Catholics, Orthodox and Evangelicals: A Paradox

[Eggnotz]

Catholicism and Orthodoxy are the oldest manifestations of Christianity. They hold to Tradition and claim Apostolic Succession. The Great Schism notwithstanding, they both are contiguous with the Early Church. They are the repository of the Ancient Faith, give or take.

It is highly paradoxical that the latter-day manifestion of evangelicalism has produced more Christians that stand up for the basic tenets of the faith. The woods are full of Catholic and Orthodox politicians who flout everything Christianity stands for in order to achieve some political imperative. To many, ethnicity and political gain are the priority while they claim to be Orthodox or Catholics.

Evangelicals have a funky hermeneutic* but, POUND FOR POUND, take the mandates of scripture more seriously.

The “Bidens” and the “Snowes” of the world lay claim to their respective ecclesiastical pedigrees when it suits their purpose.

“And do not think you can say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as our father.’ I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham.” Matthew 3:9

Biden and Snowe are cited here as metaphors for people who claim to be Christian and act against the Gospel. No one knows the heart and they should not be personally judged, certainly not by me.

*I was evangelical for decades so I took some license.

 

[wisdomseeker]

Catholicism and Orthodoxy are the oldest manifestations of Christianity. They hold to Tradition and claim Apostolic Succession. The Great Schism notwithstanding, they both are contiguous with the Early Church. They are the repository of the Ancient Faith, give or take.

It is highly paradoxical that the latter-day manifestion of evangelicalism has produced more Christians that stand up for the basic tenets of the faith. The woods are full of Catholic and Orthodox politicians who flout everything Christianity stands for in order to achieve some political imperative. To many, ethnicity and political gain are the priority while they claim to be Orthodox or Catholics.

Evangelicals have a funky hermeneutic* but, POUND FOR POUND, take the mandates of scripture more seriously.

The “Bidens” and the “Snowes” of the world lay claim to their respective ecclesiastical pedigrees when it suits their purpose.

“And do not think you can say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as our father.’ I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham.” Matthew 3:9

Biden and Snowe are cited here as metaphors for people who claim to be Christian and act against the Gospel. No one knows the heart and they should not be personally judged, certainly not by me.

*I was evangelical for decades so I took some license.

Are you serious? evangelicals take the gospels more seriously? where did you get that?

:byzsoc:

 

[Eggnotz]

Are you serious? evangelicals take the gospels more seriously? where did you get that?

That’s not exactly what I said, but that happens all the time.

Anyway, when I was an evangelical the people I sat in Church with were pro-life and took the mandate to be salt and light seriously. When I was Orthodox and now that I’m Catholic I’ve realized something. In the Orthodox Churches I belonged to and the Catholic Church I now belong to, you can’t swing a cat without hitting 5 people who vote consistently for pro-choice candidates who work against life.

I’m Catholic because, at its heart, Catholicism is the most dedicated to helping the poor and living out the Gospel. That is not what I said. (My post said “pound for pound”.) I’m talking about any distribution of pew sitters in the Churches I mentioned. I stand by my paradox.

How can people sit so close to the Truth and yet be so obtunded? Paradox indeed.

 

[wisdomseeker]

That’s not exactly what I said, but that happens all the time.

Anyway, when I was an evangelical the people I sat in Church with were pro-life and took the mandate to be salt and light seriously. When I was Orthodox and now that I’m Catholic I’ve realized something. In the Orthodox Churches I belonged to and the Catholic Church I now belong to, you can’t swing a cat without hitting 5 people who vote consistently for pro-choice candidates who work against life.

I’m Catholic because, at its heart, Catholicism is the most dedicated to helping the poor and living out the Gospel. That is not what I said. (My post said “pound for pound”.) I’m talking about any distribution of pew sitters in the Churches I mentioned. I stand by my paradox.

How can people sit so close to the Truth and yet be so obtunded? Paradox indeed.

i quite understand what you are saying. but in the world we live in today is very easy to see the wrong of others. we must take care that we are not judging others. those who dissobeying the laws of God will soon realize they are on the wrong side of the fence.
take for example the woman who fought for abortion rights, today she is fighting against what she once tought was right. until this day she suffers immenselly the consequences.

we must be patient with them. we must keep our hope that they will repent some day and realize their wrongs.
we are all subject to temptation and who the devil tempts the most?" Catholics. the devil knows about the Church Jesus built, this is the One the devil is going to pay attention to. since his goal is to take over what belongs to God.

God Bless.

 

[4Squarebaby]

Perhaps because in most of the evangelic world it is not a sin to miss a Saturday/Sunday service. The motivation to be in the pew is slightly different. People with differing political beliefs thus are not “forced” to show up and create the paradox.

 

[Eucharisted]

Judge not, lest ye be judged.

The Church of Christ is Holy, and no other ecclestial community can claim this, for the Church of Christ is the Body of Christ, and Jesus Christ is Thrice-Holy: God Himself and perfect man. The Church is Thrice-Holy because it resembles the Holy Trinity, being a Triune Divine Institution: Church Militant, Church Suffering, and Church Triumphant. And the Mystery of the Church is further known by meditating on the Mystery of the Trinity, which in turn is further known by meditating on the Mystery of the Church. Such is the work of the omnipotence of God!

 

[Eggnotz]

-The Catholic Church proclaims abortion to be murder.

-A person insists that they are Catholic.

-They vote for, and financially support, people who increase the number of abortions.

Is this an incongruity? Yes.

Is this a paradox? I’m sorry but, yes.

Am I judging the state of someone’s soul? No.

