child safety

[SamH]

This mentality is why many people fear having a large family. Absolutely nothing wrong with teaching an older child to help care for younger siblings.

Agreed.

It teaches the older child responsibility and empathy. That’s why single child syndrome runs rampant even in families with two children.

 

[EasterJoy]

As it turns out, part of the problem is that youngsters have been known to use bathrooms for child-on-child assaults. This can include physical assaults that involve sexual humiliation. IOW, since the assailant is not seeking any sexual gratification, but rather to carry out some particularly humiliating personal attack, the assailant can be another child. Let’s be honest: This kind of thing is probably leagues more common than attacks by adult sexual predators. It isn’t so much necessary that an adult be in the bathroom itself as that the children inside know that it only takes one cry for help for an assailant to be caught red-handed, since there is an adult in earshot to hear the whole thing.

My twins have been escorting each other into bathrooms and swimming pool locker rooms since they were seven or eight. The problem with “the buddy system”–that is, with having two non-related children escort each other–is presented above. Bullies have been known to lure their victims into secluded places, where they can humiliate them in private, and we all know these bullies can easily be peers of the same or a similar age. (As for siblings, well, let’s face it, home is a far more convenient place to victimize one’s siblings.)

 

[KarenElissa]

So my question is this: Am I way out of touch on this one? In my discussions with other parents at my church, it seems I am. I was the only person who did not adamantly agree that it is irresponsible and dangerous to allow a child of any age to go the bathroom alone at church. If we can’t give them freedom and responsibility in environments like this, when can we? When do they start to learn how to grow up if their every action is parent supervised?

I don’t know if you have seen the Free Range Kids site, but I think you might appreciate their philosophy.

 

[EasterJoy]

Where does this end? If she’s making a sandwich for herself, is it wrong of me to ask her to make one for her hungry brother, too? Or should I be making both sandwiches, even well into her teens and beyond, because it is my job? Should a child be given no household responsibilities that don’t directly relate to his own things because the rest of it is my job? One of the things my 10 year old was supposed to do in Cub Scouts was to plan and make a meal for the family. Isn’t that my job? When do they learn about responsibility and service to others? The family is the best place for an attitude of service to begin. Isn’t is also my job to teach my children how to become responsible and competent adults? If they are never given any responsibilities outside of caring for themselves (which is also my job), I wouldn’t produce adults who had any capabilities or sense of confidence in themselves.

For the record, my 9 year old relishes the opportunity to take younger siblings to the bathroom. When the toddler fusses during Mass, she begs me to let her take him out. Both of these things make her feel like she’s a big girl, and that I trust her with responsibility.

A nine-year old is competent to take a younger sibling to the bathroom, provided the younger sibling can talk and provide a witness about anyone who approaches the older one. The job isn’t to physically fend off attackers, but to keep each other from being made vulnerable to those with bad intentions because of the lack of eyewitnesses.

Provided that they’re not getting a false sense of their abilities, I think it is good for kids to be given as much responsibility as they are old enough to handle. Pushing a child to take on a responsibility that they are not ready for, however, is another thing altogether. If a child is given responsibilities that make him or her anxious, that works against developing self-confidence. It is better to say, “Yes, your older sister was taking on this responsibility at your age, but it is OK if you are coming around on a different time table. Some come into their confidence a little later in life. You will get there.” Besides that, let us face it, some kids think they are ready for responsibility, but give evidence in other ways that they are not ready. Obviously, it depends on the child.

 

[surfinpure]

Your child may know the rules, but that does not matter to a molestor.
Cat;9782541:

Anyway, our parish has had not just one, but several incidents of children being accosted in the bathrooms by perverts. So I am naturally going to side with the OP’s priest on this issue.

I would tend to err on the side of extreme caution. **Those who desire children and teenagers are very clever and subtle, and even a well-trained and savvy child or teen could be drawn into their net. **

Once a child or teen has been threatened or heaven forbid, actually molested, their innocence can never be restored fully. An incident will mark them for life.

This, exactly, unfortunately.

You’re talking to a former martial arts and women’s self-defense instructor. I’ve taken the training from the archdiocese and given seminars on safety. I’ve read and re-read the works of Gavin de Becker, the nation’s leading expert on predicting violent behavior. I’m a homeschooling mother who uses attachment parenting. Caution is my old friend…

And I’m telling you that at some point we have to let our children out of our sight. We cannot eliminate all risks. We have to use the good sense God gave us and minimize the risks in the best and** most reasonable** way. Walking a twelve-year-old child to the bathroom (as others mentioned) is not reasonable. Period.

