Catholics on Yoga

[inthecloud]

As someone yo do martial arts and is interested in European Western (read Catholic/Ortthodox) and Asian Mysticism. I have lots of trouble with yoga.

1. Yoga is part of hindu mysticism. Is about breaking the chain of reincarnations and becoming one with the Brahma.
2. There are many differents kinds of yoga. Some like Karma-yoga are based in doing good deeds for salvation, sort of Pelagian herecy. Some are the esoteric chacra-yoga are based in manipulating energy centers in the body. Others like like batkhi yoga resemble Catholic mysticism in creating trough prayer and contemplation a void Dark Night that them is filled with the Everything. Some kind of yoga resemble the Hesicasm mysticism of Eastern Orthodox monks. And there is Hatha Yoga who is the most popular kind of yoga marketed in the west. Is about reaching deep meditation often exercising a deep control of the body. As a exercise is is OK but if done right it should come with a heavy monistic hinduism package that is not compatible with teistic Catholicism.

 

[mwmroe]

I was born and raised Catholic and I lost all interest in it. I would say that I had faith to begin with, but I lost my faith. And eventually I got involved many forms of Hinduism and the New Age. So it’s easy to be deceived if you’re not catechized well in your faith to begin with. I guess if you think you can separate yoga from its spiritual and religious aspect. But to be honest with you I don’t know how you can really do that. I think eventually you can be drawn in by the subtleties of the spiritual and religious aspects of Hinduism. And if towards the end of the class they don’t ask you to recite some prayer, or meditate on the energy of their guru, or they don’t read to you from one of their religious books. I guess you might be ok, but that’s not always the case. There are many other ways to get physically fit. Why pick yoga? The goal of yoga is to realign the serpent force in the body in order to attain enlightenment. This yoking which is what yoga means with Brahman. There are many other ways to get physically fit and your better off doing that then choosing yoga. Find a form of physical fitness that doesn’t have some spiritual or religious aspect at the heart of it.

 

[mwmroe]

This of course is different than Catholics doing yoga exercise from a video tape or taking lessons at the local YMCA.

Also, at this time, you were not involved with your Catholic Faith, which is why you were able to be sucked into the New Age Movement and Hinduism.

As a several Catholic priest have told me, if you can separate the spiritual aspects of yoga, there’s no problem.

Its when you being to go into the spiritual aspects that can be harmful, especially for some one who has no spiritual faith to begin with.

Jim

I was born and raised Catholic and I lost all interest in it. I would say that I had faith to begin with, but I lost my faith. And eventually I got involved in many forms of Hinduism and the New Age. So it’s easy to be deceived if you’re not catechized well in your faith to begin with. I guess if you think you can separate yoga from its spiritual and religious aspect. But to be honest with you I don’t know how you can really do that. I think eventually you can be drawn in by the subtleties of the spiritual and religious aspects of Hinduism. And if towards the end of the class they don’t ask you to recite some prayer, or meditate on the energy of their guru, or they don’t read to you from one of their religious books. I guess you might be ok, but that’s not always the case. There are many other ways to get physically fit. Why pick yoga? The goal of yoga is to realign the serpent force in the body in order to attain enlightenment. This yoking which is what yoga means with Brahman. There are many other ways to get physically fit and your better off doing that then choosing yoga. Find a form of physical fitness that doesn’t have some spiritual or religious aspect at the heart of it.

 

[mwmroe]

…

 

[mwmroe]

Left a second copy.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

mwmroe

well I never went beyond using Yoga videos and all they do is Power Yoga exercises. They never get into any form of meditation.

Why do Yoga? Because its good for you. In fact, its the best exercise I’ve found, especially after turning 40.

I sounds like what you got into was traditional Yoga, in the classic sense.

The Yoga most Americans are learning these days, is not traditional yoga, but uses the physical exercises and breathing techniques, and they call it yoga. The woman on PBS that is teaching yoga, this is not traditional yoga, as in India. I work with an Indian who knows traditional yoga, and he finds the PBS series humorous.

