Catholics don't believe "Once saved, Always saved"?

[Father_Read]

Then what does “The Sacraments of Initiation can never be undone” mean?

Just in case the term “initiation” is causing some confusion, it means that Baptism, Confirmation and the Eucharist are the sacramental means for being initiated into the Church, as well as referring to the fact that they are the sacramental means for laying the foundation of Christian life. It does not mean an automatic initiation (as in the sense of being a type of entrance) into heaven at the end of ones life. As the Catechism states:

1212: The sacraments of Christian initiation - Baptism, Confirmation, and the Eucharist - lay the foundations of every Christian life. “The sharing in the divine nature given to men through the grace of Christ bears a certain likeness to the origin, development, and nourishing of natural life. The faithful are born anew by Baptism, strengthened by the sacrament of Confirmation, and receive in the Eucharist the food of eternal life. By means of these sacraments of Christian initiation, they thus receive in increasing measure the treasures of the divine life and advance toward the perfection of charity.”

However, it is still possible for someone to act in ways seriously contrary to the grace provided by God through these sacraments. Generally speaking, people can still commit mortal sin and fall from of a state of grace. Unless such people become reconciled with God, they are on the road to hell.

I hope this information helps.

 

[FreakyLocz14]

So once someone is initiated into the Catholic Church, they will always be Catholic?

A lot of Protestants believe that once they say “the sinner’s prayer” every single thing good or bad that they’ve ever done is covered by that prayer.

Catholics, on the other hand, believe that being ‘saved’ is a process. Not a one time event.

Honestly, this is one of the reasons why I became Catholic.

I don’t think that Jesus wants people to say a prayer and start acting like they could do anything they want because their sins are 'covered in the blood of Jesus."

I don’t think that saying a single prayer makes one a Christian. I think it’s a good start on the road of salvation, but not the “end all - be all” of the salvation experience.

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Their view is that it is impossible for humans to justify themselves, so God became human in Jesus to pay the price of our sins. Since the wages of sin have already been paid for by Jesus, anyone who accepts his sacrifice on their behalf is saved.

Essentially, most Protestants view Jesus’ sacrifice as a completely free and unmerited favor. In other words, a “get out of Hell free card”.

 

[Brendan]

So once someone is initiated into the Catholic Church, they will always be Catholic?

---

Their view is that it is impossible for humans to justify themselves, so God became human in Jesus to pay the price of our sins. Since the wages of sin have already been paid for by Jesus, anyone who accepts his sacrifice on their behalf is saved.

Essentially, most Protestants view Jesus’ sacrifice as a completely free and unmerited favor. In other words, a “get out of Hell free card”.

Catholics also belive that we cannot save ourselves. Unlike the Protestants that you mentions, Catholics also believe that we retain free will, and thus, can freely choose to accept or reject that Gift of Grace.

The Free, Unmerited Gift from God of Salvic Grace can be rejected and regained according to free will.

 

[GaryTaylor]

Catholics believe once saved you better get your butt into the Church. And “usually” the magnitude of the event confirms their better thinking.

 

[JimG]

Their view is that it is impossible for humans to justify themselves, so God became human in Jesus to pay the price of our sins. Since the wages of sin have already been paid for by Jesus, anyone who accepts his sacrifice on their behalf is saved.

Essentially, most Protestants view Jesus’ sacrifice as a completely free and unmerited favor. In other words, a “get out of Hell free card”.

So do Catholics. We believe that we are saved by God’s grace, which is completely unearned and cannot be merited. We are saved by being incorporated into Christ, and the sacraments are means that God uses to do that.

Also, there is certainly a sense in which we believe that salvation is permanent. The sacraments give grace, both a grace of help with our spiritual life, but more importantly sanctifying grace, which is a sharing in God’s own life. That grace is abiding, that is, it is permanent. God in effect moves into our soul and sets up housekeeping. He pitches His tent in us. He intends to stay permanently. But God does respect our free will. If we kick him out, he will leave.

 

[FreakyLocz14]

Catholics also belive that we cannot save ourselves. Unlike the Protestants that you mentions, Catholics also believe that we retain free will, and thus, can freely choose to accept or reject that Gift of Grace.

