Changing parishes; what is your opinion?

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DWC_RC:

You can attend any Catholic church of your own choosing–anytime. But you’re a member of the parish in whose territory you actually reside. A comparison I often make is to say that it’s like state lines in the US. You are a citizen of whatever state you happen to live in, regardless of which one you happen to prefer. If you live near a state line, you can always cross the line to do your grocery shopping, socializing, volunteer work, etc. etc. But you’re still a resident of where you actually reside (so, try as you might, you still can’t legally vote in that other state, or do anything else that requires legal residency). Same thing with Catholic parishes: you’re a parishioner of the parish whose territory includes your place of residence.

Some pastors might allow you to “register” in another parish, or allow you to register if you’re not a parishioner–but registration means nothing. Parish membership has nothing (repeat again, nothing) to do with parish membership. It’s all about the territory in which you reside. Personal parishes (ethnic parishes, traditional Latin Mass parishes, the new Anglican-Catholic parishes, etc) are an exception but that will get us way off-topic.

On a day by day basis it usually doesn’t matter where you attend Mass (or many other forms of parish worship, or events). But there are times when parish territory becomes extremely relevant. People who cross parish lines and attend a different parish often have no difficulties–but the potential is always there. This is the sort of thing that may come back to cause you problems in the future. For example, if you have another child (I don’t know your exact situation, so this is just “for example”) when it comes time for Baptism, the pastor of parish B might tell you “I won’t do this baptism without first consulting your proper pastor and getting his permission” He might even say “I won’t do it at all, since you don’t live here; you’ll have to see your own pastor.”

In summary: you may attend Mass anywhere you choose (this is entirely your own choice), but you are only a parishioner of the parish in whose territory you actually reside.
 
As of now, the parish I belong to is in a city in which I no longer live. We moved, but we did not switch parishes. So where do I stand in that situation? Do I not belong anywhere right now?
 
You are certainly free to change parishes if you decide it is best for your family, but be sure to register at the new parish if you live outside their boundaries, and support it financially and every other way. Key factor in your decision: the Catholic school and RE programs for your children at the parishes around you. Of course the content, teaching and aspects of the program, but do you need to be a registered supporting member of the parish to participate or get reduced fees.

Canonically you are a member of the territorial parish in which you reside, so yes, every Catholic “belongs” to a parish.

you may also be a member of a jurisdictional parish no matter where you life (the Lithuanian or Italian parish in your area, for instance, if such has been established by the local ordinary). Where we raised our kids in Cleveland we resided in the “generic” parish (which years ago was the “Irish” parish) but were expected to participate in the relevant ethnic-language parish in the area if be belonged to that group, especially if one wanted to send children to their schools: so were surrounded by a Lithuanian, Slovenian, 2 Italian, Spanish language, Polish, Hungarian parishes in the immediate neighborhood. Those divisions have someone dissolved by now, especially with all the parish closings and consolidations going on in that diocese. Anyhow it gave a whole new meaning to “Mass in the vernacular” during those years of rapid liturgical changes.
 
DWC_RC said:
As of now, the parish I belong to is in a city in which I no longer live. We moved, but we did not switch parishes. So where do I stand in that situation? Do I not belong anywhere right now?
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What city did you move to? And county? I can tell you wich parish you are technically part of that way.

Moving would basically mean that you belong to another parish anyways, but there were other issues at play still.
 
DWC_RC said:
As of now, the parish I belong to is in a city in which I no longer live. We moved, but we did not switch parishes. So where do I stand in that situation? Do I not belong anywhere right now?
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The parish you “belong to” is the one in which you live. You might still be registered at your old parish, but that means nothing with regard to parish membership (there was a typo in my last post when I said “membership has nothing to do with membership” it should have read "registration has nothing to do with membership). As soon as you established residency in your new place, you ceased to be a member of your old parish, and became a member of your new parish–this happened even if you weren’t aware of it, and even if you never notified either parish. So even though you haven’t “registered” at your new parish, you are a member there.

