Children's Liturgy of the Word (pulling out of Mass)

[Cat]

If that’s how you really feel, then you should lead a campaign in your parish to get a well qualified DRE and a certified Catechist for every class.
The Catholic church has many programs in place for the purpose you state.
Have your pastor insist that parents enroll their children & support the parish in the education of THEIR children.
The people you speak of are the people who

1. don’t take their kids to Mass at all
2. don’t enroll them in education until it’s time to “get” a Sacrament, like FHC or Confirmation.

I do take a hard look. It’s my job. And what I see is parents who think Mass is optional. For them and for their children. I deal with more lukewarm Catholics than anyone here would believe.
Worship, an Mass participation is paramount. These programs with the gimmicks are just patches that mollify the parents, not the kids. The kids sit and stare just as they do in the church, they’re just with other kids. And the misbehaving ones still misbehave.
I had family who I thought were pretty devout and after their son made his First Communion, they said they were allowing him to “take a year off” from instruction…because “poor thing, what with soccer and all he’s just wiped out on Sundays” so they were not bringing him to Mass OR religious ed.
Anyone who thinks that the problem of people leaving the church is going to be fixed by taking the kids OUT of Mass? Crazy pants.
There’s no way I’ll ever believe that this is a good thing. If what you assert is true, the faith would never have lasted 2000 years. We have plenty of wonderful kids in the Church, doing oodles of community service, attending Adoration, working with the elderly, and serious about their faith. They nearly 100% from families that took them to the entire Mass even in the “fussy” years.

That’s all good.

We’re not talking about taking the children out of Mass for the entire Mass, right? From what I’ve seen in parishes that offer a Children’s Liturgy of the Word, it lasts for about as long as it takes to walk a child downstairs to the bathroom and wait for them to do their business. The children are out for the time that the pastor is doing his homily and that’s it. It’s not the entire Mass, it’s just a time for them to hear the Gospel reading presented in a method that will be at their level.

I think children are best taught with methods that work with children, and adults are best taught with methods that work for adults. E.g., a “lecture” or “homily” is not a good method to teach children. And for adults, use of puppets or singing rhymes or games is not a good way to teach them (although it works for me!)

Examples of teaching methods that work well with children are:

1. Use of visual aids e.g., the old-fashioned flannelgraph, or puppets, or pictures of any kind, or items such as rocks, soap, yarn, a model airplane–almost anything will do!
2. Use of visual aids that the children themselves can touch, smell, or hear
3. Use of music/songs
4. Question and answers; the teacher asks the questions and the children answer
5. In religious teaching, actually seeing the open Bible in front of them and seeing the teacher read directly from the Bible rather than from a sheet of paper or pamphlet
6. For older children, a group project (e.g., use this box of items to tell a story about how the Gospel passage can be applied to your daily life).
7. REAL LIFE stories about children just like them (used as a way to illustrate ways to apply the Bible readings)
8. Games (age-appropriate), especially quizzing games and drills with little prizes (a sticker, a piece of candy, etc.)

NONE of these methods would be appropriate for a Mass homily, with the possible exception of use of a visual aid by the priest! Most of these methods would result in angry parishioners writing a letter to the bishop about the “liberal feel-good priest.”

But these methods WORK with children! That’s why children love attending AWANAs and other church clubs, and that’s why school teachers who use methods like this win Golden Apple Awards from their communities! The kids LEARN!

The notion that this type of teaching is “entertainment” is absurd! Do you think playing “peek-a-boo” with a baby is “entertainment?” Of course it’s fun for the baby and the parent, but it also teaches the baby very valuable information. You can’t teach a baby this same information by sitting him/her in a chair and saying, “Darling, I’m going to tell you all about the concept that when you can’t see something, it’s still there. This concept is vitally important for you to know because it helps you…”

Obviously the baby would not listen and would definitely not learn because a lecture isn’t the best teaching method.

Same for kids–use kid methods, and they will learn. Use adult methods, and SOME children will learn.

But I know the score–here on CAF, over and over again, I’ve seen parents who say that THEIR children are different and prefer “ADULT” conversation and activities. And I’ve seen teenagers who insist that they hate all the trappings of being a teenager and they much prefer MATURE conversation, music, books, etc.