The Free, Unmerited Gift from God of Salvic Grace can be rejected and regained according to free will.

So do Catholics. We believe that we are saved by God’s grace, which is completely unearned and cannot be merited. We are saved by being incorporated into Christ, and the sacraments are means that God uses to do that.

Also, there is certainly a sense in which we believe that salvation is permanent. The sacraments give grace, both a grace of help with our spiritual life, but more importantly sanctifying grace, which is a sharing in God’s own life. That grace is abiding, that is, it is permanent. God in effect moves into our soul and sets up housekeeping. He pitches His tent in us. He intends to stay permanently. But God does respect our free will. If we kick him out, he will leave.

Catholics believe that a person needs to abstain from mortal sin in order to be saved. That doesn’t comply with the Protestant view of salvation. Most Protestants believe that salvation is sola fide (through faith alone). This means that all of a person’s past, present, and future sins are forgiven at the moment that person accepts Jesus Christ.

 

[TimothyH]

Catholics believe that we have been saved, are now being saved, and will be saved, just like it says in the Bible. Catholics believe that salvation is a past event, is ongoing now, and will be finalized at the end of time.

I could quote the verses - Hebrews 9, 1 and 2 Corinthian… We are saved, we are being saved, and we will be saved.

-Tim-

 

[Brendan]

Catholics believe that a person needs to abstain from mortal sin in order to be saved. That doesn’t comply with the Protestant view of salvation. Most Protestants believe that salvation is sola fide (through faith alone). This means that all of a person’s past, present, and future sins are forgiven at the moment that person accepts Jesus Christ.

Which, by definition then, means a lack of Free Will, that a person cannot thereafter reject God.

If such were the case, the Fall never would have happened, as both Adam and Eve had the full Gifts of Grace.

They certainly had Faith, as they both knew and accepted God as their Lord, but yet still rejected Him.

Of the Protestants that you speak of, how do they define Faith, is it something that God does on behalf of the faithful (does God belive FOR them), or is Faith something the Faithful do, albeit via the gift of Grace?

 

[JimG]

Catholics believe that a person needs to abstain from mortal sin in order to be saved. That doesn’t comply with the Protestant view of salvation. Most Protestants believe that salvation is sola fide (through faith alone). This means that all of a person’s past, present, and future sins are forgiven at the moment that person accepts Jesus Christ.

Yes, it seems very strange to me that one could believe that one could accept Christ, then later reject him freely, perhaps repeatedly, and still walk into heaven with no need of further repentance and reconciliation.

It’s as if I accepted Christ at age twelve, all my sins are forgiven. I then go on to become a serial murderer, and never worry about doing more murders because after all, I have already been saved, and I am headed straight for heaven in my final shootout with the cops.

 

[Cricket2]

What all this discussion tells me, is we should not take salvation as a guarantee. Because of our free will we can toss the gift away. No one should go about thinking they are safe just because we are baptized. At every moment of our lives we can choose to abandon Christ. He never abandons us; We do the leaving and sinning.

We should never take His forgiveness for granted either. What good is to us if after confessing our sins and receiving forgiveness we go directly out the door and sin again? We are held accountable for our choices and actions.

I think one thing some Catholics may forget concerning the Sacrament of Confession, or may not even know: the Priest can refuse absolution. This is particularly true if he determines that there is no intent on the part of the sinner of changing his/her behavior–or perhaps if the person has committed a serious crime and refuses to turn their self into the law. (Murder??)

I heard a Priest speak on this matter during a retreat. One of the things he explained was as long as we are living we can change, ask for forgiveness and make choices for or against God. But once we die, the moment we die, the condition or state we die in is permanent. There is no more opportunity for change, regret or penance…etc. He also reminded those attending that we are the ones that choose Hell if that is where we land up. We choose life with God or life without him due to our free will.

 

[yankees1990]

Nowhere in the bible does it say once saved always saved. Calvinists claim this i believe and some other cults(who claim only they go to heaven) but the bottom line is we dont have eternal security. Technically the ones who have eternal secuirty are the elect(the ones who make it) but honestly i dont think we will know if we are the elect until we die and see where our final destination is. Moreover there are verses that say we can actually fall away

like
“I am the true vine, and my Father is the gardener. 2 He cuts off every branch in me that bears no fruit, while every branch that does bear fruit he prunesso that it will be even more fruitful. You are already clean because of the word I have spoken to you. Remain in me, as I also remain in you. No branch can bear fruit by itself; it must remain in the vine. Neither can you bear fruit unless you remain in me.