These same exercises are found in sports and in palates and other forms of exercise, because they are good for you.

I also studied Tai Chi, but here again, my instructor never got into anything spiritual. She taught us the 108 forms, and how to breath through them. She taught us about chi energy which is nothing more than the bio-electrical impulses, that you body uses to move various parts of your body. People who are searching for some mystical, grasshopper experience, swallow the mysticism behind chi energy, but its really bogus in that regard. Tai Chi isn’t even a good martial art, which many instructors try to sell it as. You have to use some common sense.

Anyway, neither of these forms of exercise ever compromised by faith. If anything, it help me in my prayer, because a sound body and mind is more conducive to prayer than a out of shape, dunderheaded one.

Jim

 

[mwmroe]

mwmroe

well I never went beyond using Yoga videos and all they do is Power Yoga exercises. They never get into any form of meditation.

Why do Yoga? Because its good for you. In fact, its the best exercise I’ve found, especially after turning 40.

I sounds like what you got into was traditional Yoga, in the classic sense.

The Yoga most Americans are learning these days, is not traditional yoga, but uses the physical exercises and breathing techniques, and they call it yoga. The woman on PBS that is teaching yoga, this is not traditional yoga, as in India. I work with an Indian who knows traditional yoga, and he finds the PBS series humorous.

These same exercises are found in sports and in palates and other forms of exercise, because they are good for you.

I also studied Tai Chi, but here again, my instructor never got into anything spiritual. She taught us the 108 forms, and how to breath through them. She taught us about chi energy which is nothing more than the bio-electrical impulses, that you body uses to move various parts of your body. People who are searching for some mystical, grasshopper experience, swallow the mysticism behind chi energy, but its really bogus in that regard. Tai Chi isn’t even a good martial art, which many instructors try to sell it as. You have to use some common sense.

Anyway, neither of these forms of exercise ever compromised by faith. If anything, it help me in my prayer, because a sound body and mind is more conducive to prayer than a out of shape, dunderheaded one.

Jim

“Although yoga is sold to the west through various gimmicks and techniques its basic occultism remains the same the hope of immortality is at its heart and the dream of realizing ones inherent divinity its ultimate purpose, become a Christ they call it. Despite the claims that yoga is only physical and non-religious it is the very essence of Hinduism spirituality. It eventually leads to the realm of the spiritual through meditation where the person looks into himself to find the true self and in finding the true self he believes he is finding god.”

“Yoga in its many westernized forms is also at the heart of the New Age movement that has adopted Hinduisms basic beliefs and goals. In spite of the seeming variety and hundreds of competitive schools of yoga all forms come out of India and lead into the occult though most westerners are not aware of this.”

“This new yoga in the west went into a sort of amalgamation with occult and Gnostic groups and the Hindu mythology was put forward in a sort of demythologized way which we now recognize in such terminology as New Age. The age of enlightenment, the age of the superman, the man with super consciousness has begun. God is losing all importance man is the only thing which matters. Man is saving himself by his knowledge by the development of his mind faculties.”

Quote from God’s of the New Age

If you have the time it may be helpful for you watched the video “God’s of the New Age.”
video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6272335793596892362&q=god%27s+of+the+new+age

EWTN Audio Library File Index
ewtn.com/vondemand/audio/file_index.asp?SeriesId=842969394&pgnu
You may want to listen to 3. Meditation Control Host - Fr. Mitch Pacwa, S.J.

Blessings

 

[JimR-OCDS]

If you have the time it may be helpful for you watched the video “God’s of the New Age.”
video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6272335793596892362&q=god%27s+of+the+new+age

EWTN Audio Library File Index
ewtn.com/vondemand/audio/file_index.asp?SeriesId=842969394&pgnu
You may want to listen to 3. Meditation Control Host - Fr. Mitch Pacwa, S.J.

Blessings

I’m familiar with these and they have no connection to what I’m talking about.

I’ve been doing power yoga for 10 years. I know priest who do yoga. All are devote Catholics.