OK, I’ll buy it.

But I still think that a lot of parents are kidding themselves when they think that their child is the exception and learns “just like a grownup.”

And just because something is enjoyable doesn’t mean that it’s “entertainment.” That’s unfair to good teachers.

 

[CHRISTINE77]

That’s all good.

We’re not talking about taking the children out of Mass for the entire Mass, right? From what I’ve seen in parishes that offer a Children’s Liturgy of the Word, it lasts for about as long as it takes to walk a child downstairs to the bathroom and wait for them to do their business. The children are out for the time that the pastor is doing his homily and that’s it. It’s not the entire Mass, it’s just a time for them to hear the Gospel reading presented in a method that will be at their level.

I think children are best taught with methods that work with children, and adults are best taught with methods that work for adults. E.g., a “lecture” or “homily” is not a good method to teach children. And for adults, use of puppets or singing rhymes or games is not a good way to teach them (although it works for me!)

Examples of teaching methods that work well with children are:

1. Use of visual aids e.g., the old-fashioned flannelgraph, or puppets, or pictures of any kind, or items such as rocks, soap, yarn, a model airplane–almost anything will do!
2. Use of visual aids that the children themselves can touch, smell, or hear
3. Use of music/songs
4. Question and answers; the teacher asks the questions and the children answer
5. In religious teaching, actually seeing the open Bible in front of them and seeing the teacher read directly from the Bible rather than from a sheet of paper or pamphlet
6. For older children, a group project (e.g., use this box of items to tell a story about how the Gospel passage can be applied to your daily life).
7. REAL LIFE stories about children just like them (used as a way to illustrate ways to apply the Bible readings)
8. Games (age-appropriate), especially quizzing games and drills with little prizes (a sticker, a piece of candy, etc.)

NONE of these methods would be appropriate for a Mass homily, with the possible exception of use of a visual aid by the priest! Most of these methods would result in angry parishioners writing a letter to the bishop about the “liberal feel-good priest.”

But these methods WORK with children! That’s why children love attending AWANAs and other church clubs, and that’s why school teachers who use methods like this win Golden Apple Awards from their communities! The kids LEARN!

The notion that this type of teaching is “entertainment” is absurd! Do you think playing “peek-a-boo” with a baby is “entertainment?” Of course it’s fun for the baby and the parent, but it also teaches the baby very valuable information. You can’t teach a baby this same information by sitting him/her in a chair and saying, “Darling, I’m going to tell you all about the concept that when you can’t see something, it’s still there. This concept is vitally important for you to know because it helps you…”

Obviously the baby would not listen and would definitely not learn because a lecture isn’t the best teaching method.

Same for kids–use kid methods, and they will learn. Use adult methods, and SOME children will learn.

But I know the score–here on CAF, over and over again, I’ve seen parents who say that THEIR children are different and prefer “ADULT” conversation and activities. And I’ve seen teenagers who insist that they hate all the trappings of being a teenager and they much prefer MATURE conversation, music, books, etc.

OK, I’ll buy it.

But I still think that a lot of parents are kidding themselves when they think that their child is the exception and learns “just like a grownup.”

And just because something is enjoyable doesn’t mean that it’s “entertainment.” That’s unfair to good teachers.

It sounds a lot like Sunday School. Maybe the Protestants were right!

 

[SMHW]

T
But I know the score–here on CAF, over and over again, I’ve seen parents who say that THEIR children are different and prefer “ADULT” conversation and activities. And I’ve seen teenagers who insist that they hate all the trappings of being a teenager and they much prefer MATURE conversation, music, books, etc.

OK, I’ll buy it.

But I still think that a lot of parents are kidding themselves when they think that their child is the exception and learns “just like a grownup.”

And just because something is enjoyable doesn’t mean that it’s “entertainment.” That’s unfair to good teachers.

I think the majority of the people who come to Catholic Answers are exceptional people to begin with.

Let me rephrase that. The people here are ABNORMAL!!!

