Challenging Sermons

[Eugene]

I am a craddle Catholic and have attended Mass every Sunday as long as I can remember bar the occassional illness or travel. Thus over 4 decades worth of sermons. What really puzzles me is what our priests are taught in the seminary and why. Let me explain - I find the level of preaching consistanly a “high level” one - rarely challenging, rarely directly focussed on the evils and danger many Catholics have to confront in the modern world on a daily basis.

What I mean by high level is that you will words about turning away from sin, love your neighbour, do good, etc. which in itsel are to be commended at all times. But I find there is very little connection to the reality of people’s lives. Concrete examples and challenges are rarely given. Let me list a few examples:

1. We are constantly bombarded with same sex marriage propoganda nowadays. These lobbyists and supporters tend to classify those opposed to same sex marriage, homosexuality, etc. as being homophobic, intolerant, etc. and sadly there are Catholics who agree with them and who would support same sex marriage. Yet, not ONCE have I ever heard a sermon in which this issue was addressed. The closest it came to was when a priest mentioned the disproportionate influence minority lobbysist enjoy.

Why do we not hear in our sermons WHY same sex marriage is not right? It is the only place where many of the faithful can be enlihgtened about it.

1. I have learned that many parishioners in a neighbourng parish practice tarrot card reading, tea leaves reading, etc. Yet, not once has their parish priest addressed these issues from the pulpit. In my over forty years of attending Mass I have only heard a priest directly naming and shaming the occulting practices in a homily and that was more than 20 years ago!
2. Husbands love your wives - it is in a Protestant church I attended once for a wedding that I heard the pastor clearly spell out, if your spouse is not your best friend then something is wrong! Yor psouse is more important han the kids - never, ever bad mouth your spouse in public, never chastise your spouse in front of the children - I agreed with everything said but wondered why on earth our Catholic priests never preach like this.

Are they afriad of challenging? Repercussions?

I fully understand that my comments are based on my experiences in a European based church community. Others may have different experiences.

I do not wish to knock our priests as I have the utmost respect for them. This is thus a generic query and I’m interested to hear others experiences and thoughts on the matter.

Blessings and regards.

 

[Whispering_Hope]

I hear what you are saying Eugene. As far as I know the sermon should be based on the Readings of the day. Some priests are eloquent, sadly others are not.

Very often I go for Mass to our neighbouring parish. The priest there is amazing. I find I do not want the sermon to end. He explains the day’s readings so well and then suggests how we could apply those teachings to our every day life. I do wish you could experience a sermon like that one day. May God Bless you.

 

[mercyangel]

I guess it just depends on the priest. Ours talks in-depth about the above mentioned topics all the time. Also abortion, end of life issues and much more.

 

[Sahara_DeSert]

Last Sunday we had a substitute priest as ours was on a trip/vacation. The sub priest said something I have never heard from a sermon before and sounded a bit new-agey to me. He said that Jesus had come from another dimension and that on his Ascension he returned to this dimension. I am used to ‘Jesus came from the Father and returned to the Father to sit at his right hand…in Heaven.’ Sure, I can accept that Heaven is another dimension, it just sounded so strange to my ears. He never once used the word Heaven. Comments?

 

[GRATEFULONEjim]

The best advice I can give is to schedule an appointment with the parish priest and ask him why he seldom brings up the issues. Priests are generally very open to suggestions and enjoy talking with parishioners on topics such as this.

 

[mountee]

I understand your concerns and share them as I see this time of the Mass as an opportunity to enhance the catechizing of the members, young and old. However, as other threads on this forum have explained the sermon is an expansion of the readings. Certainly there are opportunities within these readings to discuss everyday life concerns,but most of the priests I have been exposed to do not generally take advantage of them. The sermon I listened to last weekend regarding the Holy Spirit was ripe with opportunities, but, nothing. Based on my own 62 years as a Catholic I know I need to hear more about the faith and the Truths I need to follow but I think that this needs to happen away from the Mass on my own time perhaps in a class at Church during the week or something similar.

