Choosing Hell

[jfoges]

In order go to hell, one would have to die in a state of mortal sin. In order to be in a state of mortal sin, one would have to wilfully and knowingly commit a mortal sin. This knowledge would include the knowledge that the sin is mortal and will result in damnation. Therefore, anyone who dies in a state of mortal sin has consciously chosen hell. One could also go to hell if one died without being baptised. However, in order for one to die in such a state, one would have to willingly and knowingly choose not to accept God’s grace, which would naturally lead to the baptism of desire, water, or blood.

 

[ateista]

In order go to hell, one would have to die in a state of mortal sin. In order to be in a state of mortal sin, one would have to wilfully and knowingly commit a mortal sin. This knowledge would include the knowledge that the sin is mortal and will result in damnation.

Hmmm… that is quite reassuring. Obviously only Christians can commit a sin, since “sin” is a Christian concept. Atheists are unable commit sins - since they don’t believe in “mortal sins” and they don’t believe in damnation either. So they cannot commit sins “knowingly”. Therefore they are excused. Good job!

 

[Pug]

If you aren’t going to make the choice strictly between Hell and Heaven, but more like between Hell and Purgatory leading somewhere nice-ish, then I rather like the idea of an inviting, open door to a home, with a place to remove your dirty shoes and put on clean house shoes and a sink and a mirror to freshen up your face and a place to set down your baggage there in the entry. Further down the hall you see how it is the kind of house that opens inside to a central garden inside, with paths and flowers, with someone you love, Mary, or Jesus sitting there on a pleasant rock down a path by a pond.

The hell thing would have to be somewhat tempting, though. It would take a cattle prod to get me to go into a huge, loud, licentious party. I hate crowded gatherings like that. Maybe make it be, oh, a quiet room with a person in it whom you’ve always wanted to see taken down a peg, and they are sitting there, down on their luck, fat, friendless, and poor, and you see the opportunity to go in there and “talk” to them a bit, ie gloat or maybe taunt them. Perhaps make them be a half-blown up suicide bomber, or a golden boy who led a “frivolous” life and had everything handed to them, or that, uh, neighbor, (yeah, that is civil enough), down the block who regularly sat in his driveway with that thumper car at 120 decibels for 3 hours starting at 1 am, or whatever. If you set it up like a carnival shooting arcade with a high-powered sniper rifle pointing at that “neighbor” of mine standing by his car all tricked out, you might at least get me to walk into the room without force. Unfortunate though that may be.

If I were to give in on the neighbor thing, though, it would essentially require checking my integrity and personhood at the door. Maybe that is what hell is, though.

 

[tobias]

All this talk of singular choice/decision kind of smacks of protestantism.
I would hearken back to the ‘Didache’ (teaching of the 12) which speaks of the 2 ways; one which leads to heaven and one which leads to hell. A decision of such magnitude can hardly be left to a ‘one time’ choice, rather a metanoia ( change of heart/ action). And as Augustine pointed out in ‘the city of god’, we are given the account of the good thief on the cross that we know it is possible to change at the last moment, but no others that we not become presumptive of God’s mercy.

  There are 2 paths laid before you. One is very rocky, full of thorns, incredible inclines, chasm's that must be lept over, and every sort of hinderance one could imagine. At the end of this path can be seen a beautiful city where there is a room prepared for you. The other path is smooth, with many places to rest, and all sort of amusement to occupy your time. But the end of this path is blurry, only hues of orange and red, and every so often a foul odor or distant scream can be sensed, but the pleasantries of the path continue to distract from the path's end. 
  The people on the rocky path can see those on the smooth path and beg them to come over for the journey, and to look at where both paths lead, but cannot force them over. Those on the smooth path mock those on the rocky path, trying to coax them over for immediate comfort.
  At all times there are individuals who find the rocky path too much to endure and cross over to the smooth path. Likewise there are those on the smooth path who become dissatisfied with instant gratification and self purpoe who cross over to endure the rocky path.
 Till an end is reached there is freedom to switch paths, both ends may be seen but the intoxication with self makes the end of the smooth path hard to accept, untill self is set aside. 

 The ultimate choices; ease now or later, comfort now or later, weeping now or later, the easy path or the difficult path ( you get the idea, they're called the beatitudes).    We all choose blessedness or woe!!

 

[fishstick]

But that’s a bad analogy, no one would take the smooth path, or at least I wouldn’t. It would be alot more rewarding to have to fight through an adventurous quest to get to that final paradise in the dangerous path.

Either way, if I could choose, (assuming either of these were real) I’d probably opt for hell, just to catch a glimpse of how bad eternal suffering really is, and maybe do some fact checking on Dante.

 

[Blade_and_Blood]

My take:

Well, you don’t directly “choose” it, you just decide, “Okay, I did this specific bad thing and I don’t regret it. I’m glad I did it, and I don’t see why it was wrong.” And then, to Hell it is.