But in this case, *abnormal *does not mean bad because the “normal” Catholics are the ones whose Faith may not be that strong and whose knowledge of their Faith could use some *major *enriching.

My point is that the Catholics here are probably already trying to do the the kinds of things that will help their children to grow up and be good Catholics.

The Mass in general --and Children’s Liturgy of the Word in specific-- may be the only “instruction” that some children will get in their Faith. CLoW is not really meant to be a form of religious education; it really is supposed to be liturgy. But it is certainly best if it is organized by people who know how to work with children and reach children!

 

[pianistclare]

That’s all good.

We’re not talking about taking the children out of Mass for the entire Mass, right? From what I’ve seen in parishes that offer a Children’s Liturgy of the Word, it lasts for about as long as it takes to walk a child downstairs to the bathroom and wait for them to do their business. The children are out for the time that the pastor is doing his homily and that’s it. It’s not the entire Mass, it’s just a time for them to hear the Gospel reading presented in a method that will be at their level.

I think children are best taught with methods that work with children, and adults are best taught with methods that work for adults. E.g., a “lecture” or “homily” is not a good method to teach children. And for adults, use of puppets or singing rhymes or games is not a good way to teach them (although it works for me!)

Examples of teaching methods that work well with children are:

1. Use of visual aids e.g., the old-fashioned flannelgraph, or puppets, or pictures of any kind, or items such as rocks, soap, yarn, a model airplane–almost anything will do!
2. Use of visual aids that the children themselves can touch, smell, or hear
3. Use of music/songs
4. Question and answers; the teacher asks the questions and the children answer
5. In religious teaching, actually seeing the open Bible in front of them and seeing the teacher read directly from the Bible rather than from a sheet of paper or pamphlet
6. For older children, a group project (e.g., use this box of items to tell a story about how the Gospel passage can be applied to your daily life).
7. REAL LIFE stories about children just like them (used as a way to illustrate ways to apply the Bible readings)
8. Games (age-appropriate), especially quizzing games and drills with little prizes (a sticker, a piece of candy, etc.)

NONE of these methods would be appropriate for a Mass homily, with the possible exception of use of a visual aid by the priest! Most of these methods would result in angry parishioners writing a letter to the bishop about the “liberal feel-good priest.”

But these methods WORK with children! That’s why children love attending AWANAs and other church clubs, and that’s why school teachers who use methods like this win Golden Apple Awards from their communities! The kids LEARN!

The notion that this type of teaching is “entertainment” is absurd! Do you think playing “peek-a-boo” with a baby is “entertainment?” Of course it’s fun for the baby and the parent, but it also teaches the baby very valuable information. You can’t teach a baby this same information by sitting him/her in a chair and saying, “Darling, I’m going to tell you all about the concept that when you can’t see something, it’s still there. This concept is vitally important for you to know because it helps you…”

Obviously the baby would not listen and would definitely not learn because a lecture isn’t the best teaching method.

Same for kids–use kid methods, and they will learn. Use adult methods, and SOME children will learn.

But I know the score–here on CAF, over and over again, I’ve seen parents who say that THEIR children are different and prefer “ADULT” conversation and activities. And I’ve seen teenagers who insist that they hate all the trappings of being a teenager and they much prefer MATURE conversation, music, books, etc.

OK, I’ll buy it.

But I still think that a lot of parents are kidding themselves when they think that their child is the exception and learns “just like a grownup.”

And just because something is enjoyable doesn’t mean that it’s “entertainment.” That’s unfair to good teachers.

What you describe is Sunday school: Faith Formation. Not Children’s Liturgy of the Word. What makes you think parishes don’t offer this already?

 

[Phemie]

My own parish is abnormal. We have not had religious education, beyond immediate sacramental preparation, since June 1998. That’s when the Catholic school system was dismantled in my province.

Since that time we have been using the same program to prepare the children for First Communion, and for the first 8 years that was also preparing them for Confirmation. It consists of 6 sessions before the sacrament and one afterwards. Really, the Children’s LoW, which was truly done as a Liturgy, was needed. It forced parents to actually bring their children to Mass.

95% of our parents are poorly cathecized. Those who aren’t are recent immigrants to our country from what we consider Third World countries.