I disagree that doing yoga exercise will lead a Catholic into the occult or eastern forms of spirituality. Only a person of very weak faith or no faith at all, will get drawn into such things. I’ve never been drawn to Eastern religion or the occult, nor have the many Catholics who I know, who do yoga, karate or tai chi.

Jim

 

[Bennie_P]

I’m familiar with these and they have no connection to what I’m talking about.

I’ve been doing power yoga for 10 years. I know priest who do yoga. All are devote Catholics.

I disagree that doing yoga exercise will lead a Catholic into the occult or eastern forms of spirituality. Only a person of very weak faith or no faith at all, will get drawn into such things. I’ve never been drawn to Eastern religion or the occult, nor have the many Catholics who I know, who do yoga, karate or tai chi.

Jim

And it will be your example that may help lead a person weak in faith just do that. Just because everyone is doing it doesn’t mean it will not cause harm. Even if you are right about yourself and the strength of your faith, in your own words “only a person that is very weak in thier faith will get drawn into such things”. What about the youth of the Church? or the “culture Catholic” that doesn’t really practice thier faith? If they have knowledge of you taking yoga classes, or another active member in the Church, have we no responsiblity to them? not to put our stamp of approval on something that may lead them astray? Just as Hinduism and Buddhism teachings one to look into themselves, is that not what you are practicing when you do not think of harm you may contribute to those of weaker faith?

Isn’t that what Paul is talking about when he gives instruction concerning the meat of idols?

1Co 8:9 But take heed lest by any means this liberty of yours become a stumblingblock to the weak.
1Co 8:10 For if a man see thee who hast knowledge sitting at meat in an idol’s temple, will not his conscience, if he is weak, be emboldened to eat things sacrificed to idols?
1Co 8:11 For through thy knowledge he that is weak perisheth, the brother for whose sake Christ died.
1Co 8:12 And thus, sinning against the brethren, and wounding their conscience when it is weak, ye sin against Christ.

 

[mwmroe]

I’m familiar with these and they have no connection to what I’m talking about.

I’ve been doing power yoga for 10 years. I know priest who do yoga. All are devote Catholics.

I disagree that doing yoga exercise will lead a Catholic into the occult or eastern forms of spirituality. Only a person of very weak faith or no faith at all, will get drawn into such things. I’ve never been drawn to Eastern religion or the occult, nor have the many Catholics who I know, who do yoga, karate or tai chi.

Jim

If you were familiar with this video and audio program you would understand that they do have a very real connection to what you’re talking about. I’ve tried to explain this to you. At the heart of yoga is Eastern spirituality. The whole goal of yoga is to prepare you for meditation. It’s true that a person with a very weak faith or no faith at all can be drawn into these things. There are people I’m sure that went into Eastern religions that never found their way out. I guess I was one of the lucky ones.

EWTN Audio Library File Index
ewtn.com/vondemand/audio/…842969394&pgnu
You may want to listen to 3. Meditation Control Host - Fr. Mitch Pacwa, S.J.

Blessings

 

[mwmroe]

I’m familiar with these and they have no connection to what I’m talking about.

I’ve been doing power yoga for 10 years. I know priest who do yoga. All are devote Catholics.

I disagree that doing yoga exercise will lead a Catholic into the occult or eastern forms of spirituality. Only a person of very weak faith or no faith at all, will get drawn into such things. I’ve never been drawn to Eastern religion or the occult, nor have the many Catholics who I know, who do yoga, karate or tai chi.

Jim

If you were familiar with this video and audio program you would understand that they do have a very real connection to what you’re talking about. Yoga is the very essence of Hinduisms spirituality. The whole goal of yoga is to prepare you for meditation. It’s true that any person with a very weak faith or no faith at all can get drawn into these things. There are people I’m sure that went into Eastern religion that never found their way out. I may have been one of the fortunate ones.

EWTN Audio Library File Index
ewtn.com/vondemand/audio/…842969394&pgnu
You may want to listen to 3. Meditation Control Host - Fr. Mitch Pacwa, S.J.

