Celibacy

[Cowfold]

An interesting article in ‘The Times’ (UK) this morning where one of the Vatican hierarchy (a Cardinal no less) expounds on the possibilities of married priests.

Is this the ‘thin end of the wedge’?

I have said it before and I’ll say it again that the future of the Catholic Church lies in allowing Secular Clergy (parish priests) to marry. Leaving the celibate life to those who desire it or those who have chosen a monastic vocation.

 

[anode]

Many Catholics agree with you, but the current papacy won’t budge, and I don’t see it in Rome’s future.

 

[Joe_5859]

An interesting article in ‘The Times’ (UK) this morning where one of the Vatican hierarchy (a Cardinal no less) expounds on the possibilities of married priests.

Is this the ‘thin end of the wedge’?

I have said it before and I’ll say it again that the future of the Catholic Church lies in allowing Secular Clergy (parish priests) to marry. Leaving the celibate life to those who desire it or those who have chosen a monastic vocation.

I think that “expounds on the possibilities of married priests” is overstating it by quite a bit. I’m sure Cardinal Schönborn is shaking his head in bewilderment at the spin the media has put on his comments.

 

[OchsFam]

I have said it before and I’ll say it again that the future of the Catholic Church lies in allowing Secular Clergy (parish priests) to marry. Leaving the celibate life to those who desire it or those who have chosen a monastic vocation.

Thanks be to God that Truth is not up for a vote and majority decision.

There is a reason we have celibate priests and the results are profoundly positive.

God Bless.

 

[feargalmac]

Cowfold, perhaps you should read the piece on the BBC website where the Cardinal clarifies what he had said, and I quote “If celibacy is the problem, then without celibacy there should be no sexual abuse but unfortunately this is not the case. We know about cases inside the family,” he said.

The full text of the article can be found here.

news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/8564074.stm

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

I have said it before and I’ll say it again that the future of the Catholic Church lies in allowing Secular Clergy (parish priests) to marry. Leaving the celibate life to those who desire it or those who have chosen a monastic vocation.

This can never and will never happen. Once ordained to major orders, deacon and up, a man can not marry.

A married priesthood means that married men are ordained to the priesthood.

I am pretty sure you know this but the way you said it in the thread appears that you are calling to allow priests to get married which can never change.

 

[Cowfold]

**This can never and will never happen. ** Once ordained to major orders, deacon and up, a man can not marry.

A married priesthood means that married men are ordained to the priesthood.

I am pretty sure you know this but the way you said it in the thread appears that you are calling to allow priests to get married which can never change.

Never say Never!

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

Never say Never!

It can’t, it is part of the theology of the priesthood. Once ordained they may never marry.

They can be married when they are ordained but if his wife dies he becomes celibate.

This is dogma which is a never that we may say.

 

[Cowfold]

It can’t, it is part of the theology of the priesthood. Once ordained they may never marry.

They can be married when they are ordained but if his wife dies he becomes celibate.

This is dogma which is a never that we may say.

And therein lies the future!!

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

And therein lies the future!!

Yes ordaining married men to the priesthood may be in the future of the Latin Church but it will not fix any thing.

Look at all the Churches that do so, the Orthodox and the Eastern Catholic Churches, even look to those protestant Churches that not only “ordain”/commission ministers who are married but allow them to marry afterward, they are all still hurting for vocations.

 

[Cowfold]

Yes ordaining married men to the priesthood may be in the future of the Latin Church but it will not fix any thing.

Look at all the Churches that do so, the Orthodox and the Eastern Catholic Churches, even look to those protestant Churches that not only “ordain”/commission ministers who are married but allow them to marry afterward, they are all still hurting for vocations.

There is an arguement that celibacy may be responsible for much of the problems facing the church in Ireland and elsewhere.
I feel the marriage option is the answer.

 

[curlycool89]

Yes ordaining married men to the priesthood may be in the future of the Latin Church but it will not fix any thing.

Look at all the Churches that do so, the Orthodox and the Eastern Catholic Churches, even look to those protestant Churches that not only “ordain”/commission ministers who are married but allow them to marry afterward, they are all still hurting for vocations.

