Changes to Mormon Scriptures

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Janderich said:
This is usually why I end up quiting these threads. I don’t like the negativity from myself or what I may bring out in others. Sorry for any comments presented in bad taste.
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I hate to point out the Big Pink Elephant in the room, but, historically what we see is our mormon posters leave when they cannot defend the statements they have presented. This applies to their “doctrine” as well.

There are several stereotypical actions we see from mormon posters.
  1. The persecution card
  2. Drop out of threads until the dust dies down, then come back and act like nothing happened.
  3. Drop out all together once they get in over their heads and cannot defend anything that has been stated.
  4. If it can’t be defended, then it must be misunderstood, mistranslated, misrepresented.
  5. “Don’t tell me what I believe” Which is particularly amusing when used against former mormons.
  6. When all else fails, Bear your testimony.
These are just a few of the sterotypical actions we see from many of our mormon posters.
 
Yet, we should still be engaging with love and charity. Please keep the other party in mind when you post and feel what they may feel with the words/intent you are presenting.
 
Janderich said:
We live in an imperfect world with imperfect teachers. As I said before all books contain some error. There is only one sure way to separate truth from error. It is through the Holy Ghost. Jesus said, “Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth; for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.” (John 16:13) We must be guided by this spirit. It is through this gift, that we may sort through the many teachings and false doctrines that abound. The Book of Mormon contains the same truth, "And when ye shall receive these things, I would exhort you that ye would ask God the Eternal Father, in the name of Crist, if these things are not true; and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart, with real intent, having faith in Chrsit, he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holly Ghost. And by the power of the Holy Ghost ye may know the truth of all things. (Moroni 10:4-5).

Now this is usually the part where people start making light of what I say. As if the spirit is inconsequential. As if feelings and thoughts are meaningless. But I say, no Christian can call himself such if he does not follow this guide.
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Sorry but this
4 And when ye shall receive these things, I would exhort you that ye would aask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these things are not btrue; and if ye shall ask with a csincere heart, with dreal intent, having efaith in Christ, he will fmanifest the gtruth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost.
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and this
13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
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are not saying the same thing at all.

John is asking you to seek guidance from the Spirit who will guide you in the truth.

Moroni is telling you that the spirit will tell you these things are true and if He doesn’t you were insincere and lacked both real intent and faith in Christ. In other words we can discount your “testimony” because well insincere you doesn’t try or even believe.

Not at all the same, Moroni is a set up where only those who accept it as truth are winners who have the Spirit and those who don’t have no faith in Christ. It’s just a heads I win tails you loose situation.
 
yet another thread where too much fact and evidence chased Mormons away
 
twopekinguys said:
Don’t you just hate it when that happens? 😃
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lol…it will ALWAYS happen. And they hate seeing the facts…it could harm their testimony. And, after awhile, all the twisting and bending of facts to explain all the LDS problems gets to be too much for them
 
It also seems that a number of the more, let’s call them, vigorous posters have gotten themselves banned or suspended.
 
Janderich said:
This is usually why I end up quiting these threads. I don’t like the negativity from myself or what I may bring out in others. Sorry for any comments presented in bad taste.
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No problem.

Now, please address all of the concerns that you’ve been repeatedly dodging through the entirety of this thread.

👍
 
Hello Janderich - Would you please comment on why you think this change was made to the Introduction of the Book of Mormon?

Introduction (from current BoM available online)

The book was written by many ancient prophets by the spirit of prophecy and revelation. Their words, written on gold plates, were quoted and abridged by a prophet-historian named Mormon. The record gives an account of two great civilizations. One came from Jerusalem in 600 B.C. and afterward separated into two nations, known as the Nephites and the Lamanites. The other came much earlier when the Lord confounded the tongues at the Tower of Babel. This group is known as the Jaredites. After thousands of years, all were destroyed except the Lamanites, and they are among the ancestors of the American Indians.

changed from: (according to the copy of the BoM given to our family a couple of years ago)

….and they are the principal ancestors of the American Indians.
 
lax16 said:
Hello Janderich - Would you please comment on why you think this change was made to the Introduction of the Book of Mormon?