Blessings

 

[JimR-OCDS]

Bennie P

And it will be your example that may help lead a person weak in faith just do that. Just because everyone is doing it doesn’t mean it will not cause harm. Even if you are right about yourself and the strength of your faith, in your own words “only a person that is very weak in thier faith will get drawn into such things”.

People who are weak in their faith, aren’t looking at what Catholics do, but rather, they’re looking outside the Church.

What about the youth of the Church? or the “culture Catholic” that doesn’t really practice thier faith? If they have knowledge of you taking yoga classes, or another active member in the Church, have we no responsiblity to them?

They’ll know that as a Catholic, they can do yoga exercises and still remain faithful.

However, knowing that Catholics are doing yoga isn’t the problem, the problem is, not having faith in the first place. Faith in Jesus Christ is what makes us Catholic. If doing yoga exercises is going to take you away from the Church, you really didn’t have faith in the first place, and no one can give or take away faith from another person. Faith comes from God.

Jim

 

[Bennie_P]

Bennie P

People who are weak in their faith, aren’t looking at what Catholics do, but rather, they’re looking outside the Church.

They’ll know that as a Catholic, they can do yoga exercises and still remain faithful.

However, knowing that Catholics are doing yoga isn’t the problem, the problem is, not having faith in the first place. Faith in Jesus Christ is what makes us Catholic. If doing yoga exercises is going to take you away from the Church, you really didn’t have faith in the first place, and no one can give or take away faith from another person. Faith comes from God.

Jim

So it doesn’t matter if we live as good examples for our weaker brethren? Once one has faith it is unshakable, right? And we all are giving the same amount all at once?
And Paul’s instruction about not making our brethren stumble is for another time and not today? Yes faith comes from God, but doesn’t he want us to give strength and support to one another?

1Co 8:9 But take heed lest by any means this liberty of yours become a stumblingblock to the weak.
1Co 8:10 For if a man see thee who hast knowledge sitting at meat in an idol’s temple, will not his conscience, if he is weak, be emboldened to eat things sacrificed to idols?
1Co 8:11 For through thy knowledge he that is weak perisheth, the brother for whose sake Christ died.
1Co 8:12 And thus, sinning against the brethren, and wounding their conscience when it is weak, ye sin against Christ.



Hinduism and Buddhism teaches one to look into themselves, is that not what one is practicing when they do not think of the harm they may contribute to those of weaker faith?

 

[JimR-OCDS]

Bennie P

So it doesn’t matter if we live as good examples for our weaker brethren?

Doing yoga exercise isn’t an example of living a deviant lifestyle, that would lead people into harmful lifestyles. Your quotes from scripture is a typical fundamentalist method, where they apply literal interpretations to anything they disagree with.

People will know your faith by your love and the good works you do, not what type of exercises you do, especially exercises done in the privacy of my own home. The idea that this will lead people astray is silly.

Also, I know many people who practice yoga, and they are very kind and compassionate people.

I know you have a mental block against anything east of Rome, but the fact is, yoga exercises are healthy for you and are not dangerous spiritually.

You can argue your point all day long, but you’ll never convince me otherwise.

Jim

 

[mwmroe]

Bennie P

Doing yoga exercise isn’t an example of living a deviant lifestyle, that would lead people into harmful lifestyles. Your quotes from scripture is a typical fundamentalist method, where they apply literal interpretations to anything they disagree with.

People will know your faith by your love and the good works you do, not what type of exercises you do, especially exercises done in the privacy of my own home. The idea that this will lead people astray is silly.

Also, I know many people who practice yoga, and they are very kind and compassionate people.

I know you have a mental block against anything east of Rome, but the fact is, yoga exercises are healthy for you and are not dangerous spiritually.

You can argue your point all day long, but you’ll never convince me otherwise.