“I am the vine; you are the branches. If you remain in me and I in you, you will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing. If you do not remain in me, you are like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up, thrown into the fire and burned. John 15:1-6

If we are not abiding in Christ(not habitually sinning) then here the father will remove you from the vine and you have to repent to actually get back on the vine i beleie

There is also hebrews chapter 6 that says if we fall away then we cant renew ourselves to repentance

 

[Lion_Heart]

Greetings in Christ,

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA The predestination of the elect

Quote: “Consequently, the whole future membership of heaven, down to its minutest details, … has been irrevocably fixed from all eternity. Nor could it be otherwise. For if it were possible that a predestined individual should after all be cast into hell or that one not predestined should in the end reach heaven, then God would have been mistaken in his foreknowledge of future events; He would no longer be omniscient.” End quote

JUSTIFICATION BY FAITH ALONE by James Akin
Quote: “In fact, in TRADITIONAL WORKS OF CATHOLIC THEOLOGY, one regularly encounters the statement that FORMED FAITH IS JUSTIFYING FAITH. If one has formed faith, one is justified. Period. End quote. (It is on the internet, every Catholic and Protestant should read and study it.)

To freely accept the GIFT OF FAITH, “THE WILL IS PREPARED BY THE LORD.” – Canon 4 of the Council of Orange (529 AD); John 6:44-45.

This formed faith produces INSTANT JUSTIFICATION and INSTANT SALVATION without water baptism and without sacraments, [CCC 1249]; Acts 10:44-48.

At the point of our conversion, (makes no difference that a person is Catholic or Protestant), “God raises us up together, and made us sit together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus.” (Eph.2:6)

Quote: “AUGUSTINE’S CONTRIBUTION TO OUR UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT IT MEANS TO BE IN THE BODY OF CHRIST.
We are inserted into the Body of Christ by our baptism and become members united to the Head, so that while our feet may be on earth we are already in heaven.” End quote.
The above quote taken from a public letter of Paul Maloney OSA Written September 19th 2012

So those who are saying we are not saved until we are in heaven, they are perfectly right, because at our conversion God takes us up to heaven.

CONDITIONS THAT OUR WORKS COUNT FOR ANYTHING

The Catholic Church clearly teaches that one MUST be in a STATE OF GRACE, MUST be a member of the BODY OF CHRIST, MUST be have been SAVED, MUST be already JUSTIFIED before we do a SINGLE WORK that counts for anything.

Further conditions MUST BE PRESENT to make SUPERNATURAL merit possible:

“The meritorious work must be morally good, that is, in accordance with the moral law in its object, intent, and circumstances.

It MUST be done FREELY, WITHOUT any EXTERNAL COERCION or INTERNAL NECESSITY.

It MUST be SUPERNATURAL, that is, AROUSED and ACCOMPANIED by ACTUAL GRACE, and proceeding from a SUPERNATURAL motive.

Strictly speaking only a person in the STATE OF GRACE can merit, as defined by the Church.” (Denzinger 1576, 1582)

JUSTIFICATION IN CATHOLIC TEACHING by Jimmy Akin

Quote: “The essence of supernatural love is unselfishness—doing something NOT BECAUSE IT WILL HELP US SOMEHOW, but because we want to do it out of SHEER LOVE for the other person, whether that person is God or one of our fellow human beings out of the love of God.
This is THE ONLY KIND of love that ultimately pleases God and therefore the ONLY KIND that ultimately gets us a reward IN heaven.” End quote. Emphasis mine.

If we believe: Work is condition of our salvation, then our works can NEVER BE UP TO THE ABOVE STANDARDS because we do it for ourselves to purchase salvation not for love and for the Glory of God, and ALL our work goes up in smoke at the judgment of 1 Cor.3:11-15.

With love in Christ,
LH

 

[Judas_Thaddeus]

Then what does “The Sacraments of Initiation can never be undone” mean?

