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White_Peony
Guest
What is it?
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followingtheway
Guest
Like the the Charismatic movement (which is similar to Pentecostalism) but with Catholic practices, beliefs, and so on. So it’s Pretty much Catholics who do things like speak in tongues…
The Church is okay with it…
God bless :byzsoc:
David
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White_Peony
Guest
And the Church is ok with it?! What on earth?!
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PatriceA
Guest
Be careful, there are quite a few Charismatic Catholics here at CAF. You’d do better if you search for information in past threads.
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GloriousOrder
Guest
Yes, we wouldn’t want to upset the poor darlings, would we?
Let their ‘side’ take as much flak as traditionalists get!White Peony, Charismatic Catholicism is a rubbish idea stemming from Catholic acceptance of a Protestant notion called Continuationism. The old debate is that the Charismatic Gifts mentioned by St. Paul (prophecy, healing, speaking in tongues) either continued after, or ceased at the death of, St. John the Apostle; the former side are called Continuationists, and the latter are called Cessationists. Most classical protties were Cessationists, believing the Gifts ceased around A.D. 100. The Charismatic movement is recent, and stems from old breakaway Protestants, who said the gifts continued.
The problem with the both camps is that they recognise gifts from Pentecost that never existed, were never recognised as legitimate by the Catholic Church before the 1970’s, and thus are a delusion. “Speaking” and “praying” in tongues means nothing in the modern sense: it’s gibberish. Why would God use rational creatures to spread the Gospel via a fundamentally irrational operation of the will? It contradicts everything He has given us through history, especially the wisdom of St. Thomas on human nature.
Report this post, if you want. Charismatic Christianity is nonsense. C.A.F. is ruled by a dictatorship of fear with regards to lack-of-charity. Won’t anyone stand up for what they are sure is the best form of worship? Must there be a grand inquisition because someone dislikes Charismatics? We ought to have some fortitude… it’s a virtue, you know, C.A.F.!
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PatriceA
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Unlike you, I would rather respect both Traditionalists and the Charismatics. There is room for both in the Catholic faith.Yes, we wouldn’t want to upset the poor darlings, would we?
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GloriousOrder
Guest
There is room for a lot in Catholicism, due to its wonderful, nebulous nature. I respect traditionalist human beings and charismatic human beings equally for their ontological nature. All are made in the image of God; however, some like to turn their backs on more than 1600 years of liturgical worship and go for dancing. I may have to tolerate the idea, but are we not allowed to dislike things?
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Dorothy
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Thank you! As long as they are obeying the Magisterium of the Church we should be charitable.
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BertBlyleven
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A troll I sense…
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White_Peony
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I think that one shouldn’t be obsessing too much on one fruit of the Spirit. All are from God. I have nothing against speaking in tongues, but St.Paul said speakin in tongues is worthless if someone else cannot understand it. Just my thoughts. Oh, for another, I think a part of speaking in tongues means being able to pick up on another language quickly. Like my bff’s older sister picked up on French very fast. My bff figured out Spanish quite well because she knew some French. I, too, figured out Spanish quickly from knowing some Latin (being Catholic pays off in school, no? Thank You, Jesus, for Your help!). My bff, her sister, and I can pick up on languages very fast. perhaps that is part of speaking in tongues.
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White_Peony
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Oh, is Charismatic Catholicism eastren rite or is it another break away?
And can we please be kind? In Christ’s name have a little respect for you felllow man.
And can we please be kind? In Christ’s name have a little respect for you felllow man.
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dconklin
Guest
Charismatic is not a title. It is a way of worshiping.
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Scoobyshme
Guest
It’s basically an emotion-based thing. It tends to easily (and erroneously) lead folks to seeking emotions as the end, rather than the means. I’m tolerant of it, but just barely. I think it’s okay for folks just getting into the spiritual life, but it’s not a long-term solution by any means. It gets you all hyped up emotionally, and then leaves you nowhere to go. The essence of true spiritual life is prayer, sacrifice, self-denial, carrying the cross, and especially serving Christ, His Church, and others.
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Dorothy
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I agree that it is not a long-term thing, but I have seen the charismatic renewal draw many Catholics deeper into the Church, and then they become more fully involved with their spiritual life and ways of doing service.
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jilly4ski
Guest
I agree, it can be a good jumping off point or a way to worship differently if you are already strong in your faith and well versed in traditional devotions. It can make for a good spiritual revival retreat.
Some of the dangers of the Charismatic movement are that people sometimes get stuck there and that can lead to a stagnation of the faith. Also, after awhile you can’t get the same emotional high as you did and if can feel like God has abandoned you, which of course is untrue, but when one is so focused on the emotional feeling, it seems that way. There are some liturgical abuses associated with the Charismatics, but it doesn’t have to be so.
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Ben_F
Guest
In 1970 I experimented with speaking in tongues. I was young. I was impressed. I wanted it so bad. I believe there are others still very much into this , as I was back then. Paul could have been talking about these spirit filled utterances that no one can understand. Maybe he even experienced it. I have a hard time not judging those that do this. We have many in our Church that do a lot of praying, walking down the isle on their knees toward the alter, making a lot of attention to theirselves. I´m sort of a pray in your closet type Christian. Never the less, I believe we should let these people go their way. If it´s real it will grow. If not. It will dissappear. Like the life at conception debate, we should err on the side of life not death. For all the Carismatics here God bless. If I should go bananas in Mass some day, then so be it. I really think Love is my main blessing that I want. I really don´t love the Lord as much as I should. God bless:thumbsup:
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Irish_Polock
Guest
This is the truth of it; thanks GloriousOrder! :clapping:Yes, we wouldn’t want to upset the poor darlings, would we?