Introduction (from current BoM available online)

The book was written by many ancient prophets by the spirit of prophecy and revelation. Their words, written on gold plates, were quoted and abridged by a prophet-historian named Mormon. The record gives an account of two great civilizations. One came from Jerusalem in 600 B.C. and afterward separated into two nations, known as the Nephites and the Lamanites. The other came much earlier when the Lord confounded the tongues at the Tower of Babel. This group is known as the Jaredites. After thousands of years, all were destroyed except the Lamanites, and they are among the ancestors of the American Indians.

changed from: (according to the copy of the BoM given to our family a couple of years ago)

….and they are the principal ancestors of the American Indians.
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The more the years go by, the more untenable of a position Mormons are in
 
Janderich said:
The Book of Mormon has over 268,000 words. Most of the changes you discuss are extreemly minor (commas, spelling, etc)
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Janderich - Yes, there are many, many grammatical errors that have been corrected in the Book of Mormon. Did Joseph Smith have to do **any **of the translating himself or was he relating to the scribe what God had already given him in perfect form?

Also, there are several corrections that impact the LDS view of the Trinity and would therefore would be considered doctrinal changes to the Book of Mormon. For example:

original test vs current text:

1 Nephi 11:18 And he said unto me: Behold, the virgin which thou seest is the mother of God after the manner of the flesh.

And he said unto me: Behold, the virgin whom thou seest is the mother of the Son of God, after the manner of the flesh.

1 Nephi 11:21 And the angel said unto me: Behold the Lamb of God, yea, even the
Eternal Father.

And the angel said unto me: Behold the Lamb of God, yea, even the Son of the Eternal Father!

1 Nephi 11:32 …And I looked and beheld the Lamb of God, that he was taken by the people, yea, the everlasting God was judged of the world. …

And I looked and beheld the Lamb of God, that he was taken by the people; yea, the Son of the everlasting God was judged of the world.

1 Nephi 13:40 …that the Lamb of God is the Eternal Father and the Savior of the world…

…that the Lamb of God is the Son of the Eternal Father, and the Savior of the world…

Do you feel that these changes are beyond grammatical corrections?
 
Marie5890 said:
The more the years go by, the more untenable of a position Mormons are in
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I find this very confusing, but it may be the way get around all the inconsistencies.

from: A Brief Explanation about The Book of Mormon

About this edition: Some minor errors in the text have been perpetuated in past editions of the Book of Mormon. This edition contains corrections that seem appropriate to bring the material into conformity with prepublication manuscripts and early editions edited by the Prophet Joseph Smith.

🤷
 
lax16 said:
I find this very confusing, but it may be the way get around all the inconsistencies.

from: A Brief Explanation about The Book of Mormon

About this edition: Some minor errors in the text have been perpetuated in past editions of the Book of Mormon. This edition contains corrections that seem appropriate to bring the material into conformity with prepublication manuscripts and early editions edited by the Prophet Joseph Smith.

🤷
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This would only work if none of the earlier editions were around to compare. Sadly for the Mormon church, they are.
 
Lochias said:
This would only work if none of the earlier editions were around to compare. Sadly for the Mormon church, they are.
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I wonder if many Mormons read the earlier editions that can be found online with a quick google search.

I don’t know how changes to the Book of Mormon would conform with the manuscripts of Joseph Smith? It seems just the opposite. 🤷
 
lax16 said:
I wonder if many Mormons read the earlier editions that can be found online with a quick google search.

I don’t know how changes to the Book of Mormon would conform with the manuscripts of Joseph Smith? It seems just the opposite. 🤷
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Indeed. The Mormon church apparently doesn’t give its members much credit, does it?

“Nah, they’ll never find the old editions online…”
 
Lochias said:
Indeed. The Mormon church apparently doesn’t give its members much credit, does it?

“Nah, they’ll never find the old editions online…”
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Or, as Janderich said:

“The Book of Mormon has over 268,000 words. Most of the changes you discuss are extreemly minor (commas, spelling, etc)”
 
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