children at Mass

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waterdog said:
and for the record, this is the exact wording from the parish bulletin
Recently I heard some complaints about little children making noise during Mass. I also listen to some advice. The problem is our church is built without a crying room. So how can we rectify the problem? Some parents suggest to me that we should reserve the last three/four pews on the left side for families who have little children younger than 3 years old.
(my note–I don’t know who these parents are. When we discussed this idea at parish council it was vetoed because most people realize children do best if they are up front where they can see) So parents please apply this suggestion for acouple of weeks to see if it works. If your child cries please take him/her outside. I think people deserve to have a quiet place to pray and worship. If you cannot make your children behave in Church, you can stay home. I ask our parishioners to have patience with little children. Please give them those last three pews. We welcome all to this place, but little children should be taught how to fear God and respect others. I ask for your cooperation, Thank you very much.
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This is just unbelievable to me. I’m sure if I had been going to that parish with my two (ages 3 and 1) I would never go back there after that note because it is clear that babies and toddlers are not welcome there. Such a contrast to Jesus’ view of children!
 
Add me to the other posters! The chutzpah.

My infant cried and then nursed very loudly during Adoration one Friday. I was embarrassed, as several people were there meditating, quietly praying, etc. Well, on the way out several ladies thanked me for bringing him. (“You wouldn’t think to go to your parents’ home without your child, their grandchild!”)

So sweet!
 
waterdog said:
and for the record, this is the exact wording from the parish bulletin
Recently I heard some complaints about little children making noise during Mass. I also listen to some advice. The problem is our church is built without a crying room. So how can we rectify the problem? Some parents suggest to me that we should reserve the last three/four pews on the left side for families who have little children younger than 3 years old.
(my note–I don’t know who these parents are. When we discussed this idea at parish council it was vetoed because most people realize children do best if they are up front where they can see) So parents please apply this suggestion for acouple of weeks to see if it works. If your child cries please take him/her outside. I think people deserve to have a quiet place to pray and worship. If you cannot make your children behave in Church, you can stay home. I ask our parishioners to have patience with little children. Please give them those last three pews. We welcome all to this place, but little children should be taught how to fear God and respect others. I ask for your cooperation, Thank you very much.
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Actually, that’s not as bad a note as I originally thought (not that I think it’s a good note…I don’t, and I’d be mortified to read something like that in my parish bulletin). It seems he is trying to implement a little experiment that he sincerely thinks is a compromise that will make everyone happy.

The line “If you cannot make your children behave in Church, you can stay home” seems to me more like the priest is attempting to be pastoral towards the parents of young children by giving them permission to stay home from Mass if their children are particularly rambunctious (perhaps thinking those parents would be relieved at such a suggestion). Now, I disagree with his underlying sentiment and I think the articulation is very poor, but I would charitably assume – until proven otherwise – that his intent was not to say “Get out!” to all the parents.

I think this does illustrate the importance of speaking up. Perhaps the priest had but one parent approach him and lament the lack of a cry room and tell him how they wished the back pews didn’t fill up first so that they could sit in the back with their children and take them out to the back more easily when they became disruptive. And so the priest assumes that to be the consensus. If no one voices to him any other viewpoint, how is he to know differently?

I think your letter was very well done. It seems to me like a good thing to share with your priest.
 
Shortly after our youngest was born we experienced looks, stares and comments when we went to Mass with our daughter, to include the priest staring and scowling at us when our young baby started to cry. Even our attempts to grab the diaper bag, slip out of the pew and out the door drew his and others stares, eye rolls, etc… that parish did not have a baby ghetto we could exile ourselves into and after a few months of feeling unwelcome we stopped going to Mass.

