Two of the disagreements you have don’t regard doctrine: communion under one species and the Novus Ordo Mass. We now offer communion under both species, and the current Mass is a discipline, not a doctrine or dogma.
So, Orthodoxy is the “remnant” spken of in Scripture?
I know.
There continues to be many RC Churches that do not.
I know. I often wonder what the early Church Fathers might have said if they had suddenly found themselves at the Novus Ordo.
I think the first shock would have nothing to do with the litergy but the way some behave at the massI know. I often wonder what the early Church Fathers might have said if they had suddenly found themselves at the Novus Ordo.
They would get on their knees and recognize that Jesus was present. They would give thanks to God for the Gift they received. They would admonish their brothers and sisters who gathered irreverently to partake of the Body and Blood in a way to encourage them in their faith, not demean. Finally, and most importantly, they would recognize the authority by which the Norvus Ordo was established, as it came from them through Jesus Christ.I know.
There continues to be many RC Churches that do not.
I know. I often wonder what the early Church Fathers might have said if they had suddenly found themselves at the Novus Ordo.
They would not know where they were. Nothing would look familiar to them. They would run to the nearest Holy Orthodox Catholic Church where they would recognize the ancient, beautiful and holy Divine Liturgy.
Assuming that there was one nearby…
My point exactly - you recognize a Liturgy - they would recognize Christ’s Presence
Could you provide a link for me where I could look at how the Holy Orthodox Catholic Church lead Jesus disciples’ throughout the centuries?
The Divine Liturgy of St John Chrysostom is a shortened form of the Divine Liturgy of St Basil the Great. St Basil was Bishop of Caesarea in Cappadocia from 370—379AD. Both are derived from the Divine Liturgy of St James—so named after James the Just, the brother of the Lord.
What has changed about the faith of Roman Catholicism since 1054?
Your own sources should be able to make that clear to you.
I care to know that my Church teaches that I must be baptized and confirm my faith that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and that by His sacrifice am I afforded redemption and eternal life with God.
good post
Including innovations that the undivided Church did not know or teach.
Do a google search.
Except for the last part, most of them are believed by the Orthodox Church as well. See, there are actually more similarities than differences with both Churches. I would rather start from there than go into the differences.
I think Mickey’s point is clear–the early Fathers would recognize Divine Liturgy immediately, especially if they run into the Liturgy of St. James or even St. Basil, though no doubt they would still recognize the Liturgy of St. John Crysostom. I have commented on another thread on this board regarding how 4th century Rome celebrated Mass, and it seems much closer to Divine Liturgy than Tridentine or even Novus Ordo. The thread in question then: forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=200272 My comment is post 11, if I am correct, to which the thread starter verified that the Liturgies of the two were very similar back then. Guess the Orthodox Church then has kept Holy Tradition here much better. So to reply to this–the early Fathers will recognize Christ’s Presence in Divine Liturgy more than in the Novus Ordo, as it is the Liturgy they were familiar with, and would see the Novus Ordo as an innovation of Divine Liturgy (and we need not go into the horrors of clown Masses, “liturgical dance”, and other such abuses which seem to have taken hold in a number of parishes).
What did the undivided Church know or teach 3 years after Her birth? 30 years? 300 years?
I did. Fruitless
Is liturgy doctrine? Why and how does liturgy change? What forces are there to change how we worship? Should it be allowed?
From liturgy flows doctrine (and vice versa). To understand what a church teaches, I often find it helpful to see how they worship first and foremost; from there you will already garner a lot of information just by mere observance.
Ah, this would require much dissertation. Since I am not a Liturgist, I would defer these statements to someone who can sufficiently answer them.