Chastity/Relationships

[PrayerGal]

Hello Catholic Answers Forum…

I wondered if anyone could offer their advice on the following situation as well as (name removed by moderator)ut on leading a chaste life in my mid 30s.

I have know a gentleman for 3 years. He is what I thought a good friend. We ‘dated’ a couple times in the beginning and at one point he said he was not ‘ready for what I wanted.’ Of course the translation in my head when men learn of my living a chaste life, is that they are not ready to be a man. Having said this, I honored his space. Along the way however, through friendship, I really believe that feelings were developing on both sides. Recently however, I learned, in an odd circumstance, that he is dating someone. Of course, it hurt, but the thing that really made it hurt, was that just a week prior to learning of this, I had posed the question to him on whether he was dating someone. He skirted around the question and let’s just say he did not answer with a yes. I was furious over the fact that he would lie to me.

I have written him a couple letters to express my anger. I admit I am battling on whether this is the right course of action. Does he ‘owe’ me an apology? More than anything, I just feel used as a toy that someone wouldn’t respect my feelings, knowing that he knew I had deep affection for him. I think it’s inappropriate to flirt with another if they are seeing someone else. I want to talk to him about chastity issues…about speaking the truth from our mouths always, etc., I guess I am at a loss as how to broach this topic to him or if I should even waste time.

This also brings up the next issue. I am finding it so hard to find a man who respects chastity in a woman. I think it’s unbelievable that I am a woman in her mid 30’s and cannot find a respectable mate…I have been on probably 100s of dates in my dating lifetime, and the amount of lust that exists in and out Catholic circles absolutely makes me nauseous. I am at a loss if I should have chastity talks close in the relationship beginning or take a couple dates to broach this topic. I have been asked by men both Catholic and non Catholic very early into the dating whether I want to wait for marriage for sex or whether I am a virgin. Even my friends ask me why do guys bring that topic up so soon? I have no clue except to say that I probably become an object of lust to them. Let me add, that I have changed much about myself in the way I speak, dress, etc. to counteract these issues and it just seems that nothing is working. In some ways, I think I have gone so far right, that men probably think I will lack intimacy in a relationship, which could be further from the Truth.

Anyhow, I appreciate any insight on this topic. Please also pray for me !

Blessings

 

[Latinitas]

Hello Catholic Answers Forum…

I wondered if anyone could offer their advice on the following situation as well as (name removed by moderator)ut on leading a chaste life in my mid 30s.

Sure, I’ll take this part by part. I should say that I’m no substitute for a good confessor’s opinion.

I have know a gentleman for 3 years. He is what I thought a good friend. We ‘dated’ a couple times in the beginning and at one point he said he was not ‘ready for what I wanted.’ Of course the translation in my head when men learn of my living a chaste life, is that they are not ready to be a man. Having said this, I honored his space. Along the way however, through friendship, I really believe that feelings were developing on both sides. Recently however, I learned, in an odd circumstance, that he is dating someone. Of course, it hurt, but the thing that really made it hurt, was that just a week prior to learning of this, I had posed the question to him on whether he was dating someone. He skirted around the question and let’s just say he did not answer with a yes. I was furious over the fact that he would lie to me.

Careful. Charity demands that we don’t assume sin without sound reasons to do so. “Not ready for you wanted” does not strike me as meaning not wanting chastity, but rather not wanting a relationship with you. There is nothing wrong with that, since there is no obligation to date anyone (there’s no obligation to marry; on the contrary, celibacy and virginity are counseled and praised). Also, avoiding the question may not have been kind, but I can’t say it’s actually a sin. There’s a difference between outright lying and tactfully avoiding a question that he doesn’t feel you need to know the answer to.

I have written him a couple letters to express my anger. I admit I am battling on whether this is the right course of action. Does he ‘owe’ me an apology? More than anything, I just feel used as a toy that someone wouldn’t respect my feelings, knowing that he knew I had deep affection for him. I think it’s inappropriate to flirt with another if they are seeing someone else. I want to talk to him about chastity issues…about speaking the truth from our mouths always, etc., I guess I am at a loss as how to broach this topic to him or if I should even waste time.