Jim

Doing yoga may not be and example of living a deviant lifestyle in the privacy of your own home, but it can set a bad example if you advocated it or you have children. Its true, people are going to know you by your love and your good works, not by the exercises you do, unless you advocate it or set a bad example. It’s not silly if by your outward example it leads and uniformed Christian mind into practice Hinduism’s spirituality. It’s true there are many people who practice yoga and I’m sure they are kind and compassionate people, but they maybe uniformed about the real nature of yoga. Yoga is the essence of Hinduisms spirituality and it was designed to prepare you for meditation. I don’t think there is a mental block against anything east of Rome, like myself I experienced the dangers of Hinduism personally. Your right, yoga exercises are healthy for you, but what you may not realize is that yoga was designed to arouse the kundalini energy, but your instructor may not speak about kundalini, your instructor may speak about the energy, raising the energy, trying to get the energy up, indicate that this simply means you are getting more healthy, and that can be dangerous spiritually, especially if it leads you into the occult. What their trying to help you do is rouse the serpent power, and force it into the spine, through the chakras, or spiritual centers in order for you to achieve enlightenment, to go divine, to help you achieve supernatural powers. The breathing exercises are designed to help you absorb the prana, the energy life force in the cosmos, to push it up through the chakras or psychic centers, awaking the Shakti or kundalini force to bring about psychic powers. I know we can argue our point all day long and we will never convince you otherwise.

Blessings

 

[JimR-OCDS]

mwmroe

Doing yoga may not be and example of living a deviant lifestyle in the privacy of your own home, but it can set a bad example if you advocated it or you have children. Its true, people are going to know you by your love and your good works, not by the exercises you do, unless you advocate it or set a bad example. It’s not silly if by your outward example it leads and uniformed Christian mind into practice Hinduism’s spirituality.

Actually it doesn’t get into Hinduisms spirituality, unless you choose to go there. I don’t, I’m into Catholic Spirituality.

It’s true there are many people who practice yoga and I’m sure they are kind and compassionate people, but they maybe uniformed about the real nature of yoga.

I don’t think they’re as uninformed as you perceive.

Yoga is the essence of Hinduisms spirituality and it was designed to prepare you for meditation.

If you mean by prepares a person for meditation by making their bodies more relaxed and in better health, then this is conducive toward Catholic meditation as well, and in that there is absolutely nothing wrong.

I don’t think there is a mental block against anything east of Rome, like myself I experienced the dangers of Hinduism personally.

Were you a devote Catholic when you got into these dangers?

My guess is you were not. How did you end up becoming Catholic, if you were into these dangerous things?

Your right, yoga exercises are healthy for you, but what you may not realize is that yoga was designed to arouse the kundalini energy, but your instructor may not speak about kundalini, your instructor may speak about the energy, raising the energy, trying to get the energy up, indicate that this simply means you are getting more healthy, and that can be dangerous spiritually, especially if it leads you into the occult.

This is baloney that New Age people try to say about Yoga, Tai Chi, atrsology and cyrstals. Most American yoga exercise, that people are doing, don’t get into these levels of quakery. Catholics I know who do yoga, certainly don’t.

I don’t have an instructor, as I said earlier, I used a Power Yoga exercise video. I learned the postures and flow, and now I don’t need the video at all. However, I’m also a friend of mine is a yoga instructor. She teaches at various corporations and at the YMCA.
She’s a Christian.

The breathing exercises are designed to help you absorb the prana, the energy life force in the cosmos, to push it up through the chakras or psychic centers, awaking the Shakti or kundalini force to bring about psychic powers. I know we can argue our point all day long and we will never convince you otherwise.

More New Age grasshopperism. You swallowed it at one time, because you were looking for some spiritual awakening of some sort and traveled down a path that could be dangerous, but being you came to Christianity, apparently wasn’t all that bad.

Also, there have been dangerous paths that Christianity has led people down. Self crucifixions, suicides and various christian cults that sprang up over the years. Such dangers are unique to Hinduism, but to those who distort and abuse spirituality for their own sake.

Anyway, I’m glad you found your way to Christ.

Jim