I don’t know about the phrase “The Sacraments of Initiation can never be undone,” but as for
“Once saved, Always saved,” how does one know when he or another is saved? Salvation is
always available, once gained, that doesn’t mean it can’t be lost. Now suppose someone ac-
cepts Christ as his Lord and Savior. Based on that, we can figure that he is saved, but what
if he later in life rejects Christ? Does this “Once saved, Always saved” doctrine still apply, e-
ven in the hypothetical situation in which this imaginary person dies without repenting his re-
jection of Jesus?

The idea of “Once saved, Always saved” overrides the concept of free will, relies on the pre-
sumption of salvation “no matter what I do…”rolleyes, and further more is not in adherence with *
Tota Scriptura*, All of Scripture, with which the Catholic Church is serious about, sorry no.

That is why the NASB is terrible…youtube.com/watch?v=t6dvPGgPAyo
youtube.com/watch?v=c41InKBfT30

 

[Lion_Heart]

I don’t know about the phrase “The Sacraments of Initiation can never be undone,” but as for
“Once saved, Always saved,” how does one know when he or another is saved? Salvation is
always available, once gained, that doesn’t mean it can’t be lost. Now suppose someone ac-
cepts Christ as his Lord and Savior. Based on that, we can figure that he is saved, but what
if he later in life rejects Christ? Does this “Once saved, Always saved” doctrine still apply, e-
ven in the hypothetical situation in which this imaginary person dies without repenting his re-
jection of Jesus?

The idea of “Once saved, Always saved” overrides the concept of free will, relies on the pre-
sumption of salvation “no matter what I do…”rolleyes, and further more is not in adherence with *
Tota Scriptura*, All of Scripture, with which the Catholic Church is serious about, sorry no.

That is why the NASB is terrible…youtube.com/watch?v=t6dvPGgPAyo
youtube.com/watch?v=c41InKBfT30

Greetings in Christ, Judas

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA The predestination of the elect

Quote: “Consequently, the whole future membership of heaven, down to its minutest details, … has been irrevocably fixed from all eternity. Nor could it be otherwise. For if it were possible that a predestined individual should after all be cast into hell or that one not predestined should in the end reach heaven, then God would have been mistaken in his foreknowledge of future events; He would no longer be omniscient.” End quote

THIS IS THE WAY THAT ALL PREDESTINED GET TO HEAVEN

To freely accept the GIFT OF FAITH, “THE WILL IS PREPARED BY THE LORD.” – Canon 4 of the Council of Orange (529 AD); John 6:44-45.

A Tiptoe Through TULIP by James Akin
Quote: Trent’s Decree of Justification, canon 16, speaks of “THAT GREAT AND SPECIAL GIFT OF FINAL PERSEVERANCE,” and chapter 13 of the decree speaks of “the gift of perseverance of which it is written: ‘He who perseveres to the end shall be saved [Matt. 10:22, 24:13],’ WHICH CANNOT BE OBTAINED FROM ANYONE EXCEPT FROM HIM WHO IS ABLE TO MAKE HIM WHO STANDS TO STAND [Rom. 14:4].” End quote (Emphasize mine)

The elects CANNOT lose their salvation because their salvation is protected by God’s GREAT AND SPECIAL GIFT OF FINAL PERSEVERANCE.

2 Tim.4:18 “And the Lord will deliver me from every evil work and preserve me for His heavenly kingdom. …” Also proves the above doctrine of “GOD’S GREAT AND SPECIAL GIFT OF FINAL PRSEVERANCE.”

With love in Christ,
LH

 

[Judas_Thaddeus]