Yes, we could have gone to separate Masses. But we were married in the Catholic Church, we were one flesh, one family, and we were trying to be good Catholics, but instead we felt unwelcome in our place or worship. With a second child less than 2 years after the first, we ended up staying away from the Mass for several years…

We have since moved, and our parish now is welcoming to kids. It’s a small community, so it’s much more a family than what we felt in our previous parish. Our current parish does have a baby ghetto, but the only use it gets is when a baby is really wailing for an extended period. But short duration or less intense crying? Parents feel comfortable just letting their child cry…

One of my friends is a priest and he just got moved to a new parish where he is finding that this is a problem there. He came across this rather timely article which he shared with his parishoners. Not sure if it has helped yet, but when I read it, I found it to be a pretty great perspective: newtheologicalmovement.blogspot.com/2012/04/crying-children-call-to-mind-mystery-of.html
 
Grrrrr…can’t tell you how angry what your Pastor said made me! Does he NOT get that if there’s no new growth then there’s NO future Church??? You need to throw this to your Bishop (in my opinion) - if enough threw it to him he might say something. If the Pastor doesn’t like it then he needs to have a cry room built. What ever happened to almost every Church having one anyway? We don’t have one at the Church in the town we live - the mid day Mass on Sunday is called “the zoo” by most - which is fine - but I know some that don’t come to that mass because of that and that’s fine - they’re collecting to build a new Church and I know that some are asking for a cry room where you can still hear the Mass.I can’t imagine why they wouldn’t want one - those cries are the future of the Catholic Church - make them (or their parents) feel unwelcome and you’re just sowing seeds for later hearing ‘I never really felt comfortable in Church…’ or something similar. That Pastor needs a swift kick in the pants - he also needs to baby sit 4 kids for 5 hours - with the codacile that he has to take them somewhere when they make too much noise…he’ll be begging for help from those same parents…might make him a bit more empathetic as well!
God Bless
Rye
 
TryingToLearn said:
Shortly after our youngest was born we experienced looks, stares and comments when we went to Mass with our daughter, to include the priest staring and scowling at us when our young baby started to cry. Even our attempts to grab the diaper bag, slip out of the pew and out the door drew his and others stares, eye rolls, etc… that parish did not have a baby ghetto we could exile ourselves into and after a few months of feeling unwelcome we stopped going to Mass.

Yes, we could have gone to separate Masses. But we were married in the Catholic Church, we were one flesh, one family, and we were trying to be good Catholics, but instead we felt unwelcome in our place or worship. With a second child less than 2 years after the first, we ended up staying away from the Mass for several years…

We have since moved, and our parish now is welcoming to kids. It’s a small community, so it’s much more a family than what we felt in our previous parish. Our current parish does have a baby ghetto, but the only use it gets is when a baby is really wailing for an extended period. But short duration or less intense crying? Parents feel comfortable just letting their child cry…

One of my friends is a priest and he just got moved to a new parish where he is finding that this is a problem there. He came across this rather timely article which he shared with his parishoners. Not sure if it has helped yet, but when I read it, I found it to be a pretty great perspective: newtheologicalmovement.blogspot.com/2012/04/crying-children-call-to-mind-mystery-of.html
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That’s a great article. Thanks for sharing. “Baby ghetto.” 😃 I never heard that one before. I know some parents who like using them because otherwise they feel too self-conscious at Mass. The only time I’ve ever used them is when the rest of the pews were full and there was nowhere else to sit. I’ve never had a positive experience in a Cry Room. It makes me feel disconnected from the rest of the congregation, which is sort of counter to what you want at Mass.
 
ryecroft said:
You need to throw this to your Bishop (in my opinion) - if enough threw it to him he might say something.
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That could be an option for later down the road, but the OP needs to voice her concerns to the pastor first before going to the bishop. Hopefully it’s just a case of the priest being unaware of other viewpoints and it can be resolved without moving it up the chain of command.
 
