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Christ-centric or Rome-centric?
- Thread starter Adamek
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Fauken
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The Catholic Church is the one, holy, catholic, and apostolic Church founded by Christ Himself with Christ as its head. So yes, it’s Christ-centric.Is the Catholic Church centered on faith in God, the Trinity and Jesus Christ, or is it a Roman institution? Are we to follow Christ, his life and his way, or Rome?
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TARRAT
Guest
What makes you think it is an either or situation. The true answer is “all of the above”.
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Cor_ad_Cor
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Yes. There doesn’t need to be any “or” statements here.Is the Catholic Church centered on faith in God, the Trinity and Jesus Christ, or is it a Roman institution? Are we to follow Christ, his life and his way, or Rome?
Clearly I wish it were so, but there are so many statements coming out of Rome recently that flatly contradict what the Bible says (Christ is not God; Jesus is not the unique savior) that there is cause for concern. I know that people will jump on me that these quotes are not reliable, but how many unreliable quotes are we supposed to handle? I just don’t accept the explanation that the pope is being mis-translated. He is not the first non-Italian pope. And the final debacle with the pagan statues in St. Peter’s basilica. What is that? Respect for paganism?What makes you think it is an either or situation. The true answer is “all of the above”.
There is reason to raise the question that starts this thread.
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Fauken
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I’d like a source from the Vatican saying as such.so many statements coming out of Rome recently that flatly contradict what the Bible says (Christ is not God; Jesus is not the unique savior)
These are pope’s words. Do you want someone from the vatican to explain them? To put a different spin on this? It has been done, but I don’t like spin. Listen to what this pope says, and writes.I’d like a source from the Vatican saying as such.
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Fauken
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I want a source that shows Pope Francis saying those words. Particularly, I want a source from the Vatican that shows Pope Francis saying those words. When did Pope Francis say “Christ is not God”?These are pope’s words. Do you want someone from the vatican to explain them?
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Jen7
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I’m not sure anyone knows exactly at this point, sadly.
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Sarcelle
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You’ll have to think of the Church beyond what is going on in the synod.
It has withstood heresy, infighting, corruption, outright persecution and evil Popes.
I’m talking about evil Popes, like Pope Alexander VI. Pope Francis may have had said some controversial things but I doubt he is evil and I doubt he will torpedo the church.
The Holy Spirit who is the guardian of the Church is not asleep at the wheel.
We have to pray that this synod controversy gets sorted out.
It has withstood heresy, infighting, corruption, outright persecution and evil Popes.
I’m talking about evil Popes, like Pope Alexander VI. Pope Francis may have had said some controversial things but I doubt he is evil and I doubt he will torpedo the church.
The Holy Spirit who is the guardian of the Church is not asleep at the wheel.
We have to pray that this synod controversy gets sorted out.
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Genesis315
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Christ centric, but Christ established His universal Church with one particular Church–the one in Rome–with primacy over all the others to ensure unity. Ultimately, the faith will always be preserved there, even if its bishop falters (as, sadly, a few have). For example, even after consenting to the condemnation of his predecessor, Honorius, as a heretic, Pope St. Agatho could say:
Pope St. Agatho:
http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/3813.htm
Pope St. Agatho:
(whole thing here)… because the true confession thereof for which Peter was pronounced blessed by the Lord of all things, was revealed by the Father of heaven, for he received from the Redeemer of all himself, by three commendations, the duty of feeding the spiritual sheep of the Church; under whose protecting shield, this Apostolic Church of his has never turned away from the path of truth in any direction of error, whose authority, as that of the Prince of all the Apostles, the whole Catholic Church, and the Ecumenical Synods have faithfully embraced, and followed in all things; and all the venerable Fathers have embraced its Apostolic doctrine, through which they as the most approved luminaries of the Church of Christ have shone; and the holy orthodox doctors have venerated and followed it, while the heretics have pursued it with false criminations and with derogatory hatred;[…]which, it will be proved, by the grace of Almighty God, has never erred from the path of the apostolic tradition, nor has she been depraved by yielding to heretical innovations, but from the beginning she has received the Christian faith from her founders, the princes of the Apostles of Christ, and remains undefiled unto the end, according to the divine promise of the Lord and Saviour himself, which he uttered in the holy Gospels to the prince of his disciples: saying, Peter, Peter, behold, Satan has desired to have you, that he might sift you as wheat; but I have prayed for you, that (your) faith fail not. And when you are converted, strengthen your brethren.
http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/3813.htm
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Sarcelle
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The infallibility of the Pope means he cannot officially teach error. This is a grace from the Holy Spirit.
Do you think this has been abrogated?
Do you think this has been abrogated?
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TARRAT
Guest
As stated by Fauken I think you need to check your sources. I haven’t heard any of the stuff you presented.
I agree and I pray that this is so. No human can destroy the church.ou’ll have to think of the Church beyond what is going in the synod,
It has withstood heresy, infighting, corruption, outright persecution and evil Popes.
I’m talking about evil Popes, like Pope Alexander VI. Pope Francis May have had said some controversial things but I doubt he is evil and I doubt he will torpedo the church.
The Holy Spirit who is the guardian of the Church is not asleep at the wheel.
We have to pray that this synod controversy gets sorted out.
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Sarcelle
Guest
Not even hell with all its demons can destroy the Church.
Edit: The church furthermore is the bride of Christ. With Christ as the Bridegroom, the Bride is safe.
Edit: The church furthermore is the bride of Christ. With Christ as the Bridegroom, the Bride is safe.
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Here is the quote on diversity of religions: The pluralism and the diversity of religions, colour, sex, race and language are willed by God in His wisdom, through which He created human beings. This divine wisdom is the source from which the right to freedom of belief and the freedom to be different derives.As stated by Fauken I think you need to check your sources. I haven’t heard any of the stuff you presented.
It states that God willed diversity of religions - this is a statement from the Koran. Nothing wrong with that, except for the fact that if God wants multiple religions, how can he send HIS SON to SACRIFICE for the ONE TRUE RELIGION.
The quote is from a document signed by the pope and it comes from the Vatican.
http://w2.vatican.va/content/france...sco_20190204_documento-fratellanza-umana.html
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