It’s good that you express your anger, provided it’s moderate and does not interfere with charity. But from what you’ve said, I can’t say he “owes” you an apology. If he did lie, than an apology would be called for, but if he didn’t, there’s not obligation on his part. He is not obliged to date you or anyone for that matter, so there’s no breach of justice. As far as chastity issued are concerned, that’s probably too personal, and I would leave it God and his confessor to work on that issue (pray that he’s seeing one). As for speaking the truth, you might say you would have preferred an honest answer to your question, but do remember to listen, especially since he might have considered that too prying on your part.

This also brings up the next issue. I am finding it so hard to find a man who respects chastity in a woman. I think it’s unbelievable that I am a woman in her mid 30’s and cannot find a respectable mate…I have been on probably 100s of dates in my dating lifetime, and the amount of lust that exists in and out Catholic circles absolutely makes me nauseous. I am at a loss if I should have chastity talks close in the relationship beginning or take a couple dates to broach this topic. I have been asked by men both Catholic and non Catholic very early into the dating whether I want to wait for marriage for sex or whether I am a virgin. Even my friends ask me why do guys bring that topic up so soon? I have no clue except to say that I probably become an object of lust to them. Let me add, that I have changed much about myself in the way I speak, dress, etc. to counteract these issues and it just seems that nothing is working. In some ways, I think I have gone so far right, that men probably think I will lack intimacy in a relationship, which could be further from the Truth.

Alas, you’re not alone in trying to find chaste persons to marry; such is the culture. Be careful with chastity talks too early, since it might seem, even to chaste men, that a) you’re bitter about men, or b) that you have some hidden point you’re trying to make. Don’t assume that the man you’re dating isn’t chaste; charity demands that we don’t make assumption of others’ characters like this. But, since it is reasonable and indeed pious to want to date only devout and chaste men, you might simply say that you’re a devout Catholic who is serious about chastity, and is looking for someone who is the same. That way you don’t sound like you’re singling the guy out, or making some kind of assumption about his character.

Anyhow, I appreciate any insight on this topic. Please also pray for me !

Blessings

I hope this was helpful, and prayers will be offered for you.

Benedicat Deus,
Latinitas

 

[catherine_m]

Praying for you and your intentions, and for all of us who find it so difficult to find a good, holy man!

And also for men who find it difficult to find a good holy woman.

 

[PrayerGal]

Thank you for your thoughtful reflection. A couple more things I should add or perhaps reflect upon:

I am totally willing to acknowledge if a man has no further interest beyond friendship, but I think I can honestly say, that I don’t think that is the situation here. He stated 'not ready for what I wanted" and a year later he is telling he misses me, etc., etc. I’m not sure that these affections read as purely friendship. There has been clear flirting. What is upsetting is being lead on if someone has no intention of further, and that is the issue I would want to speak with him about. I have known him for three years so this isnt a just beginning type conversation. We’ve had some deep conversation. Based on my observation, and I certainly say this in a charitable way, I do believe the sin of lust is at play.

Speaking of charity, I think we have to be careful to use that word as well, because as Fulton Sheen, we live in a culture of false compassion. Something is either right or wrong no?

I have analyzed in myself the idea of ‘bitterness’ and am fully able to acknowledge that there is probably some held resentment in general based on certain life experiences I had. I have been working on those in the last three years with spiritual director and others.

I look forward to any further comments.

Blessings to you and everyone on the forum.

 

[wild_thing]

If you are looking for advice, you might want to ask the mods to move your thread to the family life forum so more people will see it. This one is strictly for prayers. In the meantime, praying for your situation…

 

[PrayerGal]

Yes. I would be looking for advice…How do I get thread to family forum? Sorry, I am new here.

 

[244Rocket]

Praying for you.

 

[pollylodges]

Saint Michael, the archangel, defend us in battle, be our defense against the wickedness and snares of the devil, may God rebuke him, we humbly pray. And do you, O’ Prince of the Heavenly host, by the power of God thrust into Hell Satan and all the other evil spirits who prowl about the world for the ruin of souls.

Amen.

†

Our Father who art in Heaven, hallowed be thy name.

Thy kingdom come, thy will be done on Earth as it is in Heaven.

Give us this day our daily bread.

And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us.

And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.

Amen.

†

Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee.

Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb Jesus.

Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death.

Amen.

†

 

[mountee]

Yes. I would be looking for advice…How do I get thread to family forum? Sorry, I am new here.

Why not just start fresh with a new thread on the Family Life forum. If you look on the home page at all of the topics and subtopics you will see a forum called Catholic Life and the family forum is under it.
I will pray for you to be guided forward in a direction that will resolve your issues peacefully and leave you content.