 

[Brigid34]

I also have never heard a priest speak of SSM, abortion, etc.I have listened to homilies all up and down the left coast and never were the cold, hard facts of life mentioned. There may have been a sentence or two speaking of every day life a time or two though. These things definitely need to be addressed by our excellent priests.

 

[EasterJoy]

I guess we’re lucky. Our priest talks about these things, and the deacon does, too. They are clear that they’re teaching what the Church teaches, too, rather than some personal opinion that the congregation is free to ignore if it isn’t “helpful”. That is, they’re clear about when they’re suggesting methods that might work in the pursuit of holiness vs. teaching truths that need to be believed whether one likes them or not. I know they get sometimes get guff about it, though.

 

[Pug]

Why do we not hear in our sermons WHY same sex marriage is not right? It is the only place where many of the faithful can be enlihgtened about it.

There are always numerous children of all ages present at our Sunday mass. Perhaps this is a concern with a few topics, limiting the depth of what can be said.

 

[Elizium23]

Homilies are not for catechesis. Homilies are for expounding on the Word of God given in the readings of the day. If you want catechesis, then seek out, or start, sessions meeting in your parish. Over the past few years we have had adult Bible study classes which went in-depth to many aspects of Church teaching, as well as “The Catholicism Project” by Fr. Robert Barron, in which we explored what makes us uniquely Catholic.

Asking a priest to talk about unrelated topics in his homilies is asking him to deviate from the liturgical rubrics which govern them.

 

[Cavaille-Coll]

I beg to differ. It is true that the focus of a homily should be on the readings, but catechesis is absolutely necessary in today’s uncatechised society. There is no reason why a homily cannot be tied to the readings and simultaneously include relevant Church doctrine. Adult education programs and Bible studies are wonderful things which tend to attract the same 5% of the parish, while the only contact the priest has with the other 95% of practicing parishioners is at Sunday Mass.

 

[larsont7]

Homilies are not for catechesis. Homilies are for expounding on the Word of God given in the readings of the day. If you want catechesis, then seek out, or start, sessions meeting in your parish. Over the past few years we have had adult Bible study classes which went in-depth to many aspects of Church teaching, as well as “The Catholicism Project” by Fr. Robert Barron, in which we explored what makes us uniquely Catholic.

Asking a priest to talk about unrelated topics in his homilies is asking him to deviate from the liturgical rubrics which govern them.

This isn’t true in all cases, though, AFAIK. I’ve known many priests to give sermons as opposed to homilies, that sometimes do not reflect the readings of the day. Sometimes it’s part of a series (we had a priest do 4 weeks of sermons regarding modesty). Other times, the bishop may suggest what the preaching be about (earlier this year our bishop had all priests in the diocese speak about Confession for 3 weeks).

And even if the priests are bound by the readings, it isn’t hard to interject modern day topics based on the words of Christ. The fact that topics like contraception, abortion, and same sex marriage AREN’T talked about in Catholic churches around the world is probably the reason why more than half of Catholics support them.

 

[KendraDZ1902]

Homilies are not for catechesis. Homilies are for expounding on the Word of God given in the readings of the day. If you want catechesis, then seek out, or start, sessions meeting in your parish. Over the past few years we have had adult Bible study classes which went in-depth to many aspects of Church teaching, as well as “The Catholicism Project” by Fr. Robert Barron, in which we explored what makes us uniquely Catholic.

Asking a priest to talk about unrelated topics in his homilies is asking him to deviate from the liturgical rubrics which govern them.

I love this about the Catholic Church. Growing up in a protestant denomination where the preacher decided what he wanted to talk about, there were times where he could preach on the same thing over and over again.

I promise you, if you went to a church where they harped on the same thing all the time, you would get very tired of it.

You can’t blame the priest for people not willing to learn about their faith. If someone really wanted to know the Church’s opinion on these matters, they would look it up. I know I did when I was in RCIA.

