Catholics in American History

[katewithak]

Church Militant:

I think maybe you are. I hate to link this garbage, but maybe you need a wake-up call. Fresh-Hope’s “Just For Catholics” read-only forum and if you really wanna see one of the very worst anti-Catholic forums around then register (you probably have to) and look at their “Apologetics” forum. (Important note: I DO NOT AT ALL recommend that any of you bother to post there. It is so bad & such a waste of time that most all of the Catholics that were there [Myself included] are currently boycotting them. This is absolutely not a call for a board swarm and you are better off not to post there…ever.)

I left out the parts about the one guy threatening me and the foul language remarks. I don’t tell everything, and there is quite a bit more that is none of your business. Suffice it to say that I know what I’m talking about.

It’s not just ignorance, it’s the lousy attitudes & misinformation that lead so many people to attack our faith.

When I was in elementary school I was told about a local priest who was shot to death on the porch of his rectory because he married a couple where one of them wasn’t a Catholic.

If you haven’t experienced it then fine and Glory Be To God, but don’t try tell the rest of us that it doesn’t exist because of that.
Pax tecum,

Actually, CM, the prejudice is much less now than it used to be. Partly because many people just dismiss the Church as silly or quaint even and don’t get worked up about it as much as their fore bears. Partly because they do not feel any threat from it, especially when the President is an Protestant. Partly because of the rise in New Age. And partly because of John Paul II and the respect he engendered around the world and Mother Teresa’s impact as well softened people’s outlook toward the Church. And partly because the Church’s attention has been taken up by the abuse scandal and therefore, maybe, it has not been quite as involved in other “in your face” issues as it was.
As a Catholic back in 70’s and 80’s, I experienced prejudice and discrimination much more than I do now. I have only been threatened physically once in the last two years. The discrimination really has calmed down.

 

[Church_Militant]

katewithak:

Actually, CM, the prejudice is much less now than it used to be. Partly because many people just dismiss the Church as silly or quaint even and don’t get worked up about it as much as their fore bears. Partly because they do not feel any threat from it, especially when the President is an Protestant. Partly because of the rise in New Age. And partly because of John Paul II and the respect he engendered around the world and Mother Teresa’s impact as well softened people’s outlook toward the Church. And partly because the Church’s attention has been taken up by the abuse scandal and therefore, maybe, it has not been quite as involved in other “in your face” issues as it was.
As a Catholic back in 70’s and 80’s, I experienced prejudice and discrimination much more than I do now. I have only been threatened physically once in the last two years. The discrimination really has calmed down.

That’s a very good point Kate, but the level of vitriol in the rhetoric deeply concerns me. I’d like to say that I have confidence in the clear thinking of the American people in general, but every time I do they seem to prove me wrong again.

Is it possible that the level has dropped because it’s not PC to express such prejudices as freely as it used to be? Or is it because we (as a society) have been focused on terrorism as a “unifying” force. It has been the philosophy of governments before (The art of leadership . . . consists in consolidating the attention of the people against a single adversary and taking care that nothing will split up that attention. – Adolf Hitler, ‘Mein Kampf’).

During the last couple of elections there was much discussion of the deep divisions that exist in the views of the American people, so I’m just thinking aloud here which is really off topic.

I believe that Catholics have made many good contributions in the course of American history.

[Charles Carroll of Carrollton](Charles Carroll of Carrollton) signed the declaration of independence with his city of residence because it was pointed out that the British would have a tough time finding him among all those with what was (apparently at that time) a very common name.
Pax vobsicum,

 

[Alfie]

Church Militant:

That’s a very good point Kate, but the level of vitriol in the rhetoric deeply concerns me. I’d like to say that I have confidence in the clear thinking of the American people in general, but every time I do they seem to prove me wrong again.

Is it possible that the level has dropped because it’s not PC to express such prejudices as freely as it used to be? Or is it because we (as a society) have been focused on terrorism as a “unifying” force. It has been the philosophy of governments before (The art of leadership . . . consists in consolidating the attention of the people against a single adversary and taking care that nothing will split up that attention. – Adolf Hitler, ‘Mein Kampf’).

During the last couple of elections there was much discussion of the deep divisions that exist in the views of the American people, so I’m just thinking aloud here which is really off topic.

I believe that Catholics have made many good contributions in the course of American history.