Parish registration is nothing more than an administrative tool for the parish office staff to keep track of members and regular visitors. It’s an important and useful tool, but it has nothing to do with actually being a member of any parish. If a non-parishioner would like to be on the mailing list, or wants envelopes to make regular donations, that’s usually fine. In fact, anyone who makes regular donations is entitled to a tax receipt anyway. Most parishes will “register” anyone (parishioner or not) because if someone wants to be kept informed about the parish, that’s fine. However, sometimes other issues are at-play when territory needs to be enforced.

For most people it doesn’t become an issue unless and until something happens to make it an issue. It does become an issue whenever one encounters a situation that involves parish jurisdiction (like baptism, marriage, etc.). Puzzleannie already mentioned parish closings and consolitations in Cleveland. The same thing is/was happening in the Philadelphia area, and many others (Boston comes to mind). In Philadelphia a few years ago, the bishop decided that parish boundaries would be enforced, and very very strictly. The parishes all had to “clean up” their registration lists to include only those who were actually members of that parish. With all the parish closings and consolidations we’ve seen in the past few years (especially closing the ethnic parishes) the general trend is that dioceses are being much more strict in enforcing parish territory.
 
I think you should go to the closest church to your home, which I assume would generally be the same one whose “territory” you belong to.

My situation was strikingly similar to yours. We went to the parish where we were baptized and married, and the kids were baptized there too. The preaching was often kind of average or repeated year to year, and there was some stuff going on that one could complain about. For example, the pastor wasn’t really keen on the idea of confession before first communion. He would hand out communion to the extraordinary ministers before taking it himself. A couple of times I observed him sitting on the altar not distributing communion while the EMs were doing it. The parish was continually in debt, until we got close to out of it, then we built or remodeled more.

Also during this time I was spending more and more time learning some of the nuts-and-bolts of the faith (that I hadn’t learned growing up) and got kind of good at noticing what everyone else was doing wrong. The more and more that I learned the less and less I was satisfied with the quality of my parish experience. Many times I would think, “things are a lot better at St. Z parish - we should go there.”

Somewhere in there my dad had a complicated recovery from a surgery and spent months in the hospital. Years later he told me how Father X would come and spend time with him. He said the visits were frequent and lasted an hour or so.

That made something click inside my head. Our Pastor was no longer in competition with me to be a perfect catholic but rather was someone who cared deeply about people and was doing his job to the best of his ability. Here was someone who was working at least 60 hours a week who needed help, not criticism. Perhaps rather than building a wall as I discover his defects and failures, I should respond with love, encouragement, prayer, and a positive attitude - just like he was a spouse, parent, or child of mine. Maybe I am the light of the world and should start acting like it.

And you know what? Mass did get better, any way you measure it.

A final thought - one thing I never noticed until much later - is what a prize it is to have your young family as part of the parish. God bless the old ladies, but there is something about seeing mom, dad, and the kids in the pews that is a source of pride and joy for the rest of us in the community. In that sense you are “owned” by your home parish. You have the power to do whatever you want; however, be very careful with how you treat other people’s treasures.

NJoy
 
Where is the “territory” of a given parish published? And where is the rule that a person belongs to the parish closest to their home? Canon law?

I live about 1/2 mile from a “Catholic community,” whatever that is. The building is like a gym, there are no kneelers or pews, and the music on the speakers before Mass was Indian sitar music. So I started attending a church about 3 miles from my home and stayed through Easter Vigil, baptism and confirmation. I left because the priest skipped and added steps during Mass, and taught things contrary to Church teachings in RCIA. Several times. I’m now a happy parishioner at our Cathedral, where we have three holy priests that say the black and do the red with no ad-libs or short cuts. They also preach the gospel and the teachings of the Church. Imagine that.

I think you should move if you need to move. If things are bad enough (heretical, against Church teachings) then try to change them. But it’s your soul, and those of your family, that are at stake. I charitably and politely brought up things to the priest and was cut off at the knees. So I left. And I pray for him every single day.

