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christianwillia
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do you feel that the catholics not united with rome are really catholic
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Atreyu
Guest
Personally no not really. I don’t really see a difference between a so-called “catholicnotincommunionwithrome” and an Orthodox.
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Mijoy2
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It’s a contradiction in terms.
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severinus
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Ubi Petrus ibi Ecclesia.
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Joseph_Bilodeau
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Itdependsonwhythey’renotincommunionwithrome.
Edit: apparantly there’s a limit on how many characters you can string together without a space.
Edit: apparantly there’s a limit on how many characters you can string together without a space.
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cainem
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your profile says polish national catholic, please come home all are welcome,
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Rebecca_New
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Rome Sweet Home (where’d I hear that?)
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ByzantineCatho
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“Where Peter is, there is the Church” (St.Ambrose)
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puzzleannie
Guest
It is not my call. I am not their priest, not their bishop, nobody has delegated me to be the unity police. My opinion is worthless, they are responsible for their own souls. My responsibility is to hold, believe, teach and live all that the Catholic Church teaches, and to be faithful in my marriage, family commitments, and calling to hand on Catholic teaching to the children and adults entrusted to me. I am not called upon to make a judgement on the behavior or internal spiritual life of any Catholic, or any other person. Useless discussion in my opinion. the time could be better served making an individual examination of conscience on my own fidelity and obedience.
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christianwillia
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i was roman catholic all my life. I believe in the teachings.What Idon’t believe in all the man made rules that the church has.Likepriests can’t marry, pope lnfallabity,birthcontrol,divorceand remarriage and so on.Things that are not in the bible. I wanted a church that teaches the true catholic faith. thats why i joined the pncc. Even the pope say we have valid scaraments. There are diaologs between the pncc and the rc. theres not that much that keeps us apart.lets hope we can become one again like christ wanted.
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Forest-Pine
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I think that even if they don’t know it, and even if they are “awful” at it, if they identify themselves as Catholic, then they are Catholic. Maybe some have some fine-tuning to do in their theology. And some shouldn’t be in positions of authority (like a wayward priest). But I wouldn’t ever want someone who actually says he is Catholic to feel like I am saying he’s not welcome in the church.
Granted, I have a complex theory about pedophiles who are repentant. I say they shouldn’t be stripped of their vestements and kicked out on the street to be our next door neighbor who is now a pedophile without a sense of community and with a chip on his shoulder. (After the civil authorities have finished with them) they should be in hermetic communities where they will have a community to be accountable to, the ability to live out their calling to serve Christ, and will be secluded from society and children…
Just personal opinion that isn’t worth much, but it does highlight the fact that as long as people want to be a part of the church there is a place for the person somewhere. (But it might not be where the person wants it to be.)
I wouldn’t want one of the “priestess” nuns teaching my kiddos.
Or one of the pro-divorce, pro-contraception, eucharist is symbolic Catholics leading my Bible study.
But that doesn’t mean I don’t want them in the church.
The same holds true for schismatic religions such as the Orthodox. (I know nothing about the PNCC.) Many Orthodox say they are Catholic. I’m not going to be the one to tell them they are not. If they say they are in communion with Rome (even if the leaders of their religion say they are not), I will take the individual’s word for it. Who am I to read his heart? At the same time, even though I agree with several Orthodox teachings, there is no way in the world I could bring myself to renounce Rome (as the Orthodox would require me to do). I am currently looking into Eastern Catholicism. It is my understanding that the same Orthodox beliefs are held by Catholics who ARE in communion with Rome.
You might be interested in the thread I started entitled “Does the RCC allow us to be EO?” (RCC=Roman Catholic Church; EO= Eastern Orthodox) Pretty much, Rome says an Orthodox CAN be in communion with Rome. The Orthodox say if you reach that point you are no longer in communion with THEM. So the problem is not on Rome’s side for such people, but in the rigidity of their own religion. I also encourage you to look into Eastern Catholicism such as the Byzantine and Ruthenian churches as well.
Granted, I have a complex theory about pedophiles who are repentant. I say they shouldn’t be stripped of their vestements and kicked out on the street to be our next door neighbor who is now a pedophile without a sense of community and with a chip on his shoulder. (After the civil authorities have finished with them) they should be in hermetic communities where they will have a community to be accountable to, the ability to live out their calling to serve Christ, and will be secluded from society and children…
Just personal opinion that isn’t worth much, but it does highlight the fact that as long as people want to be a part of the church there is a place for the person somewhere. (But it might not be where the person wants it to be.)