[Charles Carroll of Carrollton](Charles Carroll of Carrollton) signed the declaration of independence with his city of residence because it was pointed out that the British would have a tough time finding him among all those with what was (apparently at that time) a very common name.
Pax vobsicum,

How come so many Protestants are married to Catholics if we are so anti-Catholic.

I wouldn’t mention Hitler in an argument since he was raised Catholic and he got his Nazi philosophy from the writings of an Austrian Catholic monk.

 

[Church_Militant]

Alfie:

How come so many Protestants are married to Catholics if we are so anti-Catholic.

I wouldn’t mention Hitler in an argument since he was raised Catholic and he got his Nazi philosophy from the writings of an Austrian Catholic monk.

There are a great many who are indeed anti-Catholic, though most of those who are married to Catholics are not so. Your comment is a non-sequitur.

Yes Hitler was born Catholic but he did not get his philosphy from a monk. He borrowed from a vast array of different religions and cults to create his own arryan religion. I note that you provide no proof of that allegation. No surprise there.

Moreover Hitler was himself anti-Catholic and our faithful suffered right in line behind the Jews. Look up St. Maximilian Kolbe and LINKS to more info. And then maybe Nazi Persecution of the Catholic Church.

 

[katewithak]

Church Militant:

That’s a very good point Kate, but the level of vitriol in the rhetoric deeply concerns me. I’d like to say that I have confidence in the clear thinking of the American people in general, but every time I do they seem to prove me wrong again.

Is it possible that the level has dropped because it’s not PC to express such prejudices as freely as it used to be? Or is it because we (as a society) have been focused on terrorism as a “unifying” force. It has been the philosophy of governments before (The art of leadership . . . consists in consolidating the attention of the people against a single adversary and taking care that nothing will split up that attention. – Adolf Hitler, ‘Mein Kampf’).

SIZE]

I’m not sure exactly why it has calmed down, but yes, the terrorism threat might have something to do with. War does seem to be a unifying cause frequently. But I do not believe rejecting Catholicism is just what people do in their leisure time. I can cite two instances and maybe find a motive.
1.16 years ago, I was expecting my first child and had a car accident next to a large farmhouse out in a rural area. The owner of the house kindly invited me to come in and sit down and call my doctor. I described my injuries to the doctor and he told me to come to emergency right away and he would meet me there. He asked if the homeowner could drive me, I checked, the man said yes. At this point some hired help the guy had on the farm showed up and I thought we were on the way to his car to go to the hospital. Next thing I knew, I was in a horse trough being baptized by the homeowner. He had spotted my scapular, you see. Arguing ensued in which I informed him I had to go to the hospital NOW as there was some concern I would lose my baby. He let me out of the horse trough but refused to drive me unless I gave up my pagan ideas and accepted the Lord. I pointed out I could not force him legally to drive me to the hospital, but perhaps a case for assault could be made where the horse trough was concerned. At that point, he and his buddy drove me in stony silence to the hospital. I tell you I was terrified on two accounts- of them because I thought they were insane and did not know what they would do next, and secondly that i would lose the baby.I began under my breath reciting a rosary at which point he pulled over and pushed me physically out of the car and began screaming witch. I just walked the rest of the way in tears. This was a Southern baptist minister in California with his own congregation. Ultimately, I did lose the baby. I have no idea to this day whether it was due to the accident, his actions, or what. I was 6 months along at the time.
2. Two years ago, my husband bought baseballs for the little league team off of Ebay. The seller, looking through our Ebay feedback, found out we had bought several crystal rosaries, and Catholic books off of Ebay. He then began mailing us threatening e-mail, talking incredibly obscene stuff about Catholics, and threatening murder in a mayhem fashion toward us and a priest. In vivid detail he went through imaginary sex acts and murderous acts, with various weapons that he envisioned as occurring with us and a priest combined. I guess any priest. How he did it, I will never know, but he discovered my daughter and her age.This guy was seven states removed from us, but then he told us he was coming to an ebay convention in a town 40 miles from us and he had our address from the shipping package. At this point, the police were involved, they contacted the FBI, my children were removed from school until after the ebay date. The FBI contacted the state troopers were he lived, they found his house, found the computer with the letters on it, but they have never located him. The house was empty except for the computer, papers, envelopes etc. He did not use his real name and he used someone else’s bank account to open his ebay account. Who, what, why or where? We have moved subsequently and we have never heard from him again. Just nuts? More than the Baptist minister or less? Who can know the motives of these people?
I have radically changed our lifestyle where the public is concerned. Maybe that is why I think there is less prejudice or hatred for Catholics.
I stay primarily in a Catholic world- maybe that is why I think there is less hatred of Catholics. Maybe there is less, or maybe I have insulated myself from it. ???
Sometimes on this forum though, I read some posts and think nothing has changed-not at all.

