Catholics vs. "Traditional" Protestants

  • Thread starter Thread starter tortdog
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
If you’re going to make such a bold statement you should prove it. If there are no references to sexual immorality in the Bible, I’ll eat a garage mechanic’s shirt. 😛
I think that scripture has to do with God creating woman to help man, as opposed to God creating man to help the woman. God is laying out the priority, not explaining to man and woman that they need to start engaging in sex.
 
I think that scripture has to do with God creating woman to help man, as opposed to God creating man to help the woman. God is laying out the priority, not explaining to man and woman that they need to start engaging in sex.
Help the man what, in your opinion?
 
This gets to what I’m saying, Prodigal. To use that scripture as support that lesbian acts are immoral is a HUGE stretch.

Just sayin’.
So are lesbian and homosexual immoral acts deemed OK by the Mormon Church?

Nonetheless lets pick up where I left off yesterday with “Trinity” and the truth in the Christian world.

John 1:1-14

In the begining was the Word
And the Word was in Gods presence
And the Word was God.
He was present to God from the begining.
And the Word became flesh!
And made His dwelling among us.

John 10:30

I and the Father are ONE.

John 14:9

Anyone who has seen Me has seen the Father. I am in the Father and the Father is in Me.

Matthew 11:27

No one knows the Son except the Father, no one knows the Father except the Son.

John 8:19

You do not know Me or My Father.
If you knew Me you would know My Father.

And just for the record as far as Theologians, it wouldn’t make a difference if one person in the entire world knew the Truth. It would still be the Truth. Thats simply a mute point about misguided men.

God Bless, Gary
 
Because it doesn’t specifically state that a woman was, or wasn’t, made for a woman? That’s where the stretch is, that someone needs it spelled out to their satisfaction. That’s not serving Him as much as it seems to be an attempt to circumvent, in my opinion. Again, that’s the reason Christ set an authoritative Church in place.
Please see Romans 1:21-27. This speaks of the sinfulness of homosexuality as it relates to BOTH genders.
 
Even on issues of lesbianism, we have to “stretch” a little to get there. Scripture talks about man laying with man, while also clearing delineating differences between man and woman. It’s by interpretation that we conclude homosexuality is for both genders, not just one.
Please see Romans 1:21-27. This speaks of the sinfulness of homosexuality as it relates to BOTH genders.
 
I think that scripture has to do with God creating woman to help man, as opposed to God creating man to help the woman. God is laying out the priority, not explaining to man and woman that they need to start engaging in sex.
The very first commandment God gave to man was:

Genesis 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them. 28 And God blessed them, and God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth and subdue it; and have dominion over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the air and over every living thing that moves upon the earth.”

And how were man and woman supposed to do that without having sex?

I don’t know what point you are trying to make and what it has to do with your original question, but God was very clear about sexual relations between men and women. He gave laws concerning sexuality and proscribed who could marry whom, etc. If you are trying to defend same-sex relations just come right out and say it. If you are urging the Catholic Church to change its stance on this issue by asking if the Church can change its teachings, then just come right out and say that, too.

You will not be able to defend same-sex relations by stating that Bible says nothing about it. That’s not correct:
‘Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable.’
(Leviticus 18:22)
‘If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have
done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will
be on their own heads.’ (Leviticus 20:13)
Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their
women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way
the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed
with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men,
and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.
(Romans 1:26-27)
Before they had gone to bed, all the men from every part of the city
of Sodom-both young and old-surrounded the house. They called to Lot,
“Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us so
that we can have sex with them.” (Genesis 19:4-5)
Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God?
Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor
adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves
nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit
the kingdom of God. (1 Corinthians 6:9-10)
knowing this: that the law is not made for a righteous person, but for
the lawless and insubordinate, for the ungodly and for sinners, for
the unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of
mothers, for manslayers, for fornicators, for sodomites, for
kidnappers, for liars, for perjurers, and if there is any other thing
that is contrary to sound doctrine, (1 Timothy 1:9-10)
The Catholic Church has never and will never change its teachings. This is because it only teaches what Christ taught, and Christ, being God gave us his immutable law, which Christ fulfilled but never negated. Same-sex relations are never going to be accepted by the Catholic Church.

I could try to soften that by watering it down, but how would that be helpful to you? Only the truth sets us free not wishful thinking or making excuses or hoping for what cannot be. God asks us to conform to his ways not he to ours. That is the truth of the matter, pure and simple. 🙂

This is what the Church teaches re homosexuality:
Chastity and homosexuality
2357 Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,141 tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered."142 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.
2358 The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible. This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God’s will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord’s Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.
2359 Homosexual persons are called to chastity. By the virtues of self-mastery that teach them inner freedom, at times by the support of disinterested friendship, by prayer and sacramental grace, they can and should gradually and resolutely approach Christian perfection.
 
Your right Della in this aspect, then I also just can’t seem to understand how you can arrive at anything but “Original Sin” through Genesis.

Biblical interpretation front to back also make’s perfect since in this context. I mean we can debate Genesis, yet placed in context with the Apostle Paul.

"Who gave himself for our sins that he might deliver us from this present evil world, according to the will of God and our Father: to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen. Galatians 1:4-5.

Paul relates with fire on and on about this. I could quote the verse’s but I just don’t see “Original Sin” as a point of contention.

I don’t see it. To me its not fringe thinking, its just not logic. Obviously there are aspects we can debate in scripture, But these three?

The thread on the NIV BIble also leads into this very topic in discussion with Anna, Pleed and myself. Interesting thread also.

There the Greek word “pornia” is talked about in scripture. Any sexual immorality is “porneia”

Mt 15:19 -
"For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, slanders.

God Bless, Gary
 
I’m not following you, Gary, about original sin and it’s connection with the topic at hand. :confused:

Certainly we are all born with original sin–the inclination to sin, but not everyone is inclined to commit the exact same sins. Some are mortal and some are venial, some are more heinous than others. Some are truly shameful and some aren’t as bad.

Homosexual acts are shameful, but they’re not as bad as murder, simply because the murdered person gets no further chance to repent of his sins while the one who commits a homosexual act will get that opportunity–he hasn’t been robbed of it by nature of the sin committed.

Is this the kind of thing you’re talking about or is it something else?
 
Homosexual acts are shameful, but they’re not as bad as murder, simply because the murdered person gets no further chance to repent of his sins while the one who commits a homosexual act will get that opportunity–he hasn’t been robbed of it by nature of the sin committed.
Some children and young boys who have been “abused” by homosexual Catholic priests have gone on to commit suicide.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top