Was it a common practice before Vatican II to rebaptize (conditional baptism) of non-Catholics with trinitarian baptisms?Actually, I think that before Vatican II, many non-Catholics were conditionally baptised when entering the Catholic Church. So the Church at that time did not unconditionally recognise the baptism of non-Catholics in a non-Catholic Church.
It was a common practice, but don’t get it wrong here–conditional baptism is not “rebaptism.” No one can be re-baptized. Baptism is a once-only thing that leaves an indelible mark on the soul.I wasn’t so sure about this:
Was it a common practice before Vatican II to rebaptize (conditional baptism) of non-Catholics with trinitarian baptisms?
Yes, non-Catholic converts were “Conditionally Baptized” before entering the Church through Confirmation and Eucharist before the RCIA. As they are still, in the RCIA if there is serious questions about the validity of their non-Catholic Baptisms.I wasn’t so sure about this:
Was it a common practice before Vatican II to rebaptize (conditional baptism) of non-Catholics with trinitarian baptisms?
Would this have been common if and when the converts were coming from ecclesial communities with known trinitarian baptism (i.e. Lutheran, Methodist, Anglican) and had documentation it had occured?Yes, non-Catholic converts were “Conditionally Baptized” before entering the Church through Confirmation and Eucharist before the RCIA. As they are still, in the RCIA if there is serious questions about the validity of their non-Catholic Baptisms.
Mormon baptism is a tricky thing…I’m going to be rebaptized after my RCIA is done. I was Mormon before, and they use the Trinitarian formula.
The formula applied by the Mormons might appear to be a Trinitarian formula. But in reality, while the formula of the Mormons is similar to the formula of the Catholic faith, there is no fundamental doctrinal agreement in its application. The Mormon invocation of the Trinity is not a true invocation of the Trinity because the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, according to them, are not three persons in which subsists the one Godhead, but three gods who form one divinity.
The Mormons believe that the divinity originated when three gods decided to unite and form the divinity in order to bring about human salvation. Furthermore, the Mormons believe that God the Father is an exalted man, a native from another planet, who has acquired his divine status through a death similar to that of human beings, this being a necessary way of becoming divine. God the Father has relatives and this is explained by the doctrine of infinite regression of the gods who initially were mortal. God the Father has a wife, the Heavenly Mother, with whom he shared the responsibility of creation. They procreated sons in the spiritual world. Their firstborn was Jesus Christ, equal to all men, who acquired his divinity in a pre-mortal existence. Even the Holy Spirit was the son of heavenly parents. The Son and the Holy Spirit were procreated after the beginning of the creation of the world known to mankind. Four gods were directly responsible for the universe, three of whom established a covenant and therefore formed the divinity.
As can be appreciated, the Mormon baptism does not in any way contain the doctrinal belief that is associated with the Christian doctrine of the Trinity. The words, “Father, Son and Holy Spirit,” have for the Mormons, a totally different meaning than that of the Christian faiths.
While this is only one reason, that being sufficient to affirm that the Mormon baptism is not valid, there are other reasons. Over and above the Mormon belief that there is no real Trinity, the Mormons do not believe in original sin, nor that Christ instituted baptism. Based on this, those who believe that they were baptized in the Mormon religion, must be baptized in the Catholic faith upon their conversion because they were never validly baptized as commanded by Jesus and taught by the Catholic faith.
catholicdoors.com/faq/qu46.htm#answer1This conclusion was handed down to the Catholic Church by The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith in July, 2001.
Unfortunately, it is only one word with no explanation.**Question: **Wheter the baptism conferred by the community «The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints», called «Mormons» in the vernacular, is valid.
Response: Negative.
Before the days of Vatican II and Ecumenism, generally speaking the Catholic Church did not really look into the validity or Form of Protestant Baptism. With Ecumenism the Church has spent some time looking at the Form of different Protestant Baptisms and most diocese have a list of accepted Baptisms and those that need more scrutiny.Would this have been common if and when the converts were coming from ecclesial communities with known trinitarian baptism (i.e. Lutheran, Methodist, Anglican) and had documentation it had occured?