Our poor Pastor doesn’t have any idea where to start to fix the problem.

 

[pianistclare]

My own parish is abnormal. We have not had religious education, beyond immediate sacramental preparation, since June 1998. That’s when the Catholic school system was dismantled in my province.

Since that time we have been using the same program to prepare the children for First Communion, and for the first 8 years that was also preparing them for Confirmation. It consists of 6 sessions before the sacrament and one afterwards. Really, the Children’s LoW, which was truly done as a Liturgy, was needed. It forced parents to actually bring their children to Mass.

**One point you bring up is well taken:
It’s LITURGY. Not a class. **

95% of our parents are poorly cathecized. Those who aren’t are recent immigrants to our country from what we consider Third World countries.

Our poor Pastor doesn’t have any idea where to start to fix the problem.

 

[UbiCaritas]

That’s all good.

We’re not talking about taking the children out of Mass for the entire Mass, right? From what I’ve seen in parishes that offer a Children’s Liturgy of the Word, it lasts for about as long as it takes to walk a child downstairs to the bathroom and wait for them to do their business. The children are out for the time that the pastor is doing his homily and that’s it. It’s not the entire Mass, it’s just a time for them to hear the Gospel reading presented in a method that will be at their level.

I think children are best taught with methods that work with children, and adults are best taught with methods that work for adults. E.g., a “lecture” or “homily” is not a good method to teach children. And for adults, use of puppets or singing rhymes or games is not a good way to teach them (although it works for me!)

Examples of teaching methods that work well with children are:

1. Use of visual aids e.g., the old-fashioned flannelgraph, or puppets, or pictures of any kind, or items such as rocks, soap, yarn, a model airplane–almost anything will do!
2. Use of visual aids that the children themselves can touch, smell, or hear
3. Use of music/songs
4. Question and answers; the teacher asks the questions and the children answer
5. In religious teaching, actually seeing the open Bible in front of them and seeing the teacher read directly from the Bible rather than from a sheet of paper or pamphlet
6. For older children, a group project (e.g., use this box of items to tell a story about how the Gospel passage can be applied to your daily life).
7. REAL LIFE stories about children just like them (used as a way to illustrate ways to apply the Bible readings)
8. Games (age-appropriate), especially quizzing games and drills with little prizes (a sticker, a piece of candy, etc.)

NONE of these methods would be appropriate for a Mass homily, with the possible exception of use of a visual aid by the priest! Most of these methods would result in angry parishioners writing a letter to the bishop about the “liberal feel-good priest.”

But these methods WORK with children! That’s why children love attending AWANAs and other church clubs, and that’s why school teachers who use methods like this win Golden Apple Awards from their communities! The kids LEARN!

The notion that this type of teaching is “entertainment” is absurd! Do you think playing “peek-a-boo” with a baby is “entertainment?” Of course it’s fun for the baby and the parent, but it also teaches the baby very valuable information. You can’t teach a baby this same information by sitting him/her in a chair and saying, “Darling, I’m going to tell you all about the concept that when you can’t see something, it’s still there. This concept is vitally important for you to know because it helps you…”

Obviously the baby would not listen and would definitely not learn because a lecture isn’t the best teaching method.

Same for kids–use kid methods, and they will learn. Use adult methods, and SOME children will learn.

**But I know the score–here on CAF, over and over again, I’ve seen parents who say that THEIR children are different and prefer “ADULT” conversation and activities. And I’ve seen teenagers who insist that they hate all the trappings of being a teenager and they much prefer MATURE conversation, music, books, etc. **

OK, I’ll buy it.

But I still think that a lot of parents are kidding themselves when they think that their child is the exception and learns “just like a grownup.”

And just because something is enjoyable doesn’t mean that it’s “entertainment.” That’s unfair to good teachers.

Bolded for emphasis.

Thank you. You see, I grew up in a very traditionalist family. I never went to a church that had any kind of children’s program, whether during Mass or outside of it. Parents were expected to teach their kids, period. And the way I was taught was to memorize and parrot back questions from the Catechism.