I wouldn’t want one of the “priestess” nuns teaching my kiddos.
Or one of the pro-divorce, pro-contraception, eucharist is symbolic Catholics leading my Bible study.
But that doesn’t mean I don’t want them in the church.
The same holds true for schismatic religions such as the Orthodox. (I know nothing about the PNCC.) Many Orthodox say they are Catholic. I’m not going to be the one to tell them they are not. If they say they are in communion with Rome (even if the leaders of their religion say they are not), I will take the individual’s word for it. Who am I to read his heart? At the same time, even though I agree with several Orthodox teachings, there is no way in the world I could bring myself to renounce Rome (as the Orthodox would require me to do). I am currently looking into Eastern Catholicism. It is my understanding that the same Orthodox beliefs are held by Catholics who ARE in communion with Rome.
You might be interested in the thread I started entitled “Does the RCC allow us to be EO?” (RCC=Roman Catholic Church; EO= Eastern Orthodox) Pretty much, Rome says an Orthodox CAN be in communion with Rome. The Orthodox say if you reach that point you are no longer in communion with THEM. So the problem is not on Rome’s side for such people, but in the rigidity of their own religion. I also encourage you to look into Eastern Catholicism such as the Byzantine and Ruthenian churches as well.
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AlanFromWichita
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Yes, exactly. I understood it to be even a little stronger than that; once you are baptized or accepted into the Church, you are objectively still Catholic, even though you may renounce your faith or be excommunicated.
Many Catholics are understandibly disturbed that others aren’t as seemingly “faithful” think it’s a good idea to tell them they aren’t really Catholic. This, to me, could lead them into sin because leaving the Church, as I understand, is a sin. Plus, it’s incorrect theology. That’s why it’s a “Catch-22” as one poster put it, for orthodox Catholics who wish to label someone “not Catholic” but in so doing, become “not completely assenting” themselves!
Best bet, I think, is to go with Church teachings and acknowledge them as Catholic, lest we judge ourselves by judging them.
Alan
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abcdefg
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here we go again:
Catholics not in communion with Rome are not TRUE Catholics
example: those ONLY in communists controlled churches
Catholics not in communion with Rome are not TRUE Catholics
example: those ONLY in communists controlled churches
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Jimmy_B
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The Catholics not united with Rome, do not know or understand their own faith. I feel CAF can help. Until they leave the Church, there’s always hope.
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AlanFromWichita
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Yes, here we go again.
Why do you deny the teachings of the Church? Are you heterodox?
I didn’t understand the part about communist controlled churches. How does that make a difference on Church teachings?
Alan
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abcdefg
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church controlled by chinese communists allows(if not promotes) abortion and ABC
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Atreyu
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How do you know that the Bible is the Word of God? I would disagree that these examples that you have listed are man made. It’s pretty clear that Catholic theology is very consistent with the Bible on divorce and remarriage, check out Matthew 19:1-12 for a pretty good explanation of divorce. Papal infallibility is also Biblical (not to mention historically accurate); check out the Catholic Answers’ library for discussion of this.
As for priests not marrying, I would admit that this is a man made rule in a manner of speaking. But it is not doctrine; it is not an absolute rule. St Paul said that it is good to stay unmarried if you are not married, as you can concentrate more on Godly things (but it is better to get married rather than burn with passion). Priests need to concentrate more on Godly things, so it is a good thing that they do not get married.
Now for contraception, I would agree that there isn’t much explicity set out in the Bible. But does that mean that contraception is ok? What if I said that contraception isn’t allowed in the Bible, therefore it is wrong? Christians today face a completely different world than did the Christians of the apostles’ era. If we reject everything but the Bible, then we have no mechanism to combat these new issues that face the world from year to year.
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rwoehmke
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If the Polish National Catholic Church allows all of these positions with the possible exception of a married priesthood, it becomes more like one of the protestant denominations than some form of Catholicism. The emphasis on Sola Scriptura alone is a tip off to this fact. Valid sacraments alone does not define a Catholic church. The term Catholic in the name becomes rather meaningless.
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