Charismatic Retreats? My First Experience

[PassthePeace1]

I see. So my experience likely would have been better if there were better preparation on my part and the organisers of the retreat.

Still, I think there were methods in which things should not have been done. In the end, you may be right though, that this type of worship is not for me. If I saw more order in the activities, I would be more accepting.

If this was an ACTS Retreat, they won’t let you prepare. All they will tell you is it will change your life, and you just have to see for yourself. At my parish they won’t leave you alone about, they have hounded us so much that my DH doesn’t even want to go back there, we are looking for another parish. Plus the disruptions to the Mass when they come back from the retreat, is very distrubing…they turn the Rite of Peace, into a pep rally, that lasted for about 5 to 7 mins of hugs and backslapping and very loud greetings to each other.

I don’t know if what you went to was an ACTS Retreat, but if it was…did they make you take pledge of secrecy? Or something to that effect?

 

[almightyservant]

The retreat I went to was organised by a group of Vietnamese. I’d give you a link, if you could read the language. It is called “Thanh Linh” which means Holy Spirit. I don’t recall any vow of secrecy, but I only went to the retreat 1 out of 3 days.

I haven’t been researching the Internet for articles, comments, and documents for a while. During my research, I saw that the Charismatic movement is a legitimate thing, but it simply has so much room for improper activity, and therefore can lead some astray. I recognise the benefits described by some on the fora, maybe I don’t have the grace to actually stick with the program of folksy singing, ejaculation of an unknown language, assuming the orans position throughout the Mass, and dancing in some parts (I say this without sarcasm.)

I’ve only been to one charismatic retreat, and others may be so much more different. But then, I don’t think I’ll revisit charismaticism (is that a word?) again
anytime soon. My first experience has been emotional and spiritually traumatic for me. I think a good thing that’s come out of this is that the experience has pushed me to read up more on Catholic Tradition and history, & history of the liturgy, and some church documents.

 

[PassthePeace1]

Okay, doesn’t sound like it was the ACTS Retreat, just wondered since I think we are in the same Diocese.

Our soon to be former parish is very Charismatic now, we are very uncomfortable there and it’s really distracting and hard to focus on the liturgy. We tried to stick it out for years, but it’s just to much now.

 

[Michael_Welter]

almightyservant, I appreciate your open minded attitude about this, and the respectful tone of this thread. This is really refreshing.

I’ve been involved with the Catholic Charismatic Renewal since 1972. Without it, I don’t think I would be Catholic today. As a result of this form of prayer, I have fallen in love with Christ and Hos Church. I am 100% Catholic, and accept all that the Church teaches, even if I don’t understand it. I received the gift of tongues in 1972, and it has greatly enhanced my personal prayer. While I use it sometimes during Mass, it is never loud enough to be heard by others.

When I first started going to charismatic prayer meetings, there was a 15 minute session before the prayer meeting started to introduce newcomers to the renewal, including explanations of what they would see and experience. It really helped people not freak out. A few years back, I worked on retreats at our parish that included some charismatic elements. I gave a talk on the Holy Spirit, and including explanations about these elements. I really think it helps if people know what to expect before they see it.

May our Lord pour His blessings upon you.

 

[benedictgal]

There are many problelms that I see with what the OP reported. First of all, the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass does not belong to anyone partcular person or ecclesial movement so that they could treat it as they please. Even the Exposition of the Blessed Sacrament, with Benediction, is a liturgy of the Church with its own particular norms and rubrics.

The account of the Consecration is most disheartening. The celebrant does not have the right to interrupt the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass and encourage this kind of activity. According to Redemptionis Sacramentum:

[53.] While the Priest proclaims the Eucharistic Prayer “there should be no other prayers or singing, and the organ or other musical instruments should be silent”,132 except for the people’s acclamations that have been duly approved, as described below.

“No” means no. This means no verbal praying of any sort should be happening. The only one who should be audible, at least in the Ordinary Form, is the celebrant (and concelebrants). No one else should be speaking.

The issue of dancing is also a major issue. There is no tradition in the West for this sort of activity. Now, if the movement was tied in with an indigenous group such as Native Americans, Aztecs, Aborigines, African tribal nations and those who live in missionary territories, then, that is an entirely different matter because of inculturation. It is interesting that proponents of this kind of innovation will invoke King David. King David’s dance was not part of the cultic worship of Ancient Israel. In fact, God spent no little time on the details regarding how, when, where and in what manner He was to be worshipped. Nowhere in the texts of Deuteronomy, Leviticus and Numbers is dancing mentioned as a form of cultic, sacrificial worship. The Church, as the New Israel, appropriated many forms of Ancient Israel’s cultic, sacrificial worship, including the use of gold vessels and other items. Dancing is not one of them.

Furthermore, while people are certainly free to pray in whatever form they choose outside of the confines of the liturgy, the ecclesial movements who are sanctioned by the Church need to respect and abide by the liturgical norms established by the Holy See. The liturgy is not just about the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass; it also includes the Liturgy of the Hours and Exposition and Benediction of the Blessed Sacrament. There are norms that must be followed. No movement, no person, not even the priest, has the right to amend what the Church has established. Several movements have already gotten in trouble for their abuses, including the Neocatechumenal Way and LifeTeen. While the Charismatic Movement is sanctioned by the Church (and no one should question that), they are not exempt from following the norms of the Liturgy, no matter what form it takes (the Mass, LOTH, and Exposition/Benediction).

 

[Lux_et_Tenebrae]

almightyservant, I appreciate your open minded attitude about this, and the respectful tone of this thread. This is really refreshing.

I’ve been involved with the Catholic Charismatic Renewal since 1972. Without it, I don’t think I would be Catholic today. As a result of this form of prayer, I have fallen in love with Christ and Hos Church. I am 100% Catholic, and accept all that the Church teaches, even if I don’t understand it. I received the gift of tongues in 1972, and it has greatly enhanced my personal prayer. While I use it sometimes during Mass, it is never loud enough to be heard by others.

When I first started going to charismatic prayer meetings, there was a 15 minute session before the prayer meeting started to introduce newcomers to the renewal, including explanations of what they would see and experience. It really helped people not freak out. A few years back, I worked on retreats at our parish that included some charismatic elements. I gave a talk on the Holy Spirit, and including explanations about these elements. I really think it helps if people know what to expect before they see it.

May our Lord pour His blessings upon you.

Hi Michael,

Thanks for the post. It is good to see a balance. Those who do like Charismatic style worship certainly have a choice not to attend. It is really wrong to trash the entire movement because of some abuses. This would be akin to bashing the Mass because of some abuses.

Lux

 

[thunderballs75]

So that I may act in charity and not be offensive I will keep it short.

The Charismatic movement is not my thing at all. All I will say is that we should be cautious about liturgical abuses, and don’t be afraid to report them if they happen.

God bless.