Thank you everyone. I go to talk to my pastor shortly and all your comments have helped give me perspective. Pray for my self-possession and that I am able to speak what needs to be said and no more, with greatest respect for his priesthood.
 
waterdog said:
I am sure that this has been discussed many times here, but I would like to know how many with small children have been made to feel unwelcome at Mass with their little children, by older parishioners and even the pastor. Mine are mostly grown, but we have recently been finally getting some younger people in our retired community. I saw complaints coming because I know my parish family and I cautioned our new priest at pastoral council that we needed to solve a problem before it happened–that is we needed to be proactive about welcoming all the little ones. Lots of Hispanic families, several Anglo families and four pregnant ladies. Please understand this is a retirement community. God has truly blessed us with this new growth. Unfortunately my warning was not heeded.

And now something truly awful. Our pastor heeded the complaints of some older people and has written in the bulletin, please all families in the back. Be sure to leave if your kids are acting up. And don’t come to Mass if you can’t make them behave. He said some other nicer things, but these negative things are there. Who tells people not to come to Mass? I am deeply offended. How to deal with this?
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Yep, me and my 2 year old son are not welcome to mass as per a couple of older ladies at my church. We haven’t been to mass in almost a year b/c my then 18 month old was making a woman very angry.

Here I was thinking how well he was doing and I was proud of him until that old hoot of a lady began to curse him under her breath. I told her off right in the middle of mass when she was about to scold him for simply smiling at her.
 
Serap said:
Yep, me and my 2 year old son are not welcome to mass as per a couple of older ladies at my church. We haven’t been to mass in almost a year b/c my then 18 month old was making a woman very angry.

Here I was thinking how well he was doing and I was proud of him until that old hoot of a lady began to curse him under her breath. I told her off right in the middle of mass when she was about to scold him for simply smiling at her.
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Maybe I’ve just got a stubborn streak in me, but I think if someone actually made a negative comment to me about my children at Mass, I’d make it a point to be there every week and I’d be inclined to sit right next to them whenever possible. :o
 
Joe_5859 said:
Maybe I’ve just got a stubborn streak in me, but I think if someone actually made a negative comment to me about my children at Mass, I’d make it a point to be there every week and I’d be inclined to sit right next to them whenever possible. :o
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I was thinking about my kids. I don’t want church to be a negative memory for them.

You’re right though…just to pi** her off!
 
shainski said:
I have been so grateful over the years for the many people who have come up to us and thanked us for coming and bringing them to church. And it seems on the days that have been most challenging for us, we got the most positive compliments for their behavior.
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We have brought our 3 kids (now 5, 3, 2) every Sunday since they were 6 weeks old. This ^^ has been our experience. The older people that sit around us absolutely LOVE our kids. We frequently have people that we don’t even know come up to us after Mass and tell us how awesome it is to have our kids there and how much they enjoy seeing us from across the church every week. I really can’t imagine it any other way.
 
28562 said:
We have brought our 3 kids (now 5, 3, 2) every Sunday since they were 6 weeks old. This ^^ has been our experience. The older people that sit around us absolutely LOVE our kids. We frequently have people that we don’t even know come up to us after Mass and tell us how awesome it is to have our kids there and how much they enjoy seeing us from across the church every week. I really can’t imagine it any other way.
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Maybe I should go to your church?
 
Serap said:
Maybe I should go to your church?
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Might be a heckuva commute, but you are more than welcome!😃 You can even come to breakfast with us afterwards. The old people at Bojangles love our kids too…👍
 
Joe_5859 said:
That could be an option for later down the road, but the OP needs to voice her concerns to the pastor first before going to the bishop. Hopefully it’s just a case of the priest being unaware of other viewpoints and it can be resolved without moving it up the chain of command.
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I had mentioned doing this because he had said something about it being brought up in Parish Council. I guess (if the Pastor isn’t already aware - I have a hard time believing he isn’t) - that he needs to be informed of just how ‘well’ his little tirade about kids being noisy went over.
But you’re right he needs a chance (if he hasn’t already been given one) to fix it on his own - I just think the Bishop would LOVE to hear about alienating young families especially with what’s going on with politics today…the Church population is shrinking…too many more Pastors pull this and it going to shrink much, much faster.
God Bless
Rye
 
waterdog said:
Some parents suggest to me that we should reserve the last three/four pews on the left side for families who have little children younger than 3 years old.