I’m not looking for a perfect priest, just a Catholic one.
 
GwenL said:
Where is the “territory” of a given parish published? And where is the rule that a person belongs to the parish closest to their home? Canon law?
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Yes, canon law.

Can. 515 §1. A parish is a certain community of the Christian faithful stably constituted in a particular church, whose pastoral care is entrusted to a pastor (parochus) as its proper pastor (pastor) under the authority of the diocesan bishop. §2. It is only for the diocesan bishop to erect, suppress, or alter parishes. He is neither to erect, suppress, nor alter notably parishes, unless he has heard the presbyteral council.

Can. 518 As a general rule a parish is to be territorial, that is, one which includes all the Christian faithful of a certain territory. When it is expedient, however, personal parishes are to be established determined by reason of the rite, language, or nationality of the Christian faithful of some territory, or even for some other reason.

vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/__P1U.HTM

The bishop of each diocese determines the territory of each parish. Whether or not that information is published in something like a diocesan directory or webpage will vary by diocese; but it’s always known to the pastor of each parish, and the information is available by contacting the parish or the chancery.
 
GwenL said:
Where is the “territory” of a given parish published? And where is the rule that a person belongs to the parish closest to their home? Canon law?
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The boundaries of a parish may or may not be published, but the diocese should be able to tell you which parish you live in, and if the people at the parish are competent enough they should know the boundaries.

Be careful, though, I don’t think the rule is that you necessarily belong to the parish that’s literally closest to your home; parishes have geographic boundaries. Think of the church in its parish as the capital of a state – being in Chicago I’m closer to Madison, Wisconsin than to Springfield, Illinois, but I still live in Illinois.
 
MarkThompson said:
The boundaries of a parish may or may not be published, but the diocese should be able to tell you which parish you live in, and if the people at the parish are competent enough they should know the boundaries.

Be careful, though, I don’t think the rule is that you necessarily belong to the parish that’s literally closest to your home; parishes have geographic boundaries. Think of the church in its parish as the capital of a state – being in Chicago I’m closer to Madison, Wisconsin than to Springfield, Illinois, but I still live in Illinois.
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yeah, when we moved to this place, so we went to our parish for Mass. several years later, a new parish was established and the church was closer to us. two parishes had to give up territory to that new parish, but our house was still included in the original parish’s territory. so we don’t go to mass there anymore, we don’t even contribute our parish, even the priest in the new parish knows us better while the priests at the old parish don’t even know us. but we still belonged to that parish and when i got married i still had to file my wedding bans in my home parish. even though i haven’t gone there for Mass for years
 
DWC_RC said:
I’m not switching parishes to save money.
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I know. It’s an issue that confronted me lately as my son is Kindergarten-age and we don’t want our kids going to a State school. We also aren’t changing parishes to save money but know there are families that do.

As an aside, a suggested book on the sidebar is I’m Not Being Fed by Jeff Cavins. I’m sure the author encourages the reader to consider the Eucharist as the primary benefit for going to Mass. The Eucharist is the same throughout the One Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church. It is not limited to beautiful churches with beautiful music and skilled homilists.
 
GwenL said:
Where is the “territory” of a given parish published? And where is the rule that a person belongs to the parish closest to their home? Canon law?

I live about 1/2 mile from a “Catholic community,” whatever that is. The building is like a gym, there are no kneelers or pews, and the music on the speakers before Mass was Indian sitar music. So I started attending a church about 3 miles from my home and stayed through Easter Vigil, baptism and confirmation. I left because the priest skipped and added steps during Mass, and taught things contrary to Church teachings in RCIA. Several times. I’m now a happy parishioner at our Cathedral, where we have three holy priests that say the black and do the red with no ad-libs or short cuts. They also preach the gospel and the teachings of the Church. Imagine that.

I think you should move if you need to move. If things are bad enough (heretical, against Church teachings) then try to change them. But it’s your soul, and those of your family, that are at stake. I charitably and politely brought up things to the priest and was cut off at the knees. So I left. And I pray for him every single day.