White Peony, Charismatic Catholicism is a rubbish idea stemming from Catholic acceptance of a Protestant notion called Continuationism. The old debate is that the Charismatic Gifts mentioned by St. Paul (prophecy, healing, speaking in tongues) either continued after, or ceased at the death of, St. John the Apostle; the former side are called Continuationists, and the latter are called Cessationists. Most classical protties were Cessationists, believing the Gifts ceased around A.D. 100. The Charismatic movement is recent, and stems from old breakaway Protestants, who said the gifts continued.
The problem with the both camps is that they recognise gifts from Pentecost that never existed, were never recognised as legitimate by the Catholic Church before the 1970’s, and thus are a delusion. “Speaking” and “praying” in tongues means nothing in the modern sense: it’s gibberish. Why would God use rational creatures to spread the Gospel via a fundamentally irrational operation of the will? It contradicts everything He has given us through history, especially the wisdom of St. Thomas on human nature.
Report this post, if you want. Charismatic Christianity is nonsense. C.A.F. is ruled by a dictatorship of fear with regards to lack-of-charity. Won’t anyone stand up for what they are sure is the best form of worship? Must there be a grand inquisition because someone dislikes Charismatics? We ought to have some fortitude… it’s a virtue, you know, C.A.F.!
God be with you!
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Alan55
Guest
Catholic Charismatic Renewal has been spoken of favorably by Popes Paul VI, John Paul II and Benedict XVI. They have recognized it as a genuine movement of the Holy Spirit. Gifts of the Spirit such as speaking in tongues, prophecy and healing are discussed in the bible (Romans, Ephesians, and especially I Corinthians) and the exercise of such gifts in contemporary charismatic renewal has been viewed as legitimate by the popes. Unfortunately, those not involved in Charismatic Renewal have sometimes dismissed the movement as false or irrelevant, such as the post quoted above.Yes, we wouldn’t want to upset the poor darlings, would we?
White Peony, Charismatic Catholicism is a rubbish idea stemming from Catholic acceptance of a Protestant notion called Continuationism. The old debate is that the Charismatic Gifts mentioned by St. Paul (prophecy, healing, speaking in tongues) either continued after, or ceased at the death of, St. John the Apostle; the former side are called Continuationists, and the latter are called Cessationists. Most classical protties were Cessationists, believing the Gifts ceased around A.D. 100. The Charismatic movement is recent, and stems from old breakaway Protestants, who said the gifts continued.
The problem with the both camps is that they recognise gifts from Pentecost that never existed, were never recognised as legitimate by the Catholic Church before the 1970’s, and thus are a delusion. “Speaking” and “praying” in tongues means nothing in the modern sense: it’s gibberish. Why would God use rational creatures to spread the Gospel via a fundamentally irrational operation of the will? It contradicts everything He has given us through history, especially the wisdom of St. Thomas on human nature.
Report this post, if you want. Charismatic Christianity is nonsense. C.A.F. is ruled by a dictatorship of fear with regards to lack-of-charity. Won’t anyone stand up for what they are sure is the best form of worship? Must there be a grand inquisition because someone dislikes Charismatics? We ought to have some fortitude… it’s a virtue, you know, C.A.F.!
I haven’t participated in charismatic prayer meetings since the 1980s, but the movement had lasting effects on my life. I became a Catholic as a result of Catholic charismatic prayer meetings, fell in love with scripture, and gained a deep love for prayer and the liturgy of the Church. I don’t understand the vehemence with which some attack this movement, even though those participating are not perfect, of course. If you don’t find Charismatic Renewal helpful to your own growth in Christ, don’t participate. Many find it helpful.
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Joe_5859
Guest
If anyone is interested in what the popes have to say on the Catholic Charismatic Renewal Movement (CCRM), here are some of their addresses:
I myself am not Charismatic. It is a spirituality that doesn’t really resonate with me personally. But if the popes are okay with it, that’s good enough for me. I’m perfectly fine with the fact that everyone is not like me. 
- Address of Pope Benedict XVI to Participants in a Meeting Organized by the Catholic Fraternity of Charismatic Covenant Communities and Fellowships (October 31, 2008)
- Message of John Paul II to the Catholic Fraternity of Charismatic Covenant Communities and Fellowships (November 7, 2002)
- Message of John Paul II to the Catholic Charismatic Renewal (April 24, 2000)
- Address of John Paul II to the Participants in the International Conference for Catholic Charismatic Leaders (October 30, 1998)
- Message of John Paul II to the Participants in the 8th International Meeting of the Catholic Fraternity of Charismatic Covenant Communities and Fellowships (June 1, 1998)
- Address of John Paul II to the Council of the International Catholic Charismatic Renewal Office (March 14, 1992)
- Address of John Paul II to the Participants of the Sixth International Assembly of the Charismatic Renewal (May 15, 1987)
I myself am not Charismatic. It is a spirituality that doesn’t really resonate with me personally. But if the popes are okay with it, that’s good enough for me.
I’m perfectly fine with the fact that everyone is not like me.
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GloriousOrder
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Beloved Brother Alan, I only say what I say in honour of clarity of opinion. It is firmly right and just for all people to speak their minds. At least we can get a clear idea of who opposes what and who is in favour of what. This is a very good thing to do, to get a clear, honest, and total grasp of the grand picture of people, life, and things. Human nature must be understood if we are to conquer our own! Many find it helpful, but many also find it detrimental, so both sides may speak and try to convince one another.
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