 

[jim1130]

katewithak:

I’m not sure exactly why it has calmed down, but yes, the terrorism threat might have something to do with. War does seem to be a unifying cause frequently. But I do not believe rejecting Catholicism is just what people do in their leisure time. I can cite two instances and maybe find a motive.
1.16 years ago, I was expecting my first child and had a car accident next to a large farmhouse out in a rural area. The owner of the house kindly invited me to come in and sit down and call my doctor. I described my injuries to the doctor and he told me to come to emergency right away and he would meet me there. He asked if the homeowner could drive me, I checked, the man said yes. At this point some hired help the guy had on the farm showed up and I thought we were on the way to his car to go to the hospital. Next thing I knew, I was in a horse trough being baptized by the homeowner. He had spotted my scapular, you see. Arguing ensued in which I informed him I had to go to the hospital NOW as there was some concern I would lose my baby. He let me out of the horse trough but refused to drive me unless I gave up my pagan ideas and accepted the Lord. I pointed out I could not force him legally to drive me to the hospital, but perhaps a case for assault could be made where the horse trough was concerned. At that point, he and his buddy drove me in stony silence to the hospital. I tell you I was terrified on two accounts- of them because I thought they were insane and did not know what they would do next, and secondly that i would lose the baby.I began under my breath reciting a rosary at which point he pulled over and pushed me physically out of the car and began screaming witch. I just walked the rest of the way in tears. This was a Southern baptist minister in California with his own congregation. Ultimately, I did lose the baby. I have no idea to this day whether it was due to the accident, his actions, or what. I was 6 months along at the time.
2. Two years ago, my husband bought baseballs for the little league team off of Ebay. The seller, looking through our Ebay feedback, found out we had bought several crystal rosaries, and Catholic books off of Ebay. He then began mailing us threatening e-mail, talking incredibly obscene stuff about Catholics, and threatening murder in a mayhem fashion toward us and a priest. In vivid detail he went through imaginary sex acts and murderous acts, with various weapons that he envisioned as occurring with us and a priest combined. I guess any priest. How he did it, I will never know, but he discovered my daughter and her age.This guy was seven states removed from us, but then he told us he was coming to an ebay convention in a town 40 miles from us and he had our address from the shipping package. At this point, the police were involved, they contacted the FBI, my children were removed from school until after the ebay date. The FBI contacted the state troopers were he lived, they found his house, found the computer with the letters on it, but they have never located him. The house was empty except for the computer, papers, envelopes etc. He did not use his real name and he used someone else’s bank account to open his ebay account. Who, what, why or where? We have moved subsequently and we have never heard from him again. Just nuts? More than the Baptist minister or less? Who can know the motives of these people?
I have radically changed our lifestyle where the public is concerned. Maybe that is why I think there is less prejudice or hatred for Catholics.
I stay primarily in a Catholic world- maybe that is why I think there is less hatred of Catholics. Maybe there is less, or maybe I have insulated myself from it. ???
Sometimes on this forum though, I read some posts and think nothing has changed-not at all.

Oh my gosh! I am sick reading this!!! Honestly, I don’t think much has really changed. Ignorance still runs amok.

 

[katewithak]

Alfie:

How come so many Protestants are married to Catholics if we are so anti-Catholic.

I wouldn’t mention Hitler in an argument since he was raised Catholic and he got his Nazi philosophy from the writings of an Austrian Catholic monk.

One reason is that many Protestants do not view Catholicism as an obstacle. My husband was married previously to a Protestant. He was seventeen. She wanted to be married in the their parish church. She liked the stained glass windows and all the antique stuff. She agreed to raise the children Catholic. Unfortunately, against my husband’s will, she aborted two pregnancies. Hr reasoning was they could not afford children. He left her and obtained an annullment. If you do not believe in something, it certainly is not an obstacle, now is it? If Protestants think Catholicsm is just silliness, why would they not marry one?