I’m not looking for a perfect priest, just a Catholic one.
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Gwen, I am glad that you made the move so that your family may grow in the Truth. However, it is not just your family’s souls at stake here, but every single one of those parishoners. I therefore suggest that you bring up the issue of teaching contrary to the Church teachings up with the Bishop. We actually have this right by Canon Law to do so respectfully. I urge you, do not just let a Priest teach contrary to the faith.

Pax!
 
When I was young, my family stopped attending our local parish in favor of another one further away as my mom clearly felt she would lose the faith if she kept going to the local parish as it was that bad.

While there are situations where it is prudent to go elsewhere, be very careful that you do so for the legitimate grave reasons, and not fall into “priest-hopping” or “church hopping.”

Since then we have moved, and now we regularly go to our local parish. It isn’t the best, but we won’t lose our faith going there unlike the other. :knight1:
 
However, it is not just your family’s souls at stake here, but every single one of those parishoners.
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I was responding to the OP with this. I do not have a family.
I therefore suggest that you bring up the issue of teaching contrary to the Church teachings up with the Bishop
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The bishop will do nothing but laugh if he gets a letter from a neophyte. Sad, but reality.

Other longer-term Catholics were in the room during one particularly egregious session. When I asked them afterwards, they sighed and said “that’s Father, I don’t know why he says the things he does sometimes.”
 
I went through something similar, not building wise but teaching wise. My parish (the one I joined the Church through RCIA 3 years ago) very rarely go into much we would call out and out abuse, but there is still a very present liberal undercurrent. This has been made even more obvious as I have started going through catechises classes. For a little while I thought abuot going to the more conservative Catholic church nearby (thats actually closer to my house) but I decided not to and here is why:

This is my Church, its all our Church and is a gift handed down to us. Like any gift we have to cherish and nuture it so it can grow. Yes there was some things I wasnt thrilled abuot, so what do you do? Well personally I ran for parish elections for the Youth ministry board…and I won. So I plan to do what little i can (in addition to teaching religious classes in the fall for the high schoolers) to bring everything bact to the ideal.

So if possible I recommend if you arent a fan of something at your parish, if you can dont just cut and run, but try to get involved. If the teachings are getting a lil liberal, volunteer to teach. If the art is leaving alot to be desired, talk to the pastor about raising some money to get something like a saint statue commissioned.

If things get really bad, you need to first of all make your feeling known to your pastor, even if he is the source of the problems you never know if you talking to him might help him understand. If things move over into the liturgical abuse section write your bishop. If however after doing all this you find that your spiritual growth is in danger, well eventually you have to do what is best for you own faith, and espically if you have a family with younguns.

Personally after reading the OP I would go to church B, but this is mainly because as someone who grew up Protestant I have had just about enough of lil metal buildings and want to feel like I am in a house of God.

God Bless
 
There are a few things to consider about a parish you are attending.
  1. Is there respect for the Real Presence of Christ? This is first because it is at the heart of the Mass.
  2. Is the priest in harmony with Catholic teaching? Through his homilies and through programs in the Church?
  3. Is the music respectful and sacred in nature?
  4. When you enter the Church before Mass, are people silent? In prayer? Or is Leroy chatting loudly with Chester about last Saturday’s hunting trip?
 
If the OP hasn’t already done so, and his family is willing, he should take his family to Parish B without further delay - or else end up like me: bitter and confused.

My wife and I are returning Catholics. In fact, it was I who insisted that we come back to Catholicism after a long church absence, and a detour to a wonderful Baptist church down the road. However our local Catholic parish is filled with the people the OP described, and worse. No reason to go into details. But suffices to say, it has been a true test for me to continue to attend. I am at the point where I find myself being overly critical and questioning Catholicism based on the conduct of fellow parishioners, church staff, and even the priests themselves. It is not a good position to be in. But the other parishes are far away. So if the OP has another parish nearby, he should attend there.
 
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