Now, don’t get me wrong: that has its place. But it’s not the be-all, end-all of faith formation. My parents taught me that I was “special” and “better” than other kids, because I didn’t need “that stuff.”

A funny story: we once, when I was about 5, went to some sort of ceremony for a friend at a Lutheran church. It was suggested that I go to the kid’s Sunday School rather than sit through the Lutheran service, and for some reason, my parents agreed. So I went. As I recall, the class consisted of sitting together in a circle and singing a couple of songs about Jesus, listening to a bible story (based, I suspect, on the readings for that day), coloring in a picture of Moses and the Ten Commandments, and then seeing if we could, as a class, list the Ten Commandments. It closed with us all saying the Our Father together.

Now, I already knew at 5(ish) that Lutherans were Wrong because they Weren’t Catholic. I had to be very careful lest they pull me away from my faith. Plus, I didn’t need all this silly kid stuff: I could sit through Mass just fine, and this was all very stupid. I was polite about it, mind you, but mentally very snobby. “Oh, we have to sit down and sing songs now? I can’t believe we aren’t listening to chant! Coloring in a picture? Oh good grief.” Etc.

At the same time, there was this little corner of my mind that desperately wished I had been in a class like this early enough that I understood more about it and could enjoy it, because it sure seemed like a nicer way to learn about Jesus than seeing how many Catechism questions and answers I could recite at a given time. I kind of wish now that I could have given 5-year-old me a hug, tell her to loosen up, and go have fun learning about Jesus. Seriously. Being a good Catholic and enjoying faith-related learning activities just aren’t mutually exclusive!

 

[Kal2012]

My son likes CLOW because it allows him to get up and get his wiggles out and be with other kids his own age.

We aren’t consistent mass goers as we’ve moved and have only recently decided on a new parish.

However, I understand the reasons why staying at the regular mass is important.

Moving really screwed up our son’s catechism this year because we’ve become inconsistent mass goers.

Please pray for my family on this issue. Thanks.

 

[Gordon_Sims]

But I know the score–here on CAF, over and over again, I’ve seen parents who say that THEIR children are different and prefer “ADULT” conversation and activities. And I’ve seen teenagers who insist that they hate all the trappings of being a teenager and they much prefer MATURE conversation, music, books, etc.

I hope you don’t think that’s the point I was trying to make. When I said they don’t get anything more from CLOW than sitting in the pew with us, I meant that if they’re not following along and trying to get something out of it, having it presented at their level in a roomful of their friends isn’t going to make it any better. The last time they went to CLOW all they could tell me about the Gospel was what color their one friend’s nail polish was and the sort of earrings this other girl was wearing. At least if they’re in the pew with me I can tell them to make note of something in the readings or the homily then ask them about it on the way home.

I’ve heard from people, especially DREs, that their parishes are on top of their evangelization and full of kids who know the Bible front to back. If that’s really the case I think it’s great. I know our DRE is the same way, although she doesn’t have any kids in the school. I will say that our girls will occasionally surprise me with their knowledge and understanding of certain things, but there are a lot fewer hits than misses. No matter what we do at home, they’d love it if the parish offered something for them. We have a short VBS session and…that’s it. My Lutheran friend’s son goes to catechism classes two nights each week and youth group on Sundays, in addition to several other extracurricular activities. Every time we hear from them my girls ask why they can’t do anything like that.

 

[Allegra]

I like the concept, the in practice, I don’t think it goes well. The number of participating children fluctuates greatly from Mass to Mass, and sometimes the number of preK-1st graders per adult gets to an unacceptable level. I’m concerned about the safety of the room and the lack of control.

 

[Eliza10]

Our church just started a Children’s Liturgy of the Word where, after the Creed, a woman takes the children into the Chapel, reads a “children’s version” of the readings (including the Gospel), and then talks with them about the readings.

Is this liturgically correct?

I am not sending my son (7 years old) to this for a number of reasons (I’ll list them at towards the end), but I’m getting some criticism from some parishioners as to why I am not letting him go. I plainly stated my reasons, but they think I’m nuts for not letting him go. To be perfectly honest, I don’t necessarily care what others say about how we chose to raise our family, but I’m curious as to if this is an appropriate thing to do at Church.