If you cannot make your children behave in Church, you can stay home. I ask our parishioners to have patience with little children. Please give them those last three pews. We welcome all to this place, but little children should be taught how to fear God and respect others. I ask for your cooperation, Thank you very much.
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I think your priest could’ve worded that better. He speaks of teaching children under the age of 3 to fear god? Children have nothing to fear from God. Respect Gods House might of been a better choice of words. He asks that parents teach their children respect when he is clearly segregating the younger Catholic Families.

I would find out if this is how he truly feels. If so, I would leave that Parish. Especially if your Diocese doesn’t rotate priests.

I know some Diocese that struggle and have ‘no clue’ as to why they cant get younger families and kids interested in Catholicism.

Its because of things like this…

JMHO…

W…
 
My wife and I have a 4 yo, a 2yo and one on the way. During my oldest’s baptism(during Mass) he shrieked the entire time. Our Pastor was great about it and told us not to worry about it. Numerous people tried to calm him down but to no avail. That was the longest mass of my life.

We began taking our kids at 3 weeks old and attend as a family every week. One week our daughter was particularly talkative. She was behaving but would not be quiet. Right before the consecration a woman asked us to move to the back. My wife politely said “NO”.

I remember growing up, a priest told the congregation that if they became upset or distracted by children at mass, they should “offer it up to God”.
 
if it were me I’d write to your bishop and include a copy of the bulletin.

we started out in a parish (large cathedral) were parents mostly stayed and everyone was ok with it but we moved to a tiny parish and didn’t know they didn’t like noise after a few looks we figured out what to do. I would be offended by the way your priest said it and I think it could have been handled better. sounds like your parish could learn some what to say and not to say to parents.
 
waterdog said:
I am sure that this has been discussed many times here, but I would like to know how many with small children have been made to feel unwelcome at Mass with their little children, by older parishioners and even the pastor. Mine are mostly grown, but we have recently been finally getting some younger people in our retired community. I saw complaints coming because I know my parish family and I cautioned our new priest at pastoral council that we needed to solve a problem before it happened–that is we needed to be proactive about welcoming all the little ones. Lots of Hispanic families, several Anglo families and four pregnant ladies. Please understand this is a retirement community. God has truly blessed us with this new growth. Unfortunately my warning was not heeded.

And now something truly awful. Our pastor heeded the complaints of some older people and has written in the bulletin, please all families in the back. Be sure to leave if your kids are acting up. And don’t come to Mass if you can’t make them behave. He said some other nicer things, but these negative things are there. Who tells people not to come to Mass? I am deeply offended. How to deal with this?
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Well Im not old, but I have experienced that some parents really don’t handle it and everyone in the parish, including the Priest who is trying to give a homily, is extremely disturbed. Sometimes children shout and make a lot of noise and the parents just don’t get it.
Its clear that they see their kids like princes and princesses and they don’t wanna upset the little gem in any way…
Its sometimes like with dog owners , they think their dogs are the most wonderful creatures, and if you don’t like to play with him when he comes drooling and running towards you, well you get a mean look from the dog owner, because you don’t understand how fantastic their dog is.

I know a parish where the priest also had to say something unpleasant to the parents of that congregation after a while of everyone else suffering this chaos. Of course some parents get offended… but sometimes they have to wonder why the problem has become so big that even the otherwise very diplomatic priests say these things.
I think the “Dont come to Mass if…” is not very well formulated… of course, but I wonder, what has been going on for a priest to take such measures. Everything else he wrote seems totally acceptable and should be natural for parents anyway.
 
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