Contextualists interpret the Bible contextually, saying we must consider the historical, cultural and literary context in which the Bible was written. This is particularly true of the first eleven chapters of the Book of Genesis, where the stories deal with prehistory, that twilight time between the appearance of people on earth and the telling of their story. Catholics use the Contextualist method of interpreting the Bible.

The first creation story reads like a poem. Each day of creation follows a pattern.

Day 1 God created light and SEPARATED it from the darkness.
Day 2 God SEPARATED the water above (rain) from the water below (sea).
Day 3 God SEPARATED the water below (sea) from the dry land.
Day 4 God POPULATED the sky with sun, moon, and stars.
Day 5 God POPULATED the air with birds and the sea with fish.
Day 6 God POPULATED the land with animals and people.
Day 7 God CELEBRATED; He blessed the day and rested on it.

Thee literary patterns of the Creation story suggests that we are dealing with a special kind of writing. It is not the kind found in eyewitness accounts or in science books. Rather, it is the kind found in children’s books. The authors of children’s books use simple, poetic stories to teach children about life. Such stories are easy to read and easy to remember.

The Genesis writer chose a similar approach to teach about God, because most ancient peoples could not read or write. They learned everything by word of mouth. Thus a poetic story was easy to remember, entertaining, and instructive.

The author of Genesis thought to teach three truths:

FIRST, that there is only one God. (Any other so-called Gods that were falsely worshiped could not be Gods since God, the creator, also created those so-called God’s and therefore they would be subject to God, the supreme ruler of the Universe.)

SECOND, that God planned creation. (Creation did not happen by chance or accident).

THIRD, that God created everything good.

Some readers of the Bible are surprised to discover that the Book of Genesis contains two creation stories. The second story begins in Chapter 2.

Why was this second story added? To answer this question we need to recall that the first five books of the Bible, called the Torah (“instruction”), or Penteuch (“five scrolls”), which were passed on orally for centuries. Only later were they written down. Apparently there were two oral traditions about creation. When the bible writer was inspired to record the Torah, he included both versions. They complemented one another. Both stories agree with the three truths as noted above.

The Second creation story also portrays God as working patiently over the body of the first man, much as a potter works patiently over a vase. This is important as it underscores the close relationship that exists between God and the first man.

Also the second story of creations teaches about the intimacy of marriage. God instructed the couple to be “one body” They are to have an intimacy toward one another similar to the one God has toward them. Thus God indicates that the purpose of marriage involves more than having children. It also involves an intimate relationship of love and support between husband and wife.

In summary, the second creation story complements the first one in two special ways. The second story underscores:

(1) The intimacy between God and humans, and
(2) The intimacy and equality between the sexes.

Some additional information about Genesis:

At a general audience on April 16, 1986, Pope John Paul II said that the theory of evolution is “only a probability, not a scientific certainty.” He went on to say that “the doctrine of faith, however, invariably affirms that a human’s spiritual soul is directly created by God. According to the hypothesis mentioned, it is possible that the human body, following the order impressed by the Creator on the energies of life, could have been gradually prepared in the forms of antecedent living beings. But the human soul, on which man’s humanity definitively depends, cannot emerge from matter because it is of a spiritual nature.”

In other words, God could have fashioned the universe through an evolutionary process. But whether He did it that way or by direct creation, He still must be acknowledged as its Maker. With this basic premise established, the Church encourages scientists and scholars to continue their investigation so that someday we may know with certainty the method God used to bring human beings and the universe to their present state of development. The ultimate answer will involve no conflict between scientific and religious truth, for God is the Author of both.

However, the Genesis account of creation is not to be shunned. Nor is it to be regarded as a scientific and anthropological account of the origins of the universe and the human race. Rather, the beautiful and inspiring passages in Genesis are to be read as religious history in which the author used figurative language and popular descriptions to teach fundamental religious truths about salvation. Some of those truths are that God in His goodness created the universe out of nothing; that everything He created was good; that He created the first humans in His image and likeness; that those first humans lost their state of perfect happiness through the sins of pride and disobedience; that the whole human race suffers from the consequences of their sins; and that one day there will be a Redeemer for fallen humanity.
Excellent. One of the best explanations I’ve read!
 
Wow i cant believe what i just read, how are we to no God if not through the Bible? Its his love letter to us.
Also the Bible will interpret itself, there is one truth. If you say it can not be treated as actual history, then you deny him as our creator.
We know God through His own divine revelation of Himself, most especially through the Eucharist, but in all the sacraments, in the Church, which is His Body, (through one another) and through His creation. The Bible was not written to be book of facts, but a religious history, an accounting of God’s interaction and revelation of Himself to humanity. God was creator before it was written, and was creator when people could not read and write. He will still be creator when the book passes away.
Quote: Actually, it’s a book, written thousands of years ago, and it cannot prove itself.
I just dont no where you have your faith, because its apparently not in God
Catholics do not make an idol out of the Holy Scriptures. We do not worship the book.
Quote:
If the bible, is their proof and their interpretation of it, is the truth, what happens when it’s challenged? Poof…there goes their proof.