One final question, I found out that the woman who is leading this has the kids stand during Gospel. This may sounds like a silly question … but is that ok to do? In my humble opinion, that sounds like the proclaiming of the Gospel, which can only be done by a Deacon or Priest … correct?

I appreciate you taking the time to read through this and offer any answers you have.

Here are my top reasons why I don’t want my son to participate in this:

1. I believe Mass should be celebrated together as a family … and be full participants in the Mass.
2. We have taught my son how to properly behave in church (including knowing the reverent positions and why), I like him to continue to honor this.
3. As a family, we talk about Fr.'s homily and other things that went on at Mass … if he was not there with us for that, we would not be able to have these conversations.
4. We read the readings together as a family ahead of time and talk about them, so he does not need a children’s version to help him understand/pay attention better.

God Bless!!!

Mickey you have good reason for your choice and it works for your family (and for that, special thanks for the great blessing of a good husband who is one with you on it, and works with you and not against you. That’s not the case in every family!). And I don’t think you are going to be approaching CLOW Moms to tell them that you do it the better way, and they should do it like you!

So your problem is just the parishioners that think they know the better way you ought to be doing things instead. They think those other parents are doing it right, and so you must not be. That is so ignorant and you should feel sorry for the dull-mindedness of these persons. So with charity, simplicity and kindness you should educate them. You can be kind with this elementary education and say something like, “All parents must choose what is wise and good for their family. All families are different and have reasons for their choices. That is why different families make different choices.” Yeah, its silly but really anyone who questions you does not have a basic foundation here and needs to know this.

If that person were to persist anyway, you can bring it down to even MORE simple, and address them sympathetically, “It can be confusing when a family makes a different choice than you would make, huh?” (No sarcasm! Be totally sincere!)

The silliness should bore them sooner or later. Also sometimes bossy people feel they are making headway in their pleasurable experience of “taking charge” of others when they get an uncomfortable reaction from you. So don’t give them the positive reinforcement of showing your discomfort or confusion. Instead, redirect it to the truth (kindly), that it is * their* problem.

 

[ProVobis]

But I don’t think I’m far off to say that many of the parents sitting in Mass haven’t a clue about the readings themselves, and it’s no wonder that our Catholic children grow up un-catechized and easy prey for the Evangelical Protestant kids who grow up in AWANA’s and did Bible quizzing on the weekends and have likely read the entire Bible through at least twice by the time they are in middle school.

It seems like you’re on the right track here. Parents don’t have much clue about what’s going on because they seemed to have gotten their instructions by bits and pieces, if at all. I’m not knocking today’s liturgy because it was that way before Vatican II as well. Perhaps someone who’s read the BIble from cover to cover a few times is probably more equipped to answer questions relating to it. In high school we studied the life of Christ in an organized fashion, if you will. Things start to make more sense that way. Several years ago I purchased “Gospel Parallels” and “Synopsis of the Four Gospels.” Very well presented, showing side by side comparisons. These are the things that can make Christianity a little more interesting for adults as well as kids IMO.

 

[MickeyM927]

Mickey you have good reason for your choice and it works for your family (and for that, special thanks for the great blessing of a good husband who is one with you on it, and works with you and not against you. That’s not the case in every family!). And I don’t think you are going to be approaching CLOW Moms to tell them that you do it the better way, and they should do it like you!

So your problem is just the parishioners that think they know the better way you ought to be doing things instead. They think those other parents are doing it right, and so you must not be. That is so ignorant and you should feel sorry for the dull-mindedness of these persons. So with charity, simplicity and kindness you should educate them. You can be kind with this elementary education and say something like, “All parents must choose what is wise and good for their family. All families are different and have reasons for their choices. That is why different families make different choices.” Yeah, its silly but really anyone who questions you does not have a basic foundation here and needs to know this.

If that person were to persist anyway, you can bring it down to even MORE simple, and address them sympathetically, “It can be confusing when a family makes a different choice than you would make, huh?” (No sarcasm! Be totally sincere!)