Greetings in Christ, Judas
CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA The predestination of the elect
Quote: “Consequently, the whole future membership of heaven, down to its minutest details, … has been irrevocably fixed from all eternity. Nor could it be otherwise. For if it were possible that a predestined individual should after all be cast into hell or that one not predestined should in the end reach heaven, then God would have been mistaken in his foreknowledge of future events; He would no longer be omniscient.” End quote
THIS IS THE WAY THAT ALL PREDESTINED GET TO HEAVEN
To freely accept the GIFT OF FAITH, “THE WILL IS PREPARED BY THE LORD.” – Canon 4 of the Council of Orange (529 AD); John 6:44-45.
A Tiptoe Through TULIP by James Akin
Quote: Trent’s Decree of Justification, canon 16, speaks of “THAT GREAT AND SPECIAL GIFT OF FINAL PERSEVERANCE,” and chapter 13 of the decree speaks of “the gift of perseverance of which it is written: ‘He who perseveres to the end shall be saved [Matt. 10:22, 24:13],’ WHICH CANNOT BE OBTAINED FROM ANYONE EXCEPT FROM HIM WHO IS ABLE TO MAKE HIM WHO STANDS TO STAND [Rom. 14:4].” End quote (Emphasize mine)
The elects CANNOT lose their salvation because their salvation is protected by God’s GREAT AND SPECIAL GIFT OF FINAL PERSEVERANCE.
2 Tim.4:18 “And the Lord will deliver me from every evil work and preserve me for His heavenly kingdom. …” Also proves the above doctrine of “GOD’S GREAT AND SPECIAL GIFT OF FINAL PRSEVERANCE.”
With love in Christ,
LH

I think you’re taking that out of context, something TRUE, but I think the “Once Saved,
Always Saved” doctrine is talking about something different from what you’re bringing up,
as “Once Saved, Always Saved” is a Calvinist doctrine, declared heretical (I believe) at
the Council of Trent.

 

[Cricket2]

Greetings in Christ, Judas

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA The predestination of the elect

Quote: “Consequently, the whole future membership of heaven, down to its minutest details, … has been irrevocably fixed from all eternity. Nor could it be otherwise. For if it were possible that a predestined individual should after all be cast into hell or that one not predestined should in the end reach heaven, then God would have been mistaken in his foreknowledge of future events; He would no longer be omniscient.” End quote

THIS IS THE WAY THAT ALL PREDESTINED GET TO HEAVEN

To freely accept the GIFT OF FAITH, “THE WILL IS PREPARED BY THE LORD.” – Canon 4 of the Council of Orange (529 AD); John 6:44-45.

That we can turn away from our God and lose our salvation seems evident to me in the following scripture: Ezekiel 3:19-21…Yet if thou warn the wicked, and he turn not from his wickedness, nor from his wicked way, he shall die in his iniquity; but thou hast delivered thy soul. 20Again, When a righteous man doth turn from his righteousness, and commit iniquity, and I lay a stumbling block before him, he shall die: because thou hast not given him warning, he shall die in his ssin, and his righteousness which he hath done shall not be remembered…etc.

We must be actively involved and ever cautious concerning our salvation. We can lose it at our own fault.
A Tiptoe Through TULIP by James Akin
Quote: Trent’s Decree of Justification, canon 16, speaks of “THAT GREAT AND SPECIAL GIFT OF FINAL PERSEVERANCE,” and chapter 13 of the decree speaks of “the gift of perseverance of which it is written: ‘He who perseveres to the end shall be saved [Matt. 10:22, 24:13],’ WHICH CANNOT BE OBTAINED FROM ANYONE EXCEPT FROM HIM WHO IS ABLE TO MAKE HIM WHO STANDS TO STAND [Rom. 14:4].” End quote (Emphasize mine)

The elects CANNOT lose their salvation because their salvation is protected by God’s GREAT AND SPECIAL GIFT OF FINAL PERSEVERANCE.

2 Tim.4:18 “And the Lord will deliver me from every evil work and preserve me for His heavenly kingdom. …” Also proves the above doctrine of “GOD’S GREAT AND SPECIAL GIFT OF FINAL PRSEVERANCE.”

With love in Christ,
LH

 

[Judas_Thaddeus]

Lion Heart;11431851:

Greetings in Christ, Judas…

I don’t know, I still default to my previous answer:

I think you’re taking that out of context, something TRUE, but I think the “Once Saved,
Always Saved” doctrine is talking about something different from what you’re bringing up,
as “Once Saved, Always Saved” is a Calvinist doctrine, declared heretical (I believe) at
the Council of Trent.