The scripture is to be compared with scripture, in this way you can only come to one conclution/interpretation, ‘TRUTH’. With this no faith can be shaken.

May Gods people be unshaken. :O)
It is helpful to understand the Scriptures in the light of what other passages say. However, the Bible was never intended to interpret itself. This requires discernment, a characteristic that the Holy Writing, valuable as it is, does not have. Such activity requires a person.
 
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First_of_9:
Great! This is how I have felt about creation as a Protestant and well…simply had trouble verbalizing it at times…lol!
I love the analogy about the poetic language…I have always been confused by the arguement over literal 7 days and so forth…it misses the message…

We are created by God!
 
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Realcatholicgk:
There’s too much rationalism here. At root that’s the error that drove all but the origional Lutheran reformation, which was hijacked by it with the German High Scolastics. Even before it was formalized in the Renesance, it was the cause of many herricies. The Bible did not decend from heaven in the hands of an angel. It was not written on golden sheets to be read with magic glasses and King James did not follow Jesus around taking notes, nore did it come to him in a trance. And it is not a book! It is a collection of writings, reflecting what the early Church believed and was doing. There are other repositories in the Church, equally valid. The Church produced it. The Church assembled it. The Church ownes it in it’s authority as God’s present authority. And the Church alone inturprets it. It is part of the Church, but not the entirety of the Church. It is a creature of the Church, and the Church is not a creature of the Bible but of God by the authority of our Lord’s investiture of power and authority in St. Peter by physical means. Reading the Bible does not magically convey supernatural powers of inturpretation. Inturpretation is the provence of the Magestarium of the Church. I almost regret that the Bible fell into the hands of the people. As the Etheopian Eunic said to Phillip: “How can I understand if I have no teacher?” (Acts 8) Democracy has addeled the brain of humanity. Have faith in God through what you are taught by the church in it’s Magesterium (it’s teaching authority), not in what you figure out yourself. Yes, it is my vocation to “figure it out.” That’s what I’m trained for. But what I “figure out” goes into the Magesterium, which then tells me what to believe and teach, and to that I am absolutely, unquestioningly obedient.
 
It is helpful to understand the Scriptures in the light of what other passages say. However, the Bible was never intended to interpret itself. This requires discernment, a characteristic that the Holy Writing, valuable as it is, does not have. Such activity requires a person.
Actually, that’s not true. The Bible explains itself just fine, and with the subject of this thread, why don’t you try to prove your point?

I believe that in post #5 I did give a small example of how the Bible explains itself with this subject. Is there something wrong with what I wrote?
 
Inturpretation is the provence of the Magestarium of the Church. I almost regret that the Bible fell into the hands of the people. As the Etheopian Eunic said to Phillip: “How can I understand if I have no teacher?” (Acts 8) Democracy has addeled the brain of humanity. Have faith in God through what you are taught by the church in it’s Magesterium (it’s teaching authority), not in what you figure out yourself.
This…only, with modern day spelling. I’ve wanted to say this for a while.
 
P101, If the Bible explains itaelf, why are there so many Bible Only Churches? If the TRUTH of the Bible was self-evident there would be uniformity of belief among Bible Only Christians. The divided nature of the Bible Only Churches belies your assertion that the Bible reveals itself.
 
There’s too much rationalism here. At root that’s the error that drove all but the origional Lutheran reformation, which was hijacked by it with the German High Scolastics. Even before it was formalized in the Renesance, it was the cause of many herricies. The Bible did not decend from heaven in the hands of an angel. It was not written on golden sheets to be read with magic glasses and King James did not follow Jesus around taking notes, nore did it come to him in a trance. And it is not a book! It is a collection of writings, reflecting what the early Church believed and was doing. There are other repositories in the Church, equally valid. The Church produced it. The Church assembled it. The Church ownes it in it’s authority as God’s present authority. And the Church alone inturprets it. It is part of the Church, but not the entirety of the Church. It is a creature of the Church, and the Church is not a creature of the Bible but of God by the authority of our Lord’s investiture of power and authority in St. Peter by physical means. Reading the Bible does not magically convey supernatural powers of inturpretation. Inturpretation is the provence of the Magestarium of the Church. I almost regret that the Bible fell into the hands of the people. As the Etheopian Eunic said to Phillip: “How can I understand if I have no teacher?” (Acts 8) Democracy has addeled the brain of humanity. Have faith in God through what you are taught by the church in it’s Magesterium (it’s teaching authority), not in what you figure out yourself. Yes, it is my vocation to “figure it out.” That’s what I’m trained for. But what I “figure out” goes into the Magesterium, which then tells me what to believe and teach, and to that I am absolutely, unquestioningly obedient.
**Hello, The Preacher,👋

You are my newest and best friend! Welcome to the trenches!

As we both know, Before 1517AD, there was One christian church. “ONE” with several different sects. (They are still firmly together even today! ).
While some were attempting to right some wrong practices in the Church, the devil saw this as a change to infect the christian church and steal souls from the real church.