Am I judging when I suggest that “A does not equal non-A”? Paradox is the correct word.

 

[Eggnotz]

Perhaps because in most of the evangelic world it is not a sin to miss a Saturday/Sunday service. The motivation to be in the pew is slightly different. People with differing political beliefs thus are not “forced” to show up and create the paradox.

That’s certainly “backing into the issue”! There may be something to that.

However, one would think it important to connect the dots and come to another conclusion. If the goal of going to Church against one’s desires (being “forced”) is to presumably get one’s “attendance ticket” punched in order to get into Heaven, wouldn’t one also want their “I don’t contribute to the killing of babies ticket” punched as well?

Missing Church is bad so they go. Voting for someone who amps up abortions worldwide is OK? There’s a term for this: “cognitive dissonance”.

 

[4Squarebaby]

That’s certainly “backing into the issue”! There may be something to that.

However, one would think it important to connect the dots and come to another conclusion. If the goal of going to Church against one’s desires (being “forced”) is to presumably get one’s “attendance ticket” punched in order to get into Heaven, wouldn’t one also want their “I don’t contribute to the killing of babies ticket” punched as well?

Missing Church is bad so they go. Voting for someone who amps up abortions worldwide is OK? There’s a term for this: “cognitive dissonance”.

Consider, the local Priest can never say don’t come to Mass but he can support politicians because of their stand on other issues. Is the ordinary Catholic above his pastor?

 

[Eggnotz]

Consider, the local Priest can never say don’t come to Mass but he can support politicians because of their stand on other issues. Is the ordinary Catholic above his pastor?

Is this the Nuremberg defense?

 

[4Squarebaby]

Is this the Nuremberg defense?

Well I don’t understand the structure and supervision of the Church, but if the Bishop remains silent about one of his Priest being a social/political liberal is the ordinary pew sitter suppose tro hold that Priest to a higher standard?

 

[Eggnotz]

Well I don’t understand the structure and supervision of the Church, but if the Bishop remains silent about one of his Priest being a social/political liberal is the ordinary pew sitter suppose tro hold that Priest to a higher standard?

I deleted my Nuremberg reference because it was a poor choice of terms for the situation. You were awfully quick on the trigger there pardner. (Actually I was slow.) My apologies.

Well, I have only been Catholic for 2 years so I’m not the guy to ask. I was an evangelical for decades.

Anyway, absent some social/political presupposition, some intellectual honesty might be in order. There are indeed many liberal causes where Christianity wrote the book. We were in the helping business first. Taking care of the less fortunate is a command.

But having said that, caring for the homeless is good. Entering into a womb and snapping off a baby’s arm like a chicken bone and sucking them into a jar before heading out to lunch is not.

It isn’t a zero sum game.

We shouldn’t accept the dismembering of a human being with 46 chromosomes like the rest of us in order to be in a position to feed the homeless. I mean no disrepect but, as far as a Priest’s position in this regard, I’m not the guy to ask.

Like I said, I’m a catholic newbie. You should get an opinion from someone else. This is just my opinion. Your mileage may vary.

 

[Eucharisted]

I deleted my Nuremberg reference because it was a poor choice of terms for the situation. You were awfully quick on the trigger there pardner. (Actually I was slow.) My apologies.

Well, I have only been Catholic for 2 years so I’m not the guy to ask. I was an evangelical for decades.

Anyway, absent some social/political presupposition, some intellectual honesty might be in order. There are indeed many liberal causes where Christianity wrote the book. We were in the helping business first. Taking care of the less fortunate is a command.

But having said that, caring for the homeless is good. Entering into a womb and snapping off a baby’s arm like a chicken bone and sucking them into a jar before heading out to lunch is not.

It isn’t a zero sum game.

We shouldn’t accept the dismembering of a human being with 46 chromosomes like the rest of us in order to be in a position to feed the homeless. I mean no disrepect but, as far as a Priest’s position in this regard, I’m not the guy to ask.

Like I said, I’m a catholic newbie. You should get an opinion from someone else. This is just my opinion. Your mileage may vary.

Welcome home! You can learn the faith by reading the Catechism of the Catholic Church.

You can read the writings of the Church Fathers here.

Important Church documents, encyclicals, papal homilies, and events can be found on the official website of the Holy See: www.vatican.va

Other noteworthy links:
Church Fathers on the Catholic Church
Catholic Answers Tracts
Compendium of the Social Doctrine of the Church
Saint Francis of Assisi’s ‘Body of the Lord’

Please don’t feel overwhelmed! You don’t need to check out everything at once; take your time, trust in the Lord. God bless!

 

[Eggnotz]

Welcome home! You can learn the faith by reading the Catechism of the Catholic Church.

You can read the writings of the Church Fathers here.

Important Church documents, encyclicals, papal homilies, and events can be found on the official website of the Holy See: www.vatican.va

Other noteworthy links:
Church Fathers on the Catholic Church
Catholic Answers Tracts
Compendium of the Social Doctrine of the Church
Saint Francis of Assisi’s ‘Body of the Lord’

Please don’t feel overwhelmed! You don’t need to check out everything at once; take your time, trust in the Lord. God bless!

Thank you.

 

[Eucharisted]

Thank you.

You’re welcome

 

[Hesychios]

Catholicism and Orthodoxy are the oldest manifestations of Christianity. They hold to Tradition and claim Apostolic Succession. The Great Schism notwithstanding, they both are contiguous with the Early Church. They are the repository of the Ancient Faith, give or take.

It is highly paradoxical…

You are right.

It is paradoxical.