The silliness should bore them sooner or later. Also sometimes bossy people feel they are making headway in their pleasurable experience of “taking charge” of others when they get an uncomfortable reaction from you. So don’t give them the positive reinforcement of showing your discomfort or confusion. Instead, redirect it to the truth (kindly), that it is * their* problem.

Eliza … thank you for this insight and great advice. I really appreciate those great phrases - and quite honestly, I can be using them in a number of other areas as well! Thanks again…God Bless!

 

[Phemie]

The Canadian bishops released a document on the Liturgy of the Word with Children. In it they made several points:

• Attendance is to be completely voluntary even if it’s used within the context of sacramental preparation because the normal place for children is in the pew with their parents.
• It is only to involve ages 4 and up and not involve children who have made their First Communion.
• It is to be infrequent, based more on the contents of the reading or homily topic than on anything else.
• It is to follow the Liturgy of the Word from Mass.
• If pencils come into play it’s being done wrong.

 

[Eliza10]

Phemie, the Canadian Bishops’ ideas sound wise!

Eliza … thank you for this insight and great advice. I really appreciate those great phrases - and quite honestly, I can be using them in a number of other areas as well! Thanks again…God Bless!

I’m glad! And I would love to be in your shoes raising young children with a good and like-minded Catholic husband! (I have a good husband now, by the grace of God.) I raised my son mostly single - blessed by being a new Catholic at least - but it was not the way I’d have ever hoped to do things. You are blessed!

 

[Cat]

I think the majority of the people who come to Catholic Answers are exceptional people to begin with.

Let me rephrase that. The people here are ABNORMAL!!!

But in this case, *abnormal *does not mean bad because the “normal” Catholics are the ones whose Faith may not be that strong and whose knowledge of their Faith could use some *major *enriching.

My point is that the Catholics here are probably already trying to do the the kinds of things that will help their children to grow up and be good Catholics.

The Mass in general --and Children’s Liturgy of the Word in specific-- may be the only “instruction” that some children will get in their Faith. CLoW is not really meant to be a form of religious education; it really is supposed to be liturgy. But it is certainly best if it is organized by people who know how to work with children and reach children!

Exactly, you’ve nailed it.

 

[Cat]

What you describe is Sunday school: Faith Formation. Not Children’s Liturgy of the Word. What makes you think parishes don’t offer this already?

I know that some parishes do offer children’s classes (and even adult classes) on Sundays. I think it’s a good idea, but even in Protestant churches, it’s becoming less common. People are so darned busy!

Please allow me to add that we are seeing a decrease in children’s catechesis in many Evangelical Protestant churches. Since there is no requirement for “confirmation” in most of these churches, there is no requirement for any kind of classes to train the children in their faith.

As people get busier and busier, especially with organized children’s sports (after all, 1/3 of U.S. children are obese and we simply must stop this, mustn’t we? Plus, many parents are hoping with all their hearts that their children will be good enough in their sport to earn a college scholarship), there are fewer adults available to volunteer to teach AWANAs, Pioneer Clubs, and other religious club ministries, as well as Sunday school, or any other type of children’s ministry like choir, youth groups, VBS, etc…

And of course, more and more parents work full-time, eliminating most of them from the pool of potential volunteers. It’s HARD to work full-time and then prepare for and run a children’s club class!

For safety reasons alone (especially out of fear of accusations of sexual abuse), there must be multiple adults involved with these various children’s classes/ministries. One zealous person cannot do it alone.

Also, there is a huge movement among Evangelical Protestants to get away from “organized” religion and devote more time to “personal Christianity” and development of the their “personal relationship with Jesus Christ” through private prayer and Bible study It sounds great–except it usually doesn’t happen. Christ established a Church for good reasons, and one of them is that we are supposed to encourage each other to stay true to Christ and live Christian lives in a world that often despises Christ! Catholics often stumble on this one, too, as some Catholics believe that Mass is supposed to be a solitary devotion and not a corporate act of service and worship. No wonder we fall away from our faith.