 

[surfinpure]

Where does this end? If she’s making a sandwich for herself, is it wrong of me to ask her to make one for her hungry brother, too? Or should I be making both sandwiches, even well into her teens and beyond, because it is my job? Should a child be given no household responsibilities that don’t directly relate to his own things because the rest of it is my job? One of the things my 10 year old was supposed to do in Cub Scouts was to plan and make a meal for the family. Isn’t that my job? When do they learn about responsibility and service to others? The family is the best place for an attitude of service to begin. Isn’t is also my job to teach my children how to become responsible and competent adults? If they are never given any responsibilities outside of caring for themselves (which is also my job), I wouldn’t produce adults who had any capabilities or sense of confidence in themselves.

For the record, my 9 year old relishes the opportunity to take younger siblings to the bathroom. When the toddler fusses during Mass, she begs me to let her take him out. Both of these things make her feel like she’s a big girl, and that I trust her with responsibility.

Right on.

 

[Aggie414]

Which is why I think it should be a parental decision. Parents know their children best and know their capabilities and level of responsibility.

While I agree with you whole-heartedly, the problem is if there’s not a rule in place, the Church has no way of enforcing it. You can’t let one family slide and not another. There has to be parameters set in place. Unfortunately because some parents do not actually parent their children and teach them how to behave properly, all parents pay the price.

 

[babochka]

I don’t know if you have seen the Free Range Kids site, but I think you might appreciate their philosophy.

I was not familiar with this, but I have enjoyed reading this blog over the last few days. It is right up my alley, although there are many things she advocates that I wouldn’t let my kid do. Which just emphasizes my point: You have to know your kids, the situation, and your own comfort level.

 

[fred_conty]

My wife or I would always accompany our kids. Kids mess around and we didn’t want this.
Beside, they didn’t use it that often.
It is amazing how things just happen when parents aren’t around.

In the old days when we had to abstain from all food and liquid from midnight to the reception of communion the next morning, restrooms were rarely needed.

Just a thought.

 

[surfinpure]

My wife or I would always accompany our kids. Kids mess around and we didn’t want this.
Beside, they didn’t use it that often.
It is amazing how things just happen when parents aren’t around.

In the old days when we had to abstain from all food and liquid from midnight to the reception of communion the next morning, restrooms were rarely needed.

Just a thought.

Yeah, doctors, maybe, but not restrooms. Those of us with perpetually low blood sugar are thankful for less stringent fasting rules. Keeps us from passing out. Also, I have a hard time believing the Church, even in the old days, didn’t allow people to drink *water *before receiving Communion.

 

[babochka]

Yeah, doctors, maybe, but not restrooms. Those of us with perpetually low blood sugar are thankful for less stringent fasting rules. Keeps us from passing out. Also, I have a hard time believing the Church, even in the old days, didn’t allow people to drink *water *before receiving Communion.

Even in the old days, if you had a medical issue, you were not require to fast from midnight.

 

[babochka]

My wife or I would always accompany our kids. Kids mess around and we didn’t want this.
Beside, they didn’t use it that often.
It is amazing how things just happen when parents aren’t around.

In the old days when we had to abstain from all food and liquid from midnight to the reception of communion the next morning, restrooms were rarely needed.

Just a thought.

You know, I just realized when I read this that I probably didn’t fully explain the situation. My 9 ad 10 year old children do not go to the bathroom during Mass, although the 9 year old does try. They are certainly old enough to hold it for an hour and a half. We are usually at church for 3-4 hours on Sunday because the parish gathers for lunch afterward. It is during this time that the children are likely to need to use the bathroom.

As far as messing around, this again isn’t the issue. I’m certain my 10 year old would not mess around. I’m equally certain that my 9 year old might, if the mood struck. The bathrooms are up a short staircase, which is visible from the entire parish hall. If one of my kids is missing for more than 5 minutes or so, I’ll go check up on them.

You said that you and your wife would accompany the kids, because you didn’t want them messing around. I’m assuming this was some time ago, since you made references to traditional fasting practices. At what age did you stop? At what age did you decide that your children could be trusted with that responsibility?

I’m really struggling with this issue.

(As an aside, I appreciate your admission that “kids mess around”. I get tired of hearing from my parents and grandparents generation how their kids were always perfectly behaved.)