 

[klm120861]

I suppose it depends on the priest. We are blessed in that moral issues are spoken about in the homilies and the scriptures for the day are given real life applications in real life situations. Our priests are pretty blunt, loving, but blunt. The only way you wouldn’t know where the Church stands on the issues of the day would be if you missed Mass.

And if you want really blunt, daily Mass is where you hear that. Thank God for priests with boldness.
Kris

 

[Joannm]

I love this about the Catholic Church. Growing up in a protestant denomination where the preacher decided what he wanted to talk about, there were times where he could preach on the same thing over and over again.

I promise you, if you went to a church where they harped on the same thing all the time, you would get very tired of it.

You can’t blame the priest for people not willing to learn about their faith. If someone really wanted to know the Church’s opinion on these matters, they would look it up. I know I did when I was in RCIA.

There is a priest in a neighboring parish who preaches about abortion every week, EVERY WEEK. The people in the parish are getting tired of hearing it. They feel he is preaching to the choir. I know it is an important message but if your congregation is full of people who agree with the Church’s position then talk about something else once in awhile.

 

[Incomplete]

Last Sunday we had a substitute priest as ours was on a trip/vacation. The sub priest said something I have never heard from a sermon before and sounded a bit new-agey to me. He said that Jesus had come from another dimension and that on his Ascension he returned to this dimension. I am used to ‘Jesus came from the Father and returned to the Father to sit at his right hand…in Heaven.’ Sure, I can accept that Heaven is another dimension, it just sounded so strange to my ears. He never once used the word Heaven. Comments?

I would be very uncomfortable with that.

 

[Incomplete]

Very often I go for Mass to our neighbouring parish. The priest there is amazing. I find I do not want the sermon to end. He explains the day’s readings so well and then suggests how we could apply those teachings to our every day life. I do wish you could experience a sermon like that one day. May God Bless you.

I also know a priest like that. He didn’t address a lot of the “hot button” issues, but what he did was make people desire to grow in holiness. For me, I ended up going to daily Mass and, even though he didn’t talk about confession much, this is the priest that got me going regularly again. I’m also learning a lot more about Scripture through a diocesan-sponsored program because of the interest he instilled in me.

That’s just a couple of examples. Sometimes a priest can move you to change, and that change then takes care of any questions you had about the issues the OP mentioned.

 

[babochka]

Homilies are not for catechesis. Homilies are for expounding on the Word of God given in the readings of the day.

How are these two things mutually exclusive? Perhaps it would be helpful to establish the church’s definition of catechesis:
":

“Catechesis is nothing other than the process of transmitting the Gospel, as the Christian community has received it, understands it, celebrates it, lives it and communicates it in many ways.” (General Directory for Catechesis #105) (Published by USCCB)

The name of catechesis was given to the whole of the efforts within the Church to make disciples, to help people to believe that Jesus is the Son of God…and to educate and instruct them in this life and thus build up the Body of Christ. (Catechesi Tradendae #1)

From Sacramentum Caritatis:

*"The catechetical and paraenetic aim of the homily should not be forgotten. During the course of the liturgical year it is appropriate to offer the faithful, prudently and on the basis of the three-year lectionary, “thematic” homilies treating the great themes of the Christian faith, on the basis of what has been authoritatively proposed by the Magisterium in the four “pillars” of the Catechism of the Catholic Church and the recent Compendium, namely: the profession of faith, the celebration of the Christian mystery, life in Christ and Christian prayer (143) *

diocesefwsb.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/Roman-Missal-Homily-Guide.pdf

**

Asking a priest to talk about unrelated topics in his homilies is asking him to deviate from the liturgical rubrics which govern them.