Also, many Evangelical Protestants object to any type of “pressure” on their precious children. The idea that a child actually has to “memorize” anything, even Bible verses, is just to demanding. And being obligated to attend a club, a choir, a social group, or anything just puts too much pressure on children–they should be “free” to grow up “naturally”. (Translation–they should be able to sit around and watch TV/play video games while their parents lounge around in utter exhaustion after running the kids to club soccer, music lessons, ISAT preparation classes, private school fundraisers, track and field club, and then dashing out to supper at some fast food place. And that’s just the stuff the PARENTS do–let’s add to that the list of activities that the CHILD is involved in!)

Anyway, the result of all of this is less training for Evangelical Protestant children, and we are seeing more and more of them who, just like Catholics, have no idea where in the Bible the book of Amos is, and didn’t even know that book was in the Bible.

So at least Catholic and Protestant children will be equal in their ignorance of their faith.

 

[MarkInOregon]

I believe I prefer, " The family that prays together, stays together" .

To be fair you are praying together as a family at Mass --the kids are only gone during the readings and the homily. They are present for the prayers. While my child prefers to stay in the pew with us–I can’t get worked up over this issue–I can’t see presenting the reading at their level while they are small doing any great damage. It doesn’t seem like a practice that should generate the angst it apparently does–but thats just me.

The peace of Christ,
Mark

 

[commenter]

My son likes CLOW because it allows him to get up and get his wiggles out and be with other kids his own age.

We aren’t consistent mass goers as we’ve moved and have only recently decided on a new parish.

However, I understand the reasons why staying at the regular mass is important.

Moving really screwed up our son’s catechism this year because we’ve become inconsistent mass goers.

Please pray for my family on this issue. Thanks.

Will definitely pray for you and family on this issue. My sons are in their late 20s and early 30s. The “wiggles” don’t go away but take on different forms. I still have a little role in their spiritual lives, and the hardest part was, and is, living up myself to the faith I have tried to share with them.

 

[Cat]

It seems like you’re on the right track here. Parents don’t have much clue about what’s going on because they seemed to have gotten their instructions by bits and pieces, if at all. I’m not knocking today’s liturgy because it was that way before Vatican II as well. Perhaps someone who’s read the BIble from cover to cover a few times is probably more equipped to answer questions relating to it. In high school we studied the life of Christ in an organized fashion, if you will. Things start to make more sense that way. Several years ago I purchased “Gospel Parallels” and “Synopsis of the Four Gospels.” Very well presented, showing side by side comparisons. These are the things that can make Christianity a little more interesting for adults as well as kids IMO.

I agree with you here. It is very frustrating to learn our faith “piecemeal,” and I don’t think it’s very effective.

When I was growing up, I was in the LAST class of Sunday School that made use of a “Kindergarten through 8th Grade” curricula that presented the entire Old Testament book by book to the children.

We had workbooks and homework—ouch! And there were lots of questions that we had to look up in the Bible.

But wow, did we learn. And by the time I graduated from 8th grade Sunday School, I had studied the entire Old Testament at a child’s level. Obviously I missed a lot of the details! But I knew the stories, and the basic concept that the “New Testament was concealed in the Old Testament and the Old Testament was revealed in the New Testament.”

The very next year, our Baptist church threw out this “old fashioned” curricula and went to a topic-based curricula where the kids did a lot of discussions about rock music, movies, dating, etc. Interestingly, my brother left church in 7th grade and never has come back. There was a fight in his class and one of his beloved teachers was insulted by one of the snotty kids, and my brother was so upset, he left. I can’t help but wonder if that old Bible-based curricula with its comforting structure would have kept fights like this at bay. Sad.

But anyway, I agree–a more organized approach to training children in the faith would be good. At the moment, it seems that parents are charged with the responsibility of educating their children. However, I think that to a certain extent, many Catholic parents have “invincible ignorance” due to being raised through the tumultuous years after Vatican II and during the whole “Sexual Revolution.” This means that they don’t have the ability or knowledge to teach their kids religion. So IMO, the local parishes need to pick up the slack, or we will continue to see a “Mass Exodus” of Catholics out of the Church, some to Evangelical Protestant churches, some to the liturgical Protestant churches that are still doing the “good” music, and most to churchless lives.