Foolishly, today there are 33,000 counterfeit denominations with 28,000 imitation sub denominations and 1,375 different doctrines that have emerged saying they follow the Bible. The only thing they all agree on is that the Catholic Church is wrong! 😃

The SDAs, 200 years ago changed the Worship day of the Christian Church, just like it was prophetizied By Daniel. But, he said “He” when it should have been she. We all know their prophet, Ms White was a woman! “He will speak out against the Most High and wear down the saints of the Highest One, and he will intend to make alterations in times and in law; and they will be given into his hand for a time, times, and half a time.” (Daniel 7:25)

God Bless!**
 
**
** As we both know, Before 1517AD, there was One christian church. “ONE” with several different sects. (They are still firmly together even today! ).
While some were attempting to right some wrong practices in the Church, the devil saw this as a change to infect the christian church and steal souls from the real church.

The SDAs, 200 years ago changed the Worship day of the Christian Church, just like it was prophetizied By Daniel. But, he said “He” when it should have been she. We all know their prophet, Ms White was a woman! “He will speak out against the Most High and wear down the saints of the Highest One, and he will intend to make alterations in times and in law; and they will be given into his hand for a time, times, and half a time.” (Daniel 7:25)
This sounds like another one of your fancy ways to detract from the subject at hand, and to avoid the already plainly stated facts here in this topic, and in many other topics which you post in. Your statement about Adventists here doesn’t even come close to Catholic teachings, let alone Adventist teachings.

There has also, always been more than one “Church” in existence. While the Bible doesn’t specifically name any one denomination, it clearly reflects more than one organization as being a “Church.”

In post #5 of this topic, the question was asked, “How could there be “evening and morning” on the first three days of creation?” A Bible answer was given. Do you have anything to add to that?
 
This…only, with modern day spelling. I’ve wanted to say this for a while.
I’ve never been able to spell, in four or five different languages no less. But then as a young man I was into into hot-rodding. Don’t bother me with paint and crome. Meet me on the drag strip. Please forgive me if I mistake your intent. It’s just that I’ve had to listen to the inconsequential since grammer school.
 
This sounds like another one of your fancy ways to detract from the subject at hand, and to avoid the already plainly stated facts here in this topic, and in many other topics which you post in. Your statement about Adventists here doesn’t even come close to Catholic teachings, let alone Adventist teachings.

There has also, always been more than one “Church” in existence. While the Bible doesn’t specifically name any one denomination, it clearly reflects more than one organization as being a “Church.”

In post #5 of this topic, the question was asked, “How could there be “evening and morning” on the first three days of creation?” A Bible answer was given. Do you have anything to add to that?
Did you ever consider that no denomination was named in the bible because the Early Christains, unlike today, were 100% unified in faith matters? In other words, there were no denominations at all.
 
I was always told, even as a Protestant, that the Church in the Bible was one in belief, but scattered by geography and hence subject to the transforming effects of different cultures. Hmmm…kind of like today!

This is what makes the most sense to me, as you can see various particular practices and modes within the Catholic Church (Roman Catholics, Eastern Catholics) and within the Orthodox Church (Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox) that are still under the umbrella of their universal church. I guess you could say that the Protestants are king of this, as they have how many different forms of one basic belief (that the Catholic Church is wrong, basically)? Yet they’re all Protestants, and many can’t even tell you the differences between their particular denomination and another Protestant denomination. They’re united if nothing else by their common belief that central authority is antithetical (or at least not necessary) to Christian belief.
 
I was always told, even as a Protestant, that the Church in the Bible was one in belief, but scattered by geography and hence subject to the transforming effects of different cultures. Hmmm…kind of like today!

This is what makes the most sense to me, as you can see various particular practices and modes within the Catholic Church (Roman Catholics, Eastern Catholics) and within the Orthodox Church (Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox) that are still under the umbrella of their universal church. I guess you could say that the Protestants are king of this, as they have how many different forms of one basic belief (that the Catholic Church is wrong, basically)? Yet they’re all Protestants, and many can’t even tell you the differences between their particular denomination and another Protestant denomination. They’re united if nothing else by their common belief that central authority is antithetical (or at least not necessary) to Christian belief.
I seem to remember Jesus saying something about that: You are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My Church. :hmmm: Of course Peter’s stay in this mortal coil wasn’t to be until our Lord’s return (please, no dispensationalists, I’m not in an indulgent mood today) so he was comissioned to pass this down by anointing and the laying on of hands in the unbroken succession. No succession, no Church. Your are right about there always having always been many different churches: Gnostic, Adoptionest, Arian, Scientologists, Mormons, Moonies, Unitarian Universalists a whole lot of churches. :whacky: But these churchs and others which have left the Appostolic Succession if not the bounds of sanity are not the Church. :nope:
 
Indeed. You’ll find no arguments against that here. In case it wasn’t clear from my post, I’m Catholic. 🙂
 
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