Welcome , this is good as you will also understand it better right?I’m going to be rebaptized after my RCIA is done. I was Mormon before, and they use the Trinitarian formula.
Only because people who aren’t Mormon make it tricky.
See my previous post above.
Whoever wrote this seems to have never read the official canon of LDS scripture, and is placing their own spin on some Mormon speculation.
See my previous post above.
They call it something else, but it’s still the Trinity.
They have different ideas about it, but the basic idea is still there.
They believe that Christ, as the Logos, instituted baptism at the foundation of the world.
One question I have, though, would be if Catholics believe Christ Instituted baptism before John the Baptist started baptizing.**
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baptism**
It is a purification process carried over from the Jewish ceremonies
of washing and cleansing.
Okay.
I’m not going to argue with the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, but I will still consider myself rebaptized come Easter.
The Catholic Church states very clearly that Conditional Baptism is not to be used haphazardly. We are never to give the impression that we are Re-Baptizing. Which is why Conditional Baptism is always done privately.I think if there is any question. My dh was in the Methodist, valid baptism, and we know because his parents are still alive and verify everything, but we went onto other faiths for awhile and were baptized again because we were ignorant and baptism seems to be a popular thing to do in a lot of churches. Now as I am back I asked my priest and he said it was because I didn’t know and my parents are also still alive and relatives can verify so if my dh comes to the Church he will not need to be baptized but he may want to anyways. If you got baptized as an older child or adult then can’t remember I would say do over, many non-C faiths baptize but do not give it any proof like a certificate etc.
If you will be considering yourself “rebaptized” then you are arguing with the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith.I’m not going to argue with the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, but I will still consider myself rebaptized come Easter.
You will not be “Re-Baptized” AFTER RCIA! You will be Baptized for the first time at the Easter Vigil. The Catholic Church does NOT accept Mormon baptism, You are presently not Baptized.I’m going to be rebaptized after my RCIA is done. I was Mormon before, and they use the Trinitarian formula.
These are all quotes from the FALSE gospel of the Mormon religion.Mormons believe in one God in three “personages”, and I still believe that.“And now, behold, my beloved brethren, this is the way; and there is none other way nor name given under heaven whereby man can be saved in the kingdom of God. And now, behold, this is the doctrine of Christ, and the only and true doctrine of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, which is one God, without end. Amen.”
- 2 Nephi 31:21
“Now, this restoration shall come to all, both old and young, both bond and free, both male and female, both the wicked and the righteous; and even there shall not so much as a hair of their heads be lost; but every thing shall be restored to its perfect frame, as it is now, or in the body, and shall be brought and be arraigned before the bar of Christ the Son, and God the Father, and the Holy Spirit, which is one Eternal God, to be judged according to their works, whether they be good or whether they be evil.”- Alma 11:44“And he hath brought to pass the redemption of the world, whereby he that is found guiltless before him at the judgment day hath it given unto him to dwell in the presence of God in his kingdom, to sing ceaseless praises with the choirs above, unto the Father, and unto the Son, and unto the Holy Ghost, which are one God, in a state of happiness which hath no end.”
- Mormon 7:7“Which Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are one God, infinite and eternal, without end. Amen.”
- D&C 20:28
This is about the only difference.“The Father has a body of flesh and bones as tangible as man’s; the Son also; but the Holy Ghost has not a body of flesh and bones, but is a personage of Spirit. Were it not so, the Holy Ghost could not dwell in us.”
- D&C 130:22
That is a whole lot of words to say that Mormon baptism is not an acceptable or valid Christian Baptism.Jordan Vajda offers an interesting explanation in the introduction to Partakers of the Divine Nature.
“The Catholic Church, albeit a bit inarticulately, has now recognized that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints represents not just another development of Protestantism, but is truly a “new religious tradition” (as also noted by Professor Jan Shipps in her landmark study Mormonism: The Story of a New Religious Tradition). Thus, the Catholic Church has recognized that the baptism of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is the baptism of a different gospel dispensation; and if a person wants to “cross-over” from one gospel dispensation to another, the baptism of the other dispensation will not and cannot be regarded as valid.”