*GIRM 65 states:

1. The Homily is part of the Liturgy and is highly recommended,[cf. Sacrosanctum Concilium 52, canon law 767§1] for it is necessary for the nurturing of the Christian life.** It should be an explanation of some aspect of the readings from Sacred Scripture or of another text from the Ordinary or the Proper of the Mass of the day and should take into account both the mystery being celebrated and the particular needs of the listeners**

.[cf Inter Oecumenici 54]

*How so? The homily topic can be drawn from the readings of the day, the Ordinary of the Mass, or the Propers. It should take into account the particular needs of the listeners, and is necessary for the nurturing of Christian life. That is pretty wide latitude given to the priest. A gifted homilist can easily draw from the readings or the saint of the day and craft a homily that provides catechesis, instruction on the Christian moral life, and inspiration to the faithful. The propers are incredibly rich in theology and can be expounded upon in depth during a homily, again drawing in issues and dilemmas faced by the modern Christian. How does this deviate from the rubrics? It seems that this is precisely what he is called to do.

Finally, one of the most famous homilies every preached, the Paschal Homily of St. John Chrystostom, is read in every Byzantine Church, Catholic and Orthodox, (and more than a few Latin Churches as well), on Easter Sunday. It is known, fittingly, as the Catechetical Homily.

saintannas.com/Articles/bymonth/april00/CHRYSOSTOM.htm

 

[bobballen_18]

There is a priest in a neighboring parish who preaches about abortion every week, EVERY WEEK. The people in the parish are getting tired of hearing it. They feel he is preaching to the choir. I know it is an important message but if your congregation is full of people who agree with the Church’s position then talk about something else once in awhile.

I know what you mean, I really do…but hey, look at it in a positive way - maybe every once in awhile, there are people in the congregation that are iffy about the issue, or that don’t actually agree with the Church’s stance, that are moved in a positive way about the issue. While it would be nice if this did happen, you can’t expect every single homily/sermon a priest gives to move everyone in the same way. Different homilies will mean different things to a variety of people.

 

[OraLabora]

Last Sunday we had a substitute priest as ours was on a trip/vacation. The sub priest said something I have never heard from a sermon before and sounded a bit new-agey to me. He said that Jesus had come from another dimension and that on his Ascension he returned to this dimension. I am used to ‘Jesus came from the Father and returned to the Father to sit at his right hand…in Heaven.’ Sure, I can accept that Heaven is another dimension, it just sounded so strange to my ears. He never once used the word Heaven. Comments?

I would be very uncomfortable with that.

Oddly I’m not. First of all any imagery we have of God is essentially an anthropomorphized vision of God; we are created in His image, but we don’t know what His heavenly image really looks like, nor what ours will look like. It is also fairly well accepted that God’s domain is outside of time.

This morning’s scripture reading at the Office of Readings for those on the two-year cycle, was from 1 Corinthians 15. I think this section might be appropriate here:

35 But someone will ask, “How are the dead raised? With what kind of body do they come?” 36 Fool! What you sow does not come to life unless it dies. 37 And as for what you sow, you do not sow the body that is to be, but a bare seed, perhaps of wheat or of some other grain. 38 But God gives it a body as he has chosen, and to each kind of seed its own body. 39 Not all flesh is alike, but there is one flesh for human beings, another for animals, another for birds, and another for fish. 40 There are both heavenly bodies and earthly bodies, but the glory of the heavenly is one thing, and that of the earthly is another. 41 There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars; indeed, star differs from star in glory.

42 So it is with the resurrection of the dead. What is sown is perishable, what is raised is imperishable. 43 It is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness, it is raised in power. 44 It is sown a physical body, it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a physical body, there is also a spiritual body. 45 Thus it is written, “The first man, Adam, became a living being”; the last Adam became a life-giving spirit. 46 But it is not the spiritual that is first, but the physical, and then the spiritual. 47 The first man was from the earth, a man of dust; the second man is from heaven. 48 As was the man of dust, so are those who are of the dust; and as is the man of heaven, so are those who are of heaven. 49 Just as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we will also bear the image of the man of heaven.

We are faced with a great mystery. I think that’s all the priest was trying to say. Perhaps his delivery and terminology was not the best; certainly the passage from St. Paul above might have helped better deliver his message both to those who prefer a more modern, pseudo-scientific description, and those preferring that the mystery be couched in more traditional language. I think what the priest was saying is not incompatible with scripture, as the above shows. Perhaps he could have used that passage to better join together the two expressions of heaven (traditional vs. modern).