 

[tawny]

Praying for your intentions.

 

[Hawkmaid]

St. Anne, pray for us!

 

[mommy_k]

Praying for your intentions, and yes, you should request this to be moved to family life subforum to get additional advice.

 

[UpUpAndAway]

Remembering you and your intentions in my daily prayers. God bless!

 

[Latinitas]

Thank you for your thoughtful reflection.

No problem. Sorry I haven’t responded sooner.

A couple more things I should add or perhaps reflect upon:

I am totally willing to acknowledge if a man has no further interest beyond friendship, but I think I can honestly say, that I don’t think that is the situation here. He stated 'not ready for what I wanted" and a year later he is telling he misses me, etc., etc. I’m not sure that these affections read as purely friendship. There has been clear flirting. What is upsetting is being lead on if someone has no intention of further, and that is the issue I would want to speak with him about. I have known him for three years so this isnt a just beginning type conversation. We’ve had some deep conversation. Based on my observation, and I certainly say this in a charitable way, I do believe the sin of lust is at play.

Okay. I should emphasize that charity towards our neighbor doesn’t mean we be gullible and naïve; it does mean, however, that we avoid suspicion of conduct. If what you describe is the case, then perhaps what I’d tell him that the signs he gave clearly implied that he was flirting, although he said he didn’t want a romantic relationship (give him the benefit of the doubt when talking to him). If he then tells you it was the chastity part that turned him off, then let it go, and pray for him.

Do remember though, he may want to date without marriage, and by expressing your thoughts on chastity, he may have thought that you were looking only for a marriage partner, whereas he just wanted a date. I’ll leave it to your judgment here, or better yet, your confessor’s judgment, though. If you think you have good grounds to assume that he is afraid of chastity then let it go. I would however warn you that if you have good reason to suspect that the man you’re looking into is not chaste, or at least does not want to be, then cut off the relationship. Otherwise, it may seem to him that you’re leading him on. Just my observations. I should emphasize again that I’m not a professional, and I can’t give expert advise on this point.

Speaking of charity, I think we have to be careful to use that word as well, because as Fulton Sheen, we live in a culture of false compassion. Something is either right or wrong no?

False compassion “charity” would be to excuse sin when sin is plainly present. But true charity does mean that we don’t hold others in suspicion without good reason to do so.

I have analyzed in myself the idea of ‘bitterness’ and am fully able to acknowledge that there is probably some held resentment in general based on certain life experiences I had. I have been working on those in the last three years with spiritual director and others.

Okay. I’m not accusing you of any wrongdoing here; after all, you’re asking for advice. Just be careful that suspicion does not ruin your perception of men; after all, no man, however good, wants to date a woman who thinks all men are lust-crazed beasts.

Benedicat Deus,
Latinitas

 

[detoutcoeur]

Praying for you…
+

*O most beautiful Flower of Mount Carmel, Fruitful Vine, Splendor of Heaven, who brought forth the Son of God still remaining a Virgin, assist us in this necessity.
O Star of the Sea, help us, and show us that you are our Mother.

O Holy Mary, Mother of God, Queen of Heaven and earth, we humbly ask you from the depths of our heart to help us in this necessity. There are none who can withstand your power.
O show us that you are our Mother.

O Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee. Sweet Mother, we place this cause in your hands. Amen.*

 

[ineedofmercy]

I’m a 15 year old guy so I might not be the best person to help
Here
But I can’t kinda understand your situation
Everyone of my guy friends brags about porn and other sins and I hate myself for when I fall to it
You said it is hard to find a guy that respects a woman’s chastity
Sometimes I fear that the other way around that some girls won’t like me if I’m not sexual or that I don’t want to disobey Gods rules on sex

I know i may be relating too well but I’m trying to help
Will pray for you
I wish I could give advice but I have little relationship experience

 

[detoutcoeur]

Prayers continuing for you…
+

*O most beautiful Flower of Mount Carmel, Fruitful Vine, Splendor of Heaven, who brought forth the Son of God still remaining a Virgin, assist us in this necessity. O Star of the Sea, help us, and show us that you are our Mother.

O Holy Mary, Mother of God, Queen of Heaven and earth, we humbly ask you from the depths of our heart to help us in this necessity. There are none who can withstand your power. O show us that you are our Mother.

O Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee. Sweet Mother, we place this cause in your hands. Amen.*