I know how weird that sounds, but I believe that during the Day of Judgment, your life flashes through your eyes in order for you to realize the sins you’ve committed and how ridiculous it was that you did it. If you regret ever doing it, you are forgiven by God. I guess a little guilt never hurt… much.

Ironically Yours, Blade and Blood

 

[Starwynd]

One thing some people are forgetting is that there are people who do sell their soul to Satan in exchange for some goods.

So yes, some people do willfully choose hell as opposed being sent there through sin.

But keep in mind, the majority of the human race is going to be sent to hell. The number of Christians that’ll be in heaven will only number in the millions.

Only Christians get to go to heaven. Nobody else.

 

[cranster]

IMHO, So if we were oriented towards God we would continue in that direction, but if we were oriented away from Him we would continue in that direction. So mortal sin is changing one’s orientation and trajectory away from God.

I choose to believe that being oriented towards God does not mean that we won’t fall into sin frequently, even mortal sin. That’s why we have the Sacraments to help us overcome. I think for a lot of people mortal sin is habitual for instance masturbation that may have begun in early life and can take a lifetime for some or even most to overcome. That doesn’t mean you do it on purpose but when you fall out of weakness you do the best you can to repent and get to confession brush your self off and continue moving forward. I don’t think if you spend you’re time using all the tools God gave us for salvation with all your heart and you fall into mortal sin out of weakness and you should die before you can get to confession that you are automatically going to hell.

 

[Genesis12345]

I am sorry, but I do not understand your concept about hell and the two doors.

When you die, you will receive a particular judgment and that judgment will either sen you to purgatory or heaven, which I am not the judge of that.

I know that if a person goes to confession and receives the Apostolic Pardon, it takes all sins away and punishments due to sins and that person will go to h eaven.

Do you know that if you are dying and there is not a priest, if you hold a Crucifix in your hand and you have the proper intentions of receiving a Plenary Indulgence, having gone to confession, asking for the indulgence, having had said prayers during your lifetime and prayers for the Pope, you will be saved.

I just cannot understand your logic about the two doors. That is fine to state your opinion, but it does not make any sense to me.

As I said, God has given us a free will and intellect and he will not interfer with it.

May God bless you in your efforts.

 

[ncgolf]

Hmmm… that is quite reassuring. Obviously only Christians can commit a sin, since “sin” is a Christian concept. Atheists are unable commit sins - since they don’t believe in “mortal sins” and they don’t believe in damnation either. So they cannot commit sins “knowingly”. Therefore they are excused. Good job!

Use that logic on gravity. Not believing or understanding what is true leads to some unpleasant consequences. If someone truly does not believe in gravity and tests this by jumping off a 10 story building … what will happen? A belief or ignorance of something, no matter how sincere, does not overcome reality. Why do parents hold the hand of toddlers while crossing a street … toddlers are ignorant of the deadliness of moving cars … that ignorance does nothing to protect them but makes them more vulnerable … not less.

How tough is it to understand sin? How tough is an understanding of justice?

We know some things are and will always be wrong. Tell me an instance where rape could ever be right. If a rapist is caught what should happen? Nothing?

 

[Neil_Anthony]

I just cannot understand your logic about the two doors. That is fine to state your opinion, but it does not make any sense to me.

Hi Genesis,
Through our life we have to make difficult choices. Sometimes we have to choose something that is painful to do the right thing. Sometimes we have to forego a temporary pleasure to do the right thing.
In our life we need to practice choosing the path that leads to heaven, even if its the harder path.
Someone who spends their whole life practicing hedonism, if faced with a choice between purgatory followed by heaven, or pleasure followed by hell, might not be able to choose purgatory. They’ve never chosen that way before, and might not be able to do it.

 

[tm30]

It’s hard to understand that “people only go to hell if they choose it” - who would choose hell?

Here’s an idea, does it make sense?

It’s very easy for the damned to choose hell, because those who live a life of self absorption have eliminated God from the equation of eternity.

They choose hell because they are self-absorbed. Does that sound strange? It shouldn’t.

Because the greatest act of self-absorption isn’t self-love – it’s self-hatred. Hell is simply an act of spiritual suicide.

 

[Molly2000z]

My take:

Well, you don’t directly “choose” it, you just decide, “Okay, I did this specific bad thing and I don’t regret it. I’m glad I did it, and I don’t see why it was wrong.” And then, to Hell it is.

I know how weird that sounds, but I believe that during the Day of Judgment, your life flashes through your eyes in order for you to realize the sins you’ve committed and how ridiculous it was that you did it. If you regret ever doing it, you are forgiven by God. I guess a little guilt never hurt… much.

Ironically Yours, Blade and Blood

I like your idea, I figure that if you try to lead a good life and treat other people right you’ll be okay at the end of your life, however,
I like the notions that people are expressing here about rooms and roads and choices.
And to the poster who said he may be spending too much time thinking about it, I think that you’re spending time on spiritual thoughts and that seems like a good thing to me.