 

[Cricket2]

Greetings in Christ, Judas

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA The predestination of the elect

Quote: “Consequently, the whole future membership of heaven, down to its minutest details, … has been irrevocably fixed from all eternity. Nor could it be otherwise. For if it were possible that a predestined individual should after all be cast into hell or that one not predestined should in the end reach heaven, then God would have been mistaken in his foreknowledge of future events; He would no longer be omniscient.” End quote

THIS IS THE WAY THAT ALL PREDESTINED GET TO HEAVEN

To freely accept the GIFT OF FAITH, “THE WILL IS PREPARED BY THE LORD.” – Canon 4 of the Council of Orange (529 AD); John 6:44-45.

A Tiptoe Through TULIP by James Akin
Quote: Trent’s Decree of Justification, canon 16, speaks of “THAT GREAT AND SPECIAL GIFT OF FINAL PERSEVERANCE,” and chapter 13 of the decree speaks of “the gift of perseverance of which it is written: ‘He who perseveres to the end shall be saved [Matt. 10:22, 24:13],’ WHICH CANNOT BE OBTAINED FROM ANYONE EXCEPT FROM HIM WHO IS ABLE TO MAKE HIM WHO STANDS TO STAND [Rom. 14:4].” End quote (Emphasize mine)

The elects CANNOT lose their salvation because their salvation is protected by God’s GREAT AND SPECIAL GIFT OF FINAL PERSEVERANCE.

2 Tim.4:18 “And the Lord will deliver me from every evil work and preserve me for His heavenly kingdom. …” Also proves the above doctrine of “GOD’S GREAT AND SPECIAL GIFT OF FINAL PRSEVERANCE.”

With love in Christ,
LH

What about the following scripture?: St. Mark 8:35-38 "For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel’s the same shall save it. 36 For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? 37 Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul? 38 Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.

Is this not an indication that we can in fact lose our soul to the devil, and thus our salvation?

 

[Lion_Heart]

What about the following scripture?: St. Mark 8:35-38 "For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel’s the same shall save it. 36 For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? 37 Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul? 38 Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.

Is this not an indication that we can in fact lose our soul to the devil, and thus our salvation?

Greetings in Christ, Cricket2

I agree with you that people can lose salvation, and in my previous posts I stated that people can lose salvation and end up in hell.

What I have proved above is not “Once saved always saved.”
I have proved: Those whom God has predestined to Heaven cannot lose their salvation and all of them end up in Heaven.
This is not the same with “Once saved always saved.”

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA The predestination of the elect

Quote: “Consequently, the whole future membership of heaven, down to its minutest details, … has been irrevocably fixed from all eternity. Nor could it be otherwise. For if it were possible that a predestined individual should after all be cast into hell or that one not predestined should in the end reach heaven, then God would have been mistaken in his foreknowledge of future events; He would no longer be omniscient.” End quote

Scripture Catholic by John Salza. (Catholic Apologetics)
III. Predestination and the “Elect”
Quote: “There are two types of predestination, TO GRACE and TO GLORY. … Predestination is either to grace (which we COULD lose) or to glory (which we CANNOT lose). … 1 Tim.2:6 – Jesus Christ gave Himself as a ransom for all (not just for the elect). But only those predestined to glory will be saved.” End quote. (Emphasize mine.)

SUMMARY OF THE ABOVE TWO CITATION

1. All predestined to heaven will end up in Heaven. CAN BE NO EXCEPTION.
2. All predestined to grace (even if they become Christians) they will all end up in hell. CAN BE NO EXCEPTION.

These doctrines above are official teachings of the Church.

If we look at the above picture we can see the mistake of the protestants.

They assume: Only those whom God predestined to Heaven become Christians.
So, they are saying: “Once saved always saved.”

Their mistake is: They don’t realize, not just only a predestined can be a Christian. – This is very clear from Hebr.6:4-6.

If they would say: “All predestined to heaven end up in Heaven” they would be right.

In fact: “Once saved always saved,” and “All predestined to heaven end up in Heaven,” based on the same principle.

The mistakes of some Catholics who are not familiar with related Catholic doctrines, conclude: If a Christian can end up in hell, then any Christian can end up in hell.

They don’t realize those Christians whom God has predestined to Heaven in fact CAN NOT end up in hell and CAN NOT die outside the state of grace.

According to Catholic doctrine which comes from the above doctrine: Those who are not predestined to heaven cannot die in the state of grace.

With love in Christ,
LH