Yep, pretty much.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

There is an arguement that celibacy may be responsible for much of the problems facing the church in Ireland and elsewhere.
I feel the marriage option is the answer.

That is an old unproven argument.

Statistically Catholic priests committing sexual abuse is no greater than that in the general public, it is just more highly publicized.

You should check the rate of athletic coaches.

Also the rates of parent’s.

Being married would not solve this problem at all. Even denominations that allow for married ministers have a close to the same rate but it is not a publicized because they are not the Catholic Church.

So really there is no such argument that can be made.

 

[Cowfold]

That is an old unproven argument.

Statistically Catholic priests committing sexual abuse is no greater than that in the general public, it is just more highly publicized.

You should check the rate of athletic coaches.

Also the rates of parent’s.

Being married would not solve this problem at all. Even denominations that allow for married ministers have a close to the same rate but it is not a publicized because they are not the Catholic Church.

So really there is no such argument that can be made.

I am not too ‘caught up’ in statistics as I believe the old maxim that there are Statistics, statistics and damn xxxx.

I am not saying marriage is a ‘cure’ for all ailments but I believe it is a stabilizing mechanism. In my youth I have seen the -ve side of celibacy in the Irish Catholic Church enough to know that the Secular Clergy lifestyle was not for me.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

I have added a bold emphasis in what you said.

I am not too ‘caught up’ in statistics as I believe the old maxim that there are Statistics, statistics and damn xxxx.

I am not saying marriage is a ‘cure’ for all ailments but I believe it is a stabilizing mechanism. In my youth I have seen the -ve side of celibacy in the Irish Catholic Church enough to know that the Secular Clergy lifestyle was not for me.

Not every one is called to such a life. That does not necessarily mean that we need a greater pool to chose from.

The other issue is, there is religious life where one lives in community. Did you look into that?

The fact is, today, married men are not called to the priesthood in the Latin Catholic Church, this discipline may change, but it is what it is and I believe that God works through his Church so he does not call married men there.

 

[Cowfold]

I have added a bold emphasis in what you said.

Not every one is called to such a life. That does not necessarily mean that we need a greater pool to chose from.

The other issue is, there is religious life where one lives in community. Did you look into that?

**The fact is, today, married men are not called to the priesthood **in the Latin Catholic Church, this discipline may change, but it is what it is and I believe that God works through his Church so he does not call married men there.

1. There was no other route of interest to me than than the one I took.
2. Give it time

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

1. There was no other route of interest to me than than the one I took.

Then this shows you do not have a calling. Married life is your call if you are married. There are third (also know as secular) orders that married people can belong to.

1. Give it time

That is exactly what I said, the discipline may change and the Latin Church may start to ordain married men.

What never will and can never change is allowing those already ordain to marry.

 

[Cowfold]

Then this shows you do not have a calling. Married life is your call if you are married. There are third (also know as secular) orders that married people can belong to.

That is exactly what I said, the discipline may change and the Latin Church may start to ordain married men.

What never will and can never change is allowing those already ordain to marry.

How can you possibly arrive at that deduction.!

 

[curlycool89]

I am not saying marriage is a ‘cure’ for all ailments but I believe it is a stabilizing mechanism. In my youth I have seen the -ve side of celibacy in the Irish Catholic Church enough to know that the Secular Clergy lifestyle was not for me.

Wait, did you just use -ve to mean negative? You must be a science major

 

[Podo2005]

An interesting article in ‘The Times’ (UK) this morning where one of the Vatican hierarchy (a Cardinal no less) expounds on the possibilities of married priests.

Is this the ‘thin end of the wedge’?

I have said it before and I’ll say it again that the future of the Catholic Church lies in allowing Secular Clergy (parish priests) to marry. Leaving the celibate life to those who desire it or those who have chosen a monastic vocation.

No… the future of the Catholic Church lies in those humble, obedient servants who are willing to follow Christ wherever He